Car Insurance.

[a6m5]

So then start scamming them yourself!

Yeah..... Not a good message, especially considering the young ages of some of the members here. Your were probably just joking though.

Driving without insurance or faking claims are not some kind of loopholes. It's illegal, don't do it.

One kid I worked with had his car stolen. Another guy I knew long time ago were trying to pull the same scam, I don't know if he ever succeded though. They were both P.O.S. 👎

 

[toyomatt84]

So, it sounds as if a Toyota from the '90's which can get pricey (depending on where you get it), a minivan, or some other vehicle (its almost as if I'm more confused than when I started).

Anyone have a source of how much insurance would be for any/every late 90's vehicles? Like a list of typical price ranges for insurance on the cheapest to insure.

 

[Double_R]

I hate insurance companies. I bet they pay off the government to carry on over charging us.
And I hate that I have to pay more than females. Why hasnt any gone to court over this. Comeon americans you like to sue people for fun.

 

[1X83Z]

Yeah..... Not a good message, especially considering the young ages of some of the members here. Your were probably just joking though.

Did you see the next sentence!?

 

[MrktMkr1986]

I hate insurance companies.

Why? They are necessary...

I bet they pay off the government to carry on over charging us.

Conspiracy theories...

And I hate that I have to pay more than females. Why hasnt any gone to court over this.

Takes too much time... Why fight?

Comeon americans you like to sue people for fun.

I should sue you for that stereotypical comment. j/k

What's the big deal about insurance companies anyway? Just pay and your covered... except for liability that is...

 

[Gturismo1]

What's the big deal about insurance companies anyway? Just pay and your covered... except for liability that is...

Ok, well maybe you are more financially well off than some other people. But I have a serious problem with forking over close to 75% of my annual income to an insurance company when I have other things, namely tuition and other education related bills to worry about.

Thats what the big deal is. It is a big deal because everywhere else in this country (Canada) people aren't paying nearly as much as people in Ontario. We get reamed, there has been government investigations into it. So yeah, I would say it is a big deal. Its not like I am complaing about paying 1000/year for insurance, I am complaining for having to pay close to 6000/year at an age where I also have to deal with rising tuition costs from the education system as well.

 

[Famine]

You choose to have a car knowing the costs involved. If you cannot stand the costs involved, choose NOT to have a car.

 

[KSaiyu]

I got a quote for a Fiat 1.0 Uno for £2,400....

 

[emad]

You choose to have a car knowing the costs involved. If you cannot stand the costs involved, choose NOT to have a car.

$6000/year on insurance is still highway robbery. Our family pays close to $8000/year for liability coverage ONLY because I'm under the age of 25 and because more than 5 years ago my mom was in two accidents where it was the other person's fault. To make the $8k/year worse, my sister wants to get HER licence. Of course, if we let her get it, the insurance company will ask if she has a license and if she does, they'll force us to add her to the policy even *if* we decide that she's not going to be driving anything till she's older. Our inurance even went up after the mechanic wrecked the car and 3 others because he forgot to bleed the brakes as he was pulling out of the garage (at a rediculously high speed).

There definately is something very wrong with Ontario's insurance. Something must be done about it.

 

[toyomatt84]

Insurance levels

I know it's a uk-based site, but it's been a little helpful.

 

[Ev0]

$6000/year on insurance is still highway robbery. Our family pays close to $8000/year for liability coverage ONLY because I'm under the age of 25 and because more than 5 years ago my mom was in two accidents where it was the other person's fault. To make the $8k/year worse, my sister wants to get HER licence. Of course, if we let her get it, the insurance company will ask if she has a license and if she does, they'll force us to add her to the policy even *if* we decide that she's not going to be driving anything till she's older. Our inurance even went up after the mechanic wrecked the car and 3 others because he forgot to bleed the brakes as he was pulling out of the garage (at a rediculously high speed).

There definately is something very wrong with Ontario's insurance. Something must be done about it.

Here's another good old fashioned Ontario insurance horror story. My dad recently made a claim to fix a small crack in his windsheild due to a pebble hitting it. Obviosuly, this was not his fault, and there was no danger whatsoever from the 'damage' done. So, what does the insurance company do? Well, they raise his rates for this! I could go on with more stories if I wanted to.

I agree something needs to be done about auto insurance here. The auto insurance industry in Ontario made a record 4 billion dollar profit in 2004. Meanwhile, anyone who drives a car is getting completely cheated out of their money. Damn the greedy pigs running the industry, and damn our useless government for doing absolutely nothing to significantly lower rates.

 

[Famine]

$6000/year on insurance is still highway robbery. Our family pays close to $8000/year for liability coverage ONLY because I'm under the age of 25 and because more than 5 years ago my mom was in two accidents where it was the other person's fault. To make the $8k/year worse, my sister wants to get HER licence. Of course, if we let her get it, the insurance company will ask if she has a license and if she does, they'll force us to add her to the policy even *if* we decide that she's not going to be driving anything till she's older. Our inurance even went up after the mechanic wrecked the car and 3 others because he forgot to bleed the brakes as he was pulling out of the garage (at a rediculously high speed).

There definately is something very wrong with Ontario's insurance. Something must be done about it.

But, get this... You don't have to pay it if you don't have a car.

By having a car and paying the insurance you're acknowledging that the insurance is cost-efficient enough that you will actually pay it. Don't get a car, then you don't HAVE to pay it. And if everyone does the same, the insurance industry won't make a penny.


I am a little curious about your wording though. It sounds as if you have ONE insurance policy covering your entire household. In the UK you have one insurance policy per car. If that's also the case in Canada, can I ask how many of you can actually drive the car simultaneously?

 

[emad]

Each individual driver has their own policy for the car for some dumbass reason. If your name isn't on it then you can't drive. Additionally, the rates per person are obviously different even though it's the same car. The person with the least experience or the highest risk is considered the primary driver no matter who owns the vehicle and no matter whether or not the person will even drive the car. In our case, I'm the primary driver for the Accord which obviously will make my insurance much, much higher than it would be if I was a secondary driver. It's frickin stupid that they do this - especially since I only need the car once every few weeks.

Either way, the insurance up here makes absolutely zero sense and literally is nothing more than legalized extortion. Don't have it, get arrested. Have the absolute bare minimum policy they allow you to have, go broke. Sell your current car and buy another one (new or used), expect to pay double what you were already paying. This is why we can't replace our Accord. Our insurance would go up to $12000+ per year for the four of us. Add my sister and it's up to $13000 minimum after the discounts from her attending drivers ed and from her good academic standing.

By the way, you're saying that it's not necessary to have a car. I find that funny since people have to have a method of going to work and going from point a to point b. The town I'm in has a really bad transit system. Go into Toronto and the transit is good enough that you don't even need a car. But of course, Toronto is the only city in Ontario with a good transit system. My town comes second and it's absolutely horrible here. Most of the commercial/industrial areas in which a vast majority of this city works rarely see a bus passing by once per hour. The buses also stop running early in the day. There were several times when I had to give friends rides home from work because the last bus of the day had left 2 hours before their shifts ended. It's also damn difficult to get groceries because of the sucky bus schedule. To make it worse, the transit companies are seriously considering charging even more than the already high $2.25 fares. Monthly passes dont help since they end up costing more unless you plan on using the bus at least 5 days a week.

 

[Famine]

By the way, you're saying that it's not necessary to have a car. I find that funny since people have to have a method of going to work and going from point a to point b. The town I'm in has a really bad transit system. Go into Toronto and the transit is good enough that you don't even need a car. But of course, Toronto is the only city in Ontario with a good transit system. My town comes second and it's absolutely horrible here. Most of the commercial/industrial areas in which a vast majority of this city works rarely see a bus passing by once per hour. The buses also stop running early in the day. There were several times when I had to give friends rides home from work because the last bus of the day had left 2 hours before their shifts ended. It's also damn difficult to get groceries because of the sucky bus schedule. To make it worse, the transit companies are seriously considering charging even more than the already high $2.25 fares. Monthly passes dont help since they end up costing more unless you plan on using the bus at least 5 days a week.

I'm sorry if I sound harsh, but MOVE.

You - or your family - has chosen where to live, and the fact you "need" a car to get to wherever it is you're going is directly linked to that.

Additionally, $2.25 per day, each and every day, adds up to $821.25. That's markedly less than $8000 - unless there's ten of you...

 

[emad]

I'm sorry if I sound harsh, but MOVE.

You - or your family - has chosen where to live, and the fact you "need" a car to get to wherever it is you're going is directly linked to that.

Additionally, $2.25 per day, each and every day, adds up to $821.25. That's markedly less than $8000 - unless there's ten of you...

Our family is forced to live wherever our business is located. Unless of course you would like us to sell our business, move somewhere else and start from scratch.

These rediculous insurance rates started around 2003. It was around then that the Ontario government started allowing the companies to run amok and charge whatever the hell they pleased.

About the $4 billion in profits, Ontario's population is somewhere around 12 million people. Can you seriously justify these companies charging THAT MUCH? These profit figures were of course of house, car, motorcycle, and whatever else sort of insurance combined so the ratio of profits per person is kinda skewed. In 2003, Ontario insurance companies saw more than a 400% increase in profits and they werecomplaining about their expenses.

Here's an interesting article - they want to make our rates worse: http://www.newswire.ca/en/releases/archive/February2005/18/c6283.html

 

[Famine]

Our family is forced to live wherever our business is located. Unless of course you would like us to sell our business, move somewhere else and start from scratch.

I don't get it then. To where are you commuting if you live where your business is?

And again, $2.25 a day is less than $8000 a year for up to (and including) NINE people.

 

[Ev0]

I've gotta side with emad on this one.

Firstly, even Toronto's transit system sucks. The subway, although it is fast once you're on it, is in dire need of repair, since for instance our tunnels are starting to fall apart. And our bus system is terrible. For example, every week I need to get to my math tutor's house. This isn't a problem half the time, since I can use my mom's car to drive myself there in less than 10 minutes. But, the other half of the time, when my mom is using the car, I have to use the bus to get there. Now, since I live in Thornhill (a suburb bordering on the north of Toronto), I have two choices. I can either take two different buses and pay two fares, or I can walk 10-15 minutes to the bus stop for the Toronto bus stop. I always do the latter, since I save $2.25, and there is little to no loss of time. And, once I get to the bus stop, it's normally a 10-15 minute wait for a bus. It's then another 10 minutes for the actual bus ride. So, a trip that takes less than 10 minutes by car is stretched out into at least a 30 minute travel time.

And did I forget to mention a large portion of Toronto's buses are in need of replacing, since they have been in service since the first half of the 1980s? If nothing is done about public transit soon, it could get real nasty in the city.

As for insurance, I've definitley gotta side with emad, on that it's basically legalized extortion, seeing how it is highly illegal to drive around without insurance (something which more and more people are doing now). And it's not just the auto insurance industry that's gone nuts. For example, a friend of my mom's knows someone who lives in the country who can't get any fire insurance for their home since they are not close enough to a fire hydrant. Obviously living further from the closest fire station, or hydrant for that matter, should justify a rate increase, but leaving absolutely no chance to get insured?

And after reading that article, it starts to make me wonder if something is going on behind the scenes that the voters don't know about. McGuinty isn't exactly Mr. Credibility anyways...

 

[a6m5]

In North America(w/exception of NYC), you got to have a car. This is not an luxury to most people, it's an necessity. My 15 minute commute by my car would take at least an hour by bus(at least 2 separate lines). That's an hour and half you lose in a day, not counting grocery shopping, going to your friends house, getting a hair cut, movie theater, etc. Cities around here are designed with people with cars in mind. I live by Portland, where they spend heavily on public transportation, and it is still nearly impossible to get around without a car. I understand where Famine is coming from, but if Ontario is anything like the cities in the states(I've also been to Vancouver, several times), you will not be able to get around without a car. You also shouldn't have to move, because the insurance industry is out of control.

If this insurance problem is so serious in Ontario, what is government doing? Shouldn't Senators be forming an committee or something? I think it's time, people in Ontario send a message to the government and the insurance companies there.

 

[Ev0]

In North America(w/exception of NYC), you got to have a car. This is not an luxury to most people, it's an necessity. My 15 minute commute by my car would take at least an hour by bus(at least 2 separate lines). That's an hour and half you lose in a day, not counting grocery shopping, going to your friends house, getting a hair cut, movie theater, etc. Cities around here are designed with people with cars in mind. I live by Portland, where they spend heavily on public transportation, and it is still nearly impossible to get around without a car. I understand where Famine is coming from, but if Ontario is anything like the cities in the states(I've also been to Vancouver, several times), you will not be able to get around without a car. You also shouldn't have to move, because the insurance industry is out of control.

There are a few areas in Toronto where you might be able to make do without a car. But everywhere else, especially in the suburbs, a car is a necessity.

If this insurance problem is so serious in Ontario, what is government doing? Shouldn't Senators be forming an committee or something? I think it's time, people in Ontario send a message to the government and the insurance companies there.

Well, the people of the province elected a premier, who has yet to keep a single one of his hundreds (yes, hundreds) of campaign promises. The current liberal government in Ontario is useless, plain and simple. Now, seeing how the people of the province were ignorant enough to elect a government who made dozens of unrealistic promises, is it much of a surprise that the people have not yet banded together to fight insurance?

 

[emad]

Thanks Ev0 and a6m5 for backing me up while I was gone 👍

I don't get it then. To where are you commuting if you live where your business is?

And again, $2.25 a day is less than $8000 a year for up to (and including) NINE people.

Me, I commute to school every day. My parents and brother go to the family business daily.

I have to go through between 1 and 3 transit companies per day to get to school (It depends on my schedule, how far I can get a ride, and whether or not I will be late). In a week, I spend $36.50 for transit based on my school schedule. That's $146/month and $1168 per 8 month school year. Of course, I usually have a few classes during the 4 summer months as well. That's pretty a pretty hefty sum for a student to be paying out of his pocket mate

Our business is a 20 minute drive away. To take the bus there, it takes a minimum of 3 buses. 2 of them have 1 to 2 hour intervals. To get to the office by bus, you would have to leave at least 2.5 hours early. To make it worse, the bus to leave the office doesn't even run after 5pm. Someone is always there till at least 6pm

 

[MrktMkr1986]

Ok, well maybe you are more financially well off than some other people.

That's funny. If you read one of my posts in the "February" thread, you'd understand why.

For the record: I'm not more financially well off than some other people. Just because I own a few shares of stock and aspire to work on the stock market DOES NOT mean that I am rich.

But I have a serious problem with forking over close to 75% of my annual income to an insurance company when I have other things, namely tuition and other education related bills to worry about.

I have tuition too... but the reason why I asked that is:

Would you rather pay a few thousand a year in car insurance, or be sued hundreds of thousands dollars because you were involved in a car accident? I don't know about you, but I'd rather be broke and safe than save a few pennies and risk being sued, or getting in trouble for driving without insurance.

Thats what the big deal is. It is a big deal because everywhere else in this country (Canada) people aren't paying nearly as much as people in Ontario. We get reamed, there has been government investigations into it. So yeah, I would say it is a big deal. Its not like I am complaing about paying 1000/year for insurance, I am complaining for having to pay close to 6000/year at an age where I also have to deal with rising tuition costs from the education system as well.

I'm sure you do but it's the same thing in New York. Especially when you live close to New York City like I do.

 

[Takumi Fujiwara]

I'm paying about $3000 a year. For a car worth less than half that. I pay more than both my parents together, and my dad drives a 328i, my mom an '04 Prius.

 

[StevieMo]

Now that the drop came in here I'm paying just over $100.00 canadian. So like $80.00 a month american. not bad for an 18 year old. I think my yearly is around $1230.00.

 

[Famine]

Me, I commute to school every day. My parents and brother go to the family business daily.

I have to go through between 1 and 3 transit companies per day to get to school (It depends on my schedule, how far I can get a ride, and whether or not I will be late). In a week, I spend $36.50 for transit based on my school schedule. That's $146/month and $1168 per 8 month school year. Of course, I usually have a few classes during the 4 summer months as well. That's pretty a pretty hefty sum for a student to be paying out of his pocket mate

Our business is a 20 minute drive away. To take the bus there, it takes a minimum of 3 buses. 2 of them have 1 to 2 hour intervals. To get to the office by bus, you would have to leave at least 2.5 hours early. To make it worse, the bus to leave the office doesn't even run after 5pm. Someone is always there till at least 6pm

There's something I'm missing here.

You are "forced" to live where your business is, but your parents still have to make a 20 minute drive to get to where your business is. That means it could be anywhere between 5 miles (which you could walk in 20 minutes) and 25 miles away (which you could cycle in an hour) - which isn't exactly living where your business is.

Further to that, $1168 per 8 month school year, if taken off your car insurance policy - where you admit that you are the least experienced and thus highest risk driver, so it should slash quite a large chunk of that $8000 off - would represent a saving. In fact, unless you're paying the portion of the car insurance deemed as "yours", your parents would (should?) pay your fares for you as you'd end up saving them money. Cycle there and you wouldn't have the cost of car insurance OR bus fares.


I'm sorry if I sound harsh or unfair, but the fact of the matter is you are validating the insurance company's charges by voluntarily paying them. You have alternatives available to you.

 

[TheCracker]

8 months of taxi fares would be cheaper.

 

[Ev0]

8 months of taxi fares would be cheaper.

Nope. Taxi drivers have had to raise their rates, since half of the money they earn has to go towards car insurance. At least in Toronto.

 

[emad]

Further to that, $1168 per 8 month school year, if taken off your car insurance policy - where you admit that you are the least experienced and thus highest risk driver, so it should slash quite a large chunk of that $8000 off - would represent a saving. In fact, unless you're paying the portion of the car insurance deemed as "yours", your parents would (should?) pay your fares for you as you'd end up saving them money. Cycle there and you wouldn't have the cost of car insurance OR bus fares.

The problem is that I have a drivers licence. When we apply for the policy, the insurance company specifically asks if there are any other licenced drivers in the household. If there are, they absolutely must be insured for at least one of the cars in the household. If they find out that you lie on that, they cancel your policy, they won't refund the money, and to make things worse, the policy cancellation instantly means that only one or 2 companies in the province will take you. If you go with those one or two companies, you will be paing an enormous amount more on the insurance.

As for your question on where our business is, It's about 20km away. My parents are both in their 40's but have bodies and the health of 60 year olds. This is simply because of a cultural thing. Most Pakistani baby boomers have absolutely horrible health because we rarely ever watch what we eat and exercise or any hard labour for that matter isn't looked highly upon for some weird as hell reason. They have not at all taken care of themselves until just a few years ago. There is no way they can bike 20km to get to work or even take a bus and wait for more than an hour at a time at the stops. Especially when it's -30 outside and you have a layer of ice and snow on the ground. To live any closer to the office, the cost of land and housing skyrockets and you only get about 5km closer. To get any closer would put you into strictly commercial and industrial areas of the city - where no housing of any sort lies.

As has been said by me, Ev0 and other people. The public transit system here is absolutely atrocious. There are very few cities that offer any convenience whatsoever for people without cars. It is simply not possible to go anywhere important without them.