2019 FIA Race Discussion

Discussion in 'Gran Turismo Sport' started by bduddy, Jan 23, 2019.

  1. CallawaySS

    CallawaySS

    Messages:
    83
    I'm still deciding on whether should I use F50 or S-FR. They are both very easy to drive. S-FR has little bit better brakes and little bit faster cornering speed ( which is probably because it has less power ), but that can be seen mainly where you are coming through chicanes, where you can use full throttle. F50 is on the other hand faster on straights, I'd say even significantly faster, with only a little bit worse handling, but it's still handles very good. It also seems maybe a little bit more stable. And it might actually save tyres more, thanks to MR layout.
     
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  2. Lost Sheltie

    Lost Sheltie

    Messages:
    454
    Yep it's a decision to make. SFR is 10-15mph slower at the end of the straight, so it makes the time back up in the twisty bits.

    Basically will you get bottled up behind F50's in the twisty bits, or will you be able to get by. And if you choose the F50 you are quite likely to get 'nudged' in the twisty parts of the track by people misjudging your speed. Will be kinda like a very slow Group C vs Group 1 race :)

    I am going to use the F50, simply because I am sick to death of always racing the SFR in every 'N' race we have, and it looks cool.
     
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  3. watto79

    watto79

    Messages:
    395
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Has anyone done any tyre wear simulation for Manufacturers on Wednesday? I've signed for Ford for this season and am using the Mustang for Gr.3. It really looks like I'm going to have to do 2 stops. I can make softs last 6 laps but they are completely gone by the end and the risk of sliding off the track is high. I've done limited experiments on mediums but they seem to wear just as quickly and are just slower. The only thing I haven't tried yet is to start on Medium/Soft but I don't think it will make much difference. A pit stop seems to cost about 10 seconds.

    I'm much more comfortable being on fresher softs and pushing hard than nursing worn tyres, but full disclaimer, I suck on worn tyres.

    Anyone have any thoughts on this?
     
  4. darth_tails

    darth_tails

    Messages:
    1,041
    Location:
    Scotland
    Tuning isn't allowed but it really depends on your confidence with the S-FR racing concept, a 2:03 is a not bad time but you can probably go
    quicker, I was averaging that for a while but now I'm putting in 2:01/2:02 times in Free Practice.

    My suspicion is you can probably make some time in T1/T2 chicane and the exit to T3 and the final chicane corner but you have to be
    confident in the car and brake/lift off otherwise you can loose too much time, I believe I can go faster but not found where I'm loosing time
    just yet.
     
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  5. HERE4BEER3

    HERE4BEER3

    Messages:
    320
    I think it's actually T2/T3 chicane, but we know what you mean HEHE! T1 would be that sweeping right hander before the chicane

    @bnight Doing that chicane perfectly can definitely get you 1-1.5 seconds off your lap time easily. Early braking for that chicane is key so you can clip the apex on T2 and go flatout through the chicane.

    Of course we are just guessing since that is one of the trickier parts. My advice would be to watch replays of some of the top 10 and see what your doing differently. Once you can identify where you are slow it's up to you do adjust your driving style and try different approaches to turns.
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2019
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  6. Winnie847

    Winnie847

    Messages:
    519
    Location:
    United States
    I felt something similar to this. I didn't beat my qualy time in race, but I came a lot closer to it than I thought I could have. So far my best practice lap with no tire wear has been 1:59.5 in the SFR, but in race I was able to get down to 2:00.2 and that wasn't a very perfect lap. I think if I managed a better lap I could pull a 2:00.0 or even very high 1:59 with no mistakes. This was surprising to me, but I think it has something to do with comfort softs behaving differently than racing tires, which is what I'm used to. When I got the 2:00.2 in race, I think it was on my 5th or 6th lap, which was odd. It seems like comfort softs get better after a few laps, or maybe that was just me getting the hang of in-race tire wear, not sure. Then I joined someone else's practice lobby last night, and the best time I got was 2:00.9, something felt different. It felt like I couldn't brake as late or turn in as easily. Another guy in the race pulled off a 2:00 flat in the F50, but he's on the leaderboard and his practice time is in the 1:58's. What I recommend is running more laps with tire wear and fuel on, see how low you can get that time, then head back over to the practice session to see if you can mimic that lap and improve your time there. It worked for me and I shaved off a half-second doing so.

    Some advice for this track using the SFR: you can probably carry more speed through those corners than you think you can. Braking hard initially, then letting up and turning pretty sharp will throw the car into a bit of a slide. In a race car, you don't really want this, but in the SFR it can gain you time if you get on the throttle mid slide and manage the steering through the exit. If you have TCS on, this won't work nearly as well. I just started braking later and inducing a little bit of a slide to get better turn-in, and gained a bunch of time.

    Also, regarding the T2/T3 chicane...after initial braking, light throttle through the apex of T2 then get on full throttle up that hill as early as possible and find a way to stay full throttle all the way through to the braking zone of T5. It's not easy but you gain a lot of time there. As far as the bus-stop chicane goes toward the end of the lap...if you are lifting or braking, you are wrong. It can be done smoothly in the SFR with no lift whatsoever. There could be up to a whole second gained there if done right. Remember these are momentum cars, don't slow down unless you have to, find a way to chuck it through those corners at a higher speed. Even if it might look sloppy, it will be faster.
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2019
  7. bnight

    bnight

    Messages:
    53
    Location:
    Bulgaria
    @darth_tails I was just wondering if there is anything tuning wise that can be done. I'm playing with T150 wheel and TC put to 2 I can probably try to remove TC completely but not sure I will manage to drive this car better the combination of understeer and snap oversteer is not my favourite also first time I'm trying this car out.

    @HERE4BEER3 will try to watch some replays maybe this will help. I'm not sure why my time are so slow I surely have places for improvement though as I'm not perfecting some of the corners. Will see how tonight session will go.
     
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  8. darth_tails

    darth_tails

    Messages:
    1,041
    Location:
    Scotland
    @bnight - No tuning possible. My time by the way is with the DS4 controller so that should be proof that the time is possible with a wheel.

    I do have TC set at 0 so you might want to try that, it will take a bit of practice but the S-FR is quite forgiving once you get used to it, I don't
    have any brake balance on it so not sure if that would make a difference, the other car suggested is the F50 but I don't have that one so
    you might want to try something else.

    Just because a car is all over the leader boards may not necessarily make it the best for your style!
     
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  9. praiano63

    praiano63 Premium

    Messages:
    8,371
    Location:
    Brazil
    I did some test in rooms with my new manufacturer Nissan this morning . for the GR3 lago Maggiore 11laps race.
    According to my driving style even with brake balance set to +5 , it seems that the best option is 6 laps racing medium + 5 laps racing soft ti(y)res.
    Front wear and grip for the 6th lap with racing soft is really prejudicial due to extreme compound waste. A lost of around 3 seconds for this single 6 th lap.
     
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  10. 05XR8

    05XR8

    Messages:
    26,316
    Location:
    Australia
    Isn't the s-FR more stable due to downforce? I know the 996 has rear downforce Level 100. F50 is rear at 100. S-FR is F/100, R/200.

    The F50 has a BoP of 296hp/27.8kgfm/1,242kg

    Where S-FR has 272/35.8/1,311.
    So, less hp, more weight, but much more torque and downforce.

    Then, you've also got gear spacing. The F50 uses a Final drive of 3.7 to the S-FR's 4.3.

    The Pantera just needs to come down in weight.
    295/43.3/1,405, 4.220 gears. The torque and gearing, are it's saving grace. Also being MR.

    996: 293/31.3/1,282, 3.440

    What helps the 996 is the RR configuration, light weight and torque from the turbo. It's essentially a race car anyway.
    The speed in gears, is the largest of the cars above, at 50km/h spreads.

    Anyway, the downforce alone, should exclude the S-FR.
     
  11. HERE4BEER3

    HERE4BEER3

    Messages:
    320
    I find the S-FR extremely stable with TCS 0. The only way I really lose the backend is if I go skidding through a corner then go full throttle while trying to correct. You don't have to be anywhere near as gentle with the throttle as you do the Xbow or the GT40.

    Hmm, I know what I'm trying out tonight. I'm @ 2:01.1 in free practice, I've been lifting on the righthand curb before the chicane. At least if I can nail it for qualy I'd be happy but they don't call it the chicane of death for no reason, I'd rather loose a second every lap than hit that corner once.
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2019
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  12. Keith2324

    Keith2324

    Messages:
    304
    Location:
    Barbados
    I'm not quite sure where to post this, but I know a lot of people "complain" about disconnects during the daily and FIA races. One approach you can try is to look up whatever primary and secondary DNS servers your internet provider is using and use those instead of the Google ones. Your speed will increase and be more balanced. Give it a shot. You'll be glad you did.

    Keith.
     
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  13. adstomko

    adstomko

    Messages:
    566
    Location:
    England
    The F50 is much better than the Toyota here. Plus, I think you need a H shifter
     
  14. SpecMiata-JSW

    SpecMiata-JSW Premium

    Messages:
    683
    Location:
    United States
    I haven't turned a lap yet, is the KTM not the fastest if you can turn laps in it without it trying to kill you?
     
  15. Venster

    Venster

    Messages:
    867
    You lose quite a bit of time from not having a shifter, I’ve set a 1.59.5 with both a pad and wheel but both I could improve on as only a handful of laps on each. Don’t think I can get into the 58s I’m just not good enough in n class!.
     
  16. Winnie847

    Winnie847

    Messages:
    519
    Location:
    United States
    For me, the trick was learning to treat that whole thing like one big left hand turn. When you initially enter the bus stop, it's a slight right. I see a lot of people use the whole width of that kerb on the way in, but I tend to barely clip it and drive over more of the 2nd wide kerb which is to your left. Then I attack the thinner kerb in the middle of the bus stop at an angle, and start turning hard left just before I reach the halfway point of that thinner middle kerb. It's almost like you have to turn hard left earlier than you think you should. This will allow you to get a straighter exit out of there which means you're less likely to hit the left wall on the straight on your way out. But you're right, if you don't get it down to where it's repeatable for you, lifting just before turning hard left exiting the bus stop might be best, so you can get more turn-in since you'll be off throttle. Hope that makes sense, it's hard to explain without a video.

    Good luck!
     
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  17. adstomko

    adstomko

    Messages:
    566
    Location:
    England
    The Toyota and Ferrari handle pretty well. The only difference is that, in the Ferrari, you have to lift at the 'chicane of death.'

    I'm not 100% sure if you need a shifter, but it should be an advantage by a couple of tenths
     
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  18. RZQSPEED

    RZQSPEED

    Messages:
    2,362
    Location:
    Indonesia
    I did some tyre wear evaluation for my AMG at Maggiore Reverse. If the AMG on the DS4 with my driving style requires a 2-stop on full softs, then the Mustang is certainly needing that, otherwise the understeer fest handling will be even worse on worn tyres. You can try for a 1-stop with Mediums up front and Softs on the rear and swap to full Softs at the end of Lap 6.
     
  19. watto79

    watto79

    Messages:
    395
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Thanks for replying. I just tried a medium/soft run changing to full softs at the end of lap 6 and it was a nightmare. The only thing worse than driving on worn softs? Driving on worn mediums!

    I just don't have the skill to keep a good pace and keep it on the track with worn tyres.

    2 stops it is. That will confuse everyone when I pit at the end of lap 3 :lol:

    If the Mustang is that bad on tyres I'm glad I only have it for one season!
     
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  20. HERE4BEER3

    HERE4BEER3

    Messages:
    320
    Well I did it, I managed to do the chicane of death without lifting. I was finally able to put the magic lap together after 13 laps. If I made it through the chicane, I messed up somewhere earlier, if I was managing my "perfect" lap, nerves would get me at the chicane and I'd wreck at the corner. Ugh. I was able to get a "perfect" lap earlier, but then I overshot my braking zone on the last turn because I wasn't used to going into it so fast lol.

    Come wednesday I'll probably just take it easy through there though. Chances are I'll be stuck in traffic and end up killing someone who freaking brakes there anyways.
     
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  21. Winnie847

    Winnie847

    Messages:
    519
    Location:
    United States
    Nice job man! Now you just gotta put it all together. I'll admit it's pretty difficult for me to get a solid lap around there in any car. I still think if I got my optimal I'd be in the 1:58's but so far I haven't had one perfect lap...just some that are better than others. If I can take T2/T3 chicane and the bus-stop chicane well enough, that's usually a pretty good lap.

    Also, that final turn after the bus-stop is probably the most difficult on the course for me, especially because you approach it at varying speeds like you mentioned. Every time I think I can brake later I overshoot and miss the apex, every time I brake earlier it's too early and I end up crawling up to the apex at the speed of nothing and ruining my exit. There's some camber in the braking and turn-in zone that definitely complicates things. Good luck on Wednesday's races!
     
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  22. HERE4BEER3

    HERE4BEER3

    Messages:
    320
    I forgot to mention in my earlier post, not lifting through the chicane = -.7 seconds. I was able to improve my best time from 2:01.1 to 2:00.429, my optimal for this session was 2:00.239. Next goal is sub 2:00.
     
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  23. Winnie847

    Winnie847

    Messages:
    519
    Location:
    United States
    Very respectable time, especially for DR-B.

    I've seen some A+ drivers post similar times, so I think you'll probably do well in race.

    I'm going to be running some practice lobbies on Wednesday leading up to the races, so feel free to add me on PSN and find me there if you wanna get some laps in before hand.
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2019
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  24. schnick

    schnick

    Messages:
    142
    Location:
    Australia
    Can I ask how you optimally "tune" power and weight for the S-FR? (or power/weight N class tuning in general?)
    Just wondering if there's any tenths to gain there but I also think I'm too conservative in the bus stop
     
  25. Winnie847

    Winnie847

    Messages:
    519
    Location:
    United States
    You can't tune it, you just have to make sure the power meets the N300 requirements, and BOP does the rest. When you join the "free practice" session you will have to choose a car. All the N300 cars show up on top, but all the cars that can be modified to meet N300 requirements are listed below and highlighted. If you select one of those it will prompt you to change the settings accordingly. In some cases you will have to use XP to "upgrade" the power options, which will actually give you the choice to tune down rather than up. I think with the SFR, as soon as you go below 300hp the red message at the bottom of the screen goes away. Once you select that power, BOP actually adjusts it to something like 247HP and fixes the weight how it wants. After that, nothing else can be changed except for TCS and Brake Balance.
     
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  26. schnick

    schnick

    Messages:
    142
    Location:
    Australia
    Maybe I should elaborate. What I meant was do you only drop power or only add weight (if enough can be added to drop to N300) or is there some optimal mix of both? Also is upgrading the engine with mileage points and detuning optimal for the power band? Or does BOP actually nullify any advantage that might be gained from an "optimal detuned power band"? I don't recall the BOP screen showing up but I might have another look tonight and stop looking for excuses as to why I haven't gone sub 2:00 yet :boggled:
     
  27. HERE4BEER3

    HERE4BEER3

    Messages:
    320
    Once you drop it to N300, the BOP will nullify everything. Basically what your doing when tuning is adjusting the BOP anyway, so it doesnt matter what you set it at to get to N300 once the race BOP goes into effect it changes.

    At least as far as I know.....
     
  28. bnight

    bnight

    Messages:
    53
    Location:
    Bulgaria
    Down to 2:01.900 now I made a 2:01.1 but the game doesn't save it to the server. Good thing is that I can constantly do such laps. Bad thing is that I have room for improvement but can't achieve it. See how tonight session will go.
     
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  29. 05XR8

    05XR8

    Messages:
    26,316
    Location:
    Australia
    Got my 996 down from 2:00.848 to 2:00.608. Been trying 2nd gear and 3rd gear at the first left-right. It's where I can make more time. I've got the bus stop and everywhere else locked in.
    - Oh, also broke into the 1 second mark with the Pantera. Love this car.
    It'll be one of these three:
    IMG_6440.JPG


    Braking and the point of brake release and starting the turn in, need that bit more concentration.

    Anyway, the "real" qualifying will be interesting. Nice to see top 3 switched to the F50. Bye bye S-FR...
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2019
  30. The Cake

    The Cake

    Messages:
    102
    question for yah,

    If u dont have a lot of money and want to compete next race with the old aston martin....its 10.000.00 credits....why?? How?