Another "help me choose" thread!

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SpartanG

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Hello all, I've been thinking about my next car for a while now. Here's the scoop.


Background info: I'm 17, with a minimum wage job. Money doesn't necessarily come easy. I'm in my final year of high school and will be heading off to college in fall 2012. I plan to buy either in the fall of 2012 or spring of 2013. I hope to have at least $4,000 saved up, preferably more like 6k. I would like to hold a job during my time in college so there will be income.

The car: Of course, I want something with a definition of sport/fun. The car will mostly be a weekend car, to take out on free time and enjoy the roads. It might not be sensical to own a car when i don't necessarily need one, but cars are my passion and life love. This is where I want my money going. Also, with the freak snow event that hit the northeast, I got a chance to do a bit of "spirited" snow driving and really enjoyed it a lot, and it's something that I want to pursue. This doesn't necessarily mean the car needs to be 4wd, but cars that can take the extra punishment associated with this are welcome. I also want a manual, obviously. I don't mind getting a little dirty with fixing the car either, but I don't want something that will screw up something expensive, like blow an engine or ruin a transmission. That kind of stuff I probably couldn't afford. I don't necessarily need power either, my current car is listed as a 8 second 0-60 and it's plenty fast for me. You don't need to go fast to have fun.

I've already considered:

Mazda Miata - dirt cheap, good examples with fair mileage can be had for $2500 easily. great fun to drive, but uncertain of its snow ability. Very reliable. Cheap to fix. Cheap insurance too. Very realistic for me.

first gen Impreza or 2nd gen Legacy - Might be hard to find in budget, insurance prices could be out of my budget. But with almost all models having 4wd, this would be a great fun snow driver.

5th or 6th gen Celica - Rally pedigree, just like the subarus. fwd might kill some fun, and the all-trac would probably either be too rare or out of price range. I love the styling of these two cars though. Hard to find unmolested/modded. the fwd platform would make snow driving possible, but fun? unsure :confused:

W20 MR2 - beautiful car, but MR layout might make snow driving perilous, if not suicidal. Could get some snow tires.


Notice a theme here? All 90s japanese sports cars. I love these things. If you have any comments on these cars or have something to add on, please do! Thanks for reading!
 
Here's one more option: *Click* Sure, it ain't Japanese, but it is affordable and good in snow. And it would bring the lovely burble of V6 into your life.
 
Nothing wrong with front wheel drive. You're seventeen, still young. I had a late model 95' Integra, and it was a great car. No shame in doing a Honda at seventeen unless you totally go the lame route with it.

Miata - Well, great all around car, not hard to find, lots of older people owned them so they aren't beat to death. Probably not that great in the snow, light weight, rear wheel drive, get the idea here. Not to mention, I can't fit in them at 6'3 160 pounds.

The old Subarus, eh...probably plenty of stories about ones that are reliable, but not the best route to go. When you do have to work on them, they aren't cheap. AWD is great, but old Subarus are hard to find in bad shape, let alone good shape.

Old Subarus are hard to find in bad shape, let alone good shape.
- Same can pretty much be said for the SW20 MR2. Solid gold and Toyota reliability if you can find one. Let me be honest, can also say that for old Celicas. Can't remember the last time I saw a 5th gen Celica, not to mention one for sale. Again, I'd recommend an Integra or a Prelude over a US Spec 4th or 5th Gen FWD Celica.

You've also got your Eclipses and Talons, not the most reliable, but easier to find than an MR2 or an old Celica. Not to mention you can also get them turbo and AWD, and you'll probably find a lot more fun with one of these than an old man's US Spec 90's Subaru. Can probably think of a few more suggestions, but I'm a bit tired at the moment.
 
Anything light weight like a miata or mr2 maybe not be good for snow as it will slide much easier. Truthfully I would say if it's just for weekends mostly just use your parents car or ride with friends and keep saving. Life and problems only gets much harder and expensive when you add stuff to it at a low income.
 
If I were you I wouldn't focus on the snow part so much. Realistically how often will you drive in the snow over the course of the year?

I'm on my phone so I have no idea where you live but even if you get solid snow through the winter that's really only 2-3 months.

FWD with snow tires arentbad at all in the snow. 4wd will help with traction in some situations but in all reality for the hit you'll take to your budget or to the mileage on the car I'd think it's worth it to look at FWD over 4wd. God I've taken my girlfriends '98 mustang up a mountain snowboarding atleast a dozen times without issue but the snow tires are the big factor there.

If I were you I'd look for any mid '90s Japanese import in FWD that comes with decent snow tires. All 3 cars I've bought came with snow tires and all have been FWD imports.
As reference for the snow driving with snow tires I've had 0 issues taking my '88 Integra, 91 Golf or my '00 Accord up some pretty icy and snow covered mountains for snowboarding but all had good snow tires on...
 
Just to counter people saying the Miata won't be good in snow because it doesn't weigh much, that's more or less the exact opposite of what you actually want in snow.

Light weight is much better than lots of weight because there's less mass to try and move across a slippery surface. Getting going is easier, stopping as easier (have a think about who you'd prefer uncontrollably sliding towards you on an icy surface, a fat guy or a waif-like girl? Light weight is much easier to stop) and there's not as much momentum trying to pull you off the road in corners too.

Yes, RWD isn't great in snow but mine was fine the other year, even on summer tyres. Didn't get stuck at all, on winter tyres it would have been even better. It was also quite easy to drive, since 50/50 weight distribution means both ends of the car are doing equal work in the corners - neither of the FWD cars I had before or after it were as easy to turn even at low speeds.

Fair enough you won't go plowing through any deep drifts, but there's such a thing as driving for the conditions.

Theoretically, an MR2 should be even better in snow because being mid engined more of the car's weight is over the rear wheels where you need the traction (rear-engined old Beetles are famously brilliant in snow - light weight, skinny tyres and engine over the back wheels for traction), though for the same reason it's probably more difficult to control if you get it sliding as it'll be more like a big pendulum.

As mentioned though, if you really think you'll be doing a lot of snow driving, FWD is best. And there's little to say you won't have fun either. A Celica would be good fun whether FWD or 4WD and in all honesty, a little safer to learn the trade of driving quickly, if you're still fairly new to that.
 
+1 for the light weight snow concept by HomeForSummer. With snow tires, I rather drive my MINI than my Tahoe in snow and ice.
 
Yeah I guess I overemphasized the snow part. I just want something that can handle some sort of offroad driving, some dirt roads or snow, but not like hardcore muding or drivng in 3 feet of snow.

A prelude or integra would be cool, I think they look pretty good and I do have a heart for honda, my curent car is an acura. Only problem would be finding one unabused. Parts are also plentiful and cheap enough

An audi would be sweet cause I love german cars, but that one has problems and it would generally be dificult to find one with fair miles in my budget. Also, european parts prices :-(

Unfortunately I don't care too much for american cars. My personal experiene isn't the best with them.

On my phone now so don't have the time to check all responses. Ill be back tonight, thanks for the input so far!
 
I think most people are missing his point for the snow thing. He wants a car that's FUN to drive in the snow. RWD or 4WD will is way more fun in the snow than FWD (in fact fwd is now fun at all) and this is what he is looking for. And as HomeForSummer already mentioned, a lighter car will be better in the snow, or any other surface for that matter. People seem to forget the one thing that makes the difference, the tires.

Spartan G, get a Miata. It fits your criteria perfectly and you know inside that is what you will end up getting, especially considering it is the first car you mentioned ;)
 
I would avoid an old mid-nineties Subaru. Any Scooby you find will likely be due for some extremely heavy-duty maintenance. The transaxle bushings up front will likely be bad, and the transmission will be near the end of its life. Subaru maintenance is expensive - something you don't need.

The Miata is likely the most sensible on your list - can be had cheaply and not that difficult to repair.
 
SpartanG
5th or 6th gen Celica - Rally pedigree, just like the subarus. fwd might kill some fun, and the all-trac would probably either be too rare or out of price range. I love the styling of these two cars though. Hard to find unmolested/modded. the fwd platform would make snow driving possible, but fun? unsure :confused:
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The Celica All-Trac disappeared with the changeover to the ST204 model in 1994. The earlier models can be found, but they seem to be pretty rare. I'm not sure of the maintenance costs associated with the car, but it would be safe to assume that they would be quite high, despite Toyota offering several of their vehicles with the All-Trac setup at the time.

I have a '98 ST204, and I can say it has been a really nice car to own. Its everything a Toyota should be... Reliable, comfortable, quiet... But still has the surprisingly sporty capabilities that the engineers baked into the chassis. Keep in mind that this car is pretty heavy compared to the prequel and sequel to this model, clocking in at about 2900 lbs. With the 5S-FE under the hood, matched with the close-ratio gearbox, it gets up with a bit of gusto, but it won't win any awards for straight-line performance. The car is at home on the winding back roads, absorbing the major bumps and cracks, while flying through the corners at a pretty high rate of speed.

In the couple of years I've had the car (bought in the spring of 2008), I've only had a few problems. There was an issue with the fuel rail that flooded the engine, my retractable antenna is broken, and based on some of my research... No one makes a decent set of all-season tires that fit the car. Outside of that, most of the bits and pieces are shared with the Corolla and Camry, so parts are affordable and easy to replace.

I often think about how different my life would have been if I bought that Honda Civic or the Mazda 3, but in the end, I've had a good run with the Celica. Having gone from two Volkswagens to a Toyota, it has been strange living with a car that has essentially been trouble-free, but otherwise, the positives have outweighed the negatives.



Oh... And snow...

Last year I was running Goodyear Eagle GTs on the car, and the Celica survived the winter without too many problems. The biggest issue was the low ride height of the car, and on occasion, the car will get stuck pushing the snow around with the front and rear bumper. Having switched to a narrower set of BFGoodrich Traction T/As for this winter, we'll see how things go.
 
shmogt
Truthfully I would say if it's just for weekends mostly just use your parents car or ride with friends and keep saving. Life and problems only gets much harder and expensive when you add stuff to it at a low income.
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This is always an option. Some schools don't allow you to keep a car on campus until the second year, and if i go to a university that enforces this, it'll just be another year for me to save up. But honestly, i can only take so much of racing sims before I want to experience the real thing of owning a sports car. :)

Bottoz
+1 for the light weight snow concept by HomeForSummer. With snow tires, I rather drive my MINI than my Tahoe in snow and ice.
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👍


speed junkie
I think most people are missing his point for the snow thing. He wants a car that's FUN to drive in the snow.

Spartan G, get a Miata. It fits your criteria perfectly and you know inside that is what you will end up getting, especially considering it is the first car you mentioned ;)
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Thank you! And yes, the miata is really turning out to be the car for me. Super cheap so I won't lose my life savings at that point and a great overall package. I remember reading somewhere that the miata is literally the go anywhere, do anything car. That is, until it comes to carrying things...


And that last post about the celica was great to read. But the comparative rarity of the car may end up being a problem. I'm the kind of person that would wait a while in order to buy the perfect car, so if I'm waiting on a miata and spot a celica, I'll keep my eyes open.
 
I've read your choices and I see your theme, but I'd like to throw a suggestion out there. Jeep Cherokee. Get 2wd with a stick. I have a 97 and I consistently blow most imports out of the water. If you're concerned with snow get 4wd then. The newest ones can be had for around 2500-4000. They're dirt simple and easy to work on, not to mention quite reliable. The I6 they came with can last 300k easy. It's no Miata, but it's a unibody construction so it's stiff and light (~3400lbs). You'll also find it a tad more useful than a smaller car.
It's great fun
 
If you're not hauling people around all the time: 5th-gen Prelude SH.

Gorgeous looks are presentable and attract all the right attention, great handling (remember, SH!), great engine, fuel economy isn't bad, FWD is snow friendly, and it's as reliable and insurance/maintance-friendly as a Honda. At least around here, it's not terribly difficult finding them unmolested because they're typically driven by thirty-somethings. Usually in the $3-5k range.
 
seanyb505
I've read your choices and I see your theme, but I'd like to throw a suggestion out there. Jeep Cherokee. Get 2wd with a stick. I have a 97 and I consistently blow most imports out of the water. If you're concerned with snow get 4wd then. The newest ones can be had for around 2500-4000. They're dirt simple and easy to work on, not to mention quite reliable. The I6 they came with can last 300k easy. It's no Miata, but it's a unibody construction so it's stiff and light (~3400lbs). You'll also find it a tad more useful than a smaller car.
It's great fun
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So an SUV with basically none of the capability, slow (we have one, you must be racing clapped out ricers in '94 four door Civics or something), and aging. Ours also rides like its got 1500lb/in springs and eats wheel bearings. Lets not forget 17mpg, either. This fulfills none of the OP's criteria for a "fun weekend car".



About the MR2...No. You're 17 and without more experience, they can get you into trouble, fast. When it comes down to cheap fun, you can't beat the Miata or MR2, but the Miata is much easier to drive without any surprises. There's probably a 100:1 ratio of Miatas to MR2s, also, so you can get parts easier. :lol:

My other suggestion would be a CRX, since its the same formula, but FWD. I don't have any personal experience driving one, though.

What's your current car anyway?
 

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