2011 "Eco-Friendly F1"

[Sureboss]

This idea of using bio-fuels is rediculous, prices in the EU are already going through the roof for related goods, eg pasta has gone up 27% in the last year, and we dont use that much bio-fuel, yet.

Can't run cars on pasta, whatever next pizza?

 

[Danoff]

I almost hope that they do something like this so that when champ cars are faster than F1 cars, I have an excuse to quit watching it. The minute F1 cars start getting outrun by some other series, my loyalty will be gone.

 

[Omnis]

I almost hope that they do something like this so that when champ cars are faster than F1 cars, I have an excuse to quit watching it. The minute F1 cars start getting outrun by some other series, my loyalty will be gone.

Yeah, if that's the case, everyone should migrate to some kind of Formula Unlimited. A well-prepared FU will really show F1 what's up.

Seriously, though. The unrestricted nature of F1 cars has been what has helped drive advances in automotive technology throughout the decades. It would seem kind of backwards to suddenly restrict F1 to current market technologies and specifications.

 

[superberkut]

Excellent point. I never would have thought of that.

Maybe, then, the FIA should follow the same path, but increase engine size, or at least turbocharging.

Also: http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060227/FREE/302270007/1023/THISWEEKSISSUE

This is an interesting design, and may hold the answer to creating Formula racers that attain the performance of its predecessors, but with less fuel usage. It would also aid the purpose of F1. There are five-stroke engines out there, but a six-stroke engine would be more powerful and save fuel, too. Should F1 adopt it, development of the engine would increase to produce an even better powerplant for cars.

P.S: Is Formula Masters changing for this as well? Hope not!

 

[Alfaholic]

Excellent point. I never would have thought of that.

Maybe, then, the FIA should follow the same path, but increase engine size, or at least turbocharging.

Also: http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060227/FREE/302270007/1023/THISWEEKSISSUE

This is an interesting design, and may hold the answer to creating Formula racers that attain the performance of its predecessors, but with less fuel usage. It would also aid the purpose of F1. There are five-stroke engines out there, but a six-stroke engine would be more powerful and save fuel, too. Should F1 adopt it, development of the engine would increase to produce an even better powerplant for cars.

P.S: Is Formula Masters changing for this as well? Hope not!

I've never heard of a five or six stroke engine cycle. Do you have any links? I'd love to find out what that's all about.

 

[jammyozzy]

Wading in on the wind tunnel vs. CFD debate, there does now appear to be a third way emerging - coast-down testing. The basic idea is that the car is driven, under its own power, to a set speed through a tunnel, and various forces are measured.
There are lots of rumours of Chip Ganassi racing using Laurel Hill tunnel in Pennsylvania for just this sort of thing, and the new road surfaces, run-off areas, buildings and discarded Sunoco Supreme drums (the official fuel of NASCAR, if I'm not mistaken), combined with stories from hikers of hearing V8's running up through four gears seem to confirm it.
How anything is measured is unknown, but the advantages over a full-size wind tunnel are obvious - a massive reduction in energy consumption, much less maintenance vs. a rolling road, the ducting and running temperatures are realistic and the tunnel can be cooled or heated to the desired temperature.

CFD has its place in racecar aerodynamics, but at the end of the day the theory has to be validated somehow, and coast-down testing seems to be a much more environmentally friendly, and cheaper, way of testing a race car, and could be the next 'big' development in aerodynamics. Banning wind tunnels, whilst extreme, isn't quite as ridiculous an idea as it may first appear to be.

(Source - Racecar Engineering, Vol.17 No.10. I'll put some scans of the pictures up later. 👍 )

I've never heard of a five or six stroke engine cycle. Do you have any links? I'd love to find out what that's all about.

The only six-stroke engine I've heard of is this one. The fifth and sixth strokes compress and then vaporize water, producing power while cooling the engine.

 

[Blake]

How anything is measured is unknown, but the advantages over a full-size wind tunnel are obvious - a massive reduction in energy consumption, much less maintenance vs. a rolling road, the ducting and running temperatures are realistic and the tunnel can be cooled or heated to the desired temperature.

So wait, this is basically the old sticking tufts of wool onto the chassis and watching how the behave in the wind? They’ve been doing that since the 30s… God knows how they’ll actually get real numbers from this sort of testing.

And, no matter how these forces are measured, how are you going to get anywhere near as much data as from a wind tunnel? You can hardly have people driving a car up and down a road 24 hours a day.

 

[Metar]

You can hardly have people driving a car up and down a road 24 hours a day.

I'd do it happily


Seriously though, that's not a feasible option for Formula 1. You can't get as much data, from anything, as you would from a good session on the wind-tunnel. CFD comes close if you have a strong computing-station (which F1 teams do). Might be enough for NASCAR, since it's infinitely more basic than Formula 1 aerodynamics... But no way it'll work in F1.

Plus, correct me if I'm wrong... But isn't digging a whole tunnel, clogging it with exhaust-gases 24/7, and changing temperatures to whatever you need just a tad not environmentally-friendly?

 

[superberkut]

I've never heard of a five or six stroke engine cycle. Do you have any links? I'd love to find out what that's all about.

If I can recall, my post has a link to it. Or does it not work?

 

[Alfaholic]

If I can recall, my post has a link to it. Or does it not work?

My bad, yes it does!

Cheers for that.

 

[Slick Rick]

I think it would be pretty cool. With the amount of money they pump into development and testing they might discover loads of cool thinks that could be applied to road cars in the future...

 

[superberkut]

I think it would be pretty cool. With the amount of money they pump into development and testing they might discover loads of cool thinks that could be applied to road cars in the future...

With adopting the proposed formula or taking a radical step AWAY from it, as the suggestions here indicate?

Either way, though, I see that you are correct...