- 1,370
- Laval, Canada
- OutbackV6
Hi to you all, I recently came to the conclusion that I needed to understand more aspects of tuning that I more or less took for granted. I’ve been using the tuning guides of @Motor City Hami,
@praiano63, @DolHaus, and @Ridox2JZGTE, and all the info I could get my eyes on, but there were holes in using all these guides, at least for me. To fully understand all the components PD includes for tuning I would have to test them. So I decided to stop all tuning and start from the ground up. My current ongoing tests include, Steering Control Sensitivity, Tire grip comparison, Track grip comparison, Track top speeds ( used to adjust the transmission), wheels (inch up 1, inch up 2, standard), spring vs weight vs tires, and the subject of this thread - BRAKES.
My idea for tuning brakes was to find the maximum brake power before the wheels lock up and use that, so I tried putting the brake balance at 10/10, Comfort Hard tires and go full speed on a straight line and hit the brakes full, the results, no wheel lockup. Went to check on the data logger using wheel speed, vehicle speed, and brake, no sign of the wheels locking up.
I then had a conversation with Ridox, : ”Another thing is brake balance, in GT6, each car has predetermined brake bias hidden inside the car parameter. So, if you run 0/0 brake balance on standard brakes, the front tire usually will lock up first ( no ABS ). I often run higher rear to give the car best possible rotation under braking without causing oversteer. The best method to set your own brake balance is to not use ABS, find a short track to drive on, like Tsukuba, and start from 0/0 or 1/1, brake on 1st turn.Make a note of how the ca handle under braking, stable ? twitchy ? understeers ? Make adjustments to your liking.
Once you find a good value on no ABS, use ABS 1, and brake again with the same value. You will notice differences on some cars, with ABS 1 you often find you will want to increase the BB value a bit, and can run a bit more higher rear before the car over rotates under braking.”
So I went and tried the ABS:0.For the tests shown below I was using the NSX Type R’92, I’ve only done the tests with Standard brakes on Comfort Hard/Medium tires so far. I’m also doing the same tests with the RX500, Skyline GTR ’02, Civic Type R’08 and the Challenger R/T ’70, with the 6 different street tires available, but I haven’t finished those yet.
The method I used to determine when the wheels lockup is as follows:
1-Track: Indianapolis Motor Speedway, Brake balance 0/0
2-Manual Transmission set to 1st gear, after the start line and after the first curve , as soon as the road gets straight and that I’m at the max speed on 1st gear I hit the brakes using the square button on the PS3 controller and hold until my speed is at zero.
3-1st gear again, after the next curve, same procedure.
4-Still on the same straight, going to 2nd gear.
5-Still on the same straight, again on 2nd gear.
6-after the 3rd curve now up to 3rd gear.
7- after the 4th curve again at 3rd gear.
8-Cross the finish line and save.
9-Restart procedure using BB= 1/1, and so on.
Data logger
1- I check to see at what speed the vehicle is going when my front wheel gets to zero, (wheel lockup) , record the values
2-Same thing as above but with the rear wheel.
So far my opinion on brakes is it would seem to be better to do the tuning with the ABS0, to me it’s like tuning with Sports Soft or Race Soft tires, some of the characteristics of the car may be covered by the high grip of the tires, so I use less grip tires to tune. Likewise the ABS1 may be covering up the cars faults and you will not be able to see it. This is just my opinion, I’m far from the best tuners, and if I’m wrong I would be very grateful if one of you can enlighten me with your knowledge.
These are the results of the tests, on the CH - 4/4 and CM - 5/5 there was a slight irregularity which I can't explain. The wheels lockup was longer at the slowest speed, ???
These are the results from the CH tests in graph form.
These are the results from the CM tests in graph form.
These are the results from the CS tests in graph form.
These are the results from the SH tests in graph form.
These are the results from the SM tests in graph form.
These are the results from the SS tests in graph form.
Good day to you all, @TurnLeft
@praiano63, @DolHaus, and @Ridox2JZGTE, and all the info I could get my eyes on, but there were holes in using all these guides, at least for me. To fully understand all the components PD includes for tuning I would have to test them. So I decided to stop all tuning and start from the ground up. My current ongoing tests include, Steering Control Sensitivity, Tire grip comparison, Track grip comparison, Track top speeds ( used to adjust the transmission), wheels (inch up 1, inch up 2, standard), spring vs weight vs tires, and the subject of this thread - BRAKES.
My idea for tuning brakes was to find the maximum brake power before the wheels lock up and use that, so I tried putting the brake balance at 10/10, Comfort Hard tires and go full speed on a straight line and hit the brakes full, the results, no wheel lockup. Went to check on the data logger using wheel speed, vehicle speed, and brake, no sign of the wheels locking up.
I then had a conversation with Ridox, : ”Another thing is brake balance, in GT6, each car has predetermined brake bias hidden inside the car parameter. So, if you run 0/0 brake balance on standard brakes, the front tire usually will lock up first ( no ABS ). I often run higher rear to give the car best possible rotation under braking without causing oversteer. The best method to set your own brake balance is to not use ABS, find a short track to drive on, like Tsukuba, and start from 0/0 or 1/1, brake on 1st turn.Make a note of how the ca handle under braking, stable ? twitchy ? understeers ? Make adjustments to your liking.
Once you find a good value on no ABS, use ABS 1, and brake again with the same value. You will notice differences on some cars, with ABS 1 you often find you will want to increase the BB value a bit, and can run a bit more higher rear before the car over rotates under braking.”
So I went and tried the ABS:0.For the tests shown below I was using the NSX Type R’92, I’ve only done the tests with Standard brakes on Comfort Hard/Medium tires so far. I’m also doing the same tests with the RX500, Skyline GTR ’02, Civic Type R’08 and the Challenger R/T ’70, with the 6 different street tires available, but I haven’t finished those yet.
The method I used to determine when the wheels lockup is as follows:
1-Track: Indianapolis Motor Speedway, Brake balance 0/0
2-Manual Transmission set to 1st gear, after the start line and after the first curve , as soon as the road gets straight and that I’m at the max speed on 1st gear I hit the brakes using the square button on the PS3 controller and hold until my speed is at zero.
3-1st gear again, after the next curve, same procedure.
4-Still on the same straight, going to 2nd gear.
5-Still on the same straight, again on 2nd gear.
6-after the 3rd curve now up to 3rd gear.
7- after the 4th curve again at 3rd gear.
8-Cross the finish line and save.
9-Restart procedure using BB= 1/1, and so on.
Data logger
1- I check to see at what speed the vehicle is going when my front wheel gets to zero, (wheel lockup) , record the values
2-Same thing as above but with the rear wheel.
So far my opinion on brakes is it would seem to be better to do the tuning with the ABS0, to me it’s like tuning with Sports Soft or Race Soft tires, some of the characteristics of the car may be covered by the high grip of the tires, so I use less grip tires to tune. Likewise the ABS1 may be covering up the cars faults and you will not be able to see it. This is just my opinion, I’m far from the best tuners, and if I’m wrong I would be very grateful if one of you can enlighten me with your knowledge.
These are the results of the tests, on the CH - 4/4 and CM - 5/5 there was a slight irregularity which I can't explain. The wheels lockup was longer at the slowest speed, ???
These are the results from the CH tests in graph form.
These are the results from the CM tests in graph form.
These are the results from the CS tests in graph form.
These are the results from the SH tests in graph form.
These are the results from the SM tests in graph form.
These are the results from the SS tests in graph form.
Good day to you all, @TurnLeft
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