Are LM´s real life cars?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Juanmax
  • 56 comments
  • 1,857 views
Originally posted by Stealth Viper
So what's the "final answer"? Are they real? Or not?
Click to expand...

NO in the sense that they don't exist.

YES in the sense that they could.

It's like a fictitious story about a man in everyday life. It could happen, but it probably hasn't.

~LoudMusic
 
If, as has been postulated in several prior posts, LM stands for Le Mans (which I believe it does), the answer is no. If you go to the Le Mans web site, you can get entry lists for the races, and those cars are not listed. In regards to the 787B, this car ran a R26B 4-rotor engine, and for the endurance of Le Mans, the horsepower was dialed in to a reliable 700 HP or so. The engine could probably pump out a hundred more or so, but for much shorter periods of time. It is the only car by a Japanese marque to ever win Le Mans, by the way.
The 276 HP figure quoted for most Japanese high performance sports cars is bogus. The numbers are the "official" numbers released by the manufacturers. the 276 is a number is dictated by the Japanese government, but they are somewhat lax in that they take the manufacturers word for it. The RX-7, the Skyline, the Lancer Evo VII, the WRX STi: if you were to dyno any of these cars, you'd see that some make a great deal more hp than 276. The last year the RX-7's were in the states, 96, they were making 255 HP. You're telling me they only make 21 more HP five years later? As to the three rotor, the 20B, they are only rare in the States, as they were never officially imported, due to emissions cert problems. They weren't ever meant for the RX-7; they were installed in the Cosmos', as seen in prior Grans Turismo.
 
ev-fto.jpg
 
Originally posted by doubleclutch
If, as has been postulated in several prior posts, LM stands for Le Mans (which I believe it does), the answer is no. If you go to the Le Mans web site, you can get entry lists for the races, and those cars are not listed.
Click to expand...


Nobody was arguing this. My reference to LM referring to LeMans was in reference to the Nissan R390, which I am fairly certain did run at lemans a few years ago. Runing a car at Lemans isnt what makes a car a lemans race car. The American Lemans series is populated by several cars that have never been to france yet in my minds eye are still lemans cars. I dont know if that makes sense...

The 276 HP figure quoted for most Japanese high performance sports cars is bogus. The numbers are the "official" numbers released by the manufacturers. the 276 is a number is dictated by the Japanese government, but they are somewhat lax in that they take the manufacturers word for it. The RX-7, the Skyline, the Lancer Evo VII, the WRX STi: if you were to dyno any of these cars, you'd see that some make a great deal more hp than 276. The last year the RX-7's were in the states, 96, they were making 255 HP. You're telling me they only make 21 more HP five years later? As to the three rotor, the 20B, they are only rare in the States, as they were never officially imported, due to emissions cert problems. They weren't ever meant for the RX-7; they were installed in the Cosmos', as seen in prior Grans Turismo.
Click to expand...

You're mostly right. the 276hp limit is an industry self regulation. Many see it as a runnig joke, but it is fairly close to reality, at the WHEELS. Most horsepower figures are horsepower at the crank (bhp) instead of dyno horsepower. The lack of available 4 wheel dynos makes testing this difficult for many high powered cars. The Skyline GT-R and a few others are rated at 276 because that's what they are pumping to the wheels. This is mainly due to a restrictive intake. This is done to improve the fleet fuel economy numbers. These cars are made for the aftermarket that can drop $300 to get another 100 horsepower. I am pretty sure that RX-7s were never rated at 276 horsepower. Cars dont always get more powerful over time.
 
i don't care what the hell u are and who the hell u are, but for the love of God...don't come to a forum for a GAME and pretend like you know everything...that really makes me mad!

in conclusion, GET A FRIGGIN' LIFE!!!!! GROW THE HELL UP!!!!!!
 
Originally posted by BrianCNorton



I'm not sure what youre talking about with your rx-7, but yes, there are very fast RX-7s around. I would just be VERY suprised to see on with 800 hp, or even 600 hp. Thats a LOT of power. On a 20b engine (3 rotor) I can almost see this on a fully converted drag machine, but nothing short of that.
Click to expand...

There is a recent Car and Driver, or Road and Track, that has a 600+hp RX7 in a comparo against a few hopped up Corvettes, a Benz, and some other tuner cars... It didnt have anything extraordinary to achieve this power: big turbo, engine strengthening, etc...

I have also seen in a respected magazine a 700+hp Skyline, 600-700hp Supra, 800+hp Viper, 700+hp Camaro, 650hp Corvette, etc.. So it is not that out of reach, although I am sure it is ridiculously expensive...

I am sure an 800hp RX7 can be had for the right amount of money. Just drop in a bigger version of the 787 rotary, with 8 turbos. :p
 
Originally posted by Stealth Viper
So what's the "final answer"? Are they real? Or not?
Click to expand...

The R390 GT1 LM Race Car is real, the one in GT3 raced at LeMans in 1998, that yellow RX-7 is a JGTC car and it is real! If you go back to GT2 you will see that you can win a Black R390 GT1 LM race car which raced at LeMans in 1997. The 787b is real 1991 LeMans winner, the Toyota GT1 Race car is real 1998 and 1999 at LeMans.
 
Originally posted by BrianCNorton


Nobody was arguing this. My reference to LM referring to LeMans was in reference to the Nissan R390, which I am fairly certain did run at lemans a few years ago.
Click to expand...

Yes, back in 1998 is when the Blue one raced, the Black one from GT2 was the 1997 Racing R390GT1.
 
Originally posted by trophymaker
I have also seen in a respected magazine a 700+hp Skyline, 600-700hp Supra, 800+hp Viper, 700+hp Camaro, 650hp Corvette, etc.. So it is not that out of reach, although I am sure it is ridiculously expensive...
Click to expand...

That Viper would either be the TNT King Snake or the 800TT, I am thinking that the 700+hp Skyline was a Blitz model, but I will have to pick up that issue soon!
 
no worry bro...Brian is full of crap...he just copy/pastes info to make himself sound smart!
 
Originally posted by Rice Rocketeer
no worry bro...Brian is full of crap...he just copy/pastes info to make himself sound smart!
Click to expand...

Not really Rice he does know what he is talking about in this thread, I have no comment on the other threads. I on the other hand am 100% sure that all my info on the LMs is true!!
 
Whew, before this gets too heated, let me add my $.02. LoudMusic is exactly right. The majority of the LM cars are from real racing series. If you haven't seen them before, it's more than likely because these are European (or Japanese) series which don't get that much coverage here, even on Speedvision. But, I'm sure there are a few of the cars which could have been created by the developers, even though they have not been built in real life.

Also, I always thought LM in the GT series stood for "Limited", as in Limited Edition, not Le Mans.
 
Originally posted by Jordan
Also, I always thought LM in the GT series stood for "Limited", as in Limited Edition, not Le Mans.
Click to expand...

Me 2 but with Rice and Brian all argueing I didnt want to post that.
 
The LM cars, I am pretty sure that as a general rule they are not real. (with the exceptions nailed down quite well by zerocool) By real I am referring to the car in the game being a replication of a REAL car. I am not talking about matching horsepower and model. I consider the Castrol Supra a "Real car." There are 1000+ hp skylines and supras and a few others, but they are not replicated in the game.

Zerocool, that's very big of you to come out like that, considering all the ragging I did on you not long ago. Kudos.
 
Originally posted by BrianCNorton
Zerocool, that's very big of you to come out like that, considering all the ragging I did on you not long ago. Kudos.
Click to expand...

Its cool man, that was acient history Brian, back when I thought you were an a** but that was months ago!!

Water under the Bridge!
 
I just remembered about the Audi TT LM when that was in GT2, no Audi TT's were in DTM when GT2 frist came out but now there are, so maybe in the future most LM cars will be made.
 
Originally posted by Jordan
Whew, before this gets too heated, let me add my $.02. LoudMusic is exactly right. The majority of the LM cars are from real racing series. If you haven't seen them before, it's more than likely because these are European (or Japanese) series which don't get that much coverage here, even on Speedvision. But, I'm sure there are a few of the cars which could have been created by the developers, even though they have not been built in real life.

Also, I always thought LM in the GT series stood for "Limited", as in Limited Edition, not Le Mans.
Click to expand...
Too late! If this was taking place face to face, we'd either all be dead, or have a better understanding of what eachother are trying to say. I think we'd all be dead ...

Thanks for the plug though, Jordan (:

If I understand what we're all coming to, is that the GT3 LM cars by the technical specifications can and possibly do exist. However, there is no such thing as a "Poliphony Digital" or "GT3" sponsored race car. There might be a car with similar specs, but it has a real world sponsor ... like Castrol or Calsonic (who the heck is Calsonic anyway?). I'm sure this would have something to do with licensing, much like the Ferrari, Lamborguini (sp?), and Porche issues.

The fact that the LM cars in GT3 can reach horse power of nearly 1000hp, really has nothing to do with validating their realism. The Escudo is a real car, and the 'stock' specs in GT3 are fairly accurate. However, if you drop in the "GT3 turbo", it will get darn close to 2000hp, and we all know that's a load of crap. The same with the Castrol Supra, the various Vipers and NSXs (or is it NSXi? (: ).

Poliphony Digital didn't just make up a bunch of cars for us to play with. They got these numbers from something, even if they're not wholey accurate.

Bah, I'm adding to the insanity. Better stop before I make it too much worse.


~LoudMusic
 
I think Calsonic is an electronic company in Japan, not sure but it sounds good 2 me.
 
Originally posted by ZeroCool85
I think Calsonic is an electronic company in Japan, not sure but it sounds good 2 me.
Click to expand...

Calsonic Kansei

Product types
Heater & Air conditioning systems: car air conditioners, car heaters, compressors, controls, actuators, etc.
Engine Cooling systems: radiators, oil coolers, intercoolers, motors, cooling fans, etc.
Exhaust systems: mufflers, converters, exhaust manifolds, metallic catalysts, exhaust tube, etc.
Instrument clusters : custom IC-based digital instrument clusters, cableless electric crossover coils, etc.
Sensors and switches: chassis controllers, body controllers, interior and exterior components, electronic control units, etc.
Other: Automobile rubber hose, air cleaners,heat exchangers for racing car, mobile communications, fish cooler for fishing boat, remote control engine starters, railways train air conditioning systems, home air conditioners, etc.

So ... I guess they do car stuff (:

~LoudMusic
 
Originally posted by LoudMusic


Calsonic Kansei

Product types
Heater & Air conditioning systems: car air conditioners, car heaters, compressors, controls, actuators, etc.
Engine Cooling systems: radiators, oil coolers, intercoolers, motors, cooling fans, etc.
Exhaust systems: mufflers, converters, exhaust manifolds, metallic catalysts, exhaust tube, etc.
Instrument clusters : custom IC-based digital instrument clusters, cableless electric crossover coils, etc.
Sensors and switches: chassis controllers, body controllers, interior and exterior components, electronic control units, etc.
Other: Automobile rubber hose, air cleaners,heat exchangers for racing car, mobile communications, fish cooler for fishing boat, remote control engine starters, railways train air conditioning systems, home air conditioners, etc.

So ... I guess they do car stuff (:

~LoudMusic
Click to expand...

I was close.......
 
Originally posted by ZeroCool85


WOW!!! Those R390 pics are sweet, good show!
Click to expand...

Some RX-7 racers ....

rx7_gt_group.jpg


These cars and the ones in GT3 don't really resemble eachother, and I haven't found specs on these cars, but they sure are cool looking (:

~LoudMusic
 
Originally posted by BrianCNorton
I stand corrected.
The Nissan r390 is denoted as an LM race car, and it is a direct replica of the Calsonic R390.

I dont know why this is, except that LM might stand for something different like LeMans or something, but it is the exception rather than the rule.

As for an 800 hp rx-7, I'll believe it when I see a dyno.
MAYBE if you had one of the japanese 3 rotor engines, MAYBE.
Ive heard of a couple in the 500 range.

Unfortunately, there is no race bred rotary nowadays.
Click to expand...

You like apples? Well ...

(Original)

The Mazda RX-7 has won more races than any other car in IMSA history. In the 1970s, Racing Beat shattered the Bonneville G-Production Class Record by running a two way average of 160.393 MPH, in an RX-3. In late 1978, Racing Beat shattered the Bonneville E/GT Class Record by running 183.904 MPH in a P-Port 13B RX-7. In 1987, Racing Beat the Bonneville GT/Sports Class Record by over 37 MPH, with an average of 238.442 MPH in an RX-7 Turbo II.

The current third generation contender for Bonneville Land Speed record has a horsepower-per-liter ratio of over 450:1 (the motor makes approximately 930 HP from 2.0 liters - 123 cu. in. ) Racing Beat campaigned a Mazda RX-3 in sanctioned NHRA drag racing back in the 70s A normally aspirated 1.2 liter rotary motor is capable of well over 270 horsepower Mazda made a four-rotor engine, designated as the 13J-2M which produced 630 HP @ 9000 RPM onregular (87 octane) unleaded gas, normally aspirated.

DSC00062.JPG


921130578.jpg


... how ya like THEM apples? (:

~LoudMusic
 
Originally posted by LoudMusic


The current third generation contender for Bonneville Land Speed record has a horsepower-per-liter ratio of over 450:1 (the motor makes approximately[/i] 930 HP from 2.0 liters - 123 cu. in. ) Racing Beat campaigned a Mazda RX-3 in sanctioned NHRA drag racing back in the 70s A normally aspirated 1.2 liter rotary motor is capable of well over 270 horsepower Mazda made a four-rotor engine, designated as the 13J-2M which produced 630 HP @ 9000 RPM onregular (87 octane) unleaded gas, normally aspirated


~LoudMusic
Click to expand...


This is not an RX-7, at least in as much as a Ford NASCAR is a taurus.
 
it looks like a corvette to me , but thats just how it looks probably wrong :)
 
Back