Contact or no contact? Nations Cup Showdown

  • Thread starter Thread starter Winnie847
  • 16 comments
  • 1,115 views

Poll: Contact or no contact?

  • Contact

    Votes: 5 33.3%

  • No contact

    Votes: 2 13.3%

  • Maybe it was lag

    Votes: 8 53.3%
  • Total voters
    15
Winnie847

Winnie847

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Winnie847
Help me settle this argument.

It seems pretty clear to me there was contact here. But some of the people in the live stream argued against this to the point of condescension. Perhaps they aren’t aware that in GTS you can’t always actually see the two cars touching, and that the only way to know for sure is by analyzing inputs and speed changes? You can see Kokubun’s car slow down by about 35km/h instantly, before he applies brake pressure, and at the same time, Gallo’s car lunges forward into the braking zone. I’m not trying to assign blame or call anyone out as being dirty. I’m simply stating that it appears that contact was made. Agree, or disagree? Or was it lag and maybe the contact only appears when viewing from Kokubun’s angle?

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Link has been fixed. Should cut straight to the important part.
 
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Hard to say without seeing Gallo's telemetry but he looks to have been distracted going into the braking area. He clearly looks off to his right and to me it looks like he misses his braking marker. In other footage he lifts around the 150 board and straight on the brakes on Soft tyres but in this instance he doesn't brake until nearly the 100 board on Mediums. Could there also have been a touch, maybe, but Kokubun was well off the throttle before the 150 board.

Inconclusive IMO, but only because the speed drop off of the trailing car does look a tad suspect.

Gallo looking off to his right.
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Kokubun off the throttle before the 150
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Gallo still not showing brake lights at near the 100
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Brake lights finally come on at 100
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I tend to come off throttle a bit early too when someone swerves right in front of me headed into the braking zone.

I don’t doubt that Gallo did miss his braking point. But I also don’t doubt that there was contact made based on the dramatic decrease in speed of Kokubun’s car. His lift and subsequent braking also correlate to immediately after it appears contact was made, which makes sense.
 
I voted lag, because even if the contact seems evident as you proved it, the major issue here is lag as Kokobun would have never touched Gallo's car in a LAN event, even with this VERY late (but still legit) move from the Italian

Anyway amazing racing throughout the weekend, I don't know how they manage to race so close to each other on track being thousands of km apart. The miracle of technology!

Edit: oh btw congrats to @OutlawQuadrnt for qualifying for this. The track selection was just bad for Nissan I think (and maybe the level of the competition was a bit too high even for a guy like you^^)
 
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FPV MIC
Kokubun off the throttle before the 150View attachment 1075883
Click to expand...
TBF I'm not sure how much you can trust that overlay to be 100% accurate. It is not part of the standard hub and even the standard hub lies in replays.

When I first saw it I thought contact. The way Gallo's car moves after is reminiscent of contact. When the investigation message popped up I expected a penalty to Kokubun and was shocked to see a warning to Gallo.
They didn't really cover the incident well afterwards and never got Gallo's thoughts. I did however slow down the footage from Kokubun to 0.25. Gallo moves quite late and almost at the same time as Kokubun right. At this point it looks like contact. It will either be netcode or the fact that they both moved and Kokubun was committed to outbraking on his better tyres. Due to the late move I can see why they gave Gallo the warning. But there was also definitely contact and it would have been a very late move from Kokubun without Gallo moving.
 
Lots of lag, so really hard to tell what's really going on, check the response lag on Kokubun's steering telemetry compared to the face shot. I've no doubt that if you viewed a replay from each of the driver's consoles', one of them would clearly show contact. No way to tell which one from that stream.
As for Gallo's glance to the right, my guess he's just noticed in his radar/rear view that Kokubun is moving over and he lunges right to block.
 
OJBrit
TBF I'm not sure how much you can trust that overlay to be 100% accurate. It is not part of the standard hub and even the standard hub lies in replays.
Click to expand...
That's why I said inconclusive and that it's hard to say without seeing Gallo's telemetry (to see if he gains speed). If you think you can't trust the hub because it's inaccurate, then you also can't trust the speed drop off either. ;)

I've been in enough races online, and been involved in enough incidents in the past to know that two people can tell two totally different stories about one incident... but both can be telling the absolute truth.

They really need to be all in the same place for these events.
 
I'm sure many of us have seen this same scenario. USA "5 mile per hour bumpers" + lag. That's what it looks like from the first video. Heart in the mouth stuff when that happens.
 
Definitely contact with lag. It was fortunate that Kokubun wasn't penalised for that, as he did absolutely nothing wrong there.

Just a note on something that happened the lap afterwards...

There is an exploit where you can dip two wheels onto the grass while serving a penalty, to minimise your time lost by forced braking. This should really be penalised at live events - it happened at least once in the Spa Nations race and also in the previous event for Manufacturers (at Nurburgring GP).

It would be more difficult to implement a bug fix in-game but should not be too difficult at live events with stewards to review it.
 
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I suppose that I shouldn’t have made it seem like lag and contact would be mutually exclusive. Was there lag? Probably so. Was there contact? Definitely so. Whether or not both parties experienced the contact doesn’t matter because at least one of them did. Kokubun’s car slowed down instantly to no fault of his own, because Gallo put his car exactly where Kokubun was trying to put his at the same time. If one of the two parties involved experienced contact, then that should be more than enough to say contact was made, with or without lag.
 

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