Different grade of tires: your experiences and opinions

  • Thread starter azidahaka
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azidahaka
i'm switching to harder compound now that i've lowered my force feedback setting.

i think that those that like to play on racing tires are those that like to wrestle the wheel because they find it more realistic; instead using a lower FFB (at least on my DFGT wheel) allows for very interesting and intense racing.

too high ffb on low grade tires makes it impossible to countersteer and fast controlling the car. The feeling is way better on race tires and race softs on max ffb....

i think i understood from where the tire grade debate and all the misunderstanding are coming.

i must be a genius lol
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What do you have your DFGT FFB set to?
 
The DFP and DFGT wheels tend to be sluggish at best. I love the heavy feedback of them but like you said, they're just too slow :(

On the flipside, my G27 is fast, but the feedback strength is a bit underwhelming.

Personally I still tend to leave mine cranked up. Strange but I think I'm actually a little more precise with heavier steering. Many disagree on this point but for me it works. (On the G27 anyway)
 
I don't mind the tires, because there is enough choice to suit everyone.

What I hate is the tire wear. It's not even close to realistic or even rational.

A brand new tire has a little less grip at the start, then the grip is pretty consistent for a good span of it's life. When you start to lose traction, your tires are done. In the game however, you have grip at "10" and you just keep losing it. Really, the grip difference you'd have at 8 is realistically what a worn tire feels like in comparison. A half worn tire is definitely not undriveable as it is in the game.

You want to go fast with a sport tire? Shave the tread. In the game, that would be a tire that is at like 4 or something. It's just useless and I hate when it's on in a race.
 
As ridiculous as it is for every car to have the same capacity, fuel consumption isn't horrible; but I couldn't agree more regarding tire degradation.

As an aside, I knew that name looked familiar when I saw it in a room a few minutes ago. :lol:
 
For all the hard compounds experts and those who want to give it a try i'm going to test with other friends today at 19:00 gmt in a friends only room for a new hop in and drive serie.

We'll race toyota 86 base model '12 stock, no tune no assist beside abs all on confort hard tires.

The car is just around 200hps and is easy to drive even on conforts so all are welcome to join :)

Just remember to befriend me! (Extra info on my signature, if it takes off will became a FGTA serie)
 
I'm sorry I made a new thread about tyre grades (My GT6 tyre philosophy) when there's already one.. Long story short -
COMFORT TYRES - All dot approved (road legal includind semi slicks)

CH - any tyre over 220/240 UTQG
CM - 120-220/240 UTQG
CS - Road legal Semi (60or80-100 UTQG)
SH - R compound Semi (lower than 60or80 UtQG
SM - Hard compound slick territory and probably Soft compound Semi slicks
SS - Definetely Slick only territory - no semi whatsoever

Examples:
Toyota GT 86 - Tyres: Michelin Primacy HP tyres 240 UTQG
Tyres in-game: Comfort Hard

Mazda RX8
Tyres: Bridgestone Potenza RE040 UTQG 140
Tyres in-game: Comfort Medium

Honda S2000
Tyres: Bridgestone Potenza RE050 UTQG 140
Tyres in-game: Comfort Medium

Bmw M3 CSL
Tyres: Michelin PILOT SPORT CUP UTQG 80
In-game: Comfort Soft

Lotus 111R
Tyres: Yokohama Advan 048 60 UTQG
In-game: Comfort Softs (maybe Sports Hard depending on Compound)
>>I don't know if AD048R are the same with AD048<<

My Mazda Mx5 1.8 1994
Tyres: 195/50/15 Toyo R888 100 UTQG
In-game: Comfort Softs (Definetely no SH, personal experience No no way :D)

Lamborghini Diablo GT
Tyres: Pirelli P ZERO Assymetric 220 UTQG
In-game: Comfort Medium (killer :P)

Nissan GTR R35
Tyres: Potenza RE 140 UTQG
In-game: Comfort Medium

Lots more - I'm not here to disagree with anyone and I'm not saying I'm completely right - it's something it works for me! Loving the new gt6 update!!

 
Back in GT5 someone had made a list of stock tires based on skidpad performance. I worked on a similar list for personal use on GT6. It only has premium cars and isn't very up to date, but it's here if people want to use it. If anyone has any questions about certain things I did, feel free to ask.
 
Stephanos82
Lotus 111R
Tyres: Yokohama Advan 048 60 UTQG
In-game: Comfort Softs (maybe Sports Hard depending on Compound)
>>I don't know if AD048R are the same with AD048<<
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Looks like the same tire.

As I said in your other thread, I totally agree. Public rooms love RS tires, but if the stickiest tire was the SS, everyone would adapt. I think the choice made in game design was more so that the average player saw a distinct difference and felt awesome.

...because let's face it, the chances that more than a handful of players could ACTUALLY beat Senna's lap times on the same tires is pretty low, much less beat it by a second or more.
 
LancerEvo7
Back in GT5 someone had made a list of stock tires based on skidpad performance. I worked on a similar list for personal use on GT6. It only has premium cars and isn't very up to date, but it's here if people want to use it. If anyone has any questions about certain things I did, feel free to ask.
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That guy was calan_svc (where is he now?) - his observation struck a chord within gtplanet but it wasn'r flawless! It was based on on a tyre's g result on a skidpad test but the test the results were taken from were all from different sources in different weather etc. Moreover GT doesn't have a g testing ground to accurately.

azidahaka
UTQG?
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= Uniform Tire Quality Grading - the lower it is the more grip it's "supposed" to have but it also wears out faster too!
It's a good indication of a tyre's potential but also to be taken with a grain of salt ;)
 
Just an update on my journey through tires; i've started a ch tires serie and driven some ridox replicas and ferraris in sh and cs, and i'm starting to get better.

The 4 wheels sliding is detectable and same is for all the setup unsettlements when u hit a curb or open throttle too soon. Loving it altought i'm not very competitive as @Kaisto and @gtp_litchi can confirm :D

Only disappointment is that hard compunds lover are vocal, many and enthusiast but do not seem to commit much to online racing
 
I'm still not sure if fitting lower grades of tires equates to a more realistic experience. While grip in terms of lateral acceleration gets more realistic, the car's behavior seems to get way more unrealistic. For example, the real life S2000 and RX-8 tend to stick to the road when cornering, while in GT6 fitting CH tires on them makes them very twitchy. So far the only car I've noticed needs tires a few grades lower than what it comes with is the GT 86 and its siblings.
 
Maxx2013
I'm still not sure if fitting lower grades of tires equates to a more realistic experience. While grip in terms of lateral acceleration gets more realistic, the car's behavior seems to get way more unrealistic. For example, the real life S2000 and RX-8 tend to stick to the road when cornering, while in GT6 fitting CH tires on them makes them very twitchy. So far the only car I've noticed needs tires a few grades lower than what it comes with is the GT 86 and its siblings.
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It's so much easier to push a car beyond it's limits in GT because there's no seat of the pants feedback to tell you when you've reached the limit. You're relying mainly on muscle memory and feedback from the steering peripheral, sound and visuals. What might appear to be twitchy in the game is just us exceeding the limits of the car, something you won't see much in real life except in crash videos.
 
Johnnypenso
It's so much easier to push a car beyond it's limits in GT because there's no seat of the pants feedback to tell you when you've reached the limit. You're relying mainly on muscle memory and feedback from the steering peripheral, sound and visuals. What might appear to be twitchy in the game is just us exceeding the limits of the car, something you won't see much in real life except in crash videos.
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I've heard S2000 owners talk about how hard it is to drift the car. The suspension was setup for grip, and the car has wide rear tires. There's a video on YouTube of some Japanese guys (I think it might have been Tsuchiya even) trying to drift one, and the only way he could get it sideways was to use some pretty aggressive Scandinavian flick maneuvers. In GT6 with CH tires I only need to lightly apply some throttle going into a corner and the rear starts kicking out. Real life reviews of the S2000 mention that flooring it in a corner plants the back end firmly onto the road. The AP1 was looser, but the AP2, which is what I was driving in GT6, has tighter handling.

Pretty much all of that applies to the RX-8 as well. Car is setup for grip, very hard to drift.

There's also another problem presented by using lower grade tires - excessive wheelspin. On some FWD cars you can even faintly hear the tires squealing when driving full throttle at high speeds in a straight line. At first I thought I was hearing things, but nope, it's there.

I really wanted to think that using lower grade tires would make the game more realistic and have experimented with this quite a bit but the benefit is only in more realistic lateral G numbers. There just seem to be too many other drawbacks with most cars. I'd rather have my cars "feel" close to the real thing than try to pursue realistic numbers. This game doesn't have much of a sense of speed anyway, so the cars don't usually feel like they corner too fast on the standard tires they come with.
 
Maxx2013
I've heard S2000 owners talk about how hard it is to drift the car. The suspension was setup for grip, and the car has wide rear tires. There's a video on YouTube of some Japanese guys (I think it might have been Tsuchiya even) trying to drift one, and the only way he could get it sideways was to use some pretty aggressive Scandinavian flick maneuvers. In GT6 with CH tires I only need to lightly apply some throttle going into a corner and the rear starts kicking out. Real life reviews of the S2000 mention that flooring it in a corner plants the back end firmly onto the road. The AP1 was looser, but the AP2, which is what I was driving in GT6, has tighter handling.

Pretty much all of that applies to the RX-8 as well. Car is setup for grip, very hard to drift.

There's also another problem presented by using lower grade tires - excessive wheelspin. On some FWD cars you can even faintly hear the tires squealing when driving full throttle at high speeds in a straight line. At first I thought I was hearing things, but nope, it's there.

I really wanted to think that using lower grade tires would make the game more realistic and have experimented with this quite a bit but the benefit is only in more realistic lateral G numbers. There just seem to be too many other drawbacks with most cars. I'd rather have my cars "feel" close to the real thing than try to pursue realistic numbers. This game doesn't have much of a sense of speed anyway, so the cars don't usually feel like they corner too fast on the standard tires they come with.
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You're really talking about multiple flaws in the GT physics engine, car suspension modeling, tire modeling and even sound. The squealing tire thing is definitely real, and annoying as hell. The tire model is a generic one, same tire for all cars, which isn't the case in real life. The suspension modeling is the same IMO. It's a combination of generic factors like overall grip level, weight distribution etc. Comprimises have to be made in order to model hundreds of cars so we can't expect GT to accurately model what happens with any particular car and I don't believe they try to. I think they are just giving us an approximation of each car's handling attributes and they do a decent job considering how many cars they have to deal with.

It's my belief that this is the type of work Project Cars is doing, more individually tailored car tuning to simulate real life performance and not trying to slot cars into some type of generic physics/suspension/tire modeling system. GT6 is more of a game for the masses, more like a buffet than a high end gourmet restaurant.
 
Maxx2013
I've heard S2000 owners talk about how hard it is to drift the car. The suspension was setup for grip, and the car has wide rear tires. There's a video on YouTube of some Japanese guys (I think it might have been Tsuchiya even) trying to drift one, and the only way he could get it sideways was to use some pretty aggressive Scandinavian flick maneuvers. In GT6 with CH tires I only need to lightly apply some throttle going into a corner and the rear starts kicking out. Real life reviews of the S2000 mention that flooring it in a corner plants the back end firmly onto the road. The AP1 was looser, but the AP2, which is what I was driving in GT6, has tighter handling.

Pretty much all of that applies to the RX-8 as well. Car is setup for grip, very hard to drift.

There's also another problem presented by using lower grade tires - excessive wheelspin. On some FWD cars you can even faintly hear the tires squealing when driving full throttle at high speeds in a straight line. At first I thought I was hearing things, but nope, it's there.

I really wanted to think that using lower grade tires would make the game more realistic and have experimented with this quite a bit but the benefit is only in more realistic lateral G numbers. There just seem to be too many other drawbacks with most cars. I'd rather have my cars "feel" close to the real thing than try to pursue realistic numbers. This game doesn't have much of a sense of speed anyway, so the cars don't usually feel like they corner too fast on the standard tires they come with.
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Are you sure that those were not the driving aids still kicking? in modern cars you rarely can get rid of completely of the driving aids except with hacks and fuses off. The driver controls just soften the aids but not to the extents of disabling them like is possible with GT.

The factory 350Z, as is expected on a road tuned car, was the same as you are describing.

350z0ns6f.jpg


At 16:35:



But that is far from the real character of the car:




And here is another great example of a modern sports car transformation when ALL the factory aids are completely removed.

 
Very informative post. You may be right, Zer0 (are you the Zer0 from GT5 shuffle racing lobbies by the way?). AP2 S2000's seem to have a stability control system that can't be turned off with the push of a button. I just tried an S2000 on CH tires with Active Stability Management (ASM) enabled and it felt pretty tight.
 
Great topic and thread, i've started using a wheel in the past few months and while I can drive fine around the track, when it comes to the limits in terms of grip I start to struggle. So I started recently driving an rx-7 fd on comfort hards as a way of learning countersteering (a long term goal of mine is being able to drift as well as I can on the pad) and just learning the car in general. What I didn't expect was to start getting much better at driving in general and at a much aster rate than I was previously progressing, not to mention a bucket load of added fun-factor.

I'm still using ABS at the moment as I first thought it acted as it does in real life but learnt it doesn't from this thread. So now i'm looking forward to the next stage and turning off all ABS and driving that way as well.

Just wanted to say thanks for all the in-depth discussion as i'm looking forward to trying out all manner of cars in a more realistic fashion
 
I typically put Racing Softs on my best cars and leave the default tires on cars I buy since I'm not gonna spend money on tires more of the time.
 
It's a shame there's no skidpad resource available in-game (perfect use of GT Arena, I think) because it seems so many people associate a tire's grip with how well a car exhibits turn-in or how long it takes a 1000hp Viper to stop smoking. The very first thing I look at is the lateral sheer threshold--which even transcends driving aids (except SRF)--and have experienced much more realistic limits on lower grade tires in cars I'm familiar with than I have linear grip on the same compounds.

What @qdog said is the sort of thing I really love to see. Sure, people should play the way they get the most enjoyment and only the way they get the most enjoyment, but if someone gets that enjoyment by trying something they wouldn't necessarily have tried had they not seen this discussion--and even refined their capabilities to the point that they get even more enjoyment out of the way they'd previously played the game--I'd say the discussion served its purpose.
 

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