Anyone else feel ripped off?

  • Thread starter LVracerGT
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1,211
United States
Earth
TheLordSnowden
LordSnowden
Ironically, I'm actually ok with launching feature lite game with a strong committed post launch strategy...

This is very common in the social/mobile spaces, but there are rules to this model, one being transparency and lots of communication (I.e. Pcars)... But no one else is doing this in the console space, likely for good reason... I'm not sure it works in a space were customers are conditioned to expect the whole product for so many years (forever actually).

I only started vocalizing my frustrations a couple weeks ago as 2 months have gone by with no communication regarding the core product features... I think pd were also promoting this model without admitting it (that's fair if you make good on it).

My fear is that they might think they are making good on it by giving free cars and tracks... But again, that's all marketing for the none core audience.

GT 6 still needs to find its legs and honestly the online feature, if strong enough, could be their strongest hope for this... As online gamers are very sticky.

All the other features like track creator, gps, etc are gimmicks at best right now, and not likely something to sell more retail units. Believe me, it pains me to say that but they just aren't universally 'needed' or 'core to the franchise' features... A livery editor on the other hand could be a leg that directly competes but we know PD aren't going to do it in a way we would expect. -I digress.
 
184
United States
Denver
ONEEYEMONSTaR
MANDINGOspqr
PD was not ready (again). But this time instead of delaying 2 years they just shipped it half finished. And as you pointed out there is no strong incentive to finish it now.

OUCH!I went to GT4 therapy over the 4 year wait for my reserve copy...some wounds never heal. Lost all confidence in PD and only finally got a PS3 2 months' after the release of GT5
 
41
United States
SE Virginia
Blown03Cobra
I actually think they did a good job with what they had to work with. I feel a huge improvement in the way the cars feel and drive. Although I do wish they would spend more time in creating ways to allow us to customize the cars. I find my self playing Forza to fill that void but if I want to race nothing comes close to GT.
On top of that ever since the PS3 came out they have always expressed, how hard it is to create the game they want to make. Now that they have a system that they are happy with we should expect great things to come.
 

69Fastback

(Banned)
42
United States
TX
So GT6 wasnt what you wanted. Big deal. PD is notoriously bad with dates, really bad. Did you really expect any different this time around? .. and who here has worked in the gaming industry ? you seem to know a whole lot about development, deadlines, marketing, and creation. .. things change, people change, and lastly the game series will change. So be it, it is what it is, vote with your dollars and learn from the past. its really simple.


even though GT series has great visuals since day one, if thats not your thing, or you think its not a big deal or a game saver and think GT6 is not up to your liking, then play GT4 and clap your hands in excitement.


Who cares?.. i mean for crying out loud, its a game !! and if you feel ripped off then youre entitled to it, but whos fault is it really? .. PD promises many things and they failed to deliver, so stop supporting them!!

I get it, we all have to say what should be on the game, and what youd like to see, blah blah blah blah.. it aint going to happen. Lets be realistic for a moment, they dont care what 4 people in a forum have to say. I mean if they listened to what every bozo had to say for them to do, then they run out of business in a heart beat.. talk about delaying a game LOL


everyones an expert i get it, ill just shut up now and let the geniuses speak and see nothing come of it.


and FYI i really doubt PD cares if you consider yourself a "hardcore fan" and your disappointed on how the series is now. theyll just lose you as a customer and gain another one later. this is my opinion :P

PD will eventually "fix" what they promised, thats different though.
 
926
machschnel
Who cares?

I'm guessing you typed out a half page defense of Polyphony because you don't care?


theyll just lose you as a customer and gain another one later. this is my opinion :P

Judging by sales, they've lost a lot of GT5 customers, don't seem to be gaining any though.


they dont care what 4 people in a forum have to say

If you wish to keep you're head in the sand that's your business, but again, judging by the sales, it's not just 4 people who have problems with GT6 - more like millions.
 

69Fastback

(Banned)
42
United States
TX
I'm guessing you typed out a half page defense of Polyphony because you don't care?





Judging by sales, they've lost a lot of GT5 customers, don't seem to be gaining any though.



If you wish to keep you're head in the sand that's your business, but again, judging by the sales, it's not just 4 people who have problems with GT6 - more like millions.


yeah, im not defending anyone both the upset consumer AND PD is to blame for the "misfortune". you need reading comprehension.



thats your opinion, that my head is in the sand. i feel like YOUR head is in the sand, and possibly somewhere else.

you dont know the reason why they lost customers, and you dont know if they gained new new ones. but as business goes, you lose one you gain one.



and for your information its called sarcasm when i said 4 people, but i dont expect you to understand. And i was talking about this specific thread. whatever reason they "lost" customers is, im more than sure its not because of what you had to say ( they have your money).. everyone has a different reason why they didnt like it, and thats fine. I said vote with your dollars, and watch PD go down (or up?), thats all.

and next time dont take a small piece from my statement and make it out of context or else youll mislead people.
 
Last edited:
926
machschnel
you dont know the reason why they lost customers, and you dont know if they gained new new ones. but as business goes, you lose one you gain one.

Not quite.....

http://www.videogamer.com/ps3/gran_...gt5_managed_in_same_time_frame_in_the_us.html

"Gran Turismo 6 looks set to be a high profile casualty of the jump to the new generation consoles, selling an estimated 300,000 copies in the US since its release, according to analysis firm Cowen & Co.

The 300,000 figure compares poorly with the 1,169,074 copies which Gran Turismo 5 managed in the same period back at its launch."
 

69Fastback

(Banned)
42
United States
TX
Not quite.....

http://www.videogamer.com/ps3/gran_...gt5_managed_in_same_time_frame_in_the_us.html

"Gran Turismo 6 looks set to be a high profile casualty of the jump to the new generation consoles, selling an estimated 300,000 copies in the US since its release, according to analysis firm Cowen & Co.

The 300,000 figure compares poorly with the 1,169,074 copies which Gran Turismo 5 managed in the same period back at its launch."


im not denying it, thats fine. I dont think you get it. Forget that little statement , thats not the point. i wrote a whole paragraph and you nit pick that little thing. anyway, why did they lose the customers??? answer me this . you dont know, you think you know, but you really dont. its all speculation at this point.

could it be because the game sucked, they didnt give you the course creator, wah wah wah, they charged 60 dollars, they upset you, they put a gun to your head, or whatever else..

or it could be something on the inside that we dont know about, it could be because of the new consoles or lack of promotion, lack of time, ads, who knows, i blame it on both the consumer AND PD/sony, for both the lacking sales AND the lacking game in features. its not a blame per say its more of a reason why things happen how they did.


from your linked site.

"Sony hasn't offered any official sales figures for Gran Turismo 6.

VideoGamer.com Analysis
The success of PS4, selling over four million units in 2013, may well have shot Sony and Gran Turismo 6 in the foot. The franchise has always delivered solid sales for Sony, but it seems the publisher got the launch timing for this edition completely wrong. Perhaps this will force Sony to accelerate the release of the first PS4 Gran Turismo.
"



anyway, why am i getting into this whole other thing about sales? i have the game, i love it and ill play it and continue to play it .. sure i dont think its finished because its not, but life is short to pay too much attention to this, idgaf. lol sorry im done here :P
 
1,198
Australia
Sydney
snakebacon97
:( There seems to be an unhealthy amount of upset, cynical, sometimes hostile people on the GT6 Forums.
The 300,000 figure compares poorly with the 1,169,074 copies which Gran Turismo 5 managed in the same period back at its launch."
It's no surprise that Gran Turismo 6 isn't selling anywhere near as many copies as 5 did. Gran Turismo 5 came out at the right time, the PS3 Slim was becoming much more affordable around the world, and GT5 was an international system seller. The same happened with every GT game, the second entry for each console never sells as well as the first.

Anyway, I'm just chipping in to say no, I don't feel ripped off at all, My AE copy was my main Christmas present, I'm very happy with it, have played it heaps and will continue to play it on and off throughout the coming years. Career mode didn't take me very long to do, and I don't often race online because my internet connection is slower than the Malaysian average, but I'll have fun hotlapping, collecting cars, and maybe even playing online outside of just cruise lobbies if shuffle races are reintroduced (and the NBN falls through
smiley-tongue-out.gif
)
 
2,498
United States
Iowa, USA
LVracerGT
yeah, im not defending anyone both the upset consumer AND PD is to blame for the "misfortune". you need reading comprehension.



thats your opinion, that my head is in the sand. i feel like YOUR head is in the sand, and possibly somewhere else.

you dont know the reason why they lost customers, and you dont know if they gained new new ones. but as business goes, you lose one you gain one.



and for your information its called sarcasm when i said 4 people, but i dont expect you to understand. And i was talking about this specific thread. whatever reason they "lost" customers is, im more than sure its not because of what you had to say ( they have your money).. everyone has a different reason why they didnt like it, and thats fine. I said vote with your dollars, and watch PD go down (or up?), thats all.

and next time dont take a small piece from my statement and make it out of context or else youll mislead people.

There's so much fail in this post it literally boggles my mind. Do everyone here a favor and go back to playing COD.
 
788
United States
ohio
beretta-gt88
I still do feel ripped off I'm back to playing GTA V I'm not a online racer GT 4 is the best Gran Turismo by far it felt complete and it was a blast to race the AI it had some great tracks too I wish we had HD ver of Gran Turismo 4 for PS3 GT 5 and 6 was a waist of money :banghead::yuck:
 

HaylRayzor

HASA Member
Premium
3,130
HaylRayzor
Ironically, I'm actually ok with launching feature lite game with a strong committed post launch strategy...

Perhaps you could help us appreciate the strategy more by pointing out some evidence that this was a strategy and not just a fail that is being spun as strategy.
 
100
Canada
BRING BACK SHUFFLE TO GT Sport
J.P.MOTORSPORTS
The problem with GT6 is not enough Mazda MX5, RX7, Nissan GTR'S, we need more of the same model LOL.GT6 looks a bit like cable tv a lot of the same channel abc east coast, abc west coast LOL. Anyway I still like what they did so far with the game, the new driving physics are a lot better than GT5, anybody who's ever driven a real car will tell you that the things you can do in GT5 are a little bit on the impossible side of life, GT5 delivers on the driven feeling but realism is way better on GT6.
 
56
Kyrgyzstan
UK
simmieGTR
No it isn't. And that's exactly the problem. Pay for a game (same price as any actually finished game) and get... this.
That's the point - I don't understand how people can say this is better than GT5 - GT6 is no more than polished beta, all the points above are valid for a premium game it is low quality and low on content :( I am hoping they will fix it but in reality I know they wont.
 

oneloops

(Banned)
723
United States
United States
3 reasons GT6 is a very depressing game

1 .- AI as shy as a 5 years old girl ...

2 .- Sounds like a 20 th century game ... not like a real car and real racing cars

3 .- And wasted force feefback effects ( no gear changing vibration, no intensity , lineal FF ... ) Project Cars and all others PC sims are better than gt6 FF effects.

The 4th reason is that it isn't so difficult to fix THAT 3 THINGS
 

C_Raccoon23

Local Trash Panda
Premium
5,287
United States
USA
TPC_Raccooon23
CRaccoon23
That's the point - I don't understand how people can say this is better than GT5 - GT6 is no more than polished beta, all the points above are valid for a premium game it is low quality and low on content :( I am hoping they will fix it but in reality I know they wont.

For starters, GT6 1.0 is a lot better than GT5 1.0. I bought both games at release. First impressions go a long way, and GT6 has a much stronger one on me than GT5.
 
2,498
United States
Iowa, USA
LVracerGT
For starters, GT6 1.0 is a lot better than GT5 1.0. I bought both games at release. First impressions go a long way, and GT6 has a much stronger one on me than GT5.

The only thing GT6 1.0 had/has over GT5 1.0 is faster loading times, a few more cars and tracks, and better physics. GT5 1.0 had car sharing with friends, birthday cars, and no serious bugs or glitches until the online 12 or more cars was discovered about a year after release.

IMO GT5 was way better at release, and just goes to show how badly PD has messed up GT6 thus far.
 
39,029
For starters, GT6 1.0 is a lot better than GT5 1.0. I bought both games at release. First impressions go a long way, and GT6 has a much stronger one on me than GT5.
Not everyone bought GT5 in it's "we forgot to even let you tune your car" disaster that GT5 1.0 was. Even if you just waited until around Christmas to play GT5, you were already up to 1.05; which had added quite a bit of major functionality from the original game (admittedly mostly stuff that should have been there from the start, but nothing compared to what GT6 has no reason to be missing). In comparison, in roughly the same amount of time PD has mostly just shuffled deck chairs for GT6.
 

C_Raccoon23

Local Trash Panda
Premium
5,287
United States
USA
TPC_Raccooon23
CRaccoon23
The only thing GT6 1.0 had/has over GT5 1.0 is faster loading times, a few more cars and tracks, and better physics. GT5 1.0 had car sharing with friends, birthday cars, and no serious bugs or glitches until the online 12 or more cars was discovered about a year after release.

IMO GT5 was way better at release, and just goes to show how badly PD has messed up GT6 thus far.

Those were good features, but I personally value GT6's removal of the UCD, removal of the level system, reusable paint chips, ability to remove any upgrade after installing it, etc. much more. That's just me.

Not everyone bought GT5 in it's "we forgot to even let you tune your car" disaster that GT5 1.0 was. Even if you just waited until around Christmas to play GT5, you were already up to 1.05; which had added quite a bit of major functionality from the original game (admittedly mostly stuff that should have been there from the start, but nothing compared to what GT6 has no reason to be missing). In comparison, in roughly the same amount of time PD has mostly just shuffled deck chairs for GT6.

I will admit that so far, PD has been doing a better job at supporting GT5 than GT6.
 
56
Kyrgyzstan
UK
simmieGTR
For starters, GT6 1.0 is a lot better than GT5 1.0. I bought both games at release. First impressions go a long way, and GT6 has a much stronger one on me than GT5.

At first impression I thought Gt6 was better than GT5 - but after 2 months it does not stand the "test of time" . The gameplay is certainly worse than 5 and there also a shortage of content - I don't recall the AI in GT5 do anything as stupid as the current GT6 Ai - they will drive straight through you (Nascar was the worse). The handling is everywhere solid as rock one moment floating above the tarmac next :(

Needs a few more months with the devs IMO
 
69
Australia
Sydney
tollo03
Those were good features, but I personally value GT6's removal of the UCD, removal of the level system, reusable paint chips, ability to remove any upgrade after installing it, etc. much more. That's just me.



I will admit that so far, PD has been doing a better job at supporting GT5 than GT6.
I have bought all six game when they came out. 1 & 3 where the best games 4 was ok too.I did not realise what I was missing till I finally went online with gt5, it was a shock.I feel ripped off paying full price with with half finished games,especially gt6.Thought its a much better physics engine.Its not 1/2 as versatile as gt5. The lack of cars to win & poor money. + not being able to use the red bull cars & formula 1's in the regular game is a disappointment.At least telling us what to expect in the finished game is a let down & all the time trials in the seasonals & no car rewards is rubbish in my book.
 

oneloops

(Banned)
723
United States
United States
Is not little AI issues, is the concept of the AI, PD want only "races" with 15 cars to overtake with the first one +20 seconds before you.

But what GT6 needs is a combative AI to fight with ALONG all the race. PD doesn't want to see that concept (real-life concept) of races and it's frustating for all of us.
 
1,211
United States
Earth
TheLordSnowden
LordSnowden
Perhaps you could help us appreciate the strategy more by pointing out some evidence that this was a strategy and not just a fail that is being spun as strategy.
It might be very much what you just said until proved otherwise... But without going into great detail, PD always mentioned (and still sort of does) 6? Or so months prior to realize they would "support", "update", "add", and that "All DLC would be free". Preparing us for a longer continually evolving experience.

The way this works in games is that a set amount of gameplay and features are defined for launch, then another set is defined for a time well past launch, and teams are structured to simply keep developing to the schedule.

CRM and comunity managers host frequent events and comunications regarding up coming features with the idea that the game is always "fresh".

This is seen in nearly every social, f2p and mobile games. Not as common on console... The closest console example would be happy wars or Spartacus.

But its a development stratagy. And its critical that you make good on it shortly after release to keep engament and retention.

To your point, that critical "shortly" after release is 1-2 weeks, not months... Attrition of users accelerates the longer a game is out.

The real difference between this and launching an incomplete game is that you don't launch and react to feedback, you just keep to your dev plan... Imagine GT 5 2.0 witching a couple months (with all updates leading up to it regularly/daily/weekly)

Pretty gross simplification but It could work for GT but PD have never had production discipline... And that's what's needed, strong organization and discipline.
 
618
United Kingdom
London
Davox LDN
It might be very much what you just said until proved otherwise... But without going into great detail, PD always mentioned (and still sort of does) 6? Or so months prior to realize they would "support", "update", "add", and that "All DLC would be free". Preparing us for a longer continually evolving experience.

The way this works in games is that a set amount of gameplay and features are defined for launch, then another set is defined for a time well past launch, and teams are structured to simply keep developing to the schedule.

CRM and comunity managers host frequent events and comunications regarding up coming features with the idea that the game is always "fresh".

This is seen in nearly every social, f2p and mobile games. Not as common on console... The closest console example would be happy wars or Spartacus.

But its a development stratagy. And its critical that you make good on it shortly after release to keep engament and retention.

To your point, that critical "shortly" after release is 1-2 weeks, not months... Attrition of users accelerates the longer a game is out.

The real difference between this and launching an incomplete game is that you don't launch and react to feedback, you just keep to your dev plan... Imagine GT 5 2.0 witching a couple months (with all updates leading up to it regularly/daily/weekly)

Pretty gross simplification but It could work for GT but PD have never had production discipline... And that's what's needed, strong organization and discipline.

And also maybe more staff I think.

Pretty good explanation @Lawndart, really ;) !!!