heel-toe?

[DORIFTO_N()B]

hey guys ,i was messing around awhile with my friend(Drifting)in Gt4
and i was like "dude check it out heal toe" he started laughing but
i noticed something when i "heal toe" the car seems to understeer less, i wanted to know if any1 else does this in GT4?
(i know im probly not the only 1,or the 1st person to "heal toe" in GT4

i think i found my understeer problem

 

[AndrewOval]

lol i tried to heal toe but your reaction has to be pretty precise. So i just keep one foot on the accelerator and another on the brake. Made it much more easier. Sometimes i find it that heal toe gives the car to much kick makes me oversteer. So i really dont use it often.

 

[KiwiBoy]

I think your referring to trail-braking. Since heel and toe requires braking and giving gas during down shifting. Not sure if I'm right, but this is what I read on the internet.

 

[nk4e]

Heel Toe but it isn't used because GT4 doesn't have a clutch, nor does the DFP.
I think the steps goes like this
Brake
Heel-toe
Turn/gas
countersteer with little gas until the end

but this is going to get off topic, What will really effect the car with understeer is the settings or tires. Well, weight transfer may count.

 

[DORIFTO_N()B]

yes, after playing for a while i noticed its more of a trailbraking and also by tapping the gas when i down shift(heal toe) it seems to oversteer a bit more
at the begining of the Drift,i said it helped out my underteer problem cuz the trailbreaking,the weight shifts foward and i have more grip on front tires thus less understeer.


Heel toe shifting is a race shifting technique that allows drivers to downshift quickly while applying the brakes. Proper heal toe shifting keeps the engine, transmission, and wheel speed matched up so there is no jolt through the driveline while downshifting. When drifting, heel toe downshifting allows drivers to downshift in order to increase engine rpm, while braking to transfer weight forward and off the rear wheels.

Got info here--http://www.driftsession.com/drifting_technique/heel_toe_shifting.h

 

[inferno]

Definition of heel and toe:

"heel and toe" is used for downshifts during cornering and prevents the drive wheels from loosing traction due to engine breaking.

performing heel and toe simply means, under breaking while cornering, (say a decreasing radius corner perhaps) with your "toes" on the break, you rotate your foot towards the accelerator and using your heel, blip the throttle to kick up the revs as you shift down a gear. as said before this prevents the downshift from breaking traction at the drive wheels as the clutch is re-engaged.

 

[Sage]

DORIFTO_N()B – Heel-and-toeing is only physically possible while the clutch is disengaged, which is a moot point in the GT series, since the transmission works as an automanual type deal; furthermore, heel-and-toeing has nothing to do with understeer, but rather smooth clutch engagement and (thus) avoiding upsetting the chassis.

I suspect you’re talking about entering a corner on the gas, and blipping the brake (which happens to be the exact opposite of heel-and-toeing). This is something that you’d never want to do in a real car, but it works well enough in GT4, since there’s no mechanical damage – it’s effectively the same thing as releasing your foot from the gas for a split second to regain traction, thus curing the understeer.

[edit]: Eh, I take too long to type.

 

[nk4e]

DORIFTO_N()B – Heel-and-toeing is only physically possible while the clutch is disengaged, which is a moot point in the GT series, since the transmission works as an automanual type deal; furthermore, heel-and-toeing has nothing to do with understeer, but rather smooth clutch engagement and (thus) avoiding upsetting the chassis.

I suspect you’re talking about entering a corner on the gas, and blipping the brake (which happens to be the exact opposite of heel-and-toeing). This is something that you’d never want to do in a real car, but it works well enough in GT4, since there’s no mechanical damage – it’s effectively the same thing as releasing your foot from the gas for a split second to regain traction, thus curing the understeer.

[edit]: Eh, I take too long to type.

Well, its better though because some people may not understand the other post but yours.

 

[DORIFTO_N()B]

DORIFTO_N()B – Heel-and-toeing is only physically possible while the clutch is disengaged, which is a moot point in the GT series, since the transmission works as an automanual type deal; furthermore, heel-and-toeing has nothing to do with understeer, but rather smooth clutch engagement and (thus) avoiding upsetting the chassis.

I suspect you’re talking about entering a corner on the gas, and blipping the brake (which happens to be the exact opposite of heel-and-toeing). This is something that you’d never want to do in a real car, but it works well enough in GT4, since there’s no mechanical damage – it’s effectively the same thing as releasing your foot from the gas for a split second to regain traction, thus curing the understeer.

[edit]: Eh, I take too long to type.

I understand that part> releasing your foot from the gas for a split second to regain traction, thus curing the understeer.

but i was understeering at corner entry not mid Drift and i couldnt find a way too correct that, its the trailbreaking that helped me out not the "heal toe"
even though you cant really "heal toe" in GT4.
sorry guys.

 

[N35QU1K]

Well, though i know it probably does nothing to better my car's handling or smoothen its downshifting, but i do do it. I even built a mock clutch pedal out of construx building toys and a rubber band. (If anyone wants, i can post pictures)

Ever since i was introduced to Best Motoring and Keiichi Tsuchiya and all that jazz, I practiced it with GT4 (yeah, I'm such a loser with my fake-*** clutch). I've never gotten the chance to drive stick in real life, and pretending to do it in GT4 probably wont help anything.

On another note, im not quite sure if it has any effects on the car's handling; its probably just an excuse for your foot to stay on the brakes just a little bit longer.

 

[DG5 DRIFTER]

you can't heel toe there isn't a clutch and heel toe is a shifting technique to keep your revs up and stop your speed from slowing down to much it doesn't stop understeer.I think i already seed a thread like this.
Here this is what the meaning of heel toe shifting.

Heel toe shifting is a race shifting technique that allows drivers to downshift quickly while applying the brakes. Proper heal toe shifting keeps the engine, transmission, and wheel speed matched up so there is no jolt through the driveline while downshifting. When drifting, heel toe downshifting allows drivers to downshift in order to increase engine rpm, while braking to transfer weight forward and off the rear wheels.


1. Before entering a turn, do your initial braking to transfer your vehicle’s weight forward. Double clutch / heel toe downshift (see next step). Turn your wheels into the corner. Carry enough momentum into the corner to induce oversteer.


2. Clutch in, bring your vehicle into neutral, and release clutch. While on the brakes, slide your right heel over to the gas pedal and rev up (blip) the engine to match transmission and engine speed. Without matching revs on downshift, the engine speed will cause a jolt through the driveline, upsetting rear traction uncontrollably.


3. After matching revs, clutch in, and downshift your vehicle. Double clutching is optional, but reduces wear on your transmission. Use e-brake if momentum and downshift do not create enough oversteer.


4. Release the clutch, get off the brakes, and press the accelerator. Accelerate enough to keep tires spinning to continue oversteer. Add steering input (countersteering) to keep your vehicle from pivoting or spinning out.

 

[Scaff]

Heel and Toe downshifting has been discussed on quite a few different threads, and while its a great technique for the real world (I heel and toe almost every downshift that involves braking - mainly for the additional smoothness in the gearchanges). I've posted the following a few times and it always seems of use, how to heel and toe.

In regard to GT4 not only can't we heel and toe, but we do not need to. The game does it for you, every downshift you do in GT4 has the throttle 'blipped' for you. I tested this a while ago as part of some work I carried out on compression (engine braking), the last part of the following post covers it well.

http://gtplanet.net/forum/showpost.php?p=1794405&postcount=375

Regards

Scaff

 

[DFR RX-7]

haha, its kinda funny that i came across this thread, because i tried the same thing earlier today. but im not entirely sure how to properly heel-toe, since im not even old enough to have a real driver's liscence.

 

[Red_Line]

Ya I think what some people are talking about is a clutch kick, since heel-toe is done to keep RPM's up on a downshift.

Since there's no clutch it's pointless in GT4, might as well just you LFB (left-foot braking) to be more accurate with throttle and braking.

 

[nk4e]

haha, its kinda funny that i came across this thread, because i tried the same thing earlier today. but im not entirely sure how to properly heel-toe, since im not even old enough to have a real driver's liscence.

You don't need a license to learn heel-Toe but you do need a Car with Manual Transmission. Well, nor do some of us because Gt4 doesn't have a Clutch so certain techniques aren't used

 

[jammyozzy]

Just out of interest, is it possible to heel-toe shift with your foot the other way around? i.e. the heel of your right foot is depressing the brake pedal while the ball blips the throttle?

When I first got my G25 and began practising heel-toe shifting I naturally did it this way around, because it felt much more natural to blip with the ball of my foot, and I had trouble moving my heel to blip the throttle without accidentally putting mare pressure on the brake pedal at the same time. I'm just wondering whether this is at all possible with a real car, and if it's possibly more dangerous that the conventional method.

 

[Sage]

It’s not intrinsically “wrong”, per se, but it’s probably just about impossible in most cars. In every car I’ve been in, the brake and gas pedals have been arranged somewhat like this…

… which means that unless you’re double-jointed, it would be enormously difficult to place your heel on the brake and your toes on the accelerator.

 

[jammyozzy]

Ah, that's something I forgot to consider. I know that in our Impreza the accelerator pedal is slightly higher than the brake pedal, but now I think about it almost every other car I've sat in has the pedals set up something like that.

Cheers Sage. 👍

 

[Ske]

What you're doing is what's called left-foot braking, a pretty common technique for rallying and such to moderate weight transfer and keep the car from unsettling in fast corners...

 

[Suzuki]

Ya I think what some people are talking about is a clutch kick, since heel-toe is done to keep RPM's up on a downshift.

Since there's no clutch it's pointless in GT4, might as well just you LFB (left-foot braking) to be more accurate with throttle and braking.

partially incorrect. heel-toe is used to shift down smoothly as to not affect the balance of the car since usually you would be threshold braking, so any sudden jerks would cause the drive wheels to lock up.

Just out of interest, is it possible to heel-toe shift with your foot the other way around? i.e. the heel of your right foot is depressing the brake pedal while the ball blips the throttle?

When I first got my G25 and began practising heel-toe shifting I naturally did it this way around, because it felt much more natural to blip with the ball of my foot, and I had trouble moving my heel to blip the throttle without accidentally putting mare pressure on the brake pedal at the same time. I'm just wondering whether this is at all possible with a real car, and if it's possibly more dangerous that the conventional method.

to do heel-toe doesnt mean you HAVE to do it exactly like that. i know some people with big feet just put the left part of their foot on the brake and right on the gas to blip it. its just whatever feels more natural/comfortable to you.