Alsace - Village not suited for racing?

  • Thread starter Haitauer
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Haitauer

Haitauer

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Finland
Finland
HI-tauer
Might be just me, but after todays manufacturer race i cant help feeling very unsatisfied with racing at Alsace. Competitive racing is very hard due to wildly varying and unpredictable racing lines and braking points people use. Wide turns also seem to encourage dive bombing. And its not like its due to DR/SR - currently at DR B SR A/B.

Alsace is a beautiful track for cruising and driving alone, but cant seem to find clean racing there. I think the track is too wide for that.

Then again i couldnt bring my self driving more than 2 corner in that i3 race.. Just awful driving a car with no gears in a game as one doesent really have too much sense of speed.
 
Without ever driving the course I could tell from just looking at the layout it was a lousy track.

Too much elevation change, too twisty, too many changing radius corners. A good track is 10 average corners and 1 or 2 great ones. It seems like with some of these fantasy tracks PD tried to make every corner as iconic/difficult as possible. An example is Grand Valley in GT3 being perfect, and them making it overly technical in GT4 and later games.
 
The Gr.4 endurance race in mission mode made me appreciate this track a bit. There are definitely a few corners that aren't very conducive to racing but for the most part, I think I like it.

I think you may have a point though- because it is so wide, it seems appealing to pass just about anywhere. So when racing other players, lines are going to be all over the place.
 
Don’t think it’s a bad track but agree that dive-bombers will be encouraged here as it can be hard to make moves elsewhere. You need to maximize that exit speed and make sure you are making your pass early.

I led my race from start to finish last night but was worried about getting hit a few times in the first 5 laps as you swing out wide to take those right handers... very stressful until he made a mistake and gave me a few seconds
 
I did many races there as well and as long as I was in the top 5 the racing was pretty clean... anything past that just forget about it. People diving into corners and changing lines constantly. Agree with most the points you made for online racing, but I do like the track for the most part.
 
I have only experienced racing at Alsace in the one make Audi TTS races from last week, but it pretty much became my favourite track from that.

Hooking it all up feels so great, like a smooth rollercoaster ride but you're always right on the edge. That said, I did mostly win from the front so didn't encounter much aggression - but compared to last night's carnage at the Nurburgring GP, Alsace comes across as the more appropriate racetrack.

The first corner on the reverse track is comparable to Nurb turn 1 for people failing to brake, but on the Nurb you are much easier to hit.
 
For the guy that said “I don’t like how everyone takes different braking lines and the track is too big.”- this sounds more like a “you” problem.

And for the dude that said “far too many corners not conducive to racing”- your joking right? EVERY corner is conducive to racing, otherwise we are drag racing.
Sorry to rain on everyone’s “complaint thread 2.5” but it’s been done a million times. You know you don’t HAVE to play the game right?

Mods: I’m surprised there isn’t a law on this here. It’s getting out of hand. Or should I go make a weekly complaint thread as well?
 
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Ian Fairbanks
For the guy that said “I don’t like how every takes different braking lines and the track is too big.”- this sounds more like a “you” problem.
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I didnt mean different line from me. If theres a pack of five cars it feels they all take different lines/speeds and the mayhem starts..
 
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I really like Alsace... when racing in the right direction. It's was the reverse race a couple days ago that really through me off. Some tracks are just nightmares in reverse Alsace is definitely one of them.
 
Haitauer
I didnt mean different line from me. If theres a pack of five cars it feels they all take different lines/speeds and the mayhem starts..
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Welcome to real life racing. Braking zones and racing lines differ by driver ability, drivetrain type, vehicle ability, and race traffic.
Now if it were a SPEC race, then Sure. The vehicle would be taken out of the equation.
 
Ian Fairbanks
Welcome to real life racing. Braking zones and racing lines differ by driver ability, drivetrain type, vehicle ability, and race traffic.
Now if it were a SPEC race, then Sure. The vehicle would be taken out of the equation.
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This level of variation is nowhere to be seen on other tracks.. So there goes that..
 
Haitauer
This level of variation is nowhere to be seen on other tracks.. So there goes that..
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I see it every time I hop online. I’ve been rear ended by good racers online. When I watch the replay and talk to them, it was because they didn’t expect my brake zone to be that early. A few have also told me it was difficult to see my brake lights illuminate...
 
I (B/A) had a great 5-way battle in tonight’s FIA race; that track can produce some solid racing if you’ve got the right people around you.
 
The problem is that it allows you to choose different lines and braking points. I had it in today's race that often the cars around me braked either earlier or later than me, just because they chose a different line. And that often led to bumps, that were not really on purpose. But when the car in front brakes just a bit earlier than you planned to, it can get nasty.
Especially today, the cars around me were changing all the time, so I didn't really have the chance to learn their behavior, as everyone was completely different.
 
timekiller001
The problem is that it allows you to choose different lines and braking points. I had it in today's race that often the cars around me braked either earlier or later than me, just because they chose a different line. And that often led to bumps, that were not really on purpose. But when the car in front brakes just a bit earlier than you planned to, it can get nasty.
Especially today, the cars around me were changing all the time, so I didn't really have the chance to learn their behavior, as everyone was completely different.
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I don't think the track allows for different lines and braking points. What I think it happens on this track is that people are still trying to figure out what lines and braking points to use to be as fast as possible. It's a new track and most people don't know the perfect line yet. Contrary to Dragon Trail and Lake Maggiore, this one was not part of either the beta or the demo IIRC.
 
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It reminds me of that one dlc track they added to gt6 I can’t remember the name but it was like 10 miles or something based on Spain? Seems like they just took a section off that and called it a track.
 
There can’t be “multiple racing lines” anyway. There is only one truly fast way around a corner and most everyone takes close to that. The difference is in speed at which your vehicle can take it. And that means different braking zones, and braking zones are the Precursor to collisions
 
Ian Fairbanks
There can’t be “multiple racing lines” anyway. There is only one truly fast way around a corner and most everyone takes close to that.
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Ah, no.

You can and should absolutely learn to take corners with different lines, and understand what are trading in return. That’s racecraft, positioning your vehicle to maximise your flow and position relative to where the opponent is at that time.

Racing is not hotlapping (where I agree there is usually and ideal line). Alsace is a track where there are multiple valid and fast racing lines through certain series of corners, but which ones you chose to take depend entirely on what your opponents are doing around you.

Ian Fairbanks
The difference is in speed at which your vehicle can take it. And that means different braking zones, and braking zones are the Precursor to collisions
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Which is precisely why you need to be able to take different lines into a corner depending on the cirmcumstances, and know what the trade off will be.

I find Alsace allows that variety, and cars can generally run side by side through corners a lot more safely than other tracks.

In fact, the place I got punted (from 3rd to 8th) in the Constructors last night was into the final chicane where it gets tight and there isn’t enough room for two cars to take different lines. Some GT-R hero though his line was more important than mine despite not even being alongside and into the tyre wall I went.

At Alsace with the big sweepers I’ve overtaken on the inside, on the outside, with under/over moves - fantastic stuff.
 
Apart from the Ring this is now my favorite track bar none. You HAVE to get used to it and then it all kinda flows in a weird almost flying acrobatics kind of way!
Do most of my money grinding here so Ive done a ton of laps both ways. Reverse I like too. Just take the N400 S-FR- Racer, tune it and load up a field of pro GT4 AI.
That's 20k a lap for winning, and that little car buzzes round this track owning the bigger cars.
http://www.kudosprime.com/gts/car_sheet.php?id=109
Tuned up it will even give GT3 cars a good run on this track, I can get to midfield (10/20) on 3 laps!
 
PJTierney
I (B/A) had a great 5-way battle in tonight’s FIA race; that track can produce some solid racing if you’ve got the right people around you.
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I did not have this experience in the FIA race. Was around mid-pack (my first problem) and everyone kept braking very late/dive bombing. Every time I would pass them cleanly and try and maximise the exit speed for the next corner I would get rammed in to and punted off. Watched one guy do it over and over and amazingly he didn't finish with any penalty time despite hitting me off about 3-4 times every time I passed him. Of course because I was hit my DR went from A to B.

If you're in space or with clean drivers then it has potential but a few corners require early braking for better exit speed and this allows the hacks the opportunity to bust in and ruin things.
 
JesseDeya
You can and should absolutely learn to take corners with different lines, and understand what are trading in return.
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Yes. My favourite craft is "defective driving". :cheers:

JesseDeya
I find Alsace allows that variety, and cars can generally run side by side through corners a lot more safely than other tracks
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That is true - IF there is the will to do that. If people understand losing a position in one corner is just an opportunity to gain it back in the next.

This is also the part of race craft people tend to loose towards the end of races leading to diving and bumping.
 
I kinda like it. But it's one of those tracks where people get overly confident when overtaking, which is always problematic. But there are a lot of sections that really test your driving skills and I appreciate that.
 
I actually like the track. I had only good races there so far. Yes, it’s wide and if you don’t cover the inside line, you might risk being out braked by someone, but you can still watch your mirrors and try over/unders as exit speed is all important there I find. Has a good rhythm, I think. And the forward variant is better than reverse.
 

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