Glad to see cockpit view steering wheels are stilL COMATOSE

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xSNAKEx

xSNAKEx

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GT series is always trying hard to be realistic. So then can anyone explain why they are STILL purposely persisting with this tiny steering wheel movements in cockpit view?



Watch 2:50 to 3:00 and compare how much the wheel is turned in GT6 compared to real life. Same car Same track, same inputs, you cant get a more perfect example of how flawed GT is.

I have been complaining about this since GT Prologue and even sent an email to Sony and still nothing.

They have now realised a GPS datalogger that manages to a collect vast amount of sensitive information, and replicates a real life drive into GT6, but somehow they refuse to make the steering wheel in game turn at the same rate that you turn it.

I understand it will look silly to DS3 users, but please PD enable it for for people with steering wheels.
 
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I remember watching a early build of either GT5, or GT5 Prologue, where they did have the 900 degree rotation of the steering wheel. It also showed the hand over hand animation too. If I remember, I think they were driving a Ferrari, on Suzuka. Don't know why they took it out.
 
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Silent Drifter
I remember watching a early build of either GT5,, where they did have the 900 degree rotation of the steering wheel. It also showed the hand over hand animation too. If I remember, I think they were driving a Ferrari, on Suzuka. Don't know why they took it out.
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Yup you remembered correctly, here is the video.



https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/posts/6091101/

Heck even if they didn't have hand over hand animations, as long as the wheel turns the right amount I would be happy.

Check out this guy he doesn't use hand over hand :p



The video gets hilarious after 2 min mark where the co-driver goes crazy after making a mistake which the driver gets pissed at.
 
Honestly I have never once even bothered to look at the wheel on screen while driving, Hard to believe that people complain about something like this other than perhaps that you can't make it not visible at all which would be my preference. Kind of dumb to be using a wheel and watching another wheel on screen to see if it matches what you are doing. You should be looking at the road.
 
HBR-Roadhog
Honestly I have never once even bothered to look at the wheel on screen while driving, Hard to believe that people complain about something like this other than perhaps that you can't make it not visible at all which would be my preference. Kind of dumb to be using a wheel and watching another wheel on screen to see if it matches what you are doing. You should be looking at the road.
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Well different people perceive things differently. What may be a complete non issue to you can be a game breaker to others. Similar to how some people like the new GT6 graphics, some people hate them and some people don't even notice them.

Honestly nothing in the game bothers me more that this topic. When I look at a car driving the way I perceive it is Is I also imagine the wheels underneath the the car pointing in a direction and the car going in their direction.

When you see the steering wheel pointing one way but the car is following another path it looks completely wrong and perplexing from an intuition standpoint.

In the GT5P BEtA video posted above with 900 degree steering, even in the crappy days of prologue physics, cockpit view looks more "right" than it ever has.
 
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Most of the time when you are turning the wheel, you don't spin the wheel hand over hand, with the exception of going off or drifting. Taking this, they decided rather than try to get the hands to not bug out like in that video, they made it so the wheel won't spin 900 degrees. It makes sense, and it follows the actual movements for the most part. Do you really turn the wheel that much?
 
Colonel_Loki
Most of the time when you are turning the wheel, you don't spin the wheel hand over hand, with the exception of going off or drifting. Taking this, they decided rather than try to get the hands to not bug out like in that video, they made it so the wheel won't spin 900 degrees. It makes sense, and it follows the actual movements for the most part. Do you really turn the wheel that much?
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Umm no it doesn't make any sense at all and is the most visually incorrect representation of car behaviour you could possibly make in a video game.

Iin a video game all you really have is video and audio. It would be the same as making the car sounds bounce of the rev limiter even though you are at only at 2000rpm just because it sounds cooler. That would make no sense and neither does this.

And yes I turn the wheel that much. Its pretty much all you do in driving? :S

Have you even seen real life racing pushing cars to and past their limit?
 
xSNAKEx
Umm no it doesn't make any sense at all and is the most visually incorrect representation of car behaviour you could possibly make in a video game.

Iin a video game all you really have is video and audio. It would be the same as making the car sounds bounce of the rev limiter even you are at 2000rpm just because it sounds cooler. Or like having a front wheel drived car make smoke from the rear tyes when it does burnouts. That would make non sense and neither does this.

And yes I turn the wheel that much. Its pretty much all you do in driving? :S
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I think i see the issue here. Are you using a controller or a wheel?

I use a wheel, and the wheel onscreen always matches my actual wheel. If i'm not hanging the back end out, then i don't do any hand over hand action. As long as everything is under control and i'm taking a turn normally, the wheel pretty much never turns more than 180 degrees, and the upper end is in extreme cases.

That's how it is in my actual car as well. You don't need to turn the wheel much, like that rally driver in the video you posted.
 
Colonel_Loki
I think i see the issue here. Are you using a controller or a wheel?

I use a wheel, and the wheel onscreen always matches my actual wheel. If i'm not hanging the back end out, then i don't do any hand over hand action. As long as everything is under control and i'm taking a turn normally, the wheel pretty much never turns more than 180 degrees, and the upper end is in extreme cases.

That's how it is in my actual car as well. You don't need to turn the wheel much, like that rally driver in the video you posted.
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Dude I think your missing the main point. It doesn't matter whether you use a ds3 or wheel. The wheels of the car in game, according to where it goes and the physics engine etc, do not point at the same direction as the steering wheel in game does. In fact the steering wheel is pointing at an angle almost 3 times less than the wheels.

To address your question. I use a wheel for series racing. Its 900+ degrees. It points nowhere NEAR where the in game wheel does. Maybe you are using as wheel that has less than 900 degrees rotation so thats why you one matches up with the in game does. But even if it did, its still beside the point as the wheels of the actual car are pointing in a totally different angle.

Why don't you have a look at the Gran Tursimo 6 vs real life comparison video posted and see where the real steering wheel is pointing, where the real car is travelling, ALSO where the gran turismo wheels are pointing, but NOT where the gran turismo steering wheel is pointing. Thats 3 out of 4 things pointing in the right direction and the 1 being idiotic which is the in game wheel.

I don't know how to explain it much clearer without diagrams and I shouldn't have to do that as its pretty easy to get.
 
xSNAKEx
Dude I think your missing the main point. It doesn't matter whether you use a ds3 or wheel. The wheels of the car in game, according to where it goes and the physics engine etc, do not point at the same direction as the steering wheel in game does. In fact the steering wheel is pointing at an angle almost 3 times less than the wheels.

To address your question. I use a wheel for series racing. Its 900+ degrees. It points nowhere NEAR where the in game wheel does. Maybe you are using as wheel that has less than 900 degrees rotation so thats why you one matches up with the in game does. But even if it did, its still beside the point as the wheels of the actual car are pointing in a totally different angle.

Why don't you have a look at the Gran Tursimo 6 vs real life comparison video posted and see where the real steering wheel is pointing, where the real car is travelling, ALSO where the gran turismo wheels are pointing, but NOT where the gran turismo steering wheel is pointing. Thats 3 out of 4 things pointing in the right direction and the 1 being idiotic which is the in game wheel.

I don't know how to explain it much clearer without diagrams and I shouldn't have to do that as its pretty easy to get.
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No, the wheel i'm using is a G27, so it's full 900. When i do happen to notice the wheel, it's usually pretty close. It's not perfect, but in the above video the only time that i see it not being in roughly the same direction (it seems to be off, but when you consider the time frame it's not that bad) is when the real life driver very quickly steered to the right and then back. Outside of that instance, it matched the same amount of rotation, it was just the timing that was very slightly different.

But the above example is a stupid example anyway; it's not video of his hands on a wheel while playing a game. It's video of him driving, and then based on the data it is given, the game tries it's best to recreate what happened. Naturally the steering isn't going to be exactly the same because of that, that's always been true of this kind of technology.

I'm not saying the game's great, i have a ton of problems with both GT5 and GT6. I just think that this isn't as bad as you're making it out to be from my experience. Then again, the wheel on screen doesn't bother me at all.
 
Every time I watch that Prologue video with the 1:1 steering I just get sad. It looks phenomenal. I would love that to be in GT5 and GT6. So tired of the inaccurate current movement. Some people here say they don't notice it, but I do all the time. It's strange and somewhat distracting when the wheel on screen doesn't match the same angle as the wheel you're using.

And for a simulator, it just doesn't make sense to not portray it as it is in real life. Leave that limited angle stuff for Need For Speed.
 
Colonel_Loki
No, the wheel i'm using is a G27, so it's full 900. When i do happen to notice the wheel, it's usually pretty close. It's not perfect, but in the above video the only time that i see it not being in roughly the same direction (it seems to be off, but when you consider the time frame it's not that bad) is when the real life driver very quickly steered to the right and then back. Outside of that instance, it matched the same amount of rotation, it was just the timing that was very slightly different.
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Well then my friend you are grossly unobservant. If you have a G27 and you think the rotation is "pretty close" and top of this in the video of real life vs gt6 you think that its "matched the same amount of rotation", then it seems it would be nigh on impossible to make you get this simple concept, because your face is being shoved right at it and you cant see it. I guess will address you one more time this post then I give up. Who knows eh?

But the above example is a stupid example anyway; it's not video of his hands on a wheel while playing a game. It's video of him driving, and then based on the data it is given, the game tries it's best to recreate what happened. Naturally the steering isn't going to be exactly the same because of that, that's always been true of this kind of technology.
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Not only is it a perfect example, but you are totally missing the point. Its got nothing at all do with the game trying to recreate what happened based of telemetry. Oh god you actually the discrepancies are because the technology of the telemetry is not perfect *facepalm*.
Even if the way the data captures WAS perfect, GT6 would still be off by a huge amount because of the way the wheel is programmed to rotate. IT UNDER rotates according to where the wheels are rotating.

i,e The IN GAME wheel moves differently to where the IN GAME wheels on the outside of the car are pointing.


Conquerer
Every time I watch that Prologue video with the 1:1 steering I just get sad. It looks phenomenal. I would love that to be in GT5 and GT6. So tired of the inaccurate current movement. Some people here say they don't notice it, but I do all the time. It's strange and somewhat distracting when the wheel on screen doesn't match the same angle as the wheel you're using.

And for a simulator, it just doesn't make sense to not portray it as it is in real life. Leave that limited angle stuff for Need For Speed.
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Its very rare come across some "common" sense these days.

Anyway, here is a nice video that I thought was worth posting.

Pay attention Colonoles loki The game on the left has done it correcntly

 
I only miss this because would do the real driving comparisson vs ingame easier without the need to use multiple cameras pointing at the person playing with the wheel controller. With short radius would be cool to see 1:1 in-game but with large radius I'm not sure, could be a distraction and will require more in-game resources to look good and not weird.

 
Zer0
I only miss this because would do the real driving comparisson vs ingame easier without the need to use multiple cameras pointing at the person playing with the wheel controller. With short radius would be cool to see 1:1 in-game but with large radius I'm not sure, could be a distraction and will require more in-game resources to look good and not weird.

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That is really well done. What kind of setup is that guy using?
 
I don't understand how people can say it is not important, I agree with xSNAKEx, knowing exactly where your front wheels are pointing to using the steering wheel as reference is imo the best way to set fast laps, otherwise it feels like you are understeering on slow corners
 
You can't tell exactly where your front wheels are pointing by looking at the angle of a steering wheel. If so that would mean that you could only turn the steering wheel about 35 degrees in either direction which is not even close to what happens on your average car.

For example if your hand is on top of the wheel at 12:00 you would not move to 9:00 to get the wheels to go full left you would have to turn a lot farther in some case you would have to go more than 360 degrees. However some things like say some go carts do have a very tight steering lock and it would be much close to matching than would your average street car as would an F1 car

So imo if you are using a controller it should not mater at all as you have no way of feeling how far you are turning and the steering lock is different on different cars. If you are using a wheel then you should nto be comparing the wheel on screen to the wheel you are using. You should be able to drive based on the feel of where your hands really are and the car you are driving, and in either case if the wheel no matching the wheels is making you have slower laps it is not the wheel animation in the game that is the problem. The problem is that you are paying to much attention to the wheel when you should be watching the road instead. I do not ever pay any attention to the on screen wheel just like I do not look at the wheel I am using when I race nor do I look at the wheel in my car while I am driving, that serves no purpose and distracts you from what is important.
 
You can't tell exactly where your front wheels are pointing by looking at the angle of a steering wheel.
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idk what you mean, but if you do a full turn on the steering wheel at lets say 10mph its sort of easy to know how much the car turn
 
This bothers me as well (A bit). I usually imagine that all cars have racecar steering lock to forget about it.
 
The fact they don't use the full turning radius visually bothers me as well, but it doesn't really affect gameplay.
The thing I really miss is the option to lock turning radius of the wheel. It's simply ridiculous to drive a F1 car or similar racing car with 900° steering radius.
 

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