Clocks/Horology thread

  • Thread starter wfooshee
  • 26 comments
  • 3,129 views

wfooshee

Rather ride my FJR
Premium
5,014
United States
Panama City, FL
Is anyone else here as fascinated with clocks as I am? The concept of a machine that runs its gears at an exact rate is just fascinating to me, as are the mechanisms contrived to accomplish the task. Then you have clocks that count things besides seconds, minutes, and hours, like moon phases, months, days, and years, and even orreries, which while not exactly clocks, are mechanical geartrains to model planetary motions, so they do keep relative time of the subjects they portray.

It may be clear by now, but just in case, I'm talking about mechanical clocks, not electronic, or even quart-regulated mechanical clocks or watches. Gears, hands, and some mechanical regulation of the pace of the geartrain, powered by weights or springs. Nothing makes me roll my eyes faster than those battery-powered quartz "anniversary" clocks, styled to look like a real mechanical 400-day movement. Makes me wanna throw up!

For me it started with cuckoo clocks. I had three when i was in college. They no longer exist, apparently. I went into the boxes the other day where I thought they'd been packed, and nothing but tons of old pictures and negatives. Anyway, the clocks were both items i picked up at yard sales. they were complete but not running, or no cuckoo sound, or just inaccurate. I got them both running fairly well with some cleaning, although one was missing a pendulum, so I rigged up a kazoo hanging from a string! I could make it longer or shorter by wrapping the string differently, it was easy to adjust! Both clock also needed new bellows, a the whistles didn't work at all. I actually made them out of paper, folded according to a pattern I got by examining the remains of the originals, and then scoring the folds heavily so they flexed properly. I still had to weight the moving piece on the top of the bellows to make them fall properly and blow air through the whistles, but they worked!!!

When my mom passed back in 2004 I grabbed a couple of clocks from the house before any of my siblings had anything to say about it. OK, truthfully, it was discussed. Afterwards. Everybody agreed I could keep them. They eventually agreed. Possession and all that....

One of them was a genuine 400-day clock that mom had all but destroyed. Apparently she packed it for a move without securing the pendulum weights, so the spring suspension wire was broken. There's also no winding key. I have the clock and it's one of those "someday" projects.

26779437639_c0e5f91650_c.jpg


The broken suspension wire
38555346661_31422f3499_c.jpg


400-day clocks are sometimes called anniversary clocks, because they run an entire year on a single wind. Instead of a swinging pendulum, they have the weights hanging from a wire, and the weights spin back and forth, a torsional pendulum. As they spin, an arm attached to the wire rocks the escapement anchor, and the escapement wheel advances one tooth. That happens anywhere from every 6 to 10 seconds or so, which means the escapement wheel of these clocks advances at about 1/50th the rate of a regular mantle clock. Anniversary clocks are not really good timekeepers, as the suspension wire has no correction for temperature, and the spring may not deliver constant torque through the entire run-down. I'm told it's best to run them for a month or so between windings. When I get mine running, we'll see.

The other clock I got (or maybe, took,) is a marble mantle clock. My parents got it when I was in kindergarten, and it was ALWAYS one of my favorite things in the house. I loved to hear it count the hour and chime the half-hour, and I could sit and listen to the tick-tock-tick-tock for quite a while. It's escapement wheel is visible on the face of the clock, so it's fun to watch, too.

That clock has been running as long as I've had it, until disaster struck one afternoon. I was cleaning, and I lifted the clock to move it and dropped it about 4 inches back onto the mantle. I hate to think about it falling to the floor instead of just the three or four inches, as I'm sure it would have been completely destroyed. (As would my feet, probably...) As it was, the marble case snapped cleanly on both the front base and rear base, and several other pieces of the case came loose. That was four or five years ago, and I just got it into my head a couple of months ago to repair it.

The repair ended up being more involved than I'd anticipated. The first thing I did was remove the movement from the case so I could repair the case. The marble broke cleanly where it broke, just snapped, no grit, no dust, no tiny little pieces; just that piece and that one. To repair the case I just had to assemble the loose pieces, epoxy the broken ones, and clamp it for a day or so. Easy-peasey.

24682807748_5fdc4b54ca_o.jpg


This is the break in the center of the front of the base
24682807438_92ee84ed8d_c.jpg


The other break, near one end of the back of the base
24682807358_ddacd81b46_b.jpg


When I took the movement out, one of the springs popped to full relax, as far as it could while still in the movement, and I discovered that the pawl in the winding ratchet was broken. In the clock world, that's called a click; they don't know what a pawl is.... Anyway, I now had a mechanical repair needed as well as the case repair.

I circled the spring with a couple of large zip-ties, and used the winding key to turn the spring back down, tightening the zip-ties as I did so. Eventually I had the spring safely contained. I repeated the process for the other spring, because it had to be contained to disassemble the clock. More zip-ties. I removed the escapement anchor and let the clock run free until the spring tightened against the zip-ties, which relaxed it from the movement. Then it's just a matter of taking it apart. I'd already removed the escapement wheel from the front, and next I took out the anchor (the part that rocks back and forth on the escapement and makes the tick tock sound.) On the back, I removed the pendulum suspension, and then I was ready to take the back plate off of the movement.

With the movement open, I took out the mechanical arms of the striking system, then the chime geartrain, and then the time geartrain. In the clock world, that would be the striking chain and the going train, their terms for those geartrains. Now I was up against a certain kind of issue. The movement was completely unmarked. There were no maker marks, no model number, not even any "Made in" statement. I deduced that it was an american-made movement because the nuts that held the back plate on were 9/32". The front plate had no bushings, just holes in the brass, but the back plate did have bushings for the gear pins. So American, and cheap. No wonder they didn't put a name on it.... But that's going to make getting that part difficult.

Here's the movement after removing the back plate
38555122211_2a99bf618f_b.jpg


And here it is almost completely disassembled. I wasn't worried about that last gear on the front; it was pinned and I wasn't sure I could remove the pin without breaking it, and I didn't have a replacement handy. It wasn't that important to get every last piece out, I just needed that great wheel with the broken click, and I wanted to clean the remainder. We had the clock almost 55 years at this point, I have no idea how old it was when we got it, and the oil on the pins was a thick black sludge.
26779197279_4979decbe0_b.jpg


The broken part, and the other great wheel for comparison.
26779197069_26c31af5c1.jpg
37667330695_3232042910.jpg


I took the wheel with the broken click to a local clock shop, and they were unwilling to try to replace the click, which surprised me. They did try to find me a complete replacement wheel, and came pretty close, but I was unable to use it. I ended up ordering a couple of assortments of clicks from online clock shops, and got one that was close enough it just took a little filing for clearance to get it in.

The clicks are fastened to the gear wheel by a rivet, basically pin that is hammered down on the back side so it mushrooms out and retains the click safely. Getting the old one out means drilling it out, then hammering it through with a punch. Installing the new is just get the pin through the gear wheel and hammer the back of it down, keeping something thin between the gearwheel and the click so it doesn't get pinned hard and remains free to move. After that, just put it back together.

The new click installed!
37667325155_644d5d3aaf_o.jpg


I learned something about striking chains as i put it back together.... They're timed. Just like a camshaft in a car engine, the different gears have to be in the right position relative to each other. In my first test assembly, before I put the spring back in, i was running the gears by hand pressure, and I saw all the levers move, but the train never stopped. It struck the hours, then the half hour, then the next hour, then the half hour, and never stopped. Had the spring been in it would have run striking until it ran down. So I watch it for a while, and saw the movement in the levers that should have stopped it, and found the pins on the gears that were nowhere near in phase, and made the corrections. Eventually. Now that I know that this notch has to be there, and that pin has to be there, it became pretty straightforward to get it right.

The clock is now running and striking, and I'm watching it for accuracy. Tomorrow sometime I'll compare its time to actual and start adjusting the pendulum length. The clock actually has a mechanical adjustment from the front of the clock, a 90-degree gearset with a shaft through the face and one that raises or lowers a bracket on the pendulum suspension, changing its effective swing point. That 90-degree gearset has a broken tooth,m though, so I'm relegated to the old-fashioned way of turning the adjustment nut that the pendulum bob rests on. Right now it looks about 3 or 4 minutes a day slow. It's running in beat, though, which means the pendulum is not favoring one side or the other, the tick-tock sound is evenly timed left to right.



My next project: a wooden-gear clock. I've been doing things from wood for quite a while, inherited my dad's Shopsmith system and already had some of my own tools, but building a clock from wood just seems like the most satisfying thing you could do as far as woodworking: build a fairly complex machine! There are numerous sites to get plans or kits, and some of them incorporate very advanced features. Plans are available as paper plans for your own scrollsaw work, or dxf files if you have (or have access to) a CNC router or laser cutter. Some places are plans only, some are complete kits with laser-cut gears, and some offer several steps in between, such as cut gears, but you still have to cut and build the framing and dials. nearly all wooden-gear clock are weight-driven, as springs are too string for most of those applications. The ones that are spring-driven usually only run for a few hours, at most. It's interesting to see the designers of these clocks work with different types of mechanism. You can find ancient-style verge-and-folio, standard pendulum escapements, to grasshopper and gravity escapements. I've seen one that the escapement isn't even connected directly to the clock train, it's simply a counter that advanced a lever to release a mechanism that move the minute hand forward one minute, like one clock that drives another.
 
This is some really in-depth stuff! We have niche stuff like Trains and Anime already, so clocks are a welcome addition I suppose.
 
Nice right up and well done on getting the Mantle going again.
I recall my parents having an anniversary clock and I would stare at it in amazement as a youngster.

Not sure if @High-Test is still around but if I recall correctly from the Watch Discussion thread he worked on clocks for a while so may find this of interest.
 
I’m a huge fan of clocks & watches. I’ve never repaired anything myself and when I was younger I thought about trying to get a job fixing clocks and watches.

I’ve been following a guy on YouTube for some time called Clickspring. His videos are great and he’s currently building a copy of the antikythera mechanism.
 
I have the kit to build this clock. I ordered it with the gears and escapement pieces lasercut, maple-veneer plywood supplied for the other pieces, and the necessary hardware. I have a scrollsaw, but I don't think I'm up to cutting gears yet... Also, I think I'll do something for a weight other than the wooden shell in the kit's plans.



The clock is called Tranquility, and it's supposed to run super quietly because of its grasshopper escapement. The grasshopper produces no friction as the pallet arms grab and release the escapement teeth. In a normal escapement, the pallet slides off of the tooth as the escape wheel presses back against the pallet to impulse the pendulum. In the grasshopper, the pallet arms pivot, and as one grabs a tooth of the escape wheel, the other is released and swings out of the way. The one in the wheel is pushed by the wheel, impulsing the pendulum, and as the pendulum swings the free pallet grabs a tooth, which pulls the wheel away from the first pallet arm, releasing it. Soft touches, no TICK TOCK TICK TOCK and no friction, which theoretically keeps better time. The escapement is sensitive to proper adjustment, so it might not have been a good choice for a first kit. We'll see.
 
Last edited:
This thread has made me want to share the two clocks I inherited from my grandparents this year, I haven't been able to find any manufacturer on either of the clocks but, according to what my grandmother told me before she died in August, both were possessions of either my granddads dad or granddad, meaning that both are at least from 1900 or before, although I can't verify that 100%.

The first one is this "grandfather" clock I've been wanting ever since I was like 5 years old:
23916399_897018110455801_5607768882819536534_o.jpg

It might be a bit difficult to see on the first picture, but it's got some wear-and-tear issues that I'd love to get fixed once I get around to get it done :lol:...
24130298_897018113789134_8639414802598988368_o.jpg

However, it's all just exterior "damages" as the internals functions as if they were made yesterday - apart from a small issue where the bell would chime at ~15 minutes past the hour, a quick bit of moving the crown about 90° fixed that issue though. :dopey:
24130155_897018107122468_5292518880018840509_o.jpg



The second one is a small pocket watch, sadly it's missing a smaller hand, however that's easy enough to fix once I get ahold of a new, the main problem about this clock is that it doesn't wind. :(
23916454_897018167122462_8284008730930117486_o.jpg


The interior parts looks to be in working order, the hour and minute hand works fine at least, the winding issue seems to be down to hopefully just be the broken hairspring, being almost straight instead of
circular, but I'm unsure if there's any more hidden issues. I sadly haven't been able to find a replacement for the hairspring yet. :grumpy:
24068729_897018200455792_1084681247086491994_o.jpg


But until I find one it's going to sit in it's special wooden "case" my granddad got made for it:
24068465_897018190455793_3062376550614395302_o.jpg


I also inherited a pocket-stopwatch in a similar style to the pocket watch here, but it's sadly been used as a parts watch and it's missing at least 50% of the internals, so it's possibly never going to be running again, at least not without quite a bit of money and a willing watchmaker... :indiff:
 
I'm not one for watches myself. What I mean is, repair of watches. I love a good watch on my arm, although I've never had a decent pocketwatch. As for not being into the repair, I'm not as good as I was 30 or 40 years ago with handling the tiny bits.... :)

That hairspring has nothing to do with winding it, though, although it will certainly keep it from running! The mainspring that powers the watch is under that largest silver gear, and the click which retains it as it's wound is intact, there at the bottom. The winding is done with the crown turning that smaller silver wheel through a 90-degree gear, which in turn turns the larger wheel to wind the spring. If the winding doesn't turn at all, I would suspect it's because the spring is fully wound and can turn no further, and without being able to run the watch, it's basically stuck there. If the crown turns freely, then it's disengaged from the winding mechanism, probably something's broken.

The hairspring's purpose is to run the balance wheel, which is the "pendulum" of a watch. A pendulum reverses direction at the end of its swing because gravity pulls it down. The balance wheel reverses direction because the hairspring winds to a certain tension and pulls it back. As the balance wheel's pin swings through the escapement anchor, it gets a tiny little impulse from the mainspring, which is what keeps the watch running.

Nice wall clock. The wear and tear gives it character, in my mind. As for the tardy chime, the minute hand probably just needed to be removed and correctly installed. You'll find that the hour hand is a friction fit and can be moved around as needed to match the chime.
 
If the crown turns freely, then it's disengaged from the winding mechanism, probably something's broken.
It more or less winds freely in both directions, when turning it the "correct" way there’s a certain point where there’s a tiny bit of resistance but it’s almost nothing. I had hoped it was a simple repair but that shows how much I know about clocks. :lol:
As for the tardy chime, the minute hand probably just needed to be removed and correctly installed. You'll find that the hour hand is a friction fit and can be moved around as needed to match the chime.
100% correct and now it chimes exactly at the hour mark. I just need some more space so I can get it on the wall too, now that the chime is working. :D
 
OK, my anniversary clock is running. I found a place that said nearly all Kundo brand clocks use .032" suspension spring wire, so I ordered a 3-pack. I didn't need the blocks or fork as I have those. I bent the first spring wire I tried, making it useless, but succeeded in getting the blocks onto the second wire, only to find that I was nearly a centimeter short of being able to hang the pendulum! I had used the old wire as a guide, assuming that it broke right at the blocks, which was apparently not the case. So after some careful measuring and templating, I got the pendulum mounted and started the clock.

It runs fast. I mean really fast. In 33 minutes it has gained almost 20!!!! That means that my spring wire is too thick. Too thick makes the pendulum end its swing early, too thin makes it swing too far (and probably won't run for long.)

So I go back to that site where I found the .032" information, and I see that that's for a 12" clock, and mine is a 9" clock, I need a .023" wire. Hmmm. Anybody else see a ratio comparison with .032 to .023, and 33 minutes to 20? :lol:

Ten bucks down the tubes, learned some stuff about putting it together, so in a few days I'll have the right spring wire size and we'll be all good!



 
Last edited:
A week later, and my suspension wire arrived today. I've got it replaced in the clock and it's running, looks good so far. It's not so far off that's it's 50% fast like it was, so we'll see in the morning how much adjustment it needs.

While I had it down, I manually worked the escapement and counted 50 ticks for 5 minutes. 10 ticks a minute makes it easy to figure that each twist of the pendulum should go 6 seconds. I wasn't quite getting four seconds with the heavier wire on it!

I've also started my wooden clock kit. It arrived a couple of months ago, but I haven't had some supplies, like spray adhesive to place the patterns onto the wood, and I ordered a scroll saw, had to wait for that to arrive, and practice with it on some scrap.

You can order the clock as plans only, all the way up to all parts precut and all hardware included. I ordered the gears precut but materials for the rest of the parts. here's what arrived. This isn't plywood, it's some kind of composite material with quality maple veneer on both sides. The small piece is 1/8", the rest 1/4".
27066430989_3abe3371c6_b.jpg


The laser-cut gear sheet, walnut veneer.
27066430769_949e7d23f1_b.jpg


Pattern plans
27066430539_40037ef2d7_b.jpg


And the hardware bag and instruction book
27066430349_3f828bc3c8_b.jpg


So yesterday I gathered it all up (after running down to Office Depot to get two extra copies of the plan sheets - I don't have access to a machine with 11 x 17 paper) and laid out the patterns and started drilling and cutting.
27066429999_1d5bd523ba_b.jpg


Once the patterns were set on the wood, I set up the drill press and put holes in stuff. Then I separated the sections on the band saw, and started detail cutting on the scroll saw. I've only got these pieces, plus the lower half of the pendulum stick, cut so far. Here are the face of the pendulum bob, the clock's dial, and the front face of the frame. That front face is one of three almost identical pieces. They are identical in shape, but have holes in different places to accept the pillars that join the back frame to the front frame. This face piece doesn't have those holes and presents a smooth front to the clock. Anyway, when all three pieces are cut I will put dowels in the arbor holes to align them and sand the edges uniformly. I haven't peeled the paper yet so you see white instead of the wood.
37955894665_281287b24c_c.jpg


The maker's video of this clock is what I posted in #5 of the thread.
 
Last edited:
It's not a clock like you guys are talking about, but the other day I learned of these "hybrid" watches.

Like a smartwatch, it does extra things aside from telling time. But what has me fascinated is whether these watches still run on highly-calibrated gears, because these other functions that these watches have actually move the hands all over the place, but time-telling is not lost after it goes back to its original position. Here's an example:



1:22

Love to hear your thoughts on this.
 
Those are intriguing, but still personally, I'd want a watch with a screen that could tell me what it was trying to tell me, instead of having to remember which zone I assigned which event; the watch needs a decoder ring to come with it. :)

Update on my anniversary clock: the correct wire arrived earlier this week and got installed. The first night it lost half an hour, so I cranked a few turns into the pendulum adjustment, which is a threaded wheel that moves the ball weights outward to slow it down, or inward to speed it up. Next day was 20 minutes, so I really cranked in some turns, then it gained 5, so I'm getting it zeroed in. Today it lost a minute, so we might be getting into the zone in which it's not consistent enough to really adjust well. Still, giving it some more small twists on that dial, let it run a day, see what it does. When it stays inside a minute for a day, I'll call it good.
 
Progress on the Tranquility Clock build. I've got all the parts cut, although all the washer-type parts, from which pulleys and such will be made, are not finished, just separated from each other.

I used some dowel pieces to align the frame parts, of which there are three. The back frame, and two layers for the front frame. the rear piece of the front frame has the slots and holes for the braces and dowels that stand it off from the rear frame, and the front piece of the front frame is a solid face, to hide those slots and holes. Those front frame pieces will be laminated, so they have to be exactly the same shape! Also, the rear frame piece, which is what fastens to the wall to hang the clock, is also the exact same shape except for a wider center section which houses the hanging slots. After cutting the pieces slightly oversize on the scroll saw (coloring outside the lines, so to speak,) I aligned the frames pieces with dowels through the arbor holes and the holes that will carry standoffs when it's assembled and used a small triangular power sander to even up the curves. Once the two front pieces are actually laminated I will clean them up a bit more. Also, the dial face's interior circle has to match that of the frame pieces.

The weight box is built from nine pieces laminated. The front and rear are solid (except for a removable panel used to add lead shot once assembled) and the interior pieces are simply the boundary of the box. The two center pieces carry the hook the weight will hang from. After the glue sets I will run the box into a disc sander to smooth the sides and curves flush.

The weight box clamped and setting.
24200884267_fbdf0ac4fe_b.jpg


The frame parts after some sanding to even up the curves between the layers. I have some more work to do on the sanding, but it will wait until the pieces are actually glued. The dial face still has the paper pattern, as I haven't cut the openings for the walnut inlays that go on the face. Not really looking forward to that, although I know once it's done it will feel really good to have accomplished it!
24200883707_f1f71e0901_c.jpg


I've cut the slots for the crosspieces into the rear frame, and checked the fit.
25195077738_0e11e86044_b.jpg


Here are the rest of the maple-finish parts, some cut and shaped, most not ready yet.
25195076678_e291ed11dc_b.jpg
 
Another update:

Happy New Year, by the way!!! I turned off the TV, as I'm way to old to enjoy this 🤬 they call music nowadays.

The two pieces for the front frame are laminated and the edges sanded uniform. Pillars are being fitted here for gluing. The frame isn't going to be glued together; the long pillars around the face area are glued to the front, the stubs are glued to the back, and the two pieces ate the right (which will be the platform the pendulum fulcrum rests on) are glued one to the front and one to the back. Screws will pass through them to hold the frame together when assembled, allowing the clock to come apart if need be in the future.
24553182947_94b210c54a_b.jpg


Some initial gluing up of gear pieces and pulleys. The large gear will be the weight-driven component, will carry the minute hand, and those blades glued to it are the ratchet for the weight spool. The pulley at the right will carry the weight string, and the smaller gear here will carry the hour hand. the rest of that 12:1 reduction is not shown here.
38711377024_00b7b64268_b.jpg


One of the walnut inlays for the face. I've never done inlays before, and this was SCARY!!!!! One little hiccup with the scroll saw would mean finding another piece of wood and starting over! Like I predicted in my last post, it feels really good to have accomplished this!
38711376414_695fb1b859_b.jpg
 
Next update. I've got the wheels test fitted, but have not yet tried to mount and run the clock.

The great wheel. The weight drives this wheel, and it will carry the minute hand. The little gear will drive the gears to run the hour hand.
39662140042_711f0dc6fa_b.jpg


The winding ratchet
27914673249_0ea1b37891_b.jpg


The arbors are prepared. These are the shafts which will carry the escapement, pulleys, and gears.
27914671539_17db3ef8c8_b.jpg


The escapement frame is glued up. This will rock with the pendulum and carry the arms that engage the escape wheel. The little cylinders are adjustments for the pallet arms; the screws mounting the cylinders are off-center, so turning them changes the space allowed for the pallet arm to retract.
39662139342_092517d9a0_b.jpg


The middle wheel is assembled by using dowels to make a lantern gear which will be driven by the great wheel.
24824683397_212b8581f8_b.jpg


The escape wheel is assembled similarly, and its lantern gear will be driven by the middle wheel. The escape wheel will complete one turn in two minutes.
27914672369_c89c4235ce_b.jpg


Arbors are placed in the rear frame, then the middle and escape wheels are placed.
24824683257_f49d0aac42_b.jpg


Next the great wheel is fitted. One of those pulleys at the right will carry the cord for the weight, and the other will carry the cord for the winding pull. That little gear doesn't do anything, yet. It will drive the hour hand's gears later.
27914672069_40be2772d4_b.jpg


Then the escapement frame is placed and the pallet arms are installed.
24824682777_4f05e01eb4_b.jpg


Finally, the front frame is installed. Everything fits, and when I hold the pallet arms out of the way, the gears turn freely, no binding. I have not yet made any effort ro actually run the clock. i don't have the lead shot to fill the weight shell, and I haven't picked a place to put holes in the wall, yet.
27914671209_c6bf08f4c5_b.jpg
 
And another update. I haven't actually glued the arbor shafts into the back frame, yet, as I wanted some play until I was sure everything ran. I haven't mounted the hands, the dial, or any of the hour hand gearing, yet, either. I did mount the clock on the wall and worked on adjusting the pallet arms, and it looks like the clock is going to run! The lead shot I've ordered isn't here, yet, so I'm just pulling down on the weight shell.

By the way, lead shot is EXPENSIVE!!!! Best I've found for a small amount was 5 bucks a pound, and I need 3.5 to 4 pounds. I certainly don't need the bulk packages of 25 or 50 pounds!!!!

Simulated weight on a "Look, ma, no hands!" faceless clock....



I thought I would try to explain the idea behind the grasshopper escapement.

An ordinary escapement has an anchor that rocks with the pendulum. The anchor has either pins that stick out from it to reach the escape wheel teeth (like my mantle clock,) or it has teeth itself that reach out, like the anchor is a rocking gear (like my anniversary clock.) Those pins or teeth slide out of the escapement as the pendulums goes back the other way, and whatever drives the clock (spring or weight) actually impulses the pendulum at that time, which keeps the pendulum swinging. Otherwise the clock would stop very quickly.

That impulse that happens as the anchor slides out of the escape wheel generates friction, and friction is the enemy of running clocks and must be minimized. The grasshopper escapement has no friction. When a pallet arm is engaged on the escape wheel, the wheel pushes against it, which impulses the pendulum. The geometry is such that the other pallet arm catches a tooth as it passes, which stops or even momentarily reverses the escape wheel, releasing the first pallet arm as the pendulum carries the escapement frame just a bit farther. The pendulum reverses, the first pallet arm catches a tooth, the stopping the wheel and releasing the second pallet arm. There is no sliding of the arm against the escape wheel's teeth. No friction!
 
Last edited:
Is anyone else here as fascinated with clocks as I am? The concept of a machine that runs its gears at an exact rate is just fascinating to me, as are the mechanisms contrived to accomplish the task. Then you have clocks that count things besides seconds, minutes, and hours, like moon phases, months, days, and years, and even orreries, which while not exactly clocks, are mechanical geartrains to model planetary motions, so they do keep relative time of the subjects they portray.

It may be clear by now, but just in case, I'm talking about mechanical clocks, not electronic, or even quart-regulated mechanical clocks or watches. Gears, hands, and some mechanical regulation of the pace of the geartrain, powered by weights or springs. Nothing makes me roll my eyes faster than those battery-powered quartz "anniversary" clocks, styled to look like a real mechanical 400-day movement. Makes me wanna throw up!

For me it started with cuckoo clocks. I had three when i was in college. They no longer exist, apparently. I went into the boxes the other day where I thought they'd been packed, and nothing but tons of old pictures and negatives. Anyway, the clocks were both items i picked up at yard sales. they were complete but not running, or no cuckoo sound, or just inaccurate. I got them both running fairly well with some cleaning, although one was missing a pendulum, so I rigged up a kazoo hanging from a string! I could make it longer or shorter by wrapping the string differently, it was easy to adjust! Both clock also needed new bellows, a the whistles didn't work at all. I actually made them out of paper, folded according to a pattern I got by examining the remains of the originals, and then scoring the folds heavily so they flexed properly. I still had to weight the moving piece on the top of the bellows to make them fall properly and blow air through the whistles, but they worked!!!

When my mom passed back in 2004 I grabbed a couple of clocks from the house before any of my siblings had anything to say about it. OK, truthfully, it was discussed. Afterwards. Everybody agreed I could keep them. They eventually agreed. Possession and all that....

One of them was a genuine 400-day clock that mom had all but destroyed. Apparently she packed it for a move without securing the pendulum weights, so the spring suspension wire was broken. There's also no winding key. I have the clock and it's one of those "someday" projects.

26779437639_c0e5f91650_c.jpg


The broken suspension wire
38555346661_31422f3499_c.jpg


400-day clocks are sometimes called anniversary clocks, because they run an entire year on a single wind. Instead of a swinging pendulum, they have the weights hanging from a wire, and the weights spin back and forth, a torsional pendulum. As they spin, an arm attached to the wire rocks the escapement anchor, and the escapement wheel advances one tooth. That happens anywhere from every 6 to 10 seconds or so, which means the escapement wheel of these clocks advances at about 1/50th the rate of a regular mantle clock. Anniversary clocks are not really good timekeepers, as the suspension wire has no correction for temperature, and the spring may not deliver constant torque through the entire run-down. I'm told it's best to run them for a month or so between windings. When I get mine running, we'll see.

The other clock I got (or maybe, took,) is a marble mantle clock. My parents got it when I was in kindergarten, and it was ALWAYS one of my favorite things in the house. I loved to hear it count the hour and chime the half-hour, and I could sit and listen to the tick-tock-tick-tock for quite a while. It's escapement wheel is visible on the face of the clock, so it's fun to watch, too.

That clock has been running as long as I've had it, until disaster struck one afternoon. I was cleaning, and I lifted the clock to move it and dropped it about 4 inches back onto the mantle. I hate to think about it falling to the floor instead of just the three or four inches, as I'm sure it would have been completely destroyed. (As would my feet, probably...) As it was, the marble case snapped cleanly on both the front base and rear base, and several other pieces of the case came loose. That was four or five years ago, and I just got it into my head a couple of months ago to repair it.

The repair ended up being more involved than I'd anticipated. The first thing I did was remove the movement from the case so I could repair the case. The marble broke cleanly where it broke, just snapped, no grit, no dust, no tiny little pieces; just that piece and that one. To repair the case I just had to assemble the loose pieces, epoxy the broken ones, and clamp it for a day or so. Easy-peasey.

24682807748_5fdc4b54ca_o.jpg


This is the break in the center of the front of the base
24682807438_92ee84ed8d_c.jpg


The other break, near one end of the back of the base
24682807358_ddacd81b46_b.jpg


When I took the movement out, one of the springs popped to full relax, as far as it could while still in the movement, and I discovered that the pawl in the winding ratchet was broken. In the clock world, that's called a click; they don't know what a pawl is.... Anyway, I now had a mechanical repair needed as well as the case repair.

I circled the spring with a couple of large zip-ties, and used the winding key to turn the spring back down, tightening the zip-ties as I did so. Eventually I had the spring safely contained. I repeated the process for the other spring, because it had to be contained to disassemble the clock. More zip-ties. I removed the escapement anchor and let the clock run free until the spring tightened against the zip-ties, which relaxed it from the movement. Then it's just a matter of taking it apart. I'd already removed the escapement wheel from the front, and next I took out the anchor (the part that rocks back and forth on the escapement and makes the tick tock sound.) On the back, I removed the pendulum suspension, and then I was ready to take the back plate off of the movement.

With the movement open, I took out the mechanical arms of the striking system, then the chime geartrain, and then the time geartrain. In the clock world, that would be the striking chain and the going train, their terms for those geartrains. Now I was up against a certain kind of issue. The movement was completely unmarked. There were no maker marks, no model number, not even any "Made in" statement. I deduced that it was an american-made movement because the nuts that held the back plate on were 9/32". The front plate had no bushings, just holes in the brass, but the back plate did have bushings for the gear pins. So American, and cheap. No wonder they didn't put a name on it.... But that's going to make getting that part difficult.

Here's the movement after removing the back plate
38555122211_2a99bf618f_b.jpg


And here it is almost completely disassembled. I wasn't worried about that last gear on the front; it was pinned and I wasn't sure I could remove the pin without breaking it, and I didn't have a replacement handy. It wasn't that important to get every last piece out, I just needed that great wheel with the broken click, and I wanted to clean the remainder. We had the clock almost 55 years at this point, I have no idea how old it was when we got it, and the oil on the pins was a thick black sludge.
26779197279_4979decbe0_b.jpg


The broken part, and the other great wheel for comparison.
26779197069_26c31af5c1.jpg
37667330695_3232042910.jpg


I took the wheel with the broken click to a local clock shop, and they were unwilling to try to replace the click, which surprised me. They did try to find me a complete replacement wheel, and came pretty close, but I was unable to use it. I ended up ordering a couple of assortments of clicks from online clock shops, and got one that was close enough it just took a little filing for clearance to get it in.

The clicks are fastened to the gear wheel by a rivet, basically pin that is hammered down on the back side so it mushrooms out and retains the click safely. Getting the old one out means drilling it out, then hammering it through with a punch. Installing the new is just get the pin through the gear wheel and hammer the back of it down, keeping something thin between the gearwheel and the click so it doesn't get pinned hard and remains free to move. After that, just put it back together.

The new click installed!
37667325155_644d5d3aaf_o.jpg


I learned something about striking chains as i put it back together.... They're timed. Just like a camshaft in a car engine, the different gears have to be in the right position relative to each other. In my first test assembly, before I put the spring back in, i was running the gears by hand pressure, and I saw all the levers move, but the train never stopped. It struck the hours, then the half hour, then the next hour, then the half hour, and never stopped. Had the spring been in it would have run striking until it ran down. So I watch it for a while, and saw the movement in the levers that should have stopped it, and found the pins on the gears that were nowhere near in phase, and made the corrections. Eventually. Now that I know that this notch has to be there, and that pin has to be there, it became pretty straightforward to get it right.

The clock is now running and striking, and I'm watching it for accuracy. Tomorrow sometime I'll compare its time to actual and start adjusting the pendulum length. The clock actually has a mechanical adjustment from the front of the clock, a 90-degree gearset with a shaft through the face and one that raises or lowers a bracket on the pendulum suspension, changing its effective swing point. That 90-degree gearset has a broken tooth,m though, so I'm relegated to the old-fashioned way of turning the adjustment nut that the pendulum bob rests on. Right now it looks about 3 or 4 minutes a day slow. It's running in beat, though, which means the pendulum is not favoring one side or the other, the tick-tock sound is evenly timed left to right.



My next project: a wooden-gear clock. I've been doing things from wood for quite a while, inherited my dad's Shopsmith system and already had some of my own tools, but building a clock from wood just seems like the most satisfying thing you could do as far as woodworking: build a fairly complex machine! There are numerous sites to get plans or kits, and some of them incorporate very advanced features. Plans are available as paper plans for your own scrollsaw work, or dxf files if you have (or have access to) a CNC router or laser cutter. Some places are plans only, some are complete kits with laser-cut gears, and some offer several steps in between, such as cut gears, but you still have to cut and build the framing and dials. nearly all wooden-gear clock are weight-driven, as springs are too string for most of those applications. The ones that are spring-driven usually only run for a few hours, at most. It's interesting to see the designers of these clocks work with different types of mechanism. You can find ancient-style verge-and-folio, standard pendulum escapements, to grasshopper and gravity escapements. I've seen one that the escapement isn't even connected directly to the clock train, it's simply a counter that advanced a lever to release a mechanism that move the minute hand forward one minute, like one clock that drives another.

Hi I'm just found this website I have been collecting pocket and mantle clocks I can put batteries in the new ones. But my eyesight getting bad so I want too find me a cokoo clock too play with. You have any idea where I can find one. I'm on oxygen so I can walk alot.
 
Is anyone else here as fascinated with clocks as I am? The concept of a machine that runs its gears at an exact rate is just fascinating to me, as are the mechanisms contrived to accomplish the task. Then you have clocks that count things besides seconds, minutes, and hours, like moon phases, months, days, and years, and even orreries, which while not exactly clocks, are mechanical geartrains to model planetary motions, so they do keep relative time of the subjects they portray.

It may be clear by now, but just in case, I'm talking about mechanical clocks, not electronic, or even quart-regulated mechanical clocks or watches. Gears, hands, and some mechanical regulation of the pace of the geartrain, powered by weights or springs. Nothing makes me roll my eyes faster than those battery-powered quartz "anniversary" clocks, styled to look like a real mechanical 400-day movement. Makes me wanna throw up!

For me it started with cuckoo clocks. I had three when i was in college. They no longer exist, apparently. I went into the boxes the other day where I thought they'd been packed, and nothing but tons of old pictures and negatives. Anyway, the clocks were both items i picked up at yard sales. they were complete but not running, or no cuckoo sound, or just inaccurate. I got them both running fairly well with some cleaning, although one was missing a pendulum, so I rigged up a kazoo hanging from a string! I could make it longer or shorter by wrapping the string differently, it was easy to adjust! Both clock also needed new bellows, a the whistles didn't work at all. I actually made them out of paper, folded according to a pattern I got by examining the remains of the originals, and then scoring the folds heavily so they flexed properly. I still had to weight the moving piece on the top of the bellows to make them fall properly and blow air through the whistles, but they worked!!!

When my mom passed back in 2004 I grabbed a couple of clocks from the house before any of my siblings had anything to say about it. OK, truthfully, it was discussed. Afterwards. Everybody agreed I could keep them. They eventually agreed. Possession and all that....

One of them was a genuine 400-day clock that mom had all but destroyed. Apparently she packed it for a move without securing the pendulum weights, so the spring suspension wire was broken. There's also no winding key. I have the clock and it's one of those "someday" projects.

26779437639_c0e5f91650_c.jpg


The broken suspension wire
38555346661_31422f3499_c.jpg


400-day clocks are sometimes called anniversary clocks, because they run an entire year on a single wind. Instead of a swinging pendulum, they have the weights hanging from a wire, and the weights spin back and forth, a torsional pendulum. As they spin, an arm attached to the wire rocks the escapement anchor, and the escapement wheel advances one tooth. That happens anywhere from every 6 to 10 seconds or so, which means the escapement wheel of these clocks advances at about 1/50th the rate of a regular mantle clock. Anniversary clocks are not really good timekeepers, as the suspension wire has no correction for temperature, and the spring may not deliver constant torque through the entire run-down. I'm told it's best to run them for a month or so between windings. When I get mine running, we'll see.

The other clock I got (or maybe, took,) is a marble mantle clock. My parents got it when I was in kindergarten, and it was ALWAYS one of my favorite things in the house. I loved to hear it count the hour and chime the half-hour, and I could sit and listen to the tick-tock-tick-tock for quite a while. It's escapement wheel is visible on the face of the clock, so it's fun to watch, too.

That clock has been running as long as I've had it, until disaster struck one afternoon. I was cleaning, and I lifted the clock to move it and dropped it about 4 inches back onto the mantle. I hate to think about it falling to the floor instead of just the three or four inches, as I'm sure it would have been completely destroyed. (As would my feet, probably...) As it was, the marble case snapped cleanly on both the front base and rear base, and several other pieces of the case came loose. That was four or five years ago, and I just got it into my head a couple of months ago to repair it.

The repair ended up being more involved than I'd anticipated. The first thing I did was remove the movement from the case so I could repair the case. The marble broke cleanly where it broke, just snapped, no grit, no dust, no tiny little pieces; just that piece and that one. To repair the case I just had to assemble the loose pieces, epoxy the broken ones, and clamp it for a day or so. Easy-peasey.

24682807748_5fdc4b54ca_o.jpg


This is the break in the center of the front of the base
24682807438_92ee84ed8d_c.jpg


The other break, near one end of the back of the base
24682807358_ddacd81b46_b.jpg


When I took the movement out, one of the springs popped to full relax, as far as it could while still in the movement, and I discovered that the pawl in the winding ratchet was broken. In the clock world, that's called a click; they don't know what a pawl is.... Anyway, I now had a mechanical repair needed as well as the case repair.

I circled the spring with a couple of large zip-ties, and used the winding key to turn the spring back down, tightening the zip-ties as I did so. Eventually I had the spring safely contained. I repeated the process for the other spring, because it had to be contained to disassemble the clock. More zip-ties. I removed the escapement anchor and let the clock run free until the spring tightened against the zip-ties, which relaxed it from the movement. Then it's just a matter of taking it apart. I'd already removed the escapement wheel from the front, and next I took out the anchor (the part that rocks back and forth on the escapement and makes the tick tock sound.) On the back, I removed the pendulum suspension, and then I was ready to take the back plate off of the movement.

With the movement open, I took out the mechanical arms of the striking system, then the chime geartrain, and then the time geartrain. In the clock world, that would be the striking chain and the going train, their terms for those geartrains. Now I was up against a certain kind of issue. The movement was completely unmarked. There were no maker marks, no model number, not even any "Made in" statement. I deduced that it was an american-made movement because the nuts that held the back plate on were 9/32". The front plate had no bushings, just holes in the brass, but the back plate did have bushings for the gear pins. So American, and cheap. No wonder they didn't put a name on it.... But that's going to make getting that part difficult.

Here's the movement after removing the back plate
38555122211_2a99bf618f_b.jpg


And here it is almost completely disassembled. I wasn't worried about that last gear on the front; it was pinned and I wasn't sure I could remove the pin without breaking it, and I didn't have a replacement handy. It wasn't that important to get every last piece out, I just needed that great wheel with the broken click, and I wanted to clean the remainder. We had the clock almost 55 years at this point, I have no idea how old it was when we got it, and the oil on the pins was a thick black sludge.
26779197279_4979decbe0_b.jpg


The broken part, and the other great wheel for comparison.
26779197069_26c31af5c1.jpg
37667330695_3232042910.jpg


I took the wheel with the broken click to a local clock shop, and they were unwilling to try to replace the click, which surprised me. They did try to find me a complete replacement wheel, and came pretty close, but I was unable to use it. I ended up ordering a couple of assortments of clicks from online clock shops, and got one that was close enough it just took a little filing for clearance to get it in.

The clicks are fastened to the gear wheel by a rivet, basically pin that is hammered down on the back side so it mushrooms out and retains the click safely. Getting the old one out means drilling it out, then hammering it through with a punch. Installing the new is just get the pin through the gear wheel and hammer the back of it down, keeping something thin between the gearwheel and the click so it doesn't get pinned hard and remains free to move. After that, just put it back together.

The new click installed!
37667325155_644d5d3aaf_o.jpg


I learned something about striking chains as i put it back together.... They're timed. Just like a camshaft in a car engine, the different gears have to be in the right position relative to each other. In my first test assembly, before I put the spring back in, i was running the gears by hand pressure, and I saw all the levers move, but the train never stopped. It struck the hours, then the half hour, then the next hour, then the half hour, and never stopped. Had the spring been in it would have run striking until it ran down. So I watch it for a while, and saw the movement in the levers that should have stopped it, and found the pins on the gears that were nowhere near in phase, and made the corrections. Eventually. Now that I know that this notch has to be there, and that pin has to be there, it became pretty straightforward to get it right.

The clock is now running and striking, and I'm watching it for accuracy. Tomorrow sometime I'll compare its time to actual and start adjusting the pendulum length. The clock actually has a mechanical adjustment from the front of the clock, a 90-degree gearset with a shaft through the face and one that raises or lowers a bracket on the pendulum suspension, changing its effective swing point. That 90-degree gearset has a broken tooth,m though, so I'm relegated to the old-fashioned way of turning the adjustment nut that the pendulum bob rests on. Right now it looks about 3 or 4 minutes a day slow. It's running in beat, though, which means the pendulum is not favoring one side or the other, the tick-tock sound is evenly timed left to right.



My next project: a wooden-gear clock. I've been doing things from wood for quite a while, inherited my dad's Shopsmith system and already had some of my own tools, but building a clock from wood just seems like the most satisfying thing you could do as far as woodworking: build a fairly complex machine! There are numerous sites to get plans or kits, and some of them incorporate very advanced features. Plans are available as paper plans for your own scrollsaw work, or dxf files if you have (or have access to) a CNC router or laser cutter. Some places are plans only, some are complete kits with laser-cut gears, and some offer several steps in between, such as cut gears, but you still have to cut and build the framing and dials. nearly all wooden-gear clock are weight-driven, as springs are too string for most of those applications. The ones that are spring-driven usually only run for a few hours, at most. It's interesting to see the designers of these clocks work with different types of mechanism. You can find ancient-style verge-and-folio, standard pendulum escapements, to grasshopper and gravity escapements. I've seen one that the escapement isn't even connected directly to the clock train, it's simply a counter that advanced a lever to release a mechanism that move the minute hand forward one minute, like one clock that drives another.
 
I just found this website I have been collecting pocket and mantle clock. I can put batteries in the new ones and bands. I can't see well enough to do my pocket and Timex. So I want to get and cokoo clock and play with it tell I get it right or mantle clock that play music I'm on oxygen so I can walk much.you have any idea where I can get on cheep.on a fixed income. I will love any idea you may have
 
Back