F1 and the future of GT

Chris123
did you see what they did in gt5 with those ferrari's, seriously gran turismo doesnt need f1 it would just be rushed and would just plain suck like in gt5, stick with codemasters
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How about not giving anyone an exclusive license? All an "exclusive" license ever does is promote lazy annual release titles with horrible results (I'm looking at you, EA). Just at the NASCAR license, Eutechnyx had all the tracks and the whole championship yet they still can't even make a good game that isn't filled with bugs (online lag, Terrible AI, disappearing paint schemes). If you ask me, non of the licensed games of any kind have been that spectacular.

As for PD having licenses, I think everyone might be having their expectations too high. They'll never focus on one category of cars or license (They don't even have all the tracks for Super GT) so to somehow expect them to ever accomplish it is unrealistic from the start. The only reason the Ferrari F1 cars made it to GT5 is because somehow Ferrari is completely excused from the F1 license clause so really what else could PD have done with only one licensed F1 car? (apart from maybe some F1 themed Time Trial Seasonals)
 
@RACERCAR
whats your point then, i wouldnt expect them to implement f1 in gran turismo to a decent standard, id rather they just leave it out all together, stick with the lower categories n such, then again i think were taking this too seriously, gran turismo has never really been that realistic to begin with, i just remember seeing a video of the f10 going around nordschleife like it was some sort of alien spacecraft and it just makes the game seem silly thats all
 
Chris123
@RACERCAR
whats your point then, i wouldnt expect them to implement f1 in gran turismo to a decent standard, id rather they just leave it out all together, stick with the lower categories n such, then again i think were taking this too seriously, gran turismo has never really been that realistic to begin with, i just remember seeing a video of the f10 going around nordschleife like it was some sort of alien spacecraft and it just makes the game seem silly thats all
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The point was the expectation of PD to fully implement a license when they hardly have had all of the tracks for any car series is pointless. They always have had a sampling of many different series, never the full thing and that was without licensing. There's also that fact that honestly, Licensed games have severly lost quality in them over time with these annual releases and the repeated theme of having nearly the exact same thing as the previous year sans an updated Roster, which leaves me to question the point of having them anymore since its clear you don't need the series license to have the cars and tracks for most of them (which might be F1 next if Forza 5 having Lotus is any indication).
 
Chris123
@RACERCAR
whats your point then, i wouldnt expect them to implement f1 in gran turismo to a decent standard, id rather they just leave it out all together, stick with the lower categories n such, then again i think were taking this too seriously, gran turismo has never really been that realistic to begin with, i just remember seeing a video of the f10 going around nordschleife like it was some sort of alien spacecraft and it just makes the game seem silly thats all
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Saying to leave it out altogether is sorta like saying leave out the LMP1 field, we don't have any 2's so I can't bitch about that. Leave out all the GT's because we don't have proper competitors who have actually raced against each other. We don't have all the NASCAR's so why bother with them. We don't have all the GT 5/300. 'S so forget those too... And we don't have all the historic Le Mans racers so scratch that out....

That statement basically is such a cliche, that we can summiteers the question "what's the point of GT?" Is it really a driving sim, or a collaboration of cars around the world from different time periods, or is it just for a simple knowledge base for the "casual gamer"...? If PD wants to please everyone, they will have to learn how to correctly do class racing. Then once they look at what they got, they'll say "ooh ****, we got a Sauber C9 against a c6 LMR.." What good is a racing game, if you have to beat the game through unrealistic measures. That is where you get people saying the AI is too easy, or that this car is broken. We do not have equal competitors to make the game fun or competitive at all.

We can clearly tell from GT Academy that matching the same car for everyone makes the game a lot more competitive. So why the hell don't they do this with the career? Simple. It's gonna take a lot of time, and money. Something we all know that PD is too slow to implement for their top priority of utmost perfection, which slows down the production process, and costs way too much money...
 
Swagger897
Saying to leave it out altogether is sorta like saying leave out the LMP1 field, we don't have any 2's so I can't bitch about that. Leave out all the GT's because we don't have proper competitors who have actually raced against each other. We don't have all the NASCAR's so why bother with them. We don't have all the GT 5/300. 'S so forget those too... And we don't have all the historic Le Mans racers so scratch that out....

That statement basically is such a cliche, that we can summiteers the question "what's the point of GT?" Is it really a driving sim, or a collaboration of cars around the world from different time periods, or is it just for a simple knowledge base for the "casual gamer"...? If PD wants to please everyone, they will have to learn how to correctly do class racing. Then once they look at what they got, they'll say "ooh ****, we got a Sauber C9 against a c6 LMR.." What good is a racing game, if you have to beat the game through unrealistic measures. That is where you get people saying the AI is too easy, or that this car is broken. We do not have equal competitors to make the game fun or competitive at all.

We can clearly tell from GT Academy that matching the same car for everyone makes the game a lot more competitive. So why the hell don't they do this with the career? Simple. It's gonna take a lot of time, and money. Something we all know that PD is too slow to implement for their top priority of utmost perfection, which slows down the production process, and costs way too much money...
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seriously i cant even understand what your on about, i lost track after the first paragraph, this is my point, the f1 in gt5 was ridiculous, the other stuff they do is alright but f1 is a big no, not because there was only two cars or anything but because it just doesnt fit a gran turismo game and the physics were just absurd in gt5, like i said, check out a vid from gt5 of the ferrari f1 going around nurburgring and tell me you can keep a straight face
 
Chris123
seriously i cant even understand what your on about, i lost track after the first paragraph, this is my point, the f1 in gt5 was ridiculous, the other stuff they do is alright but f1 is a big no, not because there was only two cars or anything but because it just doesnt fit a gran turismo game and the physics were just absurd in gt5, like i said, check out a vid from gt5 of the ferrari f1 going around nurburgring and tell me you can keep a straight face
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I have seen the video multiple times. My rant was over the fact that PD doesn't add the full class. When I do a race at Le Mans in a C6 LMR, I'd expect to see some V 8 Vantages, 458 spyders, (I'd say 911 but not...) and any other competitor it has faced. I shouldn't have to go up against a Sauber C9 and have to raise my bhp to 9,000... That is where people complain about having poor AI, when actually they are not racing the right cars the correct way..

I then Mentioned GT Academy to show how much competition there was. The same cars (or similar) wil be more competitive and fun, rather than a C6 vs. C9.
 
That's because PD has never had a multiclass system whatsoever (notice how they have separate championships for the GT300 cars and GT500 cars). Just seems like the fields are randomly generated.

Also, I never race a GT car at Le Mans unless its online, I only race LMPs purely because I know I have no shot in a GT car without ridiculous modifications (which I don't want).
 
RACECAR
That's because PD has never had a multiclass system whatsoever (notice how they have separate championships for the GT300 cars and GT500 cars). Just seems like the fields are randomly generated.

Also, I never race a GT car at Le Mans unless its online, I only race LMPs purely because I know I have no shot in a GT car without ridiculous modifications (which I don't want).
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That's the point. Allow us to select, or just let the UI do it, the class we want to race against and put only those cars in. It's really not that hard, until you think of all the other cars we have which won't fill this in.

But I guess you could add in the livery paint chips and just do that, rather than making a brand new car..
 
I see alot of you going for and against more f1 cars in gt6. Many of you have good points. Like the fact that the game is completed way too fast, and needs more content. For my part, its not about having a f1 championship added to the game. Nor is it being able to chose between varius f1 cars, but simply having atleast ONE F1 car that drives like a F1 do in the modern F1 world. Like there was in GT5, The ferrari07 was enough for me. Why i want another F1 car in the game? Its not that the one we have is not driveable, or is a horrible car. But the modern F1 car is not so much about horsepower and more about grip and downforce. Wich in the end makes it a way more fun car to drive in a game. Personally i i don't like the Polypony F1 car, because its ONLY vulgar and forces a drivingstyle that is so far away from any modern F1 car you see on Tv as you can get. So just to wrap it up. Having the option to do free runs with a modern F1 car. Having the Lotus car into the game so i can makebelieve i'm senna for a while and adding the course maker back into the game would make it perfect for me. But untill then, i'll be playing gt5.

Just adding a little thing. Those of you telling us to piss off to f1 2013.. Isn't that a little ignorant? The games are diffrent in every way. There are over a thousand cars in GT6. I'm not saying there has to be a Ferrari or Mclarrien. But a F1 car that behaves like a modern car does. Who cares what the car is called, as long as its priorities are somewhat up-to-date?
 
Better to have one separate game for F1. The physics in GT6 may be exceptional, but I really would rather not have GT wasting more time for something that has been developed much more in another game. Better for them to concentrate on event creators, shuffle races, AI and the likes.
 
Licensing is a huge issue, they'd better off without the current F1 cars, and maybe they should use the old V10 cars from early 2000's.
Besides, we have the Red Bull cars.

To me they're simply not as fun to play as the slower road cars or typical 500-600 race cars.
 
Swagger897
I shouldn't have to go up against a Sauber C9 and have to raise my bhp to 9,000... That is where people complain about having poor AI, when actually they are not racing the right cars the correct way..
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The AI is poor. More than apparent in a spec race. The fact that PD doesn't have many racing categories that have a depth of cars is another issue completely.

As for F1, they should bin the idea. I don't think PD are capable of doing a lot with a little when it comes to car count, and they're in all probability not going to get more than two F1 cars in GT7.
 
ShiftingGears
The AI is poor. More than apparent in a spec race. The fact that PD doesn't have many racing categories that have a depth of cars is another issue completely.

As for F1, they should bin the idea. I don't think PD are capable of doing a lot with a little when it comes to car count, and they're in all probability not going to get more than two F1 cars in GT7.
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Although there is the ever-so weak AI, take a fiat panda and race it against another panda (or any car for that matter) stock and look how close it is though.

When people soup up their cars and then complain on here the AI is too weak, that is what I'm trying to get to. No doubt that it's still poor and defenseless almost, but that is part if the problem.
 
Swagger897
Although there is the ever-so weak AI, take a fiat panda and race it against another panda (or any car for that matter) stock and look how close it is though.
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Maybe for you. But everyone is not the same. There are people more skilled than you, who will find the AI to be unacceptably weak. No doubt there are people less skilled as well, who will find the AI to be a great challenge.

But it seems to me from the general outcry on GTP that a majority of players on here find the AI to be far too easy when given equal machinery.
 
Few cases I have trouble with it, but also I guess I should mention the apparent issue with the AI slowing down and speeding up for the players? So many things are wrong just with just how they are set up, but much more can be debated about the actual driving skills of the AI...
 
LMSCorvetteGT2
Why, should we play that when it hasn't been that good compared to GT (though subjective), why should people have to buy multiple racing games just to enjoy a certain car. Having it all under one umbrella as PD have tried for years now seems best
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Because the more you try to do, the less accurate each individual part will be. When you want to simulate everything from a kart to an F1 with everything in-between, and you want hundreds of cars, you're going to suffer in many areas.

I can see the convenience of having everything under one roof, but it really is in everyone's best interest to invest in multiple games that focus on different things done well and enjoy the crap out of them rather than wait for GT (or whatever other game) to get everything perfect on a mass scale which isn't happening any time soon.
 
This implies that Gran Turismo has a future to begin with. Car manufacturers are noticing GT6's sales slump. Which is likely why the Vision GT project has fallen on its face. I can only assume motor sports marketing departments have noticed this as well.
 
Duphman
This implies that Gran Turismo has a future to begin with. Car manufacturers are noticing GT6's sales slump. Which is likely why the Vision GT project has fallen on its face. I can only assume motor sports marketing departments have noticed this as well.
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Two things:

1. What does a game's sales have to do with designing a fictional concept that won't sale? Car Manufacterers I'm sure are far more concerned with their sales then a game's sales, they may use them to further extend their brand or draw the desired audience but its hardly big enough for everyone to just stop what they are doing. Besides, we don't even know how far along the manufacturers are with their VGT projects.

2. Of course no one is going to advertise GT6 in motorsports, its on a Console that Sony doesn't even promote anymore (and very few people care about now) so even if this game were selling well, no one cares when there is a newer console that came out not to long ago (Look no further then Forza adverts at this past weekend's Long Beach Grand Prix). When it comes down to it, GT6 is on an old and dusty machine whereas Forza is on a new and shiny machine and what do you think today's short-attention span audience will gravitate more towards?
 
Darragh
Better to have one separate game for F1. The physics in GT6 may be exceptional, but I really would rather not have GT wasting more time for something that has been developed much more in another game. Better for them to concentrate on event creators, shuffle races, AI and the likes.
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This. F1 is a complicated sport. To do it justice would require a dedicated game. Or people could just play iRacing. We need a track editor, the one they promised.
 
Cosbuster
Because the more you try to do, the less accurate each individual part will be. When you want to simulate everything from a kart to an F1 with everything in-between, and you want hundreds of cars, you're going to suffer in many areas.
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That's quite the excuse, it isn't as if were asking PD to make a jet fighter/tank/bike racing/driving/motor sports game with space flight and equestrian side game. OR is that how it sounds to you?

I and many others didn't ask for 1200 cars the increase was probably the only last part of the original "Kaz" dream for GT, making it a playable car encyclopedia. Also many others are dong just what you say is all but impossible to do without major issues. This is the movement of sim racing on console and PC and many want the game of our choice to do the same. Why is that an issue? Or are you saying PD are incompetent to the task at hand, or something else?

I can see the convenience of having everything under one roof, but it really is in everyone's best interest to invest in multiple games that focus on different things done well and enjoy the crap out of them rather than wait for GT (or whatever other game) to get everything perfect on a mass scale which isn't happening any time soon.
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No it's not in everyone's best interest and when did you become my financial account and investment guide? The fact that you and those who agree with you can't fathom to achieve on such a leave and rather suffice with the minimum "cause I don't think I and those I follow should work hard" (at least that's how I read it) is quite daft.
 
If they're going to add F1, they should do what Forza's doing; add older models. Given PD taste for weird cars they should give us the oddball relics from the past. I don't think we need to include the new F1 cars given that they have their own game. Add cars like the six-wheeled Tyrrell P34 or Fan Car Brabham BT46 (which should be recreate easy given PD's X1 cars)

How easy it would be to get said license is beyond me
 
GT and the history of F1. I wouldn't say no to some cars from the 50's and 60's.

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LMSCorvetteGT2
That's quite the excuse, it isn't as if were asking PD to make a jet fighter/tank/bike racing/driving/motor sports game with space flight and equestrian side game. OR is that how it sounds to you?
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It's not an excuse, it's an observation. When you focus on fewer things, you can do them much better.

LMSCorvetteGT2
Also many others are dong just what you say is all but impossible to do without major issues. This is the movement of sim racing on console and PC and many want the game of our choice to do the same.
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Who is doing top-notch physics at the level of Assetto Corsa with hundreds of different cars? I'd sure like to play that.

LMSCorvetteGT2
Why is that an issue? Or are you saying PD are incompetent to the task at hand, or something else?
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It's an issue because the games that are part of this "movement" suffer in many areas which I've been pointing out.


LMSCorvetteGT2
No it's not in everyone's best interest and when did you become my financial account and investment guide?
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All I'm saying is that if you want to have a good Nascar experience (Or whatever experience it is you might want), you are going to have the best time by playing a game dedicated to it.

LMSCorvetteGT2
The fact that you and those who agree with you can't fathom to achieve on such a leave and rather suffice with the minimum "cause I don't think I and those I follow should work hard" (at least that's how I read it) is quite daft.
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Not sure I said something like that. I think you are under the impression that I have been trying to "defend" PD which I'm not a big fan of to begin with.
 
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Cosbuster
It's not an excuse, it's an observation. When you focus on fewer things, you can do them much better.
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Obviously, but at this point it'd be an excuse in the fact that others have shown us they can do it and PD somehow can't? I'm quite sure PD can.

Who is doing top-notch physics at the level of Assetto Corsa with hundreds of different cars? I'd sure like to play that.
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FM's physics are quite a bit better than GT but this isn't that thread and you can visit it to see how. Also not sure why a person would need 1200+ cars to enjoy Assetto Corsa physics...

It's an issue because the games that are part of this "movement" suffer in many areas which I've been pointing out.
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Like what? I've seen you point out stuff...let's just keep it at that. And it doesn't answer the question I directed at you, rather hints that you don't think they're capable due to the other stuff you've said.


All I'm saying is that if you want to have a good Nascar experience (Or whatever experience it is you might want), you are going to have the best time by playing a game dedicated to it.
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No you're not. Maybe fore customized features but the new NASCAR games are arcade games more so than simulators and the best game that does NASCAR is iRacing at the moment and they're not a dedicated NASCAR game. Even GT does a better job that the new NASCAR only games.

Not sure I said something like that. I think you are under the impression that I have been trying to "defend" PD which I'm not a big fan of to begin with.
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By saying what you've said you are basically giving up on the idea that such a game can be crafted. Now I'm not saying a game with all the crap that PD wants right now with GT6 can be perfected maybe on the PS4 or a switch to PC, but not on the PS3 and surely not with the half attempts give because updating the majority is rather a crutch they've fallen on. I'm not defending PD either obviously, and really defending or not isn't the issue I have. Rather, the idea that putting forth an effort to build a game not for money as a priority but giving a true sim that houses everything somehow can't be achieved.
 
I would like to see see more F1 tracks in GT6/7. I don't want GTx to become a full-fledged F1 sim racer as this would mean focusing only on F1 instead of the variety of GT racing. Give us some tracks and more open-wheel cars and I'm fine with it.
 
IMO If you want great physics + GT atmosphere you guys should try Assetto Corsa, it has old F1 and new. It's so similar to GT with variety of car era and class. Plus the mod support. But that's only if you have a decent enough gaming pc. I was very disappointed when I found out there was no F1 on GT6 though. Hope GT7 is an overhaul when it arrives.
 

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