Considering PC Gaming - What do I need to know?

Dragonistic

Dragonistic

5,677
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
Dragonistic
For a while now I've been considering getting involved with PC gaming, though I don't have the money to do so right now it hopefully won't be to long until I can, within the year hopefully, though I'm thinking way ahead of myself there's alot of things I should probably know before I decide to save up the money for it.

I have no real knowledge of building a system and frankly I don't want to put in too much time in to making a system when I don't really know what I'm doing, so I'm happy to pay a premium for a system which is pre-built but powerful enough to be future proof for at least a couple of years. I know how to use a computer properly, I'd call myself an advanced-ish user of normal computers but I don't claim to know it all. My noobish in gaming PCs unfortunately means I know of only 1 brand to get such a product built and to my door (flamesuit on) which is Alienware. Where else can I get a good gaming PC out of the box/built for me?

I don't plan to buy cheaper and upgrade early, I'd rather buy a pretty powerful system from the start and upgrade later so we're talking pretty big money in the UK. Similarly, what should I invest money in to? Here's an example of the specs if I did buy an Alienware machine at current prices for a cool £1600 but if it would last many years I'd be happy to do so and upgrade much further down the line if I had to. I'm sure I must be able to get similar specs cheaper, particularly if I built a system myself but I really would have no knowledge of what I'm doing and don't have anyone to nanny me through.

Included in your system:
English Genuine Windows® 7 Home Premium (64 BIT)
Intel® Core™ i7-3820 Processor (4 Core, 10MB Cache 3.60GHz)
Dual 2GB GDDR5 AMD® Radeon™ HD7870 CrossFireX™ - Curiously, dual 1GB 6870s are more expensive, any reason for this?
8192MB (4x2GB) 1600MHz DDR3 Quad Channel
1TB SATA 6Gb/s (7200RPM) 32MB Cache
DVD+/-RW (Read/Write) 24x
Integrated HDA 7.1 Dolby Digital capability
802.11n WiFi and Bluetooth 2.1 EDR USB Combo Adapter - EUR
No Security/Anti-Virus Protection
1 yr Next Day In-Home Hardware Support
Alienware Aurora ALX Matte Black 875W Chassis
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Key Questions:
Is it right to pour money in to the graphics card? Would I need a better processor/RAM prior to a high end graphics card (or 2)?
AMD vs Nvidia Graphics cards, dual cards vs single card, pros and cons?
Where else can I get a similar system other than Alienware in the UK?
What else do I need other than a monitor, headset/speakers, gaming mouse and keyboard?
When I get a system, what programs should I make sure I have? Is Free security software good enough? (I know how to use a computer, I've used AVG free for years and never had a security problem)
How much could I save if I built the system myself? Could I even do it with no help or technical knowledge?

Requirements:
- Performance, plenty of it. Enough to run something like BF3 at max with at least 60FPS but preferably much more given the next requirement. Also want to use dual monitors with one on the game another for browsing, Skype etc.
- Future proofing and longevity. Minimum 2 years before I need to upgrade to keep up with new releases, but the more the better. As a long time console gamer I don't want to be constantly replacing or upgrading bits.
- Easy set-up and upgrade-ability. When the time does come I want to have to upgrade as little as possible, with as little hassle as possible. In other words easy to just take a part out and replace it right away which is why in the above build I opted for the more expensive chassis available as it claims upgrading will pretty much be slide out and slide in.
- Price. Though I'm prepared to price for quality, if I can get the same quality cheaper why not?

The reality is by the time I get a system all the actual prices won't be right, so general information is what I'm aiming for here. A to-do list of things to do, places to look, things to concentrate on and generally what to avoid doing.

Any input would be appreciated. It's essentially going to be my first gift to myself after I start working after I get necessities sorted first.
 
Just to give you an idea of how much money you will save if you build it, I quickly put together how much it would cost to buy all the parts you quoted seperately and it added up to £1086. So you save £500. Building a computer isnt too hard I don't think, there are many guides on youtube on how to do it, neweggs being really good, its more just knowing which parts are compatible, and I'm sure if you post a possible set up on here people will let you know about compatibility. Also, building a computer would be fun in my opinion., I'd say its worth it.

I will try and answer some more of your questions tomorrow, you asked alot, but thats a good thing :)
 
Given your requirements for BF3 at max with 60 FPS, what monitor do you have and what is the max resolution of it? Different resolutions will have a major impact on your performance. Remember that the higher the resolution, that many more pixels have to be rendered.

For example, look at the number of pixels that are being rendered at these different resolutions:

1280x1024 = 1,310,720 pixels
1600x1200 = 1,920,000 pixels
1920x1080 = 2,073,600 pixels
2560x1440 = 3,686,400 pixels

As you can see, the higher the resolutions, the harder your card has to work. PC gaming is gear progressive for the enthusiast. We are always looking for better graphics while maintaining that holy grail of 60 fps as a minimum. Starting out, 1280x1024 may look great, then 1600x1200 looks good enough, then 1920x1080 is the cats meow, then you find yourself shelling out ridiculous cash to get even higher resolutions hoping that everything will get that much smoother. You will also find when you start to read Graphic Card reviews, that certain cards excel better at higher resolutions than others. As far as brand goes, I used to be a ATI die hard, but have since switched to Nvidia. Pretty diehard Nvidia fan here along with EVGA and Intel, you can build a rock solid machine in my opinion.

I have some guys on a 2600k, 8gb of ram, running a single GTX580 and are able to get their 60 FPS on high settings at a 1920x1080 resolution.

With that said, you asked if you should pour money into the graphics card while getting moderate parts for the rest of the build? I would say you would be wasting your money to some extent. A bottle neck is a bottle neck regardless of where it is. You could have the fastest GPU in the world but wouldn't get 60 FPS in BF3 running a lower end processor/ram/etc.

With that said, a good route that many have taken is to get one GTX580 now, but build the system to accept a second card and even a third and fourth card down the road as your needs grow. To go this route, investing in proper gear up front will allow this kind of upgrade path to happen.

Power Supply, Motherboard, and case would both need to be adequate to hand the additional cards should you upgrade to more cards later on. The up side is the cost of GTX580's a year from now should be pretty reasonable and just in time when you need the extra horse power.

That's a little intro into what you are getting yourself into. :) Definitely build your own or have a buddy build it for you. A half way experienced tech should be able to build a complete system in just a couple hours tops.

I hope you find this information helpful.

:cheers:
 
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Every single time I read one of these threads, I'm thinking by myself, why the hell am I still playing console? :lol:
 
If there's one thing I've learnt while researching my potential future gaming PC, it's build, don't buy. As you saw, Gdog priced the components up individually and you save £500. That means you could have a faster processor or 2 GTX 680's, which would obliterate those 7870's... :drool:
 
As E28 said, you should build you rather than buy, I have just built myself a PC to replace my laptop which has recently died and found it quite enjoyable and found it cheaper than the cheapest PC I found which was considerably worse so definitely build it yourself, it is just sloting some parts together and connecting some cables after all.

I know little about hardware but I think buying a single better graphics card is better than 2 cheaper ones because it then allows you to upgrading by just getting a second one a few years down the line.
 
Expected feedback is expected, I knew everyone would tell me to build but I wouldn't even know where to start. It's much the same as my motoring, I fancy myself a pretty good rider (motorbike) but can I fix anything? Very basic things and then I'm stuck. You could hold most any piece of a computer infront of me and I won't know what it is, let alone where to put it in any given case or what to connect it to, with what wire.

That's why for now I would rather buy something already made and learn from it instead of walking blindly in to a high end build I am likely to do wrong. I'm already beginning to feel lost in translation with talk of bottle necking, though I know what bottle necking is I don't know which parts will hold the machine back when, what speed processor is going to slow down a system with XGB ram and Y video card? I have absolutely no clue. With nobody to hold my hand through the process, I don't have the confidence to attempt a build based purely on what I can find on the net and my own research as I am grossly incompetent when it comes to the hardware of a computer.

Appreciate the feedback as ever, will definitely take note of single v dual card. I'll probably want to run the games at 1080p, given the sort of monitor I'd be looking at 1080p would be max supported I imagine.
 
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Dragonistic
That's why for now I would rather buy something already made and learn from it instead of walking blindly in to a high end build I am likely to do wrong. I'm already beginning to feel lost in translation with talk of bottle necking, though I know what bottle necking is I don't know which parts will hold the machine back when, what speed processor is going to slow down a system with XGB ram and Y video card?
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You get the same issue with prebuilt computers. I think bottlenecking is blown out of proportion. Past a certain price point CPU becomes close to irrelevant for gaming. The CPU should last you over 2 years. The motherboard and CPU generally dictate what RAM speed you run.
 
Dragonistic
Expected feedback is expected, I knew everyone would tell me to build but I wouldn't even know where to start. It's much the same as my motoring, I fancy myself a pretty good rider (motorbike) but can I fix anything? Very basic things and then I'm stuck. You could hold most any piece of a computer infront of me and I won't know what it is, let alone where to put it in any given case or what to connect it to, with what wire.

That's why for now I would rather buy something already made and learn from it instead of walking blindly in to a high end build I am likely to do wrong. I'm already beginning to feel lost in translation with talk of bottle necking, though I know what bottle necking is I don't know which parts will hold the machine back when, what speed processor is going to slow down a system with XGB ram and Y video card? I have absolutely no clue. With nobody to hold my hand through the process, I don't have the confidence to attempt a build based purely on what I can find on the net and my own research as I am grossly incompetent when it comes to the hardware of a computer.

Appreciate the feedback as ever, will definitely take note of single v dual card. I'll probably want to run the games at 1080p, given the sort of monitor I'd be looking at 1080p would be max supported I imagine.
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I hear what you're saying..... There are some of the more reasonable builders for price point, ibuypower.com comes to mind. I haven't checked them out in a while, but they used to have some pretty sweet deals.

Here are some key terms I would be looking for when pricing a system, a grocery list if you will.

  • 850w Power Supply (higher the better)
  • SLI Ready
  • Supports SLI
  • GTX 580/680 (depending on price)
  • Intel i7 2600
  • DVD/Bluray Optical Drive
  • Hard Drive (Solid state is an option for speed, but are generally a small capacity drive)
  • 8GB minimum for your ram. 1866mhz and up would be pretty decent speed for your ram.
  • Mid Tower Case

I think that's a pretty good start to where you can start looking for computer built to suit.

Got questions? Fire away!
 
You will need a monster machine to max out BF3 at a steady 60 FPS. I have two GTX 570s and I can't do it at 1080p. I probably average around high 40s or so and drop down into the high 30s sometimes when I try to run everything maxed out. Dual 680s might do it, but I doubt it. Now I can run it at pretty high settings and bump down the AA some, but max settings is pretty hard to run at 60 fps.

When people say I can run this or that new game at max settings and get 60 fps they are probably not telling the truth. They have something turned down and are just saying they have it maxed out. To really max out BF3 and never drop below 60 fps you will easily have close to 1000$ in just you graphics cards.

With that said most games ran at high settings are just as good. I can't tell a difference in BF3 after I turn down a few settings. I am only running at 1080p though so at higher resolutions the differences might be noticeable, but then you need even more power to crank out high frame rates.

Since you are wanting a prebuilt system I would go with 2 GTX 670s( I'm pretty sure those are out now) and you would be good. The step up to 680s isn't really that much of a leap and it's certainly not worth the money it costs to go up. You can get 3 670s for 100$ more then 2 680s and have much more power. I've never really understood the appeal of the 580 or 680 when 570 or 670s are so much cheaper.

It looks like you can get the 2.5 gig 570s right now for 320$. That's what I would try and get. A system that had dual 2.5 gig 570s. You could probably find some decent prebuilts with those in them and would have some really powerful cards for a lot less money and more cram then the newer cards.
 
Once again very useful information guys 👍.

The website you link to Gdog makes building a PC sound ridiculously easy, is it really as simple as screwing some parts on and such? I guess the main issue with that comes down to the case, is it clear on cases where specific parts go? (i.e. if you have no experience, will I know where to put my motherboard for example, included in the manual?). If it is that simple, I will strongly consider doing a build which I'll try to turn in to a father-son project with my stepdad who also has little experience. If it truly is as simple as that website leads me to believe, there doesn't appear to be much room for error.

I will now more strongly consider building, when the time comes I will be back on GTP reviving this thread for piece by piece help in choosing my parts (and where to buy them in the UK) once I've ascertained an actual budget
 
It is very, very easy to build your own PC. I had never even opened a PC case before and had a friend help me. I couldn't believe how simple it has become to build one and could have easily done it myself.
If you run into any problems at all I'm sure youtube will have a video showing you exactly what to do. The only thing you need to do is take your time building it and don't force anything into slots. If it doesn't slide in as easy as you think it should you probably have something wrong.
Don't be afraid in the least bit to build your own. It also just makes it more enjoyable to own and you will be much more likely to keep it clean and dust free if you do it yourself.
 
Components only fit into the motherboard in one place and one direction, power supply leads only connect into the right size power header, the motherboard only fits in one location in the case and in one direction - it literally is nothing more than sticking things in the right-sized hole (innuendo not intended). Parts are designed to fit one way and one way only (CPU socket has a marker on a corner for correct alignment, PCI cards and RAM have notches in the row of contacts) and if you read the motherboard's manual it is impossible to put something in the wrong slot or connect things incorrectly, like getting the front panel leads backwards or trying to shove a SATA cable in a USB header :)

From experience I can tell you it honestly is nothing more than "put things in the only slot that fits and colour-code everything else"
 
For the most part I agree that it's fairly easy to build a PC, but installing the CPU and its cooler can be kind of a pain. Make sure you research this carefully and check out some videos. The CPU is delicate, so make sure it's lined up properly so you don't bend any of the pins. A beginner can easily put too much thermal grease on top of it, and heatsinks that require going under the motherboard can be tricky to install.

Although, if you keep the stock cooler, that's easier as it will have thermal paste pre-applied and will have a simpler mechanism to attach it to the board. I just like aftermarket coolers due to lower noise and more potential for overclocking/quieter overclock.
 
I probably won't be concerned with overclocking myself until I feel I need extra performance for exactly the above reason. Once again when the time comes (if) I'll be looking to GTP for guidance on whether or not I should be doing it and moreover a guide to doing so.

I'm certainly inspired to attempt a build now, it's something which appears to look (thanks to betty spaghetti wires) more complicated then it really is. It even sounds more difficult just to choose what parts to get as opposed to putting them together. As I said, I will be back when the time comes to make a shopping list of parts with GTPs guidance and then a build thread so I can ask stupid questions 👍.
 
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Dragonistic
Once again when the time comes (if) I'll be looking to GTP for guidance on whether or not I should be doing it and moreover a guide to doing so.
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Just don't listen to some of the "advice" you read in this C&T forum and you'll be sweet 👍
 
Sharky.
Just don't listen to some of the "advice" you read in this C&T forum and you'll be sweet 👍
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Well I certainly won't be acting on any advice which is not supported by others, for me if there's any doubt I won't be confident enough to go make a change I'm unsure of particular as regards overclocking. In all likelihood I'll probably try to avoid overclocking a part myself (is it only processors that get, or need to be commonly, overclocked?). Can you send parts to be overclocked professionally in the UK? I should imagine I won't need to worry about it in the short term though when I'm first making the system.
 
Dragonistic
Well I certainly won't be acting on any advice which is not supported by others, for me if there's any doubt I won't be confident enough to go make a change I'm unsure of particular as regards overclocking. In all likelihood I'll probably try to avoid overclocking a part myself (is it only processors that get, or need to be commonly, overclocked?). Can you send parts to be overclocked professionally in the UK? I should imagine I won't need to worry about it in the short term though when I'm first making the system.
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Don't worry about overclocking. It's not needed unless your system is old. Overclocking the cpu had shown me literally no improvements in gaming. Overclocking the GPU has helped with framrates though and is very very easy. MSI afterburner is a program that you just move sliders on and stay under the max voltage and your good. Again though it's really not needed and is just something for people who like to tinker and do benchmark tests.
 
Thanks, once again all the input so far is greatly appreciated and is helping me make alot of decisions. In reality there's a good chance my build may not take off for years, but now I have some degree of knowledge that I can start to make decisions now to put the money aside once I can. I'll probably wait until I have at least £1000 to spend before I start buying any parts and plan out my total build. I'll probably take much the same process as the OP, I'll use a website to build the system I think I want and post it to GTP for feedback and advice before making a build thread for specific installation and maintenance questions.
 
Gdog96
You should buy all the parts at the same time too, just throwing that in there :)
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I plan too, though I may get a few pieces earlier such as the case, PSU and 1 monitor (which I would have a use for already). The rest will all come at once, in one order hopefully.
 
I'm glad to see you have decided to build your own. It is your first step to geekdom! :D It's also nice to be using something that you built yourself. I will say that building your own is not without it's challenges, but hopefully all parts will be functioning out of the box and it will be a smooth build for you.

:cheers:
 
I'm sure I will come against an obstacle, or many, but with the information given it sounds more like any issue I do have won't require great technical skill and will be more simply taking care of what I do and following instructions.
 
Please name your first build Pauline.

If you don't, I'll hate you forever :lol:


Also, If you do end up stuck somewhere, there are many many helpful youtube videos out there (aside from asking here)
 
Tomshardware.com has monthly articles on best CPU and GPU for the $$$ for gaming. It's a good place to get an idea where you should go.
 
dice1998
Please name your first build Pauline.
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I could even get the case I'm looking at in the same colour scheme when the time comes :sly:. Though by the time I actually want to seriously plan my build who knows what will be available :lol:.
 

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