Gran Turismo Toyota Gazoo Racing GT Cup Announced for 2024 Season
- Thread starter Famine
- 103 comments
- 8,112 views
- 108
- Florianópolis
- CobraMJD
Yeah, I was googling about the issue and nobody really cares, hate speech can put you in jail for more time than if kill someone.
I just thought so bad a player with S status in "safety rank" do this **** in a official Toyota tournament and didn't get any penalty. A dirty player at least should remove their Safety status( I forgot how we call this in English)
Edit: hah and the asterisk just confirms more the today world. 😆
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I think they are just both different skills. One not easier than the other. From my experience on Gran Turismo more drivers compared to me are slower in racing cars with high downforce than I am, but they are quicker in road cars.
I never use ASM and countersteer assist in either category.
I feel like you do, that there is more skill in lower grip road cars but I dont think its true when looking at the (personal) results. I am upto A+ driver level in Super Formula, and as the downforce goes down my level goes more average to high B.
So you can see it both ways. As high downforce is "easy to drive", in order to finish on the podium or even win in you need some extra skill that other high level drivers do not have. And you can apply the logic for road cars too. I think if you feel something is easy it means you are better at it and do not realise the skill you actually have, if you feel something is difficult you are struggling.
Like juggling is easy when you are not thinking about it. Though that might not be a good analogy.
*I just noticed the reason I thought of juggling was I had just wrtitten the word struggling. Ah the background tasks of the brain.
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- 2,308
- Iowa
- pfei
This is an interesting discussion. I firmly believe that driving cars fast in general is an overall skill, while subsets of that skill are different types of vehicles. Some people can adapt to all car types and tire compounds, while others are better at only high-downforce slick-clad race cars or only "normal" street cars on sport tires (summer sport) and comfort tires (all seasons).
I am 50 years old now, and since racing games have gone online I have had periods that have led me to believe that I am better at one thing or another, only to have all that flipped on its head.
I was one of ten winners of what I believe was the first ever racing game eSports with Milestone's Superstars V8 (an Italian tin top series), which I believe was about the equivalent of a GT4 car at the time. No, I didn't get a trip to Monaco or anything. A copy of GT5 was my prize.
GT5 had the Nissan Academy and I got thoroughly humiliated in that time trial at the Indy infield with the 300Z (if I remember correctly). Therefore, road cars just aren't my thing, right? Aside from the fact that thousand of people put laps in the Nissan Academy vs. mere hundreds in the Milestone game.
I skipped GT6 because I could never get a connection with the servers from Argentina but played a lot of online DiRT Rally and Project CARS where I had wildly different results depending on the car/track combo, but in general I was better with the modern race/rally cars than with the road/classic cars. Therefore, road cars just aren't my thing, right?
Then GT Sport came, and you can see in my short video below that the vast majority of my 91 wins came in road cars. At this point I was thinking my reaction times at 40-something were now too low to handle high-downforce race cars. Therefore, I am a road car specialist, right?
Then I joined an ACC league on PC and I was pretty competitive with the GT3s, but still feeling that my age was affecting my ability to take a race car to the limit. Therefore, I am still a road car guy, right?
Enter GT7. I have done 40 Sport Mode races, with two Manufacturers wins (Gr.3) and one Nations win (Super Formula). I also raced for a year in an incredibly competitive league where my best results were in GR.3 and Super Formula while in the lower powered cars I was way off the pace. In the Super Formula season in that league I even took the championship to the last round and lost by only three points to an alien, beating another two A+ drivers in the process (I am only high A). Therefore, I am a high-downforce specialist, right?
Even in real life you have examples of F1 drivers failing in NASCAR, Indycar drivers failing in F1. Then you have GOATs like Loeb, Andretti, who can win in any car and any racing discipline.
In summary and taking into account that most of us are casual racers, fitting GT7 into our lives between work, family, activities, etc .. we are going to have peaks and troughs. A bad day at work can affect your racing. Racing is a lot about mindset. Maximum concentration is necessary. Beyond car/track combos there are myriad external things in our lives that can affect our racing.
Are some people better at finessing road cars? Yes. Are some people better at brute-forcing racing cars? Yes. Are some people able to better adapt to any car/track combo? Yes. However, I do believe that those who have the general racing skill set will be good at anything, while others may adapt better to race cars or road cars.
I will say I could never be a racer in real life. I rented a Ferrari GTB on a race track in Las Vegas a few years ago and while I was speeding past the grandstands at 200 km/hr seeing my wife and kids up there, feeling the visceral g-forces in the turns, hearing the tires squealing at the limit of grip, the deafening sound of the wind at high speed... I was aware death was a real possibility. And that held me back. Autocross and track days in my WRX do not give me that feeling of impending doom.
It's a mental game, and some of us just can't do certain things with certain cars, be it in a game or in real life.
I am 50 years old now, and since racing games have gone online I have had periods that have led me to believe that I am better at one thing or another, only to have all that flipped on its head.
I was one of ten winners of what I believe was the first ever racing game eSports with Milestone's Superstars V8 (an Italian tin top series), which I believe was about the equivalent of a GT4 car at the time. No, I didn't get a trip to Monaco or anything. A copy of GT5 was my prize.
GT5 had the Nissan Academy and I got thoroughly humiliated in that time trial at the Indy infield with the 300Z (if I remember correctly). Therefore, road cars just aren't my thing, right? Aside from the fact that thousand of people put laps in the Nissan Academy vs. mere hundreds in the Milestone game.
I skipped GT6 because I could never get a connection with the servers from Argentina but played a lot of online DiRT Rally and Project CARS where I had wildly different results depending on the car/track combo, but in general I was better with the modern race/rally cars than with the road/classic cars. Therefore, road cars just aren't my thing, right?
Then GT Sport came, and you can see in my short video below that the vast majority of my 91 wins came in road cars. At this point I was thinking my reaction times at 40-something were now too low to handle high-downforce race cars. Therefore, I am a road car specialist, right?
Then I joined an ACC league on PC and I was pretty competitive with the GT3s, but still feeling that my age was affecting my ability to take a race car to the limit. Therefore, I am still a road car guy, right?
Enter GT7. I have done 40 Sport Mode races, with two Manufacturers wins (Gr.3) and one Nations win (Super Formula). I also raced for a year in an incredibly competitive league where my best results were in GR.3 and Super Formula while in the lower powered cars I was way off the pace. In the Super Formula season in that league I even took the championship to the last round and lost by only three points to an alien, beating another two A+ drivers in the process (I am only high A). Therefore, I am a high-downforce specialist, right?
Even in real life you have examples of F1 drivers failing in NASCAR, Indycar drivers failing in F1. Then you have GOATs like Loeb, Andretti, who can win in any car and any racing discipline.
In summary and taking into account that most of us are casual racers, fitting GT7 into our lives between work, family, activities, etc .. we are going to have peaks and troughs. A bad day at work can affect your racing. Racing is a lot about mindset. Maximum concentration is necessary. Beyond car/track combos there are myriad external things in our lives that can affect our racing.
Are some people better at finessing road cars? Yes. Are some people better at brute-forcing racing cars? Yes. Are some people able to better adapt to any car/track combo? Yes. However, I do believe that those who have the general racing skill set will be good at anything, while others may adapt better to race cars or road cars.
I will say I could never be a racer in real life. I rented a Ferrari GTB on a race track in Las Vegas a few years ago and while I was speeding past the grandstands at 200 km/hr seeing my wife and kids up there, feeling the visceral g-forces in the turns, hearing the tires squealing at the limit of grip, the deafening sound of the wind at high speed... I was aware death was a real possibility. And that held me back. Autocross and track days in my WRX do not give me that feeling of impending doom.
It's a mental game, and some of us just can't do certain things with certain cars, be it in a game or in real life.
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LeGeNd-1
Premium
- 7,258
- Australia
- GTP_LeGeNd-1
Re: road car vs race car debate.
In real life, a good driver will be able to drive anything fast. However, to truly reach the top elite group you have to specialise because the gap between road cars vs race cars is a lot wider now than in the past. Put Hamilton in a rally car and he will be fast still, but probably not 7x WDC material. Conversely put Loeb in an F1 and he will still turn in decent laps but probably won't be world champion. Occasionally you get freaks like Alonso who can be fast in anything, but he is still biased more towards high downforce cars (LMP and Indy are more similar to F1 than Dakar for example). Compare to in the past where people like Stirling Moss, Fangio, Clark even up until the Andretti era where racing drivers regularly jump between different series and cars on a weekly basis (F1, sports cars, touring cars, stock cars, etc) and still do well. That's because road and race cars have a lot more in common (less sticky tyres, less downforce, less advanced suspension).
Now, in terms of gaming it's much the same but the differentiating factor here is people have more control over their practice time and what they want to specialise in. Each game is slightly different in terms of physics. It's just a matter of preference and what you play the most, then naturally you become quite good at it, it boosts your confidence, making you drive more and it's a virtuous circle. Same with road cars vs race cars.
For me personally, I don't really differentiate between road and race cars. In any car my gap to the top times is always around 2-3%, just enough for gold in TTs. However, ever since GT Sport most of the online players gravitate more towards race cars. So they practice more in race cars relative to me, and their pace is faster with race cars than road cars. It makes me look better with road cars but actually it's the other way round - other people are slower in road cars. I'm sure if they drive enough road cars as they do Gr.3 they will also be on pace and the natural order will restore itself. But I don't see this happening because most online players I know are allergic to anything less grippy than RH tyres and no downforce
In real life, a good driver will be able to drive anything fast. However, to truly reach the top elite group you have to specialise because the gap between road cars vs race cars is a lot wider now than in the past. Put Hamilton in a rally car and he will be fast still, but probably not 7x WDC material. Conversely put Loeb in an F1 and he will still turn in decent laps but probably won't be world champion. Occasionally you get freaks like Alonso who can be fast in anything, but he is still biased more towards high downforce cars (LMP and Indy are more similar to F1 than Dakar for example). Compare to in the past where people like Stirling Moss, Fangio, Clark even up until the Andretti era where racing drivers regularly jump between different series and cars on a weekly basis (F1, sports cars, touring cars, stock cars, etc) and still do well. That's because road and race cars have a lot more in common (less sticky tyres, less downforce, less advanced suspension).
Now, in terms of gaming it's much the same but the differentiating factor here is people have more control over their practice time and what they want to specialise in. Each game is slightly different in terms of physics. It's just a matter of preference and what you play the most, then naturally you become quite good at it, it boosts your confidence, making you drive more and it's a virtuous circle. Same with road cars vs race cars.
For me personally, I don't really differentiate between road and race cars. In any car my gap to the top times is always around 2-3%, just enough for gold in TTs. However, ever since GT Sport most of the online players gravitate more towards race cars. So they practice more in race cars relative to me, and their pace is faster with race cars than road cars. It makes me look better with road cars but actually it's the other way round - other people are slower in road cars. I'm sure if they drive enough road cars as they do Gr.3 they will also be on pace and the natural order will restore itself. But I don't see this happening because most online players I know are allergic to anything less grippy than RH tyres and no downforce
- 148
Some good points, and to be fair, I agree with most of it. I think I'm able to drive most car classes with competency. But what I've noticed in my group of drivers (who are around the 70k DR Mark), is that most of them will shine in race cars and struggle with road cars on Sports tyres. I think the issue is probably more to do with the tyre type than the car itself. I'm more at ease with harder compounds than softer ones. I enjoy RH on race cars more than RS tyres. But I also thrive in longer races than sprints. I guess its all down to personal preference.
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- 617
- United Kingdom
What I think might exacerbate this is that, if Sport Mode is someone's main racing outlet, you'll quickly get very used to driving GT3/GT4 cars, and only them, because the races are those two groups almost every week. So when something like the TGR Cup throws a curveball with its car selection people aren't used to how to drive those cars, so just try to drive them like a modern GT3 car since that's what they know.
- 148
A simple but excellent point. I think you're actually spot on. I've spent a lot of time in private lobbies in 500-550pp races at Nordschliefe over the years, so driving road cars on Sports tyres is almost second nature to me. Daily race A is the place to learn road cars but most 'high level' sports mode guys stay away.
