The Hate for the X1's

  • Thread starter iName
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Where did the term "X1" came from?
because it's actually called X2010, X2011/prototype and X2014
 
Early stages of GT5 it was called the X1. BMW had an issue with that, they have an X1 model, and Polyphony changed it accordingly.
 
332i
Because it is a stupid, fictious car that is merely another redbull scheme attempt. They sound ridiculous, look ridiculous, drive ridiculous, ridiculous amounts of downforce, etc. It also looks like a jet boat with enclose wheels. And Adrian newey may have "designed" it...but that is nothing more than a drawing of his brought to life by poliphony. At the time of him doing that for GT, it was also the pinnacle of the aero wars for the V8 era of f1. Like I said, it is a sleek drawing. It is an formula car with a little extra bodywork and a canopy.

They're flat out stupid and very few rooms online run at full power anyways. They're usually running roughly in the same area as the lotus and FGT, but it has far, far more downforce and is way easier to drive. It is like an FGT that has SRF fixed on with more torque.

I don't knock people who race them, I just think the car is silly and too easy to drive. You can go to places like trial mountain and skip kerbs that should shatter that suspension. The high pitch junk note is the final nail in the coffin for me as far as that car goes.

Also, X1 is obviously a spin off of "F1". I find that silly as well. Nothing about the X1 resembles an F1 car. It's not even an open wheel car in reality. It is formula libre to the max.
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The car is not supposed to be an F1 car or an open wheeler. It doesn't have more body than necessary and the whole car is designed around aerodynamics, either to reduce drag (mostly) or provide downforce. You make it sound like Newey only made a drawing a PD modeled it. It's not true. There's a lot of thought put in the car, and every part of the car has a technical reason to be the way it is (specially on the X2014).

In theory the car could be driven by an untrained person. In fact I think even in the current design the human factor is holding the car back. If it was unmanned it could be a lot faster. Also, the car is not breaking any laws of physics as far as I can tell.

BrandonW77
The VGT's and other concept cars in the game that don't really exist at least behave/handle/respond like normal cars would. The X cars do not behave/handle/respond like a normal car would, instead are more like a slot car where physics don't apply and to me that's not the least bit appealing and why I have no desire to drive one. Others may not share that opinion, and I'm not saying they should. But I don't own any of them, nor will I ever.
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The VGT cars seem to behave like real cars because their stats are more familiar with cars that already exist, so by comparision you can expect how the cars will handle. The RB cars doesn't have anything similar you can compare them to in real life, so it's harder to tell how realistic is it's performance.

I understand why some of you don't like the cars. I don't like all the cars in the game either. I'm probably not going to change your minds. But I thought I could tell the cars are not as unrealistic as you may think.
 
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Well, as a lot of people already said, it's mainly the (usually) talentless driver that makes 'encountering' the car online why people hate it.

That people don't like how it looks or drives is totally subjective, a matter of taste, not a fact, therefore an invalid argument in the overall scheme of things.

I do consider it a fact that in GT5 it was too easy to obtain one and caused a lot of people who were unable to control it to use it. Especially those people using it online made even me hating it. It definitely sucks out the fun when someone starts smashing into everyone and ruin their race/lap.

In GT6 the cars are slightly harder to get and their driving characteristics are a bit more manageable to a broader range of driving skills. The junior car in my opinion is a great car that can be used online for racing even by lesser skilled racers. I don't consider myself a very high skilled racer but it is a lot of fun. The fan-less car does require a 'above average' skill set to race it online in my opinion. The fan car is still a bit over the top for me personally, the concentration it requires sucks the fun out of it for me.

Oh and to the question a few posts back, about if the car were real and you were given the opportunity to drive it, I would definitely take it, sure the car has the potential to kill me, but I probably can't make use of it to the point were it kills me.. And if it does, I'd rather die than pass on the opportunity.
 
notStig
The car is not supposed to be an F1 car or an open wheeler. It doesn't have more body than necessary and the whole car is designed around aerodynamics, either to reduce drag (mostly) or provide downforce. You make it sound like Newey only made a drawing a PD modeled it. It's not true. There's a lot of thought put in the car, and every part of the car has a technical reason to be the way it is (specially on the X2014).

In theory the car could be driven by an untrained person. In fact I think even in the current design the human factor is holding the car back. If it was unmanned it could be a lot faster. Also, the car is not breaking any laws of physics as far as I can tell.



The VGT cars seem to behave like real cars because their stats are more familiar with cars that already exist, so by comparision you can expect how the cars will handle. The RB cars doesn't have anything similar you can compare them to in real life, so it's harder to tell how realistic is it's performance.

I understand why some of you don't like the cars. I don't like all the cars in the game either. I'm probably not going to change your minds. But I thought I could tell the cars are not as unrealistic as you may think.
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Lol

The only thing I have patience to address is that if is indeed a drawing of neweys brought to life. It is a drawing done by someone who understands fluid dynamics extremely well. Probably one of the bests in the field on the planet. I was surprised they put them back in GT6, to be honest. I figured anyone would have got if out of their system by then.

There are two points to the RB cars. One is for sense of speed. The other is that it is for kids, because I'm not quite sure who else wouldn't scoff at it/who else it would appeal to. It is not as if it is a an engineer or physicist dream to look at lol
 
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332i
Lol

The only thing I have patience to address is that if is indeed a drawing of neweys brought to life. It is a drawing done by someone who understands fluid dynamics extremely well. Probably one of the bests in the field on the planet. I was surprised they put them back in GT6, to be honest. I figured anyone would have got if out of their system by then.

There are two points to the RB cars. One is for sense of speed. The other is that it is for kids, because I'm not quite sure who else wouldn't scoff at it/who else it would appeal to. It is not as if it is a an engineer or physicist dream to look at lol
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As you said it is designed by a specialist in fluid dynamics, which is cruicial when you build a car that's supposed to be as fast as the Red Bulls. Under the body, there's nothing really revolutionary about the car. In fact there's nothing that stands out in the car that hasn't been done before. It's a compilation of proven technology put together in the same car. The car is so fast because it uses very well the air around it.
It's not really surprising the car was not dropped because it became instantly associated with the game. Even more than the VGT cars. I would not be surprised if the car is brought back in future installments. It helps promote the game. Besides, it has it's admirers as you can see in this thread. Also I wouldn't say it's aimed for kids. These cars are to engineering what the VGT are to designers. It's an oportunity for them to create something free from rules or regulation without the pressure of a real project. And I bet they have fun creating them because of that. It may not be a dream car but it is very interesting to study the car to understand the science behind it.
 
notStig
As you said it is designed by a specialist in fluid dynamics, which is cruicial when you build a car that's supposed to be as fast as the Red Bulls. Under the body, there's nothing really revolutionary about the car. In fact there's nothing that stands out in the car that hasn't been done before. It's a compilation of proven technology put together in the same car. The car is so fast because it uses very well the air around it.
It's not really surprising the car was not dropped because it became instantly associated with the game. Even more than the VGT cars. I would not be surprised if the car is brought back in future installments. It helps promote the game. Besides, it has it's admirers as you can see in this thread. Also I wouldn't say it's aimed for kids. These cars are to engineering what the VGT are to designers. It's an oportunity for them to create something free from rules or regulation without the pressure of a real project. And I bet they have fun creating them because of that. It may not be a dream car but it is very interesting to study the car to understand the science behind it.
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What proven technology? What tech at all? It doesn't feature anything but the ability to drive it. I don't understand. In the game, it is a car with a motor, four wheels and a lot of downforce. It is simple. Any sort of tech is a fantasy that doesn't really exist, even in the game. How is that different from any other car in the game? Saying it features any sort of technology is BS fantasy entertainment in the description. Just like the FGT. Ohh, it features the most recent technology of formula 1 and has a v12, abs, TCS, etc. Read it's description. It is laughable. In the game, it is again, just another car with four wheels and a lot of downforce. Any mention of "tech" is a little cheesy extra lol.

You welcome to your opinion, but I would do some more reading about Adrian newey and his contract with RBR. To be honest, Newey most likely did not even design this and PD paid for the rights to say as such or have him endorse it as his own. His contract with RBR has no unbarred holes. They also just resigned him after Ferrari offered him a 50 million plus contract for a year...plus many other enticements. RBR offered him something better, just to keep him from any other teams. He is not even designing cars for them for the 2015 season. Now that I've thought about it...I would be very surprised if he honestly drew that up himself.

"For a car to go like that" and all...it is a GT game. They can make the car do whatever it wants.

I think you just really like the car and want to believe what you want to about it. Nothing wrong with that.
 
332i
You welcome to your opinion, but I would do some more reading about Adrian newey and his contract with RBR. To be honest, Newey most likely did not even design this and PD paid for the rights to say as such or have him endorse it as his own.
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Your opinion is uninformed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Bull_X2010

http://www.redbull.com/cs/Satellite/en_INT/Article/GT5-to-star-Newey’s-dream-machine-021242903258723

adrian-newey-and-kazunori-yamauchi-gran-turismo-6.jpg
 
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332i
What proven technology? What tech at all? It doesn't feature anything but the ability to drive it. I don't understand. In the game, it is a car with a motor, four wheels and a lot of downforce. It is simple. Any sort of tech is a fantasy that doesn't really exist, even in the game. How is that different from any other car in the game? Saying it features any sort of technology is BS fantasy entertainment in the description. Just like the FGT. Ohh, it features the most recent technology of formula 1 and has a v12, abs, TCS, etc. Read it's description. It is laughable. In the game, it is again, just another car with four wheels and a lot of downforce. Any mention of "tech" is a little cheesy extra lol.

You welcome to your opinion, but I would do some more reading about Adrian newey and his contract with RBR. To be honest, Newey most likely did not even design this and PD paid for the rights to say as such or have him endorse it as his own. His contract with RBR has no unbarred holes. They also just resigned him after Ferrari offered him a 50 million plus contract for a year...plus many other enticements. RBR offered him something better, just to keep him from any other teams. He is not even designing cars for them for the 2015 season. Now that I've thought about it...I would be very surprised if he honestly drew that up himself.

"For a car to go like that" and all...it is a GT game. They can make the car do whatever it wants.

I think you just really like the car and want to believe what you want to about it. Nothing wrong with that.
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When I talked about technology I meant the car doesn't use hybrid systems, eletric motors, active aero/suspension and all the stuff that is becomeing more common nowadays that make the car go faster. However, the car has an engine, gearbox and there's a huge enphasis on improving aerodynamics. That is also technology, however simulated.

Besides, although the car only exists in the game, the game has rules and laws the car has to respect. GT being a simulator these laws are analogous to the ones in the real world. You can't just draw anything and stipulate how the car will behave. If you do you are breaking the laws of physics in the game and you can no longer call the game a simulator.

It's fine if you don't like the car, I was just trying to show there are technical reasons why the car is not as unreal as you may think. I like the cars, but they are not my favourites in the game and I rarely use them.
 
Only thing I'm going to bother addressing is that no top tier series allow active aero or suspension. All banned. All long ago. Like I said. Nothing special. Just a bunch of values from polyphony under a drawing. Idk how you can argue with that.
 
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BrandonW77
Your opinion is uninformed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Bull_X2010

http://www.redbull.com/cs/Satellite/en_INT/Article/GT5-to-star-Newey’s-dream-machine-021242903258723

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I guess I've just paid too much attention to F1 and been a fan of Newey for too long to form such an uniformed opinion.

"And here's a posed picture a Newey sitting in front of a design with Kaz. And here's something from redbull.." Those are the only two that benefit from saying newey designed it. It hurt neither. They have no reason to say otherwise to the public. From a common sense persepective in F1...it just wouldn't and shouldn't be done. And it is not. If you look at it, the whole body is an air funnel and it is using blown diffuser-esque panels in the rear where most is funneled. These are things that a fresh graduate who is very good with FD could do in his sleep. There is no reason to involve newey, other than to be a figure head, which is most likely the case. RBR wouldn't allow him to design it, because they can't even hire someone to make sure he hasn't included something that he shouldn't have or something they could have used, etc. It is a drawing of an air funnel with wheels, wings and a canopy with a huge diffuser. All you need to draw that is have a remedial understanding of how and why air travels and trails along panels, etc.

If rbr will shell out over 50mill euros for a year to him, so he doesn't go to Ferrari, merc or mclaren...you think they turned him lose while that was the exact period in time where they were doing crazy wings and wing pods, using the exhaust as extra air volume to pass over the car, etc., etc.? No way in hell. He would have to and did deliberately NOT make it a work of FD art. That's if he even drew it. No way Christian Horner would have turned him loose for a video game. Newey is a figurehead to boast the car to f1 fans. Same with vettel. Most don't know who newey is. Everyone knows what red bull is and then you have a silly car to appeal to kids. It's a trifecta to poliphony.
 
332i
I guess I've just paid too much attention to F1 and been a fan of Newey for too long to form such an uniformed opinion.

"And here's a posed picture a Newey sitting in front of a design with Kaz. And here's something from redbull.." Those are the only two that benefit from saying newey designed it. It hurt neither. They have no reason to say otherwise to the public. From a common sense persepective in F1...it just wouldn't and shouldn't be done. And it is not. If you look at it, the whole body is an air funnel and it is using blown diffuser-esque panels in the rear where most is funneled. These are things that a fresh graduate who is very good with FD could do in his sleep. There is no reason to involve newey, other than to be a figure head, which is most likely the case. RBR wouldn't allow him to design it, because they can't even hire someone to make sure he hasn't included something that he shouldn't have or something they could have used, etc. It is a drawing of an air funnel with wheels, wings and a canopy with a huge diffuser. All you need to draw that is have a remedial understanding of how and why air travels and trails along panels, etc.

If rbr will shell out over 50mill euros for a year to him, so he doesn't go to Ferrari, merc or mclaren...you think they turned him lose while that was the exact period in time where they were doing crazy wings and wing pods, using the exhaust as extra air volume to pass over the car, etc., etc.? No way in hell. He would have to and did deliberately NOT make it a work of FD art. That's if he even drew it. No way Christian Horner would have turned him loose for a video game. Newey is a figurehead to boast the car to f1 fans. Same with vettel. Most don't know who newey is. Everyone knows what red bull is and then you have a silly car to appeal to kids. It's a trifecta to poliphony.
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Until you present some resources to back up your opinion, it remains just your opinion. I'm sure Mr. Newey and Mr. Vettel are allowed to have a least a few hours a year where they're allowed to do non-F1 related activities. In fact, any F1 fan knows there is a mandatory two week period where the factories and emails are shut down so that the participants can enjoy some non-F1 time. Why the team would have some kind of issue with Mr. Newey doing a fun little video game thought experiment I cannot fathom. Considering he's going off to develop racing yachts next year, your argument doesn't hold much water (pun intended). :sly:
 
He's not confirmed to be doing catamarans, unless it is red bull sponsored. He already has a position at RBR for 2015. He just wants to do catamarans someday wth?
 
332i
Only thing I'm going to bother addressing is that no top tier series allow active aero or suspension. All banned. All long ago. Like I said. Nothing special. Just a bunch of values from polyphony under a drawing. Idk how you can argue with that.
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Well, there's a reason why they banned, as well as fan cars (like the 2J and the Brabham BT46).
And those values come from somewhere. Usually it's engineering.
And I don't get why you think Newey didn't take part in the creation of the car. In this video, at 1:04, Newey himself said he came up with the specification for the car, sketches, packaging and shapes.



It doesn't make sense PD making a deal with Red Bull to put a car in the game they (RB) didn't even make. It's like all the VGT cars being designed by PD and then they randomly put a badge of some company PD might have a deal with.
I get that you despise the car but I don't understand your reasons.
 
iName
Again, the ONLY reason anybody hates this car is because of the trolls in GT5.
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And now it's carried over to GT6 and I can't seem to find a room without seeing an X1 at some point. I hope the car gets tossed in the rubbish bin for GT7 or.......
 
I don't hate the x1's. I think its "purpose" and "idea" are really cool at what could be. But its just the people who gave it a bad reputation that ruined the car. I mean i don't like it enough to drive it just for enjoyment like my lmp's ect. But i don't hate it.

The Junior is amazing though
 
notStig
Well, there's a reason why they banned, as well as fan cars (like the 2J and the Brabham BT46).
And those values come from somewhere. Usually it's engineering.
And I don't get why you think Newey didn't take part in the creation of the car. In this video, at 1:04, Newey himself said he came up with the specification for the car, sketches, packaging and shapes.



It doesn't make sense PD making a deal with Red Bull to put a car in the game they (RB) didn't even make. It's like all the VGT cars being designed by PD and then they randomly put a badge of some company PD might have a deal with.
I get that you despise the car but I don't understand your reasons.
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The 2J and BT46 didn't use active aero. Active aero involves moving aerodynamic parts. Idk much about the 2j, but the bt46 was not a great car. In F1, that was gone with the brabham. Active suspension were canned in the early 90s by the fia, when Williams started using a spec B chassis using active suspension. The car wasn't faster and it was banned due to the fear of moving parts coming off of the car in the case of a failure. No values to be seen. Just stop lol. You really don't know what you're talking about on these things.

Your second part of the post makes no sense. In the first half your agreeing with me (or writing it as so) and the second sentence makes very little sense. I try not to argue with people either don't know what they mean or don't mean what's they say. So...all set, dude. Continue liking the car. IDC. You seem to have a retort for everything.
 
332i
The 2J and BT46 didn't use active aero. Active aero involves moving aerodynamic parts. Idk much about the 2j, but the bt46 was not a great car. In F1, that was gone with the brabham. Active suspension were canned in the early 90s by the fia, when Williams started using a spec B chassis using active suspension. The car wasn't faster and it was banned due to the fear of moving parts coming off of the car in the case of a failure. No values to be seen. Just stop lol. You really don't know what you're talking about on these things.

Your second part of the post makes no sense. In the first half your agreeing with me (or writing it as so) and the second sentence makes very little sense. I try not to argue with people either don't know what they mean or don't mean what's they say. So...all set, dude. Continue liking the car. IDC. You seem to have a retort for everything.
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The fan is viewed as a moveable aerodynamic device by FIA. When the Brabham ran their fan car, they said the fan was used to help cooling as the air passed through a radiator (wich was legal), that's why the car ran and even after it was banned the race results were kept. The car finished over 30 seconds ahead of second place. The 2J was 2 seconds faster than his fastest rival in qualifying. It was banned after other teams complained the car would kill the series by dominating it. Williams was not the only F1 car to use active suspension. The cars that used it had an increase in cornering speeds wich led to FIA banning it due to safety concerns.

I only agreed with you when you said the car was designed by one of the best fluid dynamics specialists in the world. But for some reason after that you contradicted yourself and said you don't believe he was even part of the project anymore. And I do know what I'm talking about, you're just not getting my point.

I feel this is going nowhere. We're just going in circles. Like you said, you keep hating the car and I'll keep liking it. I'll stop before it goes more off topic.
 
notStig
The fan is viewed as a moveable aerodynamic device by FIA. When the Brabham ran their fan car, they said the fan was used to help cooling as the air passed through a radiator (wich was legal), that's why the car ran and even after it was banned the race results were kept. The car finished over 30 seconds ahead of second place. The 2J was 2 seconds faster than his fastest rival in qualifying. It was banned after other teams complained the car would kill the series by dominating it. Williams was not the only F1 car to use active suspension. The cars that used it had an increase in cornering speeds wich led to FIA banning it due to safety concerns.

I only agreed with you when you said the car was designed by one of the best fluid dynamics specialists in the world. But for some reason after that you contradicted yourself and said you don't believe he was even part of the project anymore. And I do know what I'm talking about, you're just not getting my point.

I feel this is going nowhere. We're just going in circles. Like you said, you keep hating the car and I'll keep liking it. I'll stop before it goes more off topic.
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Good job dude. You can read wikipedia. The bt46 fan car was banned, because Colin Chapman threw a hissy fit. Do you realize who owned brabham at the time of the fan car?? And what board he was on? That's why it was withdrawn, not banned. Then they banned ground effects. Active aero was already banned. The active suspension cars were not much faster, if any at all. And they were banned for the very reasons I mentioned.

This is going no where, you're exactly correct. You just like to argue from one topic to the next. First it was about you think a car in a video game contains technology aboard. Descriptively in a fantasy sense - yep. Any sort of tech that affects mechanical and aero grip? Nope, because it doesn't exist in the game. There's no difference in tech between that car and any other car with downforce. The x1 just has a lot of it. May as well be the lotus with a different skin, more power and more aero. The code between the two are probably not much different to be honest in many aspects. The fact that you believe technology is inside of an object that is not concrete is outlandish. Think about that. The x1 is not a tangible object. It is a graphic on a screen. It exists as a graphic and computer files. No hardware is involved as it is just a computer file and thus no technology is applied to the car in reality throughout play. It is a car with high value options in the game. You could apply all of the same value abilities to any race car that is 50:50 MR, mod it down to the same weight as the x1 and it wouldn't drive a hell of a lot differently. No technology dude. I've been following f1 since I could sit in front of a tv with my father as a tot. Over 20 years and know it's history. This is why I find it hilarious to argue with you in regards to all of this stuff. I knkw this stuff by heart as F1 is my life. You have to run to wikipedia...and you STILL report back incorrectly with partial bits that benefit what you think and leave out what wouldn't.

Idk why you keep coming back with more crap info that you don't understand. That's exactly it. You're running off and copying/pasting what you find on the internet in searches, but you don't understand what you're pasting over and attempting to use these things as points.
 
You know more about F1 history than me. Congratulations. That's not relevant to discussion. It's not important why those technologies were banned. But it's effectiveness and it's use in the Red Bull cars. That's my point. You cannot deny that cars using all the technologies mentioned were faster and that's at least part of the reason why they were outlawed and why some are present in the Red Bull cars. Your point about technology in the car makes no sense. Just because it's in the game doesn't mean technonoly is non existent. You cannot accept the car was designed to work in real life. I'm trying to show technical reasons behind the car rather than just my personal opinion. The car was designed by an engineer not a game designer. I'm not telling you to like them, just that if one was built in real life it would perform similar to the game the same way other cars do. You said you are a fan of Newey and you don't believe a car he designed would work, even when he himself said it would on the video I posted.
This pointless discussion is the only thing keeping this thread alive. I'll just leave now since there's no point in staying here anymore. Have a nice day. No hard feelings.👍
One thing I'll correct myself is that the Red Bulls does have active suspension.
 
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@notStig I wasn't the one who meandered off onto those topics ;) Game says active suspension. That just translates into extra grip. Nothing really moves. Unless you can prove it in action from a replay of someone driving it. Newey got paid to say it would work. It is a car without lift. Of course it would work lol. One irrelevant or obvious thing after another. I like peanut butter. Enjoy the car. I don't care about this anymore.
 

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