Some rough notes about car settings

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eclipsee

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These rough notes are written in English and Spanish for a better understanding in both languages, if you don't speak English and want to leave a reply, use an online transtator and I'll try to deal with that, but please, reply in English as explained in the AUP.

Estas notas a grandes rasgos están escritas en inglés y español para su mejor entendimiento en ambas lenguas, si no hablas inglés y quieres dejar una respuesta, utiliza un traductor online y yo intentaré lidiar con eso, pero por favor, responde en inglés tal como se explica en la política de uso aceptable.

[English version]

If you need some advising about car settings I'll explain roughly how I adjust the settings of my cars.

Take these notes in the best manner you can, I can be wrong in some things and I'm not a tunning master so be gentle with me, I only want to share my knowledge.

First of all, forget all your knowledge of real life car settings, you'll see some weird things in these notes if you compare them with real life, what I can say is that these weird things work in GT5 and I can backup that with the times I achieve.

These notes or small guide won't give you a super setup but they will give you a decent setup or a good starting point where you can fine tune it to your likes.

Don't expect a big change in your car behaviour when you tweak a parameter, in fact, probably you won't notice anything if there's a minor tweak, what really counts it's the car setting as a whole and finding a balance, that's what these rough notes are for.

=======================================

These notes are based on these driving options:

Transmission ------------ Manual
Front Tyres -------------- ??????
Rear Tyres --------------- ??????
Driving Line -------------- OFF
Traction Control --------- OFF
Skid Recovery Force ---- OFF
Active Steering ---------- OFF
ASM ---------------------- OFF
ABS ----------------------- 1
Controller Sensitivity ---- 0 (Steering wheel user)

=======================================

The first thing to adjust is the gearbox.

TRANSMISSION

Here's a rough but effective way to maximize your gearbox (AKA the tranny trick)

Step 1.- Final Gear full right
Step 2.- Max Speed full left
Step 3.- Adjust 1st and 2nd gear full left, don't touch 3rd gear, adjust 4th gear a bit shorter than 3rd, 5th gear shorter than 4th, 6th gear full short.
Gear lines should draw an imaginary diagonal line, you'll need to adjust 4th gear to draw a perfect straight line.
Step 4.- Adjust Final Gear in order to reach power max peak when you are braking at the final of the longest straight.

The gear ratio affects the car behaviour, not only to maximize power band but also it affects the car behaviour when taking a bend, the bigger the number in your gear ratio the more oversteery the car will be.

For example, in a gearbox like this ...

5406
3965
3334
2810
2372
2011

... you'll find more oversteering than in this one:

2979
2081
1712
1410
1167
0967

The car will turn better with the first gearbox but slightly, don't expect a big change with that.

You can modify these gear ratios setting a longer final gear or modifiying the max speed at your will, later you can go to step 3 and continue from there.

If you modify the final gear, don't forget to reset your max speed in order to affect the gear ratios.


AERODYNAMICS

I always use full aero, the small loss of top speed is insignificant against what you can gain at the bends with full aero, in rare occasions I use a little bit less downforce at the back (a couple points maximum) to make the car a bit more loose, 99% of times is full aero though.

WEIGHT ADJUSTMENT

It's a must to use any chassis weight reduction (bonnet and windows included), if the time trial or race rules say there are minimum weight requirements you can add ballast to reach those kg's, but be careful with the weight reduction as it can't be undone, maybe if you use too much weight reduction you won't be able to reach the minimum weight requirements even with ballast at maximum.

Ballast position: It all depends on the ballast amount, tire grip, drivetrain and track characteristics, it's impossible to say what values are optimal without knowing these variables, anyway and as a rough orientation, here are some values depending on the drivetrain:

4WD ----> full back (+50)
FF ------> full back (+50)
FR ------> (+30)
MR -----> (0)
RR ------> (-30)

More kg's at the back ---> more oversteering

DIFFERENTIAL (LSD)
Usually I use fully customisable LSD default values 10/40/20, but in case the car oversteers a lot I use 5/20/10 or even 5/5/5.
The lower the value, the less the car will turn.

BRAKE BALANCE
It all depends on tire grip, car weight balance, drivetrain and your braking style, but for FR and MR cars that I often use, I set the brake force a bit more to the back in order to help the car a bit when facing the bend, some rough and standard values for me would be 5/7, but if you feel the car is tail happy maybe you'll need 7/5.


SUSPENSION

Suspension
I take as the whole columns of front and rear suspension are swapped in the menu, what there says it's front in fact it's rear, and what there says it's rear in fact it's front.

Ride Height
The usual starting point for most cars is default values, I do 1 or 2 laps and I see what's the car behaviour, later I go to the extreme max front/min rear, this setting often will give you a quite oversteering car, for 4WD or FF cars I always use this setting to get rid off the understeering, but for some FR or MR cars this can differ a bit.

If you have too much oversteering keep lowering the front ride height bit by bit until you get rid off that oversteering, if you still have too much oversteering at min/min (thing that would be rare), keep rising the rear ride height bit by bit until you get rid off the oversteering.
In some cars this method doesn't work, and you'll find that what's best is min/min or even max/max (very rare but there are some cases), as always, trial-error method is key.

Keep this in mind as orientation:

Max Front / Min Rear (Max Oversteering)
Min Front / Max Rear (Max Understeering)
Min Front / Min Rear (Better Grip)
Max Front / Max Rear (Worse Grip)

Spring Rate
Default values usually work fine but if you need more oversteering rise up the front and lower the rear, the opposite for more understeering.

Dampers
Probably this is the most grey area for me in car settings, I've tried everything here without much success, the only thing I feel is that I need to lower the values if the car has to ride a lot the rumble strips, otherwise the car will lose grip there.

Lately I'm using the same value in extension/compression in the same part (front or rear) and it seems to work, the usual is setting 2 or 3 points the extension dampers a bit stronger than compression dampers, but in some cars it seems to work just the opposite (sometimes I think the extension/compression is swapped too).

Dampers (Extension)
The same method as spring rate, usually here you need higher values than in compression dampers, 2 or 3 points more than compression will be enough.

Dampers (Compression)
The same method as spring rate, usually here you need lower values than in extension dampers, 2 or 3 points less than compression will be enough.

Anti-Roll Bars
The same method as spring rate.

Wheel Alignment

Camber Angle

No matter what kind of tires or drivetrain is, the max range I use (Front/Rear) is 2.0/2.0 and the minimum 1.0/0.5, my standard used values are 2.0/1.0 and I work from there, if needed I increase or decrease these values by 0.5, I can't notice any difference if I tweak only an increase of 0.1 or 0.2

If I feel the car has too much oversteering I increase by 0.5 the rear so I get a 2.0/1.5, if that's not enough I finish with a 2.0/2.0

Another cause of that oversteering may be that the front has too much grip comparing to the rear so I reduce it by 0.5, then I get a 1.5/1.0, if that's not enough I finish with a 1.0/1.0

So my six most used camber angle combinations are:

2.0/2.0 (rare)
2.0/1.5 (usual)
2.0/1.0 (usual)
1.5/1.5 (rare)
1.5/1.0 (usual)
1.0/1.0 (rare)

There are more rare and extreme situations where I can finish with a 1.0/2.0 (a very oversteering car), a 2.0/0.5 (a very understeering car (4WD or FF drivetrain)) or decreasing the rear angle to 0.5 if you want to make it really loose, those are very few cases though, trial-error is the key here.

In short, use 2.0/1.0 or 2.0/1.5, even 1.5/1.0, in most of cases it will work good enough.


Toe Angle

The first thing you've to do here is set the rear toe angle to 0.00, the fully customisable suspension kit uses a rear toe angle of 0.20 by default and that's not neutral at all, in fact, that's only useful for extreme oversteering cars where there's no way to neutralize its behaviour.

So, a starting point (Front/Rear) is 0.00/0.00, do some laps and notice the behaviour of the car, if you feel it's right don't go any further with toe angle adjustment.

I'm a junkie of the negative rear toe angle and I use it in almost any car, no matter its drivetrain or tire grip, to help the car turn in a bend I use positive angle in front and negative angle at rear, my max range is 0.25/-0.25 and minimum 0.00/0.00 but the standard is 0.10/-0.10

Sometimes I use negative angle in front to help out on stabilizing the braking, that's the only reason I use it sometimes.

In very rare situations I need a positive rear toe angle, if you feel your car is oversteering too much, use that positive rear toe, don't go any further than 0.20 though, it's useless IMO.


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[Versión en español]


Si necesitáis consejos sobre reglajes , explicaré a grandes rasgos como ajusto los reglajes de mis coches.

Tomad estas notas de la mejor manera que podáis, puedo estar equivocado en algunas cosas y no soy ningun maestro de los reglajes así que sed considerados conmigo, solo quiero compartir mis conocimientos.

Primero de todo, olvidad cualquier conocimiento que tengáis sobre reglar un coche en la vida real, veréis algunas cosas extrañas en estas notas si las comparáis con la vida real, lo que puedo decir es que estas cosas extrañas funcionan en GT5 y puedo respaldar eso con los tiempos que consigo.

Estas notas o pequeña guía no os dará un super reglaje pero os dará un reglaje decente o un buen punto de partida donde poder pulirlo segun vuestros gustos.

No esperéis un gran cambio en el comportamiento del coche cuando ajusteis algun parámetro en concreto, de hecho, probablemente no notaréis nada si hacéis un ajuste pequeño, lo que realmente cuenta son los ajustes globales del coche y encontrar un equilibrio, para eso son estas notas.

=======================================

Estas notas estan basadas en estas opciones de conducción:

Cambio de marchas --------- Manual
Ruedas delanteras ----------- ??????
Ruedas traseras ------------- ??????
Linea de conducción ---------- OFF
Control de tracción ----------- OFF
Fuerza antipatinaje ----------- OFF
Dirección activa --------------- OFF
ASM --------------------------- OFF
ABS ----------------------------- 1
Sensibilidad del controlador --- 0 (Usuario de volante)

=======================================

La primera cosa a ajustar es la caja de cambios.

TRANSMISIÓN

Esta es una vasta pero efectiva manera para maximizar vuestra caja de cambios (este método es conocido como el truco de la transmisión).

Paso 1.- Marcha final a la derecha del todo.

Paso 2.- Velocidad máxima a la izquierda del todo.

Paso 3.- Ajustar la 1a. y 2a. marcha a la izquierda del todo, no toqueis la 3a. marcha, ajustar la 4a. marcha un poco más corta que la 3a., la 5a. un poco más corta que 4a., la 6a. lo más corta posible.
Las lineas de las marchas deben dibujar una linea diagonal imaginaria, necesitaréis ajustar la 4a. marcha para dibujar una linea recta perfecta.

Paso 4.- Ajustar la marcha final con el objetivo de alcanzar el pico de máxima potencia cuando estéis frenando al final de la recta más larga del circuito.

La relación de marchas afecta al comportamiento del coche, no solo para maximizar la banda de potencia sino que también afecta al comportamiento del coche cuando se toma una curva, cuanto mayores sean los numeros en la relación de marchas el coche sobrevirará más.

Por ejemplo, en una caja de cambios como esta:

5406
3965
3334
2810
2372
2011

... encontraréis más sobreviraje que en esta otra:

2979
2081
1712
1410
1167
0967

El coche girará mejor con la primera caja de cambios, pero ligeramente, no esperéis un gran cambio con eso.

Podéis modificar esta relación de marchas ajustando la marcha final para que sea más larga o modificando la velocidad máxima como queráis, más tarde podéis ir al paso 3 y continuar desde ahí.

Si modificáis la marcha final, no os olvidéis de resetear vuestra velocidad máxima para que se vean afectadas las relaciones de las marchas.

AERODINÁMICA

Siempre utilizo la fuerza del alerón al máximo, la pequeña pérdida de velocidad punta es insignificante contra lo que podéis ganar en las curvas, en raras ocasiones utilizo un poco menos de fuerza en el alerón trasero (un par de puntos máximo) para hacer que el coche vaya un poco más suelto de atrás, aunque el 99% de las veces utilizo la máxima fuerza posible.

AJUSTE DE PESO

Es un deber el utilizar cualquier reducción de peso disponible, si las normas de la contrarreloj o carrera requieren un mínimo de peso en concreto, más tarde podéis añadir lastre para llegar al peso requerido, pero tened cuidado con las reducciones de peso porque no se pueden deshacer, quizás si reducís demasiado el peso no seréis capaces de llegar al mínimo peso requerido incluso con el lastre a tope.

Posición de lastre:
Depende de la cantidad de lastre, agarre del neumático, tipo de tracción del coche y características del circuito, es imposible decir que valores son óptimos sin saber esas variables, de todos modos y como orientación genérica, aquí tenéis algunos valores dependiendo del tipo de tracción del coche:

Tracción total -------------------------> todo detrás (+50)
Tracción delantera --------------------> todo detrás (+50)
Tracción trasera (motor delante) ----> (+30)
Tracción trasera (motor central) ----> (0)
Tracción trasera (motor detrás) -----> (-30)

Más kilos detrás ---> más sobreviraje.

DIFERENCIAL (LSD)

Generalmente utilizo los valores por defecto del diferencial ajustable que son 10/40/20, pero en caso de que el coche sobrevire mucho, utilizo 5/20/10 o incluso 5/5/5.
A menor valor, el coche girará menos.

EQUILIBRIO DE FRENOS

Depende del agarre del neumático, equilibrio del peso del coche, tipo de tracción y vuestro estilo de frenada, pero generalmente pongo la fuerza de frenada un poco mas fuerte en la parte trasera con la intención de ayudar al coche a encarar la curva, los valores estándar para mí son 5/7, pero si véis que al coche le gusta derrapar demasiado con esos valores, necesitaréis más fuerza delante, quizás unos 7/5 os vayan bien.

SUSPENSIÓN

Suspensión
Las columnas de la suspensión delantera y trasera estan intercambiadas en el menu de ajustes (altura, muelles, amortiguadores y barras estabilizadoras) lo que allí dice que es delantero, de hecho, es trasero, y lo que allí dice que es trasero,de hecho, es delantero.

Altura

El usual punto de partida que utilizo para la mayoría de coches son los valores por defecto, hago 1 o 2 vueltas y observo el comportamiento del coche, luego voy al extremo máximo delante/mínimo detrás, este ajuste os dará un coche con bastante sobreviraje, para coches con tracción total o delantera siempre utilizo este ajuste para quitar el sobreviraje, pero para coches de tracción trasera esto puede ser un poco diferente.

Si teneis demasiado sobreviraje id bajando la altura delantera poco a poco hasta que quiteis el sobreviraje, si aun teneis demasiado sobreviraje en mínimo/mínimo (cosa que sería rara), id subiendo la altura trasera poco a poco hasta que os libréis del sobreviraje.
En algunos coches este método no funciona y encontraréis que lo que es mejor es mínimo/mínimo o incluso máximo/máximo (muy raro pero hay casos), como siempre, el método de prueba-error es clave.

Tened en cuenta esto como orientación:

Máx Delante / Mín Detrás (Máx Sobreviraje)
Mín Delante / Máx Detrás (Máx Subviraje)
Mín Delante / Mín Detrás (Mejor Agarre)
Máx Delante / Máx Detrás (Peor Agarre)

Índice de muelles

Los valores por defecto del kit de suspensión configurable generalmente funcionan bien pero si necesitáis más sobreviraje aumentad los valores de la parte delantera y reducid los de la parte trasera, todo lo contrario si queréis crear subviraje.

Amortiguadores

Probablemente esta es la área más gris para mí en los ajustes del coche, he intentado de todo sin tener mucho éxito, la única cosa que noto es que necesito bajar los valores si el coche tiene que pasar a menudo por encima de los pianos, de otro modo el coche perderá adherencia ahí.

Ultimamente estoy utilizando el mismo valor en extensión/compresión en la misma parte (delantera o trasera) y parece que funciona, lo normal es ajustar 2 o 3 puntos mas fuerte la extensión que la compresión, pero en algunos coches parece que funciona al revés, a veces pienso que la extensión/compresión también está intercambiada en el menu.

Amortiguadores (Extensión)
El mismo método que con el índice de muelles, generalmente aquí necesitáis valores más altos que en los amortiguadores de compresión, 2 o 3 puntos más que en compresión serán suficientes.

Amortiguadores (Compresión)
El mismo método que con el índice de muelles, generalmente aquí necesitáis valores más bajos que en los amortiguadores de extensión, 2 o 3 puntos menos que en compresión serán suficientes.

Barras Estabilizadoras
El mismo método que con el índice de muelles.

Alineado de ruedas

Ángulo de caída
Da igual que tipo de neumáticos o tipo de tracción tenga el coche, el máximo rango que uso (delante/detrás) es 2.0/2.0 y el mínimo 1.0/0.5, mis valores estándar utilizados son 2.0/1.0 y luego trabajo desde ahí, si es necesario incremento o disminuyo estos valores por 0.5, no puedo notar ninguna diferencia si hago modificaciones de 0.1 o 0.2

Si siento que el coche tiene demasiado sobreviraje, incremento por 0.5 la parte trasera obteniendo un 2.0/1.5, si eso no es suficiente finalizo con un 2.0/2.0

Otra causa del sobreviraje puede ser que la parte delantera tenga demasiado agarre comparado con la trasera, así que reduzco la parte delantera 0.5 quedándome unos valores de 1.5/1.0, si eso no es suficiente acabo con un 1.0/1.0

Mis seis combinaciones de ángulos de caida más utilizados son:

2.0/2.0 (raro)
2.0/1.5 (usual)
2.0/1.0 (usual)
1.5/1.5 (raro)
1.5/1.0 (usual)
1.0/1.0 (raro)

Existen situaciones más raras y extremas donde puedo acabar con un 1.0/2.0 (coches con muchísimo sobreviraje), un 2.0/0.5 (coches con mucho subviraje (4X4 o tracción delantera)) o puedo acabar reduciendo el ángulo trasero hasta unos muy pocos 0.5 grados si lo que se necesita es un coche bastante suelto de atrás, aunque esos son muy pocos casos, lo de siempre, el método de prueba-error es clave.

Para abreviar, utilizad 2.0/1.0 o 2.0/1.5, incluso un 1.5/1.0, en la mayoría de casos funcionará bastante bien.

Ángulo del eje (convergencia/divergencia)

La primera cosa que tenéis que hacer aquí es poner el ángulo trasero a 0.00, el kit de amortiguación ajustable utiliza un ángulo trasero de 0.20 por defecto, eso no es neutral en absoluto, de hecho, eso solo es útil para coches con muchísimo sobreviraje donde no hay manera de neutralizar su comportamiento por otros métodos.

Entonces, el punto de partida (delante/detrás) es 0.00/0.00, haced unas cuantas vueltas y observad el comportamiento del coche, si sentís que está bien no vayais más lejos con los ajustes del ángulo de los ejes.

Soy un adicto del ángulo negativo trasero y lo utilizo en casi cualquier coche, da igual su tipo de tracción o agarre del neumático, para ayudar a girar el coche en una curva utilizo ángulo positivo delante y ángulo negativo detrás, mi máximo rango es 0.25/-0.25 y el mínimo 0.00/0.00 pero los valores estándar que utilizo son 0.10/-0.10

A veces utilizo ángulo negativo delante para ayudar a estabilizar el coche cuando freno, esa es la única razón por la que lo utilizo a veces.

En muy raras ocasiones necesito ángulo positivo trasero, si sentís que el coche sobrevira demasiado, utilizad ese ángulo positivo, aunque no vayais más lejos de 0.20, en mi opinión más de 0.20 no es útil.
 
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Yep , that's the so called tranny trick , but there are other ways use it too. (there was a Trannytrick 2 too in GT4)

If final gear value is set to highed value and then top speed to highes speed.
And after this if the final gear is moved to minimum value the top speed goes skyhigh.

When you figure out where the car's powerband ends in last gear ,
(where you should either shift up or brake down for the end of longest straith)
you'll be able to see/write down / memorise the top speed what is displayed at top of transmission tuning menu.

By knowing the exact speed , you can play around with the gears as much as you like and allways end up with optimal top speed.

Setting Final gear to minimum value gives longer gears that equals to less wheelspin and slower acceleration.
(Usefull for rain races)

Then there is the possibility to get higher gear values for all gear by searching for final gear value ,
that allows you to reach that memorised speed with minimal max speed setting.
(this means more acceleration as far as I know)

/basic drag and max speed tuning :sly:
 
Ramon, thanks a lot for showing us how to tune like you. Hopefully, you will then show us how to drive like you! ;)
 
Some thoughts on LSD settings Ramon as I think you may have over simplified things a little in this section. The three numbers that are displayed are initial/acceleration/braking.

Initial - as the name suggests, the default percentage lock of the diff before either accel or braking values are applied. Therefore, having a high number will generate understeer in both situations, and the opposite is true for a low number and oversteer. I will typically set this at 5 and leave it alone. The only times I've had to adjust this is to provide some overall stability to a car, MR's in particular, but even then it never gets close to double digits.

Acceleration - as the name suggests only affects the car under acceleration. The higher the number the more 'locking' action is applied across the axle. For this reason, the higher the number the more understeer will be prevalent. The amount of lock that you might want will change dependent on car/driver/tyres and track, and will also be affected as changes are made to both front and rear suspension. An effective way to tune is to accelerate hard out of a corner and see which wheel goes 'red first'. If it's the inside wheel, then increase the number. If it's the outside wheel, decrease the number. Typically, I will reduce the accel number until the inside wheel spins, and then increase the number by 2. A final number somewhere between 10 and 20 is almost always adequate.

Braking - the number represents the percentage of lock acorss the axle when no acceleration is applied (not just when the brakes are applied). In this case, the higher the number the more stability is provided and the harder a car will be to turn into a corner. Again this is a balance with suspension settings, and also brake bias. I typically have this set at it's lowest setting, and then adjust up if the car wants to oversteer too much on turn in. Fine tune to your own preference.


I usually start at 5/15/5 and iterate from there.

Hope you didn't mind me gate-crashing your extremely helpful thread, I just thought it a little misleading to say "The lower the value, the less the car will turn".

:cheers:

EDIT: one other comment on springs vs. ARB for oversteer - if I wanted to introduce more oversteer, I would tend to use the ARB rather than the spring as a higher spring rate on the rear (assuming RWD) can lead to traction issues.
 
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Everybody is welcome to post their thoughts here Jon. :cheers:

You've explained very well how a LSD works in real life, but you can bet that if I need more oversteer I'll increase the acceleration value in GT5, it's the last thing I modify (if needed) in the car settings though, as I said, usually I use default values, of course I can be wrong, but it's the way I set up my cars.

I just thought it a little misleading to say "The lower the value, the less the car will turn".
Is not my intention to mislead anyone, you can agree with what I write or not, what I wrote about the LSD works for me this way.

one other comment on springs vs. ARB for oversteer - if I wanted to introduce more oversteer, I would tend to use the ARB rather than the spring as a higher spring rate on the rear (assuming RWD) can lead to traction issues.
I take good note, I'll do some tests about this the next time.

Thanks for sharing. 👍
 
Everybody is welcome to post their thoughts here Jon. :cheers:

You've explained very well how a LSD works in real life, but you can bet that if I need more oversteer I'll increase the acceleration value in GT5, it's the last thing I modify (if needed) in the car settings though, as I said, usually I use default values, of course I can be wrong, but it's the way I set up my cars.


Is not my intention to mislead anyone, you can agree with what I write or not, what I wrote about the LSD works for me this way.


I take good note, I'll do some tests about this the next time.

Thanks for sharing. 👍

Thanks Ramon - wasn't suggesting you were intentionally trying to mislead, I was just trying to add some clarity and didn't mean to offend. I agree with the bolded statement, as long as the car has enough power to overcome grip and spin the outside wheel. Seems I over-simplified things as well!

Regardless, you are way faster than I ever will be no matter what settings are used :)
 
Thanks Ramon - wasn't suggesting you were intentionally trying to mislead, I was just trying to add some clarity and didn't mean to offend. I agree with the bolded statement, as long as the car has enough power to overcome grip and spin the outside wheel. Seems I over-simplified things as well!

Regardless, you are way faster than I ever will be no matter what settings are used :)
No offense taken mate! ;)
Feel free to post whatever you want. :cheers:
 
Well done Ramon, thx for sharing! i always struggled for the tuning, never really took the time to do trial and error.


👍
 
@Eclipse: you have used simple and immediate words providing practical solutions of complicated concepts for non experts of GT5 setting. Thank mate, not other words do add:)👍
 
Interesting thread. Way different than how I typically tune but I might have to tinker with some of your ideas.

Takes a brave soul to post ideas on setups. For every person who agrees with you, there will be five that don't. Of course, it is a little easier when you can back it up with fantastic times.
 
First of all my best regards,
It took me some time to understand everything you put because my English is not very good but in the end, I understood as a giant of Gran Turismo settings their cars(Not far from what I do). It is difficult to settings cars, but I think everything is trial and error. This Thread, give us all a bit to not so much trying to not complicate the game captures what we want in the car. I appreciate your support!
From Buenos Aires, greetings to all Spain!
 
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First i wants to congratulate Ramon for his awesome driven skills.
Second for be humble to post this thread sharing his way of tuning cars with others GT5 lovers that needs helps.

OK when and tuning cars by my self basically i use this concept that you post above trying to fit the car to my driving style but i dont do to many trails errors. Once i got a good TT am done and them find out that there is people like you making 2 or 3 seconds faster and am like WOW:drool:

If you can or somebody else reading this thread i would like to know if there is an order or preference that give you a better percent of what part of the car you need to tune first to obtain certains goals.

Example: Goal: increase grip of the FR car

Tuning parts order
1 Downforce 40%
2 Transmission 30%
3 Suspension 20% (Ride Height 8% Spring Rate 7% Camber 5%)
4 LSD 10%

Thank in advance and excuse me if am not clear enought am spanish speaker so be gentle guys:
-My english is not very good looking lol....
 
Thanks for your kind words. 👍

@Eclipse: you have used simple and immediate words providing practical solutions of complicated concepts for non experts of GT5 setting. Thank mate, not other words do add:)👍
Thank you Lorenzo 👍 , it was is my mind to keep it as simple as possible to don't scare people how aren't used to make car set ups.
Once you get a basic setup, there is a lot of fine tuning and work (trial-error).

For every person who agrees with you, there will be five that don't.
I agree absolutely. :D


Thanks for your kind words Gerchu 👍 , it would be nice that you translate your text to english before some moderator gets mad on you. :lol:


GT5pilot, my simple and single goal when I'm setting a car (no matter its drivetrain) is on finding a balanced setup but with a bit of oversteering, I mean I'm looking for a setup that makes the car turn well at the bends without losing too much the car rear end, a bit loose setup.

My usual order of settings adjustment is:

1.- Aerodynamics
2.- Transmission
3.- Ride Height
4.- Brake Balance
5.- Camber Angle
6.- Toe Angle
7.- Spring Rate
8.- Dampers (Extension)
9.- Dampers (Compression)
10.- Anti-Roll Bars
11.- Differential (LSD)

X.- Ballast Position

If ballast position is needed, tweak it, but usually you'll need to continue from step 3 to 11, in fact, all steps are recurrent when you change something, ride height and aerodynamics affect top speed so probably you'll need to adjust transmission again, spring rate affects car behaviour and probably you'll need to adjust camber/toe angle, and so on.
 
Thank you eclipsee for this. It's easy and effective and it will be my way do proceed from now on with car tuning.
 
This is great stuff Ramon! 👍

Maybe I'll try to make tune from scratch using OP.
 
Thank you. 👍

In the next tuneable car WRS session, I'll write a step by step process of what I do when I'm messing with the car settings of that specific car, trial-error write up included.
Maybe this way it will be more understandable.
 
Thank you. 👍

In the next tuneable car WRS session, I'll write a step by step process of what I do when I'm messing with the car settings of that specific car, trial-error write up included.
Maybe this way it will be more understandable.

That would be awesome!. By the way, what do you think about chassis reinforcement?
 
Great driver with a great spirit 👍 This is very much appreciated Ramon, when ever will be the first time to tune properly in GT5 I'll make sure to look here first. :cheers:
 
what do you think about chassis reinforcement?
As the chassis reinforcement can't be undone, make a save of your GT5 gameplay in a USB stick, maybe you will need to restore your car later.

I only use (rarely) the chassis reinforcement in very oversteering cars, if you use it, that will make your car prone to understeer, usually I don't feel any change, that's why I use it rarely.
Anyway, you can do an easy test, once you've done a lot of laps in a specific combo and you nail your times over and over, install that chassis reinforcement (don't forget to save your gameplay in a USB stick), later do some more laps (10 or so), if you don't improve your times, that chassis reinforcement is a waste of time and money. :D



Hey Timo!, I'm glad to see you again. :cheers:
Don't expect big changes in your times if you first look here when tuning your car, you've already covered the 99% of your lap time with your skills. :sly:

When I say 99% I really mean 99%, a lap of 100 seconds = 1'40.000 lap, a lap of 99 seconds = 1'39.000 lap, I don't think you'll gain more than 1 second with a good tune, well, those maths are wrong but you get the idea, uh? :lol:
 
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Awesome stuff, very interesting & helpful, thanks eclipsee! 👍 I will make sure I use this frequently when setting up my cars. Especially the toe & camber settings always puzzled me a bit, as in what you could gain from it in terms of handling, but this makes things a lot clearer.
 
Very helpfull, thank you.
Particularely appreciate the explanation on the trick tranny and order of settings adjustment.
See you on the track.
 
TRANSMISSION

Pretty good explanation of a first pass. One thing to note is that if you get wheelspin in 1st or 2nd gear, it is always best to make those gears taller until the wheelspin goes away or is reduced to a controllable state. Since you can't put the power down, you might as well keep the gears tall which should in turn allow you to shorten the higher gears, keeping you in the power band for a longer period at high speeds.

AERODYNAMICS

Full aero is a good start, but try reducing the rear aero if you want to get a little more rotation entering turns. With PP based racing, it is best to make due with as little rear aero as you can.

WEIGHT ADJUSTMENT

Remember to adjust spring rates when you add weight. The default values will not work properly if you add 50kg of ballast to the trunk of an FF.

DIFFERENTIAL (LSD)
This is a major topic and is covered in other threads. The default values are rarely good enough unless you are on racing tires and don't really need the LSD in the first place.

BRAKE BALANCE
Almost all cars run better with more front bias than rear. Try a few laps with ABS off to see what is going on. The more you increase the rear bias, the more the ABS will work to fix your tuning error. Simply put, when weight transfers forward under braking, the rear tires don't have enough grip. You may think by running higher rear bias you are reducing weight transfer, but you're not. The ABS system is just redistributing pressure to the front sooner.

Spring Rate
Again, default values are good for stock weight. Add weight reduction, add ballast, or lower the ride height and you'll have to make adjustments. This is the first thing I adjust. For CS tires I'll increase by up to 2. For SS tires I'll usually pick the center point of the range. For RS I'll experiment with the top end of the range.

Dampers
A good test for dampers is the Schumacher S at Nurburgring GP/F. With the cars I tune (mostly CS or SS tires with 400-500pp) you should be able to take the turn flat out or by lifting off slightly. If your dampers are too soft the car will react too much to the bumps and you'll lose control and often oversteer. If your dampers are too stiff, you'll hear the tires skip and you'll likely understeer wide. Get it just right and the car should remain planted through the entire turn.

From there, adjustments can be made to help with weight transfer. Higher extension than compression in the front will keep the nose planted after you lift off the brake pedal. This is generally the last thing I tune so experimentation is key.

Anti-Roll Bars
The key here is to feel the weight transfer. Higher values on the end of the car with more weight is a good starting point. A little goes a long way though, and the settings will compliment your spring rates. In FF cars, you can often increase the rear setting to reduce rear grip and help the car rotate.

Camber Angle

My limit is 3.0, not 2.0. Tail happy cars will need more camber in the rear. If the rear end steps out mid corner, you need more rear camber. Camber is also relative to ride height and suspension geometry. For a soft suspension, you'll want very low values. For a stiff suspension on a light car that is dropped low, you'll benefit from higher values.

Toe Angle

Setting rear toe to zero is not the first thing you should do, especially for a FR,MR,RR drivetrain. Maybe if you're using racing soft tires you can get away with it, but zeroing out rear toe is a sure way to introduce oversteer issues later on in the tuning process. Leave it as-is and increase if you have oversteer exiting turns. The highest I will run is 0.50. Decrease up to -0.50 on cars that suffer from major understeer, but if any amount of oversteer appears exiting corners, dial back your changes.

Front toe is more about feel than grip. If a car is darting into corners and immediately oversteering after turn-in (MR/RR), try some positive rear toe to soften turn-in. If a car refuses to turn in (FF/4WD), then a little negative front toe can give you a better reaction.
 
It is generally to get a feel of the car and change settings gradually untill you reach your goal. One thing to look for a great setup for TT might not not be best for racing. In racing you might need to to take a much tighter lines in corners with traffic. Also you would like a room for oversteer even if it makes the car harder to drive.

One other note, to be honest while your transmission guidelines could work for some. I find the transmission is a more complicated aspect of the car. Inthink you have to look for the beef of the powerband and set your gear to run throuh those rpm's. Than compensate with final drive to gain torque back. I.e high TQ monsters might not produce best results if gears are to work with the last 500 rpms. Set the gears that works with the better parts of your powerband (1000-2000). And compensate by raising the final drive.

If these notes help some to experimante and go through trial and error by all means go for it. Car tunning is a science IMO.

Thanks for starting thread OP.
 

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