EPA wants to prohibit street car to race car conversions

  • Thread starter CodeRedR51
  • 56 comments
  • 3,877 views
images
 
There are a lot of aspiring people who want to tune their ordinary cars into something and then the EPA wants to ban that, it's like they are such dictators and make you feel like you have no freedom with how you want your car to be like. Think of it like freedom of speech only through the expression of car tuning. No way the EPA will win against that since there are car clubs and organizations out there that will fight against this.

In short, they're actually wanting to ban the fun aspect about cars besides driving/racing.
 
Last edited:
Since they say that this generation doesn't care about cars and/or motorsports, they just want to kill it altogether it seems. '-'
 
Since they say that this generation doesn't care about cars and/or motorsports, they just want to kill it altogether it seems. '-'
Examples of that are self-driving cars and a messed up version of Formula E with no drivers. This world has gone mad and society is messed up.

Motorsports won't be called so without the drivers, the drivers themselves are the athletes competing in them. And that messed up version of Formula E without drivers is just plain stupid.
 
Last edited:
There's a lot of knee jerk reactions going on over this and I don't think it's been fully analyzed. It's always been illegal to modify emissions on a street vehicle, so I can't see much changing there. Also I think the legalese needs to be waded through to see really what the law it all about instead of SEMA's bias spin on it.

Here's Jalopnik's explanation of the law: http://jalopnik.com/the-epas-crackdown-on-race-cars-explained-1758111546?rev=1455053744356

And excerpt from the EPA in the article states:

People may use EPA-certified motor vehicles for competition, but to protect public health from air pollution, the Clean Air Act has – since its inception – specifically prohibited tampering with or defeating the emission control systems on those vehicles.

The proposed regulation that SEMA has commented on does not change this long-standing law, or approach. Instead, the proposed language in the Heavy-Duty Greenhouse Gas rulemaking simply clarifies the distinction between motor vehicles and nonroad vehicles such as dirt bikes and snowmobiles. Unlike motor vehicles – which include cars, light trucks, and highway motorcycles – nonroad vehicles may, under certain circumstances, be modified for use in competitive events in ways that would otherwise be prohibited by the Clean Air Act.

So, yes, you can still use a motor vehicle for competition, you just can't mess with the emissions system. And really all this law is doing is making a clear distinction between nonroad and road vehicles.

The EPA also said:

This clarification does not affect EPA’s enforcement authority. It is still illegal to tamper with or defeat the emission control systems of motor vehicles. In the course of selecting cases for enforcement, the EPA has and will continue to consider whether the tampered vehicle is used exclusively for competition.

The EPA remains primarily concerned with cases where the tampered vehicle is used on public roads, and more specifically with aftermarket manufacturers who sell devices that defeat emission control systems on vehicles used on public roads.

There will still be racing, there will still be racecars, and nothing much will change. You just still won't be able to modify the emissions on your street car, which you've never been able to.
 
Examples of that are self-driving cars and a messed up version of Formula E with no drivers. This world has gone mad and society is messed up.

Motorsports won't be called so without the drivers, the drivers themselves are the athletes competing in them. And that messed up version of Formula E without drivers is just plain stupid.
I have no idea how we got onto this unrelated topic, but just to dispel that one:

  • It uses automobiles - that's the motor bit.
  • They compete against each other - that's the sport.
It's different, but you can't make up your own definition of a sport just to satisfy your own argument.

On the actual topic, I completely agree that the initial reaction has been knee-jerk - a lot of the tabloid-y clickbait sites have been dishing out some hilariously dramatised stories. It's still a bit of a daft proposal, but hey, if it has such a minor impact, it's not worth making a fuss about.
 
And really all this law is doing is making a clear distinction between nonroad and road vehicles.
Which AutoBlog has asked about here and the non-road vehicles being dirt bikes and snowmobile-like equipment:

Further, the EPA claims that the new wording of its regulations only seeks to differentiate nonroad vehicles from "motor vehicles." Two nonroad vehicles specifically mentioned by the EPA include dirt bikes and snowmobiles. Any vehicle that was sold with a certificate of conformity that allows them to be used on public roads, however, are "motor vehicles" and therefore must have all their emissions controls intact.

But this is where I think the issue is, and effectively goes with the title of this thread.
According to this statement, it's already against the law to perform any modifications to a vehicle that result in the tampering or removal of emissions control systems, even for competition. In other words, if you have removed a catalytic converter from your racecar, you're already afoul of the rules.

So technically every single MX-5 racing in the MX-5 up series are illegal, same with every car running in PWC GT and TC class, CTSCC, etc, etc.
 
If they never had a catalytic converter to begin with, they wouldn't be violating that rule in which you've just quoted.
 
If they never had a catalytic converter to begin with, they wouldn't be violating that rule in which you've just quoted.
Most street based race cars (MX-5, CTSCC, etc) start out as a street car with full emissions equipment. Removing that equipment makes them illegal.
 
So technically every single MX-5 racing in the MX-5 up series are illegal, same with every car running in PWC GT and TC class, CTSCC, etc, etc.

Technically yes, but I don't know how much enforcement they would have if you were driving a racecar on private land, only if you're driving your racecar around on public roads.

The more I read about this law, it's not really saying anything that's not already on the books.
 

I want to prohibit the EPA and all there communist friends.

Screw you, EPA. You can take that crap and shove it.

I bet if it were electric cars, they would give two 🤬 about it.

This would make me leave the country, I'm not kidding. :banghead:

All auto manufacturers in the world...fight this trashy argument to the end. :grumpy:

For any other paranoids who may have missed it, or can't read:

The more I read about this law, it's not really saying anything that's not already on the books.

Also, let's not forget that SEMA has a vested interest in making sure you have the right to convert your car into a robotic, motorized grill with a sound system that can be used as a mobile aural warfare device. Off-road, of course.
 
Last edited:
They are barking up the wrong tree if they think targeting the few car guys and club racers in the world will save the us all and make everything sunshine and rainbows.

I am pretty sure richer people with their fuel sucking private jets and yachts can take an emviromental hit better than a club racer dumping what little they have into their little race car, so why not go after them instead?. Need I mention the factories that use fuels bad for the enviroment to power the ignorant EPA's hybrids?

Sorry EPA, targeting car enthusiasts love and passion just because you dont like it isn't going to save the world from climate change and global warming.
 
This is probably the only time I am ok with a government organization not doing their job and justifyjng it with large amounts of words on pages.
 
CFR = Code of Federal Regulations, BTW...OK?

EPA - 40 CFR part 1068
The existing prohibitions and exemptions in 40 CFR part 1068 related to competition
engines and vehicles need to be amended to account for differing policies for nonroad and motor
vehicle applications. In particular, we generally consider nonroad engines and vehicles to be
“used solely for competition” based on usage characteristics. This allows EPA to set up an
administrative process to approve competition exemptions, and to create an exemption from the
tampering prohibition for products that are modified for competition purposes. There is no
comparable allowance for motor vehicles. A motor vehicle qualifies for a competition exclusion
based on the physical characteristics of the vehicle, not on its use. Also, if a motor vehicle is
covered by a certificate of conformity at any point, there is no exemption from the tampering and
defeat-device prohibitions that would allow for converting the engine or vehicle for competition
use. There is no prohibition against actual use of certified motor vehicles or motor vehicle
engines for competition purposes; however, it is not permissible to remove a motor vehicle or
motor vehicle engine from its certified configuration regardless of the purpose for doing so.

Basically, it sounds like once you register your car, you can't do naughty things to the emissions systems and leave it that way, but all necessary repairs needed to get it back to legal specs is okay for public roads. Another words, nothing really changed much...most race cars are trailered anyhow.

Furthermore:

EPA
§ 1068.235: Clarify that the standard-setting part may set conditions on an exemption for
competition engines/equipment.

page 862 and 863 of 1329
EPA is proposing in 40 CFR 1037.601(a)(3) to clarify that the Clean Air Act does not allow any person to disable, remove, or render inoperative (i.e., tamper with) emission controls on a certified motor vehicle for purposes of competition. An existing provision in 40 CFR 1068.235 provides an exemption for nonroad engines converted for competition use. This provision reflects the explicit exclusion of engines used solely for competition from the CAA [Clean Air Act] definition of “nonroad engine”. The proposed amendment clarifies that this part 1068 exemption does not apply for motor vehicles.

This makes it sounds as if there is an exception for limited usage for "generating revnue"...because race series?

Page 845 of 1329
§ 1068.220: Add description of how we might approve engine operation under the display exemption. This is intended to more carefully address circumstances in which engine operation is part of the display function in question. We would want to consider a wide
range of factors in considering such a request; for example, we could be more inclined to
approve a request for a display exemption if the extent of operation is very limited, or if the
engine/equipment has emission rates that are comparable to what would apply absent the
exemption. EPA is also removing the specific prohibition against generating revenue with
exempted engines/equipment, since this has an unclear meaning and we can take any possible
revenue generation into account in considering whether to approve the exemption on its
merits.

So more contradictory laws? Or just because a certain nameless auto manufacturer messed up the rules with their shenanigans?

...and then the metric ton of information that affects the trucking industry.
 
Last edited:
Back