- 600
If it means i get to play my old favorites then a big Yes
Poll: Would you be happy with current standard cars in a PS4 Gran Turismo game?
- Thread starter Samus
- 525 comments
- 26,061 views
- 28,471
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
Right now it's 18.2% in favour of standards in GT7. If you are one of those 18.2%, would you NOT buy GT7 if standards are dropped entirely from the game? Assuming they are dropped completely with maybe 5 turned into full premiums like they did with the Lambo, Alpine etc. for GT6, would that stop you from buying GT7?
- 217
- In the Middle
- GTP_YodaTheCat
I voted To keep them and would till buy GT7 if they went. GT3 dropped loads of cars, though disappointing it didn't stop it being a better game rather than a bigger car fest. As long as there is a big enough variety of cars, and the rest of the game is up to scratch then it would be forgotten quickly enough.
Though I hanker after some of the GT2 cars still, like I would with some of the GT3&4 cars if they disappeared, there would be new favourites to enjoy and I wouldn't get around to driving all the cars anyway.
- 48
- Norfolk/VA/USA
- Twistedview
Standards shouldn't have been included in this game, so I feel they shouldn't be in the next. That's why I only purchased premium models in the game.
The problem is that a lot of the cool cars and special edition models that add so much variety are standards. As we've seen with the loss of GT2 cars, there's more chance of us just losing the car if they don't want to update it to a premium model. And they don't have the capacity to convert 100s of standards to super premium.
Take cars like the MR2, if we lose standards, will PD really remake the mk1, mk1 super charger, MK2 GT-S turbo, the Beams model etc I fear we will lose so many cars.
Take cars like the MR2, if we lose standards, will PD really remake the mk1, mk1 super charger, MK2 GT-S turbo, the Beams model etc I fear we will lose so many cars.
- 7,830
- U S A
- Tetsumura
- Nigel Fox
You keep going at this as if the Premium models can continue improving until they plop into our livingrooms or something. Again, I think the quality of graphics on those car models has just about plateaued. When you can zoom in on headlamps and read lettering on them, I'd like to know how much better they can get. Do you expect to zoom in to microscopic scale and see dust specks and pollen spores on the car surface?
Now, whether or not we've established that the car models are likely not going to see this quantum reality shift beyond what we have in GT6, this is really where we are. I already see stark differences between both sets of cars, and it doesn't bother me in a game already so photoreal in game. And I don't hide from any of the graphics issues of the Standards. I can see them in full 1080p resolution on my PS3 and computer, and so can everyone else who likes their Standard cars. And maybe I haven't made it perfectly clear yet, so let me now. The graphics issues of these cars like the Chevy Camaro, Supra MkIV, 240SX, 300ZX, the NOMAD Diablo and so on, don't interfere with my enjoyment of a damn fine car. I don't secretly gag like you guys do openly.
And by the way, the comparisons that Mikhail K made were about the same resolutions my shots were. Even expanded, the one thread I was just looking at were just 1000 pixels wide, and no one complained that he was downrezing them to hide issues. Everything looked pretty plain to us. So saying that I'm hiding graphic issues in my pics is wearing a bit thin.
As many have said, probably in order to have a massive list of cars to flout.
Yeah, but no one in their right mind with halfway functioning hearing couldn't tell the difference between a vacuum cleaner and any of these cars. My real life MkIII Supra, before it got totaled, sounded like a whizzy little school bus. And so did three others my relatives owned, one who owned two. News flash to the whiners: in Gran Turismo, that's really what they sound like. Stock street cars are heavily muffled to meet sound level restrictions. And no race car has ever sounded like a rug sweeper to me. I happen to own a couple of vacuums, and I know how they sound because I actually use them.
Yeah, but guess what? I'm arguing from a completely different basis than you and your fellow Standard haters.
You guys are debating the subject on the basis that no one should be allowed to have them, so that the game suits you.
I'm debating on the basis of making everyone happy with the game they pay money for. In my line of argument, no one is excluded from having what they want in GT7. Is there anything wrong with people having what they want? I'd sure like to know what.
One more thing. It keeps getting asked if Standards are whacked out of GT7 completely, would that be a dealbreaker for us? Clearly not, because we're fans of the game, and we want our new and improved Gran Turismos.
However, I've asked the same question of both possibilities. If Standards should happen to appear in GT7, how many of you Standard haters are going to be done with the series? Or just hang around here to make as many people miserable as you can?
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- 965
- Eastern USA
- Peelster1
Those tracks look just fine to me and I wouldn't want to lose the ability to race on them.
- 6,293
- Canada
If they drop most of the models which are currently represented exclusively by standards (maybe coverting a handful to premium like you said..I have a tough time imagining a GT game without a Supra RZ or AE86), I would probably not purchase GT7.
My reasoning for that is there will be other games on the market (I'm thinking specifically of pCARS) which do have those cars in them (not all of them, but a lot...and specifically the models I am interested in, which are mostly the oldschool JDM and EUDM cars), and they will be fully detailed models, not "standards".
If standards are removed, 2 things could bring me back to GT.
-most of the cars I am interested in being converted to premium (basically down to chance, and in my opinion, not very likely)
-the rest of the game being nearly flawless, with all the features, gizmos, and gadgets that we have been teased with for the last several years. I'd also add, a complete redesign of the game structure...I'm getting a little tired of GT1
Anything short of that, and GT6 will probably be the last GT I buy at release. There's a good chance I'll wait a year until GT7 drops down to bargain prices and then pick it up...but it most likely won't be my primary racing game.
That's exactly where I'm at. If the standards go, I see a lot of models disappearing from GT forever (or at least for a very long time)
Based on what we know about the modelling process, Kaz's desire to "keep the team small", and the pursuit to keep adding new models to the game (whether new "classic" models, or new "new" models), I don't see how PD can do anything about the majority of the standards aside from polish them up or drop them.
We'll just have to wait and see I guess.
- 711
- Chile
- cristobal458
Yees!
If you do not like the standard cars, DO NOT DRIVE!
Removing 700 cars would be a bad idea.
(Traducted from Google Translator)
If you do not like the standard cars, DO NOT DRIVE!
Removing 700 cars would be a bad idea.
(Traducted from Google Translator)
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- 965
- Eastern USA
- Peelster1
So much this. While I don't think that PD should be focusing on taking the time to update cars to premium until they fix their gameplay and give us all of the promised features; these premium cars take up more space on the hard drive and there is no point in installing a car unless you are going to use it. This of course also applies to standard models. If a player doesn't like standard model graphics then they don't have to use the car, but for those of us who like the variety of the standard model's, we can have them.
For example, I like racing trucks sometimes, however, none of those are premium. If PD just took out all standards then we wouldn't have that variety and truck racing would be completely gone. For those that say, "just make the trucks premium", while that would be nice, I will point out that I would rather have gameplay features before PD uses their time for updating in-car graphics. (I don't really use the in-car graphics as much anyway due to the lack of a free-swivel cam in-car for looking around. With the current in-car, I can't see enough to my side, which is why I drive third-person.)
I would rather have the PS2 models than nothing at all, even then. I like having the options. It would be nice if they updated the older models, however, I want them to update features first. (See another of my posts just above this one.)
- 28,471
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
I think you better check the Project CARS car list again if you think it's going to be a good substitute for what will be missing in GT7 without standards. You won't be happy
. There are a couple of Mitsu's + a few Nissans on the "unconfirmed" list but no other JDM I'm aware of. Only a handful of oldschool EUDM as well. I love the PCars car list, not a dog in the bunch, but it is a decidedly different, and much narrower focus than that of the GT series.
- 6,293
- Canada
Just thought of a "fun" exercise in regards to this debate.
Count up how many unique, standard exclusive models are in GT6.
Now, go through that last, and count how many of those models you would consider as "essential" inclusions in GT7 (I'll recycle my personal examples of the Supra RZ or AE86). Obviously, everyone's list will be slightly different, but that's not really the point.
Now, look at the size of your list of unique, standard-exclusive, essential-to-the-series models.
Ask yourself (again, based on the modelling process, size of PD, and continuing to add new models), is it even possible for PD to premiumize that list and still release GT7 in a somewhat timely fashion?
Do you still feel the same about the "remove all standards from GT7" approach?
Count up how many unique, standard exclusive models are in GT6.
Now, go through that last, and count how many of those models you would consider as "essential" inclusions in GT7 (I'll recycle my personal examples of the Supra RZ or AE86). Obviously, everyone's list will be slightly different, but that's not really the point.
Now, look at the size of your list of unique, standard-exclusive, essential-to-the-series models.
Ask yourself (again, based on the modelling process, size of PD, and continuing to add new models), is it even possible for PD to premiumize that list and still release GT7 in a somewhat timely fashion?
Do you still feel the same about the "remove all standards from GT7" approach?
- 28,471
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
The answer for me in terms of essential cars is zero. I have about 250 unique cars in my garage and about 100 duplicates. I'd have to count to be 100% sure but I think I have 8 standards in the entire bunch. 4 Rufs, 3 LMP's and 1 S2000. The only ones I would miss would be Ruf's and they aren't really plain standards anymore, they are "semi-premiums" for lack of a better word.
But I have to add, in spite of @TenaciousD's painting everyone with the same brush by saying, "you guys are saying that no one should have them" that that's not my position at all. My position isn't one of self-interest. Of course I want more, more, more, who doesn't? My concern is for the franchise and the type of game it'll become if it includes 10 year old assets just to pad the car count. They were bad enough in GT5/6 but on the PS4 they will be atrocious, not only compared to their own premiums but compared to every other car game on the market that will all have super premiums and no dogs allowed. GT will become the idiot step-child of the genre and I don't want that. I don't want GT to become a punchline, it's flirting with that already.
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- 6,293
- Canada
I think you better check the Project CARS car list again if you think it's going to be a good substitute for what will be missing in GT7 without standards. You won't be happy
I definitely agree that the pCARS list is very different than what we are used to, and in current form, would be no substitute for GTs list.
However, I'm sort of approaching pCARS with an open mind. As a gaming experience, it's a blank slate for me, as opposed to 15 years of history with GT.
With that in mind, I'm optimistic that the pCARS list will continue to grow, and based on the Community Assisted foundations of the game, I'm optimistic that I'll at least be able to get my voice heard in regards to which cars I'd like to see added.
I guess I'm basically saying that, if standards are removed from GT7 and subsequently many models are lost, I'm more inclined to believe there's a better chance the models I'm interested in will appear in pCARS before they re-appear in GT.
And yes, this is ALL based on speculation. I'll fully evaluate pCARS when it comes out, and do the same with GT7, and make my final decision from there. This debate is just a fun game to play while we wait
Damn it, our lists are very different
. I'll have to go through my GT5 garage when I get home (still haven't been able to purchase everything I want in GT6), but my list would most likely be around 50 cars at least 
This bit, I pretty much agree with, other than from my point of view, removing standards would do more to harm the franchise than including them would. I too want more, more, more, and want the franchise to be successful (fanboy at heart, all be it, a frustrated one). And I definitely agree that GT is flirting with being the genre punch line, as unbelievable as that sounds, seeing as where we came from 15 years ago.
- 462
- MLR_SPARCO
For some reason you guys seems to think it's all about graphics why we want to see standard cars gone and yes that is partially the reason,but for the most part it's about the fact that it's 2014,it's a new console,and that there's an expectation that needs to be met when making a new game for a new console.PD needs to put there best foot forward with GT7,they've been screwing us for quite some time with so many promises broken and this is PD's opportunity to really focus on things that need to be added to the game.With standard cars gone we make it whole of a lot easier for sounds to be updated and a livery system to be implemented,if standards are to stay in this game not only would PD need to update and refine their models they would also have to add interiors and sounds aswell as physics,this I'm sure is one of the main reason why it's so hard to have new content for GT6 and probably for GT7 if they make a return.
I in no way hate standard cars,more than half of my garage is populated with them,but sooner or later they gotta go and who's to say they'll take out every single standard car?More than likely we'll see iconic and popular cars return as premiums or at least DLC.All I'm saying is the pro's out weight the con's,with standards gone theres a better chance of things being implemented sooner.
I in no way hate standard cars,more than half of my garage is populated with them,but sooner or later they gotta go and who's to say they'll take out every single standard car?More than likely we'll see iconic and popular cars return as premiums or at least DLC.All I'm saying is the pro's out weight the con's,with standards gone theres a better chance of things being implemented sooner.
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- 28,471
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
- 462
- MLR_SPARCO
Yea sorry was rushing on ma phone i'll brake it up.Congratulations on the longest sentence ever in the history of GTP
- 10,944
- Canada
Agreed!Congratulations on the longest sentence ever in the history of GTP
Well put @MLRSparco. 
Also, I don't want standard cars either. Quality >>>>>> Quantity. And NO, it's not based on graphics.....
- 28,471
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
Good point, and I agree @MLRSparco made some good points including this one:Agreed!
Also, I don't want standard cars either. Quality >>>>>> Quantity. And NO, it's not based on graphics.....
Doing the sounds and livery templates for 500 premium cars is a lot less daunting than for 1300 or whatever the total would be. The less work they have to do there, the more work they can do in other places, and with such a small team relative to other developers, they really, really have to be efficient with their resources. They can't afford to skimp on sound or liveries next time around.
I don't think the loss of so many amazing cars is an acceptable trade off for a livery editor (which I hope doesn't happen). Because I can see there being a lot of awful custom liveries that make the cars look worse than standards thus negating the argument for getting rid of standards for aesthetic reasons.
Most games have the basic skylines or whatever but who else has the m nur or the GT LM or the kenwood NSX or the silvia 270 etc. These are the cars that differentiate GT from all other games. We would lose too many of them if standards were cut.
Most games have the basic skylines or whatever but who else has the m nur or the GT LM or the kenwood NSX or the silvia 270 etc. These are the cars that differentiate GT from all other games. We would lose too many of them if standards were cut.
Yes but those are the easy cars to convert to premium because once they've done one base model the minor variations are much less work. Someone spoke about a list of essential standards and if PD can replace them with premium models, my answer is yes IF PD stop being so stubborn and either hire more modelers or outsource them. Their lack of doing either is the whole reason we have standards in the first place.
As for bad liveries looking as bad as standards, no. A livery does not change the model quality. It's not just about liveries either, bodykits, wings and other body upgrades will always be limited with standards.
As for bad liveries looking as bad as standards, no. A livery does not change the model quality. It's not just about liveries either, bodykits, wings and other body upgrades will always be limited with standards.
- 40,420
This is a pretty meaningless statement without a link to said pictures so we can actually see whether he did the same thing with his comparisons as you did with yours.
"ROARING race engines without a muffler"
It's lovely that the volume level was accurate. Was the sound itself accurate? Probably, since you so frequently bring it up whenever someone complains about poor sounds; and I doubt you'd constantly refer to it to try to shutter the debate if it really didn't fit as an example.
So what does that one car mean for all of the ones that aren't accurate; particularly the ones where they blatantly didn't even try? Because my old real life S-10 Blazer sounded an awful lot like the Corvette C5-R in the game does when the muffler fell off in the summer of 2009.
Keeping the streak alive.
Unless what they want graphical consistency and feature parity among all of the content in the game. In which case, 🤬 them. To wit, if GT6 was completely full of cars of the quality of the F40, it certainly would go a long way towards making the performance problems much more acceptable. When GT6 has only one F40 in the field and the rest of the field are cars from GT4 and the game still doesn't run any better, it just makes PD look foolish for even bothering to put that F40 in the game at the quality it was at when it is just driving around.
So, really, you are actually debating the subject on the basis that everyone should be forced to put up with them even when it flies completely in the face of every claim of graphical excellence PD puts forth with the game marketing, so the game suits you.
Well, that's a pretty tough question. On the one hand, rewarding PD for something which is nothing short of incompetence is a pretty ghastly idea and I doubt I'll be buying a PS4 within the next two years anyway. On the other hand, there is certainly a measure of appeal in making you miserable.
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- 1,622
- Mass UTC-5
- HugoStiglitz_420 and GTP_HugoStiglitz
I loved GT3 so I like this idea.
- 1,622
- Mass UTC-5
- HugoStiglitz_420 and GTP_HugoStiglitz
That's the only reason I even had to think on whether or not I want them on Ps4.
Ultimately though, I think in this case, the quality gap is just too much and I really don't think they should be in GT7.
If they made a $10 DLC with all the standard cars, I would actually buy it but GT4 cars have no place in a PS4 game. It's kind of hypocritical for me to say that but GT7 needs to be all about quality, not quantity. Standards cannot be carried over from GT4.
However, I'd have no problem at all with GT5 and GT6 cars being ported over to PS4 though. Same with some of the tracks like Bathurst, Spa, the ring.
- 7,830
- U S A
- Tetsumura
- Nigel Fox
Okay.
Without a muffler?? If I said that, I was typing too fast. And of course this was about Forza 4. If you have access to it, do any race with a stock car, watch the replay and you'll know exactly what I mean.
A Supra MkIII sounds nothing like my car, at the very least it sounds like it has a serious Borla mod, inside the car or out. In fact, I cringed at a race in which a stock RX-7 had some awful moany note I jokingly called a dying cow. I was passed by another stock RX-7 and liked its generic sound much better, so in the replay, I switched cars because I wanted to listen to it and use it as an example to grouch a bit on the official Forzxa forums in their sound thread. So I switched, waited the obligatory 15 seconds or so for the replay to change car cameras, and was appalled that the game had swapped the samples for the "high quality dying cow" sounds I was trying to get away from!
I think you keep mischaracterizing my criticism of the critics. I have basically two points:
- Give credit where credit is due when things are good - hard to find when the goal is to get all the samples replaced
- Don't lie to bolster your arguments - hard to find when the goal is to... well, see above
Always ready to please, my friend.
You COMPLETELY missed my point. Now maybe you just hopped in here and saw the above exchange without the full context. Let me repost.
There, in case you missed it, is my request to give us the OPTION to install them. That way, no one is forced to damage their HDTVs or eyes with such crimes against graphics appearing on their screens.
Again in case you missed it, OPTIONS, everyone's buzzword, at least in other subjects.
One more time, in case you're skimming, OPTIONS.
And by the way, OPTIONS.
That might be hard to do when I usually just pass on by little tornadic ruler shaking posts with a pony on top. I'm getting pretty good at recognizing posters who really don't contribute much actual discussion around here.
One more thing as kind of an olive branch. Dude, you're a smart guy. You're on the podcasts. I really don't get this board nanny/mini-mod thing where almost all you do is scour the boards for opportunities to inform people of how they're full of wrong. It's kind of strange, when you could be adding fuel to some vibrant discussions here.
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- 171
- England
- MLP_Lyra
Have to agree there, @Tenacious D . Everyone wants more options and yet wont let them when it comes to probably the biggest option of them all? ._.
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