GTPlanet Touge Series..

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Touge Series Week 1

Touge Series Week 2

There will be 3 Classes. Touge 200, Touge 300, and Touge 400. You may not have more than 2HP over your class. (ex. Touge 200 Max HP = 202HP).

This series is restricted to Japanese(JDM) Cars Only. Race, Rally, And Tommy Kaira cars can not ne used. These cars can not be used due to power/weight issues. I will hold a specific race for cars such as the Spoon S2000, Spoon Civic, and Rally cars.

Car Setup Rules:
SIMULATION TIRES will be the only tires used in this series. ASM and TCS must be off. Cars HP may not be more than 2 HP over Class. Any and all engine modifcations are limited to your class HP. All other modifactions are unlimited. You may NOT use a Hybrid.

Deadlines will be set and lap times must be in or you are dis-qualified. Any questions PM me or TankSpanker. You will need X-port/Sharkport or a video of your replay to prove your times if I or other competitors believe you may be cheating. So save your replays...

Tracks will be limited to:
Trial Mountain
Trial Mountain II
Deep Forest
Deep Forest II
Rome Circuit

You will post your sector times and your final lap time along with the car, its HP and class.

Example.

Touge 300 Class
FD RX-7
298 HP
T1 - .30:524
T2 - 1.07.388
Laptime - 1.32:132
 
Here I am.
It appears I'll be helping out with this series, and I'm happy to do so.

Looks like you left out a few details Exhaust Note. There is to be no corner cutting of any kind. You should aim to keep a minimum of 2 wheels on the tarmac or curbing at all times. Also, heavy wall hits should be avoided :dunce: .
Now, that said - I wont criticize too much if it is made publicly known that your lap did involve some off track excursion, or some exchanging of paint with the barriers - as this tends to slow you down. This isnt an official ranked event anyways, its meant just to be a friendly competition. But please no shortcutting, and keep things honest.

Feel free to PM me any questions regarding this series, as Exhaust Note says, or you can contact me on AIM (nick: theTankSpanker). I keep a fairly full school schedule, but I make a point of checking the forums daily. Oh, and I'm usually on AIM from around 5pm to 11pm (central time) Sunday->Thursday, if anyone cares.

Give em Stink Drifters!
👍
 
Did anyone read the description to what the "official gtp competitions" meant?

Well just as a refresher...

All threads and competitions started in the "official ..." are to be cleared with a moderator before posting.

Hence... I am moving this thread.

Let me know if you have any thoughts on the subject and otherwise good luck with the series. :D
 
Seems to make sense to me.

I'm up for this. I still feel more cars should be open... but thats just me.
 
ok, after testing a few cars in the different levels of touge-ing as described in post #1, I've pointed out to Exhaust Note that a power to weight ratio may be need to be imposed on each class alongside the hp limits in each class. This will place more emphasis on driver's ability with his/her chosen car, and less on the driver's ability to pick the 'right car'.

These limits should make some of the heavier cars more competitive and give a somewhat more varied field of cars in each race. More thought will be required in tuning also - whether to go with stage 1 or 2 lightening and run with more hp, or do all 3 stages and run with less, etc.

Of course, certain drivetrains will still hold an advantage over others - as they tend to do. I have suggested tabulating the results for each drivetrain in each class separately, but this idea was met with little enthusiasm. A "nah" to be exact.

We are still at odds about how to determine where to draw the line on weight/power for each class, and for that reason we are simply going to leave things as they are stated in Exhaust Note's first post. That is, hp regulations only. However, if by looking at the results of the first round we determine that such a limit needs to be imposed for certain classes to try and even out the field, then we will do so.

If anyone has any suggestions about how we can implement this fairly, please PM me either here in the forums or on AIM.

👍
 
I'll go fiddle with some heavier cars in a bit, just to get some idea.

Also, I think we should not restrict to those that can submit an xport replay or video. I do have a MaxDrive, but thats beside the point. We are limiting who can participate. The WRS has mananged just fine for 100 events now on the honor system.

In this avenue of thinking, perhaps discussion of times should be limited to T times, to prevent someone from just being a tenth faster at the end line.
 
Azuremen
I'll go fiddle with some heavier cars in a bit, just to get some idea.

Also, I think we should not restrict to those that can submit an xport replay or video. I do have a MaxDrive, but thats beside the point. We are limiting who can participate. The WRS has mananged just fine for 100 events now on the honor system.

In this avenue of thinking, perhaps discussion of times should be limited to T times, to prevent someone from just being a tenth faster at the end line.

i will look into that but the lap time has to come into play... there are 3 or 4 turns after T2 in Deep Forest so the lap time has to count.

this will work on an honor system unless there seems to be a a major problem with cheating.

the first race of this series will be done how the rules are stated in the first post.... after we see what kinda of times you guys come up with certain cars, they we will lean toward the power to weight ratio...

i was thinking last night..

T200 could be limited by HP.
T300 could be limited w/ both - maybe a restriction on mods and weight reductions.(further review)
T400 will be dependent on power to weight.

or...
set 3 cars in each class(T200 and T400) to be used by each competitor. You will abide by the HP limit rule. T300 will be eliminated.

Example.

3 cars to be used for Deep Forest T200 Class
ITR
MR-S
AE86

your ITR will only be compared with other competitors ITRs
your MR-S will only be compared with other competitors MR-s's etc.

i really like the last idea..
 
exhaust_note
3 cars to be used for Deep Forest T200 Class
ITR
MR-S
AE86

your ITR will only be compared with other competitors ITRs
your MR-S will only be compared with other competitors MR-s's etc.

i really like the last idea..

And how is that radically different from splitting it into different subcategories based on drivetrain like I suggested last night?
 
TankSpanker
And how is that radically different from splitting it into different subcategories based on drivetrain like I suggested last night?

It's not. These are all good ideas. Now which will work better will only be proving after we go through it a few times.

Ok, so for this one it's just the ITR, MR-S and AE86? Or can we still use whatever car?
 
Swift
Ok, so for this one it's just the ITR, MR-S and AE86? Or can we still use whatever car?

I think it should be open to all JDM cars for this round. The greater the variety of cars that run, the better we will be able to judge and guage their potential, and to determine if any steps to even out the playing field are necessary. From the times I've turned so far, it looks like T200 is going to require the most intervention.

Glad to see you're going to partake Swift. We need some quick times from the Drift Forum crowd in this one. Can't let the grippers from the WRS take the fame and fortune - if there were any to be had, that is.

An interesting idea, which i will credit Speedzoner-T of developing, is the idea of randomizing the weight/power ratio each week for each class. This will require cars to be retuned and reset each week and should promote different winners each week. There's lots of different way of running this thing.
I still think having a set budget (which could also be randomized each week) would be an interesting way to go as well.
I'm sitting on the fence about a lot of these.

I'm growing more in favor of this random idea the Speedzoner-T pm'd me, though.
👍
 
TankSpanker
I think it should be open to all JDM cars for this round. The greater the variety of cars that run, the better we will be able to judge and guage their potential, and to determine if any steps to even out the playing field are necessary. From the times I've turned so far, it looks like T200 is going to require the most intervention.

Glad to see you're going to partake Swift. We need some quick times from the Drift Forum crowd in this one. Can't let the grippers from the WRS take the fame and fortune - if there were any to be had, that is.

An interesting idea, which i will credit Speedzoner-T of developing, is the idea of randomizing the weight/power ratio each week for each class. This will require cars to be retuned and reset each week and should promote different winners each week. There's lots of different way of running this thing.
I still think having a set budget (which could also be randomized each week) would be an interesting way to go as well.
I'm sitting on the fence about a lot of these.

I'm growing more in favor of this random idea the Speedzoner-T pm'd me, though.
👍

Thanks Tank,

Ok, could you explain in detail what was said in the PM please. Sounds interesting.
 
i think it would be best to also run drivetrain classes along with hp classes. say, AWD 200,300,400 same for the rest.
 
Swift
Thanks Tank,

Ok, could you explain in detail what was said in the PM please. Sounds interesting.

that was about it actually
Speedzoner-T just suggested possibly randomizing what the formula for each class should be, week in and week out, by means of like a die roll or something along those lines

i guess he writes short and to the point, not like me, longwided :sly:
i think its a very good idea though

so, im thinking we might choose some initial value for each class ie) weight/power inital value could be like 5.3 for T200. Then the die roll would get subtracted from this amount. So a roll of 1 would give a weight/power of 5.2 for that week. A roll of 5 would 4.8, etc. Of course, still being limited to 200hp. a weight/power of 4.7 would not mean you could tune the trueno or MR-S past 200hp,
If that's what he was thinking, it sounds very interesting, and would help to promote diverse results and varied car setups from week to week

oops, gotta goto class
 
TankSpanker
that was about it actually
Speedzoner-T just suggested possibly randomizing what the formula for each class should be, week in and week out, by means of like a die roll or something along those lines

i guess he writes short and to the point, not like me, longwided :sly:
i think its a very good idea though

so, im thinking we might choose some initial value for each class ie) weight/power inital value could be like 5.3 for T200. Then the die roll would get subtracted from this amount. So a roll of 1 would give a weight/power of 5.2 for that week. A roll of 5 would 4.8, etc. Of course, still being limited to 200hp. a weight/power of 4.7 would not mean you could tune the trueno or MR-S past 200hp,
If that's what he was thinking, it sounds very interesting, and would help to promote diverse results and varied car setups from week to week

oops, gotta goto class

Yeah, let's try it straight up a few times and see how it goes. I think implementing this system could keep things fresh.
 
also, got this idea while talkin with Suzuki:

a 'kei' class limited to under 150 hp or so - but with a base hp under 100hp (it'll keep the miatas out). Would there be any interest in this?
Exhaust Note, would you permit it?
 
Busy kids. Drivetrain restictions make sense, as FF will always be slower than RWD drivetrains.

My comment regarding T times was just for discussion. The only time that would count for placement would be the lap time.

Should I bust out my 40k dice to start making random weight/power ratios? ;)

Also, this week should be open mostly, as we are getting details worked out.

Another aspect to be considered for wieght is just a flat out minimum weight... like 800 kg or something... but then we have issues with having the "right" car.

Ran some tests... just fiddling with a Lexus IS tuned for T200... I was running almost 6 seconds slower than my main car... like... a 1'34.xxx. Mostly do to the weight I would imagine.

We'll need to find somethign to keep it fresh, the random idea is good. So would battles like.. Honda Vs. Toyota or what not... perhaps teams later on?

Cote D'Azur would be an excellent course I feel, as opposed to Rome. I'm suggesting we add that, very techinical downhill section.

Final note... grip will always be faster than drift. Its physics. Summed up in two words - static friction. Though a truly perfect four wheel drift, aka, the type with no smoke, no steering input, and no excess wheel spin could posibly be the fastest. But thats still at the limits of adhension of the tires ;)
 
Azuremen
Busy kids. Drivetrain restictions make sense, as FF will always be slower than RWD drivetrains.

My comment regarding T times was just for discussion. The only time that would count for placement would be the lap time.

Should I bust out my 40k dice to start making random weight/power ratios? ;)

Also, this week should be open mostly, as we are getting details worked out.

Another aspect to be considered for wieght is just a flat out minimum weight... like 800 kg or something... but then we have issues with having the "right" car.

Ran some tests... just fiddling with a Lexus IS tuned for T200... I was running almost 6 seconds slower than my main car... like... a 1'34.xxx. Mostly do to the weight I would imagine.

We'll need to find somethign to keep it fresh, the random idea is good. So would battles like.. Honda Vs. Toyota or what not... perhaps teams later on?

Cote D'Azur would be an excellent course I feel, as opposed to Rome. I'm suggesting we add that, very techinical downhill section.

Final note... grip will always be faster than drift. Its physics. Summed up in two words - static friction. Though a truly perfect four wheel drift, aka, the type with no smoke, no steering input, and no excess wheel spin could posibly be the fastest. But thats still at the limits of adhension of the tires ;)
Cote D'Azur would be a nice choice! although i hate the course, it would be intresting!
 
Azuremen
Busy kids. Drivetrain restictions make sense, as FF will always be slower than RWD drivetrains.

My comment regarding T times was just for discussion. The only time that would count for placement would be the lap time.

Should I bust out my 40k dice to start making random weight/power ratios? ;)

Also, this week should be open mostly, as we are getting details worked out.

Another aspect to be considered for wieght is just a flat out minimum weight... like 800 kg or something... but then we have issues with having the "right" car.

Ran some tests... just fiddling with a Lexus IS tuned for T200... I was running almost 6 seconds slower than my main car... like... a 1'34.xxx. Mostly do to the weight I would imagine.

We'll need to find somethign to keep it fresh, the random idea is good. So would battles like.. Honda Vs. Toyota or what not... perhaps teams later on?

Cote D'Azur would be an excellent course I feel, as opposed to Rome. I'm suggesting we add that, very techinical downhill section.

Final note... grip will always be faster than drift. Its physics. Summed up in two words - static friction. Though a truly perfect four wheel drift, aka, the type with no smoke, no steering input, and no excess wheel spin could posibly be the fastest. But thats still at the limits of adhension of the tires ;)


lol, ya, I could grab my 20-cube dice or whatever they're called that i have locked in the basement from age old tournaments of D+D. hehehe, but yes, I've thought about it a little more and there definitely does have to be something to keep it fresh - the WRS wouldnt have made it to 100 challenges if it were the same race every week.
anyways, yes, Exhaust Note made some reference to teams on his first post regarding this series in the drift forum, and I'm sure thats where this is eventually headed once all the rules and things of that nature get sorted. And manufacturer battles would be an interesting twist as you say. Toyota vs Honda in FF, FR and MR classes. Or the ever popular Evo vs WRX battles, I'm sure these are on the way. Kei cars... :sly:

I never gave much thought to Rome being included - just accepted it, but Monaco is a closer fit, since you mention it. Just remove the scenery and it could easily be a touge, definitely twisty enough. And a real challenge on sims.

and how did i know this would eventually become a thread debating the speed of drift vs grip. Feeling a bit threatened by all the other drifters nearby Azuremen??? :sly:
of course grip is normally faster (perfect 4wheel drift aside) for driving on dry paved roads. Keep the wheels rolling forward with minimal slip. Then the only decelleratory forces they produce will be due to rolling resistance, which is almost negligible in the face of the drag a car produces. Hang the thing sideways and suddenly force due to friction exerted on the rubber by the tarmac leaps dramatically. Physics says it all.

Now with that out of the way can we leave that debate alone. This should be reserved for suggesting and discussing rules and improvements for this series

care to reply or answer to anything Exhaust Note?
 
This sounds interesting to me, but I think you guys are making it way, way too complicated. You'll have trouble getting and keeping racers if they need a calculator and a couple of hours to figure out the regulations each week.

In the WRS, the most popular races are the ones where people get to compete against each other. If the results are divided up too much, then there'll end up only being two or three people in each category :crazy:

Why not do:

T200 = 5.0 PWR
T300 = 3.5 PWR
T400 = 2.0 PWR

Simple, leaves lots of options and potential for tuning. As the weeks go along, if one (or a handful of cars) seem to have a big advantage, add PWR penalties to them. For example, if an RX-7 takes the top three spots in each division in week one, give the RX-7 a 0.250 PWR penalty (has to run at 5.250 / 3.750 / 2.250) from then on. The JGTC works this way :) And make sure to keep a list of penalties in an easy to see spot 👍
 
Luxy's smartness will save us all!!!

Nice suggestions man 👍

And the JGTC touch is nice!!
 
what is the point of a competition if everyone is not running the SAME course.

are we supposed to be doing monaco? this comp is WAY too vague, and i dont want to be wasting my time with other tracks.

im great with the cars and i think it will work out great, but i think its the track decision making that should be the biggest focus right now. once we've established that, we can all finally get racing.
 
Omnis
what is the point of a competition if everyone is not running the SAME course.

are we supposed to be doing monaco? this comp is WAY too vague, and i dont want to be wasting my time with other tracks.

im great with the cars and i think it will work out great, but i think its the track decision making that should be the biggest focus right now. once we've established that, we can all finally get racing.

Umm.....
This week's Touge

This was in the first post bud. It's deep forest for this one. :)
 
Exhaust_Note hasn't been too clear on things, but as Swift pointed out, its all in that thread.

If E_N is just gonna let this sit, I'm considering taking over or something. He hasn't been active with the discussion and ideas at all... :indiff:
 
well thanks swift.

i wouldn't have known the thread was there, as there isnt even any notification that its on a different board all together.
 
sorry i haven't been here since tuesday, ive had exams all week and i just got in... I made tonight the deadline cause i knew i would be back tonight... i thank tankspanker for taking the times and laying them out.. im going to go over them to find the best way to setup the cars to bring the competitiveness closer...

thanks everyone...
 
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