Caterham 7 Fireblade over 600pp - why??

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alex1369

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alex1369
Like title says, why does this car have over 600pp but it does not even have 220hp when fully tuned? Is it maybe because it has only 370kg?
The Super GT cars have around 600pp - but they have 500hp and go over 300km/h....
Or is it a bug/glitch? I hope PD can fix this - to sort the cars properly by their performance..

But it so much fun to drive this car, specially at Spa when it gets really loose at exit of Eau Rouge :)
 
Hi,

200 bhp @ 370 kg = 540 bhp per tonne

based on your fig's

Most car's would die for those figures. prob one of the fastest car's on short circuits there is.

sublime handling, controlable, balance etc...


around the Top Grear Test track, only a couple of car's faster than a Caterham 7 Superlight 500..

That's why :-)
 
Cowboys965
But it accelerates so slow!
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True, however I did a supercar race with it, on a windy circuit.
I did beat the AI in Veyron in the end (but did come in the middle of the field).
 
It shows how miss matched some of the cars are in gt (remember the clio V6 in prologue!!) or getting the cobra 427 in a pp shuffle lounge shows how wrong the pp can be, the caterham under-perfoms terrible compared to one in real life
 
One of the more broken cars in GT. I urge anyone to find a Caterham like this one in the real world that came out of the factory only weighing 369kg. The vast majority of race prepped ones I've seen don't even weight as little.

Twin that with the fact the gearbox is bobbins and if you take it online or turn tyre wear on, you'll never get any heat into Sports tyres.

Otherwise an awesome car...

{Cy}
 
On Nür the Caterham is outclassed at pretty much every pp class, as are most of the superlight's on GT (G4 springs to mind). The lack of downforce (along with it's weight, I feel light cars float far too easy) makes the 7 slippery on fast bends and doesn't have the acceleration or top end to make up for it.

This car is rated up with some serious race cars and I truly don't think it should be, even being the amazing car that it is.
 
That's probably because the car has far less weight compared to those classified in the same category of machines determined by performance - A car can be as nimble as an ordinary car weighing about 1,000 kg, which is fully tuned without having its weight lightened at a snaky track... The PD kinda puts more emphasis on mobility of lateral movement of the car rather than the overall spec of straight velocity.
 
The Fireblade is extremely nimble. It's basically just a slightly heavier go-kart, which is why it has so much PP compared to other 200hp cars.
 
Because the PP system only takes into account limited factors, it's a mathematical formula and not based on real life performance. Some cars will slip through the cracks and some have like the Caterham, just means it isn't good at PP racing, but it is fun to drive against other Caterhams!!
 
The 7 in the game is based off of a real world car that was featured in a magazine. That real world car weighed 369kg.

But yes, the PP system is broken. As someone else pointed out on another fireblade thread the Caterham engine isn't "built" right, it reacts like a car engine instead of like a motorcycle engine. The Cat in the game doesn't accelerate like it should to match real life. I was hoping Spec 2 would help but no such luck.
 
CyKosis1973
One of the more broken cars in GT. I urge anyone to find a Caterham like this one in the real world that came out of the factory only weighing 369kg. The vast majority of race prepped ones I've seen don't even weight as little.

Twin that with the fact the gearbox is bobbins and if you take it online or turn tyre wear on, you'll never get any heat into Sports tyres.

Otherwise an awesome car...

{Cy}
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While a lot is wrong with the Caterham in GT5, the car itself is not (and never was from its inclusion in GT4) modelled on a factory production car. Its modelled on a Fireblade that Evo magazine ran as a long-term test car and modified during the period they had it, with one of the main aims being to reduce the weight as much as possible.

The sub 400 kilo weight is what they actually managed to get it down to.


http://www.evo.co.uk/news/evonews/55594/gt4_party_animals.html



Scaff
 
Ronald6
The 7 in the game is based off of a real world car that was featured in a magazine. That real world car weighed 369kg.

But yes, the PP system is broken. As someone else pointed out on another fireblade thread the Caterham engine isn't "built" right, it reacts like a car engine instead of like a motorcycle engine. The Cat in the game doesn't accelerate like it should to match real life. I was hoping Spec 2 would help but no such luck.
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I don't think the PP system is broken, it just has limitations. It does a pretty good job with several hundred cars in the middle of the spectrum. It doesn't do as good a job at the extreme ends, light or heavy, high hp or low hp, etc. It's a mathematical formula you can't expect it to make every car dead even there are just too many factors.
 
Johnnypenso
I don't think the PP system is broken, it just has limitations. It does a pretty good job with several hundred cars in the middle of the spectrum. It doesn't do as good a job at the extreme ends, light or heavy, high hp or low hp, etc. It's a mathematical formula you can't expect it to make every car dead even there are just too many factors.
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I agree. The Caterham is easily the hardest hit of all cars in this game with the PP systems calculations this side of a kart. Case in point, fully modded it gets to 626PP, and I can only beat AI S2k Turbos by 2 tenths of a second after 5 laps of Grand Valley, with the Caterham on a one level higher tyre grade...and the S2k Turbo has some 15PP less too. Might just well be the S2k's truly annoying AI support but even so in the real world the S2k would be destroyed in a more normal car at that PP and with higher grade tyres. Heck, it would be destroyed by normal cars at that PP with at least Sports Meds on I reckon...or even less.
 
C-ZETA
I agree. The Caterham is easily the hardest hit of all cars in this game with the PP systems calculations this side of a kart. Case in point, fully modded it gets to 626PP, and I can only beat AI S2k Turbos by 2 tenths of a second after 5 laps of Grand Valley, with the Caterham on a one level higher tyre grade...and the S2k Turbo has some 15PP less too. Might just well be the S2k's truly annoying AI support but even so in the real world the S2k would be destroyed in a more normal car at that PP and with higher grade tyres. Heck, it would be destroyed by normal cars at that PP with at least Sports Meds on I reckon...or even less.
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That would be a function of the track's layout. The PP can only ever serve as an imperfect guideline. Your 600PP Caterham may be good at slow and twisty courses like Tsukuba or Kart Space, but it'll still get blown out of the water by a 500PP Civic on Daytona Oval by sheer HP alone. In your case, the S2000 Turbo is already a very nimble car, which is what makes it a runaway in the Tsukuba 9-Hour, but on top of that, it has a half-decent engine behind it giving it respectable speed.

Your Caterham, in contrast, is probably more nimble than the S2000, but not so much so to negate the bonus it gets on the longer straights, especially the front straight and the whole run from turn 1 to the Hairpin. Really, the PP system needs to be split up into two different numbers: Speed and Handling (but that's trending away from the question at hand).
 
CyKosis1973
One of the more broken cars in GT. I urge anyone to find a Caterham like this one in the real world that came out of the factory only weighing 369kg. The vast majority of race prepped ones I've seen don't even weight as little.

Twin that with the fact the gearbox is bobbins and if you take it online or turn tyre wear on, you'll never get any heat into Sports tyres.

Otherwise an awesome car...

{Cy}
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Fix the gearing using a fully customisable transmission, then add ballast until it weights about 500 KG(about the weight of a real Caterham) and it's a great little car.
 
Johnnypenso
I don't think the PP system is broken, it just has limitations. It does a pretty good job with several hundred cars in the middle of the spectrum. It doesn't do as good a job at the extreme ends, light or heavy, high hp or low hp, etc. It's a mathematical formula you can't expect it to make every car dead even there are just too many factors.
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Exactly.

It's just another part of the "evolution" of racing games. If you compare PP to A-spec points from GT4, PD has come a long way. I remember doing a World Classic Car series race in GT4 where I maxed out a Ginetta G4 and the game said a win would be worth 1 A-spec point, despite the fact that it was not possible to keep up with the lead car (a Cobra which would easily gain 8 seconds per lap).

In that respect PP isn't a broken system, rather it's the a-spec system with very significant fixes.
 
Scaff
http://www.evo.co.uk/news/evonews/55594/gt4_party_animals.html

Scaff
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Didn't know that, thank you Sir. I can't help thinking they should have given us the car pre Evo magazine stripping and then allowed us to strip it down to that weight if we wanted to. 369kg is a frankly absurd weight for a car.

Mac K
Fix the gearing using a fully customisable transmission, then add ballast until it weights about 500 KG(about the weight of a real Caterham) and it's a great little car.
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Which is almost EXACTLY what I did :sly:👍

{Cy}
 
Cowboys965
But it accelerates so slow!
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It's a lot faster in real life. PD did a terrible representation of the Caterham in GT5. It's still a really great car to drive though, especially with the cockpit introduced in Spec II. Take it around the ring in the early morning with Normal Soft tires... :drool:
 
One last comment form me on the Weight, Standard Car weight, From performance Car Mag 880lbs = 399kg... so around 30 k to light, again as mentioned bit of lightening.

The bike engine weighs a lot less that a car engine that is in most sevens.

7 Super Sport 520kg , 121kg heavier than the blade version

Even if you go to S500 Weight between 506 and 516kg depending on gearbox options.

So upping the Kg to around 500 is far to much on a car weighing so little.

If you need to up the weight add if weight actually is 370kg, 30kg....

so PD Close to real life version, prob weight change due physics in game?
 

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