Antialiasing... Do you think PD will do it?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Dracwolley
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Dracwolley

Dracwolley

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Dracwolley
antialias.gif


This is the difference between an alias and an antialiased picture.

Another example, in GT5P...

ALIAS (pay attention to the choppy, pixelated lines around the top spoiler and the antenna)
aylcy2j8xn.jpg


ANTIALIASED (no choppy lines at all (press shot)
gt5.jpg


This is the thing that I hope PD will put into GT5 the most.
I seriously hope they do. Do you?

But also, it would take a lot of power to do it, so they may not... do you think there is a possibility that they could still do it?

EDIT: i just realized this should go in the wishlist thread. mods: if you think it should be deleted, do it, it was an act of stupidity on my part, really.
 
You do know where this thread is going dont you:guilty:, im not going to be a part of it:sly:
Edit: Or to get attention to the subject :p
 
I may be wrong, but console games are hardly ever antialiased, seeing as AA is one of those few things (along with resolution) that severely impacts framerate. I wouldn't hold my breath, and GT5 will still look amazing.
 
Oh well since it hasn't been locked i might aswell reply.
Gt does have AA, 4X in 720P, and 2X in 1080p which isn't really true 1080p.
 
G.T.Ace
Its rendered in 1280x1080p and gets upscaled to 1920x1080p.
Click to expand...

Interesting, but aren't those two resolutions two different aspect ratio's? One's 4:3 and 1920x1080 is 16:9. So if both are 1080 how can it be upscaled?

Edit: Do you mean to say its rendered in 1280x720 and gets upscaled to 1920x1080? Although I thought this wasn't true with GT5?
 
I'm of the opinion that PD should just drop 1080p altogether and use 720p. Rendering in 1080p uses 2.25 more memory than rendering in 720. Rendering in 720 would free up more memory and would give more AA. Only a fraction of GT5 players will be using 1080p anyway.

Because the bottom line is that however good GT5 is going to look in 1080p; it can look a whole lot better in 720p...and that's what PD should be doing IMO.
 
damez
Interesting, but aren't those two resolutions two different aspect ratio's? One's 4:3 and 1920x1080 is 16:9. So if both are 1080 how can it be upscaled?

Edit: Do you mean to say its rendered in 1280x720 and gets upscaled to 1920x1080? Although I thought this wasn't true with GT5?
Click to expand...

No it is rendered in 1280 x 1080p, and then scaled to fit full 1080p by PS3 scaler.
 
well, 16:9 dvds (not sure about BDs) are actually 4:3 and morphed into 16:9, so it might be the same deal.

but again, not sure.
 
Dracwolley
well, 16:9 dvds (not sure about BDs) are actually 4:3 and morphed into 16:9, so it might be the same deal.

but again, not sure.
Click to expand...

Well not all, because if you morphed 4:3 into 16:9 the image would look stretched horizontally. Wouldn't it?

dancardesigner
No it is rendered in 1280 x 1080p, and then scaled to fit full 1080p by PS3 scaler.
Click to expand...

So then its scaled from 1280 to 1920 horizontally? Wouldn't this show stretching? Sorry if I sound like a cock, I'm just a little confused lol.

Example:

Untitled-2-11.jpg


So if 1280x1080 (pink) was to be 'upscaled' to 1920x1080 (green), then wouldn't it show stretching?
 
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deep_sky
I'm of the opinion that PD should just drop 1080p altogether and use 720p. Rendering in 1080p uses 2.25 more memory than rendering in 720. Rendering in 720 would free up more memory and would give more AA. Only a fraction of GT5 players will be using 1080p anyway.

Because the bottom line is that however GT5 is going to look in 1080p; it can look a whole lot better in 720p...and tat's what PD should be doing IMO.
Click to expand...

+1:tup: i have been saying this for ages. But theres no way they are going to go against there promise now, not to mention it gives sony more technical jargon to argue why GT is better than Forza.
 
no, it's redered smushed, like you were watching 16:9 morphed into 4:3. and then it's stretched to 16:9.

i'll get a pic...

EDIT: the pic i used in the first post.
rszgt91.jpg

then stretched to 1920x1080.
 
Dracwolley
no, it's redered smushed, like you were watching 16:9 morphed into 4:3. and then it's stretched to 16:9.

i'll get a pic...

EDIT: the pic i used in the first post.
*Picture*
then stretched to 1920x1080.
Click to expand...

Oh right! So it's pre-rendered in a 4:3 format, then stretched to fit 16:9. Got it 👍
 
damez
Oh right! So it's pre-rendered in a 4:3 format, then stretched to fit 16:9. Got it 👍
Click to expand...

But only in gameplay and replays. I'm quite sure the menus are full HD (1920x1080). BTW, the 2x and 4x AA are just medium scaled ie. MSAA as oppose to FSAA (full scaled) which you can only do on the PC.

To use 720p if you're using 1080p capable screen is to force 720p. You need to uncheck the other resolution (and keep 720p) in the display setting- using manual setup.
 
Simply resizing that press shot in photoshop to say half size would AA it, It's way down my list of thing's I'd like to see PD do. I NEVER notice any jagies playing at 1080p, doing 180mph down the straight at Fuji, concentrate on the driving and quit sight seeing.

I hope PD stick with 1080p, because in a sim cockpit where you're quite close to the screen, 1080p makes a big difference.
 
Tomaz
I really hope so. I bought Full HD tv just for Gran Turismo 5.
Click to expand...

Wow that's hardcore. :crazy:
When you think about this game costs us a fortune, wheels, cockpits, HDTVs, PS3. We could have had a couple years subscription to iRacing for that, or even some trackdays.
 
One thing is clear from this thread, no one really knows that much about how GT5 works with regards Anti-Aliasing. I see people saying it has 2x and 4x AA, this would require the image to be rendered at either 2 or 4 times the final display resolution then downsized not stretched to fit the display resolution, and the resolutions involved don't have to be the same "aspect ratio" as you can have pixels that aren't square and ones that are square. I have no idea what's involved in making a game like GT5P look good, and I don't pretend to know, I do know it looks more than fine as it is.
 
@dancardesigner

i just worked out that i've spent a total of $2,760 on GT.

Dang, PD!

@No46_TheDoctor.

good summary there.
 
The game is rendered in a non standard widescreen aspect ratio and scaled HORIZONTALLY. The reason for this is because ps3's hardware scaler only works properly when you upscale horizontally and not vertically. It hasnt got the ability to upscale vertically. You can upscale on ps3 in software, but i suspect like MGS4 (native res is 1024 x 768) GT5 is using the hardware scaler instead of a software solution to reduce performance overhead. Several ps3 games for this reason run such odd resolutions in 1080p mode like 960 x 1080 and then upscaled horizontally the rest of the way. Wipeout HD for one example uses a curious dynamic framebuffer to achieve 1920 x 1080, the game actually adjusts its resolution between frames. Reducing it when the framerate drops and increasing it as the engine recovers from heavy load. it can go from 1280 x 1080, 1440 x 1080 etc etc up to 1920 x 1080 dynamically in the blink of eye- but note its always the horizontal resolution that is scaled.

GT5 also doesnt do anti aliasing in the way described here by no.46 the doctor. FSAA(full scene/screen) is where the whole scene is rendered at a higher resolution and then downsampled to reduce aliasing. however as you would expect its quite costly and actually inefficient. Aliasing occurs on the boundaries of pixels, so you dont actually need to increase the resolution of the whole scene and then downsample. You need methods that can target specific pixels and boundaries- multi sample anti aliasing, adaptive super sampling etc.

Even then as someone said anti aliasing can be prohibitively expensive for ps3. 360's custom GPU EDRAM bandwith and logic is often enough to use anti aliasing without taking much of a hit on overall performance- this was exactly what it was designed for. Ps3 is using an older, off the shelf GPU and split memory architecture. Tighter bandwidth constraints for AA reduces its performance more. On the upside RSX in Ps3 is much better at anisotropic filtering than 360, which can make a difference on racing games where textures will blur when seen at an angle in front of you, such as the track/gravel pit textures. (see forza 2!!)

Either way you arent likely to see many games on console deploying the great wads of AA + AF to improve image quality. I dont feel either has sufficient performance, usually 360 ends up with better AA and Ps3 better AF! Heavy filtering is still the preserve of PC gaming until at least another generation of consoles.
 
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PS3 games look better without it. RSX antialiasing takes too much power and "cuincux"(or something like that) will just blur whole picture. GT5:P graphics seem very good for this gen.
 
How come so many people on these forums know everything about everything, GTP is like a god damn encyclopaedia.
I guess Google is your friend:sly::p
 

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