Increasing Displacement

[Steelo]

In GT4 I can't seem to find any cars that can have displacement increased. Are there any? What are they?

 

[elctrk!]

um i thought pretty much all of them can have it done.
maybe you're just using too many race cars?

 

[Eric.]

um i thought pretty much all of them can have it done.
maybe you're just using too many race cars?

Or maybe you are using too many Skylines.

There really aren't many cars you can do it to. It isn't a significant hp increase anyways, even in a Skyline.

 

[nismo4life]

Because in real life you cannot always bore the cylinders out on an engine. The Cylinder walls aren't that thick and to increase displacement you need to basically grind them down and make them smaller, which in turn makes the cylinder bigger, but makes the wall lose alot of strength. For Example. the Nismo Z Tune Skyline, it uses the Z2 block, its a race engine bored out to 2.8 Liters, instead of 2.6. If you take a big block you can almost certainly increase that...(dont quote me because i am horrible with domestics) but you should be able to, but if you take a honda civic, the cylinder walls are thin as it is, and they are aluminum, so if you make them too thin, they will end up cracking which inturn allows water from the water jackets around the cylinder to enter the cylinder and its by by motor after that.......

Here are some pics

This is a RB26 block...notice the thickness of the wall in between each cylinder(Inter Sleeve Space).

Now notice how much less the honda B16 block has in between the cylinders, and the cylinder wall and the water jackets.

H22 block

If you bore out the H22 anymore, not only is there a chance the engine will blow, but it will dramatically decrease the life expectancy on the motor as well.

 

[Steelo]

So basically the RB26 is the only engine in the game that can bored? In real life can you not replace the crank for one with a bigger offset, giving you a bigger stroke? I don't really know much at all about that sort of stuff.

 

[nismo4life]

So basically the RB26 is the only engine in the game that can bored? In real life can you not replace the crank for one with a bigger offset, giving you a bigger stroke? I don't really know much at all about that sort of stuff.

no, like i said i might be wrong cuz i dunno alot about them, but i always heard the meat heads at my school talking about putting stroker kits on their big blocks, etc. generally in japanese cars or the majority that i've seen they make the cylinders wider...... i.e. The AMS Lancer Evolution 8, stupid example but some reject bored out a 4G63 to 2.3 liters.....yea the motor makes 601 awhp with a GT-35R ball bearing turbo, but hit motor will probably crap out at 50,000 miles because it was not designed for that

 

[Kylehnat]

but if you take a honda civic, the cylinder walls are thin as it is, and they are aluminum, so if you make them too thin, they will end up cracking which inturn allows water from the water jackets around the cylinder to enter the cylinder and its by by motor after that.......

That's funny because the only car I've been able to up the displacement on was a civic You're right, though. I don't think that modification should even be in the game. For one, so few cars can even do it, and two, in real life, heavy modifcations must be made to the engine block to safely increase the displacement.

 

[Axe_Gaijin]

Correct me if I'm wrong, as I know more about tuning bikes then cars in real life, but isn't "stroking" an engine a part of classic tuning on American musclecars? (changing heads, crankshaft and pistons).

Because I was always wondering why none (some?) of the Amercan cars in the game had the option for increased displacement.

 

[TachiTJRS]

Yes, stroking an engine is a variable option that is often combined with 'boring' an engine block. For example, the Honda B-series and Nissan SR20 often gets an increase in capacity this way. In the Honda B-series, the whole crank, conrod and piston gets changed to increase its capacity to 1.8litres (a la B18C versus the B16A)

Some engines like the SR20 and 4A-GE have piston options from the manufacturers spare partlist for increrased bore size but usually not more than 1.0mm thickness from the stock bore.

In any sense, all these require complex calculations which are often miscalulated by engine 'tuners'. As a result, the engine life expectancy decreases. However, correct blueprinting and honing of the block can spare a lot of trouble. But these techniques are often out of reach of the regular workshop 'tuner'.

In Japan, where the culture is founded on precisely calculated engineering approach, the options for increasing displacement are few and far between. Unlike the western world (or in other parts of Asia for that matter) where 'tuners' often go to lengths to bore out and engine for more power without giving a hoot about longevity.

In GT4, this principle is founded upon what techniques for what engine the car possesses are available in the context of Japan. Therefore allowing only selected cars to undergo this process.

 

[JTSnooks]

I don't think that modification should even be in the game. For one, so few cars can even do it, and two, in real life, heavy modifcations must be made to the engine block to safely increase the displacement.

Wow, what nismo4life said was true...of underengineered japanese engines (that doesn't mean they're not well-engineered, it means they have low factors of safety which means less room for certain modifications). Almost ANY American V8 (and most other American engines) can be bored out. Most of the older V8s can be bored out by over .060 inches safely. The engine in my car is bored .030 over, and I could go .060 over without worrying about safety or anything. And yes, stroker kits are very popular, but not quite as popular as boring an engine, as the only thing that has to be changed when boring an engine is the pistons. When stroking an engine, the crank either has to be ground down or replaced, and therefore difference connecting rods have to be used, and sometimes the bottoms of the cylinders have to be ground off a little for clearance.

For instance, the Pontiac 350 uses the exact same block as the Pontiac 455, which is often bored/stroked all the way to 472 ci or more. That's over a 100 cubic inch increase (5.7 liters to 7.5) on the exact same block casting!! The GT series is stupid in the respect that you can't increase the displacement on an old V8

 

[nismo4life]

Wow, what nismo4life said was true...of underengineered japanese engines (that doesn't mean they're not well-engineered, it means they have low factors of safety which means less room for certain modifications). Almost ANY American V8 (and most other American engines) can be bored out. Most of the older V8s can be bored out by over .060 inches safely. The engine in my car is bored .030 over, and I could go .060 over without worrying about safety or anything. And yes, stroker kits are very popular, but not quite as popular as boring an engine, as the only thing that has to be changed when boring an engine is the pistons. When stroking an engine, the crank either has to be ground down or replaced, and therefore difference connecting rods have to be used, and sometimes the bottoms of the cylinders have to be ground off a little for clearance.

For instance, the Pontiac 350 uses the exact same block as the Pontiac 455, which is often bored/stroked all the way to 472 ci or more. That's over a 100 cubic inch increase (5.7 liters to 7.5) on the exact same block casting!! The GT series is stupid in the respect that you can't increase the displacement on an old V8

agreed

 

[niky]

Actually, I'm pissed that the SR20 and FSZE can't be bored out in game. The FSZE can at least go up to 2.2 liters, while the SR20 has 2.2 and 2.4 liter kits. AFAIK, the Honda B's can go up to 2.2, also, but as that's not strictly a B16 or B18 engine anymore, I guess it doesn't count. The RB26DETT gets the disp.up option, but to an unspecified displacement. And the mapping is all wrong. The disp.up should provide very little hp increase at the start, but allow over 1000hp on the RB... instead, it acts just like a tuning chip replacement or a damn port and polish.

They should just leave it out if they put so little work into it, and give such little utility to the mod.

 

[UrsaMajorPrime]

I'd still be interested in a list of cars that allow this mod in the game - I always found it frustrating to see it available and almost never be able to use it.

I understand it requires a lot of other mods and recalculations, but so do all the other mods we just causually toss on to our cars in the game.

And if it's going to be used so infrequently, make it a model of car instead of an engine modification - know what I mean? (I mean the Midnight Purple Skyline is it's own model/edition, I'm sure they can do a 'stroked' or 'bored' model for the few they've got available) - know what I'm sayin?

UMP

 

[niky]

Some of the "tuner" Skylines come stroked. Don't remember which one, but there's a 2.8 liter Skyline somewhere.

But yeah, for the sake of accuracy, stroked versions should be different models.

Also have some beef with the accuracy of other mods. Notice how a stage four turbo seems to put power into the Nismo 400R at a pretty low rpm? Is that a glitch or what?

 

[Ezz777]

Is that a glitch or what?

A glitch?!? In GT!?! NEVER!!!

I would guess they may be trying to give the 400r an advantage over other skylines as this motor tended to have more low down torque than a 'normal' skyline with this much power (if that makes sense...). What i mean to say is that if you tuned a skyline motor to that of a stock 400r - the 400r would have more bottom end grunt. Hence when you then give it a stg 4 it would then have more low down grunt than a normal skyline with a stg 4.

 

[Steelo]

Ha, it's so great to get such a response from what I thought might seem like a stupid question. Bloody usefull. Very intersting responces. Would be great to see a list of cars on the game that it can be done to, even if it can't in real life. They really should have thought about the tecnicalities of the mod before they put it in the game. But hey, they can't do everything perfectly. I have one more question.... can anyone tell me why when increasing disp after the car is produced it is more often bored, but when a manufacturer produces another model of vehicle with a bigger engine it is often 'stroked' eg, Windsor engine (Ford Falcon) 5.0(AUII) to 5.6(AUIII), Daihatsu Charade 1.3 and 1.5, and B16 and B18c... others I can't think of... ? Is it because 'stoking', if it is done right, is more effective on producing more torque across the entire rev range, (does not shift the torque peak further up the range) of course, what we all really want.

 

[niky]

Actually, in the displacement up option, the Skyline RB26 is "stroked" instead of bored.

More and more manufacturers are going with this as, yes, it does improve torque, but also because engine packaging is getting tighter and tighter. Not many engines can be "bored" so much anymore (like the aforementioned Honda B-Series), but can be stroked an unbelievable amount.

 

[Spottedlaurel]

I'm at work now so can't check, but I think the Mini Marcos can get the displacement increase. Sure I've seen others too.

 

[panjandrum]

While the physics of the game may be pretty good, the upgrade options are definitely NOT based on real-life. As has been mentioned, nearly ALL the classic american cars in the game should be able to get the displacement upgrade, but they can't. Old VWs like the Ghia can be, in real life, pushed over 200 hp, while the one in the game has a max of 107. Also, the initial engine power isn't at all accurate for many models. They even screw up some of the Japanese models. The 2005 Prius, for example, has about 143 hp stock, and 377 pounds of torque. It isn't a sports-car, but it is fairly quick. The car PD gave us has something like 80 hp stock and is a complete snail. So PD definitely manages to hose a lot of things in the game.

So, don't expect too much, you'll be happier. Remember, it is just a game!

 

[Duke]

I have one more question.... can anyone tell me why when increasing disp after the car is produced it is more often bored, but when a manufacturer produces another model of vehicle with a bigger engine it is often 'stroked'.

This has to do with the manufacturing and tooling process. If they keep the bore and cylinder spacing constant, they can keep more parts common across the two engines, and all they have to do is add length to the casting die used to cast the block.

For instance, the Neon's stock engine is a 2.0 litre SOHC or DOHC 4. The next car up, the Stratus/Cirrus/PT uses a 2.4 litre DOHC. Bore and centerline spacing are identical, but stroke is 1" longer. This means the bottom end is nearly identical with just 1" added to the deck height - no complicated re-engineering involved. The 2.0 and 2.4 can then also share the same cylinder head - it's literally identical, carrying the same Mopar part number for all the cars sharing the engine.

 

[Woolie Wool]

If they had realistic mods, the muscle cars would all have HUGE displacement increases, and Vipers and Corvettes would also have displacement up available (Lingenfelter offers a 7.0-liter LS1 for the Corvette and the Apex Lethal 750 Viper has a 9-liter engine). There are a lot of real-life tuning options left out--headers, new carburetors for old cars, turbo kits for NA cars (Henessey builds an 850hp twinturbo Viper), etc.

 

[Suzuki]

There are a lot of real-life tuning options left out--headers, new carburetors for old cars, turbo kits for NA cars (Henessey builds an 850hp twinturbo Viper), etc.

i believe that the exhaust tuning includes intake,header,exhaust,intake manifold, and bigger tb/carb. no car will gain 20-60 hp(race exhaust) with JUST intake and exhaust, even if it is just straight through pipe with no muffler,cat,resonater,etc. without also upgrading header(s), tb/carb, and the intake manifold.

 

[UrsaMajorPrime]

An interesting addition to the game mod mechanics would be to require a blueprinting job before you could just slap on all that high powered stuff.

I mean I could throw a chip in my (RL) Audi and get a reasonable gain but I know without making other mods it would cause unecessary wear and tear on my engine - but doesn't require blueprinting. If I *really* wanted to make a difference though...

That way you could have Before blueprinting mods and After blueprinting mods.

Eh, just a thought to add some more realism to the game...

UMP

 

[SilverEclipse01]

In GT4 I can't seem to find any cars that can have displacement increased. Are there any? What are they?

Back to the original question...

In the game most of the R32, R33, and R34 Skylines can have their displacement increased. Also most of the street legal Honda Civics can have this done. I also believe that the Marcos and a few other of the smaller, classic cars can have this upgrade. Not many at all considering how many cars are in the game.

 

[dudejo]

especially since it SHOULD be doable with old muscle cars since

1)it's a known fact they did this often back in the day.
2)they don't have electronics at all so increased displacement should replace the chip upgrade.