- 759
- France
A thread only about balancing CSA and nothing else
- Thread starter Tou2istTrophy
- 132 comments
- 5,899 views
- 9,437
- Portland, OR
- Jump_Ace
- JUMPxACE
I'm probably in the minority on this, but I don't think it has anything to do with wheelspin. To me I don't get that when it's turned on. Rather what I think is happening is the game is balancing out your turns for you to hit the correct line. So if you countersteer slightly, it will perform a little bit of understeer to the physics model. And visa versa for understeer cars. Resulting in the car being more balanced, resulting in faster times.
Jerome
Jerome
tsk tsk
- 1,840
- United States
In just about all forms of modern motorsports ABS and TCS systems are allowed and used. In this game the CSA and ASM aids are a virtual world only and their purpose is to help maintain control of the car and enhance consistent lap times many times that are above what a drivers skill level actually is.
This race was mainly DR B and all SR S ranked drivers
Today in a race I ran in in the Daily races GR3 at Kyoto there were 19 cars on the grid, out of those 19 all used ABS,1 used no aids. 5 TCS only, 13 used TCS and CSA and 6 of those 13 used TCS along with both CSA and ASM.
Top 10 starters 1 used no aids, 4 used TCS only, 5 used CSA, and 2 used ASM as well. No aids started position 1 and TCS only started in position 3, 8 ,9 10.
Top 10 Finishers 3 used TCS only, 7 used CSA and 3 used ASM along with the CSA. TCS only users at finish were position 2,3,7 with virtual world aid users filling the other 7 positions. The 2 top TCS only users started position 8 and 9.
Some observations have been that the majority of cars seeming to be driving over their heads trying to maintain race pace are the virtual world aids users with the ASM users being the worst. Most contact I have seen lately have more often again come from drivers employing the virtual world aids.
I have actually felt like the intentional divebombing has lessened somewhat in the higher ranks but there are many drivers that seem to multiple times within a race being over their head are usually drivers trying to run a faster pace than their driving skills are allowing and most of these drivers are running the virtual aids. Without those aids in my opinion many would not be ranked to a point to enter the higher ranked lobbies.
- 35
- England
- 1,840
- United States
Where did you get the idea I am a DS4 player?
- 759
- France
Not much more else to be said honestly.
The two fastest DS4 users in GT Sport (one of them being top 5 overall) use no aids besides abs. They don't countersteer much because they are good at using the throttle when coming out of corners. I use a wheel and DS4, and don't notice much difference in difficulty. If you need to countersteer in the first place you are most likely losing time. A DS4 has its advantages and disadvantages, but it does not directly simulate a wheel, it has many assists built into it already.
Last edited:
- 35
- England
This whole debate got me running no tcs in gr3 tonight. It didn't end well because the brain cells I used to spend watching out for the nimrods now had to focus on monitoring throttle input. I'm still a little timid so my lap times are a little off but I'll stick with it. Ended up rage quitting the last race and calling it a night due to all the aholes out tonight.
- 35
- England
Which players do you talk about? And you think we should remove an aid that makes the game overall more enjoyable for players just because 2 people can do it without? I watch top players on face cam and a lot of corners they pretty much wrestle with there wheel to keep it going how they like and you think it's possible on DS4? I guess you also use a wheel because I guarantee you wouldn't feel the same way. They should ban it from wheel users if anything.
- 759
- France
Have you seen IOF? He barely even moves his wheel at all. GT has built in assists for controller users. I use a wheel and DS4, like i have already mentioned in my previous comment, and can run top 10 times with both with and without csa. Both wheel and DS4 have advantages and disadvantages. So yes, i do still feel the same way.
- 1,840
- United States
I have no problem with how a controllers input is configured and I do not think most others do either. The problem as I see it and from reading post in several threads that discuss the issue and others seem to agree is from the aids lessening the results of making a mistake or improving being able to more easily maintain faster lap times within a race over a racer that does not employ the aids.
I have no problem and I am sure that PD can adjust the response of the CONTROL INPUTS made by the racer to make counter steering easier with a pad if that is actually needed at the current time.
.
I do not think that because of what control input a racer decides to employ that any aid should add a performance or competitive advantage in race that offers a reduced penalty for making a mistake or lessen the chance of a racer making a mistake because of computer assistance over a racer that does not employ the aid which is what is currently happening in many situations.
- 35
- England
2
Last edited:
- 759
- France
Please close thread. PD and FIA will do what they do.
wtf
- 35
- England
yeah PD will use common sense like they did from the start and allow DS4 users to play there game because they know some players whatever they do will always complain someone has an advantage
- 1,840
- United States
Are you turning within 3 or 4 tenths of a second of top ten times even using CSA? Would buying a wheel put you at this level within the game?
I use a wheel, I choose to not deploy any aids that are not aids currently in use within real world motorsports competition. I am usually at least several seconds a lap off of the top ten lap times for a track and particular class of car.
So that makes me disadvantaged by your criteria, should we ban all the faster players so I will not be disadvantaged or should we create an aid that would give me an in game performance advantage to close the gap because I cannot run the lap times they are capable of?
I do not care whether you use a controller or a wheel there should be no unrealistic aids that use a computer to cover up a driver making a mistake within the race and having less of a penalty over a driver making the exact same mistake that chooses not employ that aid. If you feel that you need a wheel to be competitive at the level you want to be at or you are at a disadvantage because you do not have a wheel, buy a wheel.
There are thousands of GTS racers that want to be faster or in a higher ranking bracket than their skills as a driver allow for but blaming because someone uses a different controller type is sort of weak actually. It is well documented there are many top 10 pad users within this game that do not use virtual world aids. I wish I had their skills but I have fun back further, way back further actually in the rankings.
- 35
- England
3
Last edited:
- 1,840
- United States
Actually you CANNOT tell what controller type a player is using and there are plenty of wheel users using these aids as well from my understanding.
- 35
- England
Yes pretty much everytime I'm top 10 eu and sometimes 1st, with or without CSA but CSA makes me more consistent. And the criteria was yours, i obviously don't want wheels banned. If your so enthusiastic and believe so much about playing this game with no aids, then put your wheel away. If I use CSA then I feel I'm at no disadvantage but if that was removed then yes I'd be disadvantage. I have no problem at all people using a wheel obviously but when 100% of the people in this thread use a wheel and are here wanting to get an assist that makes mine and probably atleast 90% of players who use a controller more fun and enjoyable removed, it makes me laugh.
no you can't tell, so how do you know people using CSA who you say are driving above there means, aren't using a controller? So you expect all of them to turn it off and so now your wheel vs controller are on an equal footing? That make you feel better? and if you guys could share the name of the top 10 players on controller with no assissts so I could learn how to counter steer please, thank you.
Last edited by a moderator:
- 1,840
- United States
Playing a driving game with a wheel has been a normal activity across all platforms pretty much for the last 20 years and is considered by many including myself to be much more immersive and relates more to an actual driving experience over using a controller so why would I want to put my wheel away?
To my knowledge this virtual world aid offers the exact same advantages to a wheel user that chooses to employ the aid as well so again your argument of only pad users would be hurt or affected by its removal or nerfing its effects in game actually holds no water either.
So if a wheel user employs this aid you are okay with that as hearing you a wheel user has an advantage to begin with? If you are turning top 10 times then you should not be one that needs any aids as you are at the top of the heap but are you saying you cannot maintain that pace over race distance without using the aids?
- 1,743
- Aussie
- Tassie_tiger
From what l can tell you have 2 problems.
First, you don't seem to grasp how difficult sarcasm is to convey in written text.
Second, maths is clearly not your strong point.
Without speaking for anyone else in this thread, l for one certainly didn't advocate for the removal of any aids.
- 35
- England
4
Last edited:
- 1,840
- United States
What you are failing to follow is if PD makes settings that allow a pad user USING THEIR OWN CONTROL INPUTS to better counter steer I have no issue with that whatsoever.
My problem with the current CSA application is that the aid REACTS TO MISTAKES OR ADJUSTING FOR COUNTERSTEER post control input where the racer has made a mistake or not made the corrections needed and as a result there are many cases where a non aid user would lose pace and time on track but an aid user is saved by the computer and does not lose that same pace making the same mistake.
This aid gives those same post input results and the same performance advantage REGARDLESS WHETHER BY WHEEL OR PAD USER!
This is where I do not understand why you as a controller user thinks that it is aimed at them, it gives an in game boost to consistency over a non user regardless, the only players that are actually affected are those that prefer to race with as little computer aids as possible and do not employ it.
So for every wheel user that employs this aid in your mind they are gaining even more advantage because you think a wheel is an advantage to begin with. If you do some searching on this forum you will find many racers prefer the pad for this game over the wheel.
- 1,743
- Aussie
- Tassie_tiger
Well l hope so because decent grammar is a requirement of the AUP.
Not posting false or misleading info. is also part of it.
Anyway, I'm not sure why you feel the need to be clever towards me.
If you are going to include me in a group and then put forward false accusations about that group, I'll probably respond to let you know it wasn't appreciated.
- 35
- England
This is my fourth post I've put and not put it all in one probably going to annoy a moderator or something but it's perilous talking to
so it's just as easy to counter steer on a controller as it is on a wheel? Guess I need to cancel my order for a wheel. I don't want anything banned nor do I hate wheels. But it's rich coming from all the wheel users who want something that makes this game playable for me as a pad user removed. PD already made that setting your on about its called CSA.
- 1,840
- United States
Since the last update GR4 with no aids at all except ABS is great, GR3 I can turn TCS down compared to pre patch but turning it off completely if you even slightly crack the egg under the right pedal coming out of a slow tight corner you are going around. With the TCS off I can get it right 9 out of ten times but that one time cost many positions!
I only drive rear wheel drive cars. I will remain with ABS and the lower TCS as it still takes some finesse to get a decent drive out of a slow corner as the only aids I deploy.
