Eco-campaigner calls for "freeze on biofuels"

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Source: 4car

Biofuels are the current favoured option in the battle to reduce carbon dioxide emissions and slow down global warming, but environmental specialists and campaigners are warning that whilst biofuels - produced from sustainable-source crops which absorb carbon as they grow - are not necessarily an ethically-sound alternative to fossil fuels.

Award-winning writer and university professor George Monbiot has long warned of the implications of biofuel production, and in response to Chancellor Gordon Brown's biofuel-friendly Budget last week (tax rebates till 2010, when fuel suppliers are expected to provide at least 5% of their fuels as biofuels) has published a new article in which he describes policy on the issue as "plain fraud" which "causes more harm than good" and is "a formula for environmental and humanitarian disaster". It's a sobering thought for those believing that ethanol and biodiesel could be guilt-free fuels.

Monbiot cites problems in Mexico, where the price of maize has doubled, wheat prices are at a ten-year high and the poor are rioting - because, according to the United Nations' food and agriculture department, farmers are selling their crops for ethanol rather than for food.

Besides the use of current agricultural land for crops for fuel, instead of food crops, Monbiot quotes evidence that "virgin habitat", such as the rainforests of Indonesia, is being ploughed up at an alarming rate. The growth of palms for oil - for biodiesel for the European market "is now the main cause of deforestation there and it is likely soon to become responsible for the extinction of the orang-utan in the wild."

"There are similar impacts all over the world", he writes. "Sugarcane producers are moving into rare scrubland habitats in Brazil, and soya farmers are ripping up the Amazon rainforests& Indigenous people in South America, Asia and Africa are starting to complain about incursions onto their land by fuel planters." And if this all seems worthwhile to reduce carbon dioxide emissions, then think again: as the land and forests are cleared, "both the trees and the peat they sit on" are burnt. Research suggests that every tonne of palm oil created results in 33 tonnes of carbon dioxide emissions - 10 times as much as conventional petroleum.

More detail on Monbiot's argument, and his sources, can be found at guardian.co.uk or monbiot.com, but his point is clear. "The reason governments are so enthusiastic about biofuels is that they don't upset drivers. They appear to reduce the amount of carbon from our cars, without requiring new taxes. It's an illusion sustained by the fact that only the emissions produced at home count towards our national total. The forest clearance in Malaysia doesn't increase our official impact by a gram."
 
Why isn't everybody concentrating on solar power?
 
Why isn't everybody concentrating on solar power?
Because you will not always get Sun shine you know, because there is something called Clouds, which blocks out plenty of the sun at times.
 
Maybe the materials used for ethanol should be regulated, as in so an so% for food, another% for ethanol production, etc.
 
Because you will not always get Sun shine you know, because there is something called Clouds, which blocks out plenty of the sun at times.

They're called "batteries". This is how solar-equipped homes can operate with electricity at night.

So the problem is in Mexico? Because I've been under the impression that the farms used for ethanol production were separate from those used for food. That producing ethanol has zero impact on the amount of food grown. At least in the States. If Mexico is doing differently, that's their hook, not ours.

Frankly, it doesn't make much difference to me. I'll switch only if there's no increase in my out-of-pocket cost for the fuel, and only if there's no negative impact on my car's performance.
 
If I'm not mistaken, wasn't most of the E85 produced in the US being made from American-grown corn from states like Iowa, Michigan, Nebraska, Wisconsin, and Illinois?

...Call me crazy, but wouldn't the world's #1 producer of corn want to use their own products?
 
Why isn't everybody concentrating on solar power?

Because the efficiency vs. cost is very low. We need better materials to get more out of the sun than we currently have for it to be a viable alternative.
On ethanol, I'll say what I said on FARK yesterday:

Ethanol isn't greener than gas, and only uses up corn that can be better used feeding people.

Let's see:
The distillation process is filthy.
It takes fuel to go out and plant and harvest the crops with machinery.
Once the corn is harvested, it takes time to grow, and it cannot be grown all year in the Midwest, where most of our corn is grown. This means ethanol production would tank in winter months, and that is when energy need are greatest.

I say we clean up coal power (we have the technology, it just needs time to be cheaper), and increase use of nuclear power. For cars, we could just focus more on diesel/biodiesel and upping gas mileage. If Opel can make a diesel car that does 150mph @ 100 miles to the gallon, why can't we get more than 20-30 mpg in most cars?

EDIT: Also, the acreage of corn/gallon of ethanol is such that the US simply doesn't have the room to grow enough to both feed us and fuel all our cars.
Biofuels have promise. Algae can produce massive levels of oil for their size, they grow anywhere wet, grow quickly, and don't take up much room.
 
Why isn't everybody concentrating on solar power?

Because you can't create a monopoly with it. Anyone can just bolt some solar panels to their roof and generate at least some of their own energy. Not anyone can drill for, let alone sell oil.

In my opinion, solar energy is the absolute correct answer, but not directly. I firmly believe in hydrogen-powered vehicles and other engines/motors (but not using that ick that GM came up with; I mean hyrdogen combustion), with that hydrogen coming from plants using solar powered-electricity to split the water. Free sunlight, water in, water out. Panel efficiency aside, I challenge anyone to find a problem with that system -- ethical, ecological, environmental, or otherwise.

Financial and infrastructure problems don't really count, since those are obstacles every other alternative has.
 
Because the efficiency vs. cost is very low. We need better materials to get more out of the sun than we currently have for it to be a viable alternative.
On ethanol, I'll say what I said on FARK yesterday:

Ethanol isn't greener than gas, and only uses up corn that can be better used feeding people.

Let's see:
The distillation process is filthy.
It takes fuel to go out and plant and harvest the crops with machinery.
Once the corn is harvested, it takes time to grow, and it cannot be grown all year in the Midwest, where most of our corn is grown. This means ethanol production would tank in winter months, and that is when energy need are greatest.

I say we clean up coal power (we have the technology, it just needs time to be cheaper), and increase use of nuclear power. For cars, we could just focus more on diesel/biodiesel and upping gas mileage. If Opel can make a diesel car that does 150mph @ 100 miles to the gallon, why can't we get more than 20-30 mpg in most cars?

EDIT: Also, the acreage of corn/gallon of ethanol is such that the US simply doesn't have the room to grow enough to both feed us and fuel all our cars.
Biofuels have promise. Algae can produce massive levels of oil for their size, they grow anywhere wet, grow quickly, and don't take up much room.

Pretty much sums it up. I'd be more then willing to drive around a diesel car or truck. I would like to get one as my next vehicle, but my options are the Rabbit, the Jetta, or a huge ass pick-up. American simply does not sell diesel cars and it irritates me. I like the Jetta and I love the Rabbit so I wouldn't have an issue driving either one of them, its just I would like a larger selection to choose from. I think Dodge is going to have a diesel Nitro, but those things are ugly and no one buys them. Why can't GM make a diesel Astra? I'm sure it would sell just fine.
 
Would it be possible to magnify the solar energy thus creating more solar energy?
 
Because you can't create a monopoly with it. Anyone can just bolt some solar panels to their roof and generate at least some of their own energy. Not anyone can drill for, let alone sell oil.

In my opinion, solar energy is the absolute correct answer, but not directly. I firmly believe in hydrogen-powered vehicles and other engines/motors (but not using that ick that GM came up with; I mean hyrdogen combustion), with that hydrogen coming from plants using solar powered-electricity to split the water. Free sunlight, water in, water out. Panel efficiency aside, I challenge anyone to find a problem with that system -- ethical, ecological, environmental, or otherwise.

Financial and infrastructure problems don't really count, since those are obstacles every other alternative has.

Ding ding.

Ever since I've seen that show on the Discovery channel where they interviewed these two dutch engineers who are creating full-spectrum panels, I've always wondered why it isn't hugely followed and etc.

Anyway, as far as ethanol goes, can't farmers harvest the crap that grows in their fields? When I was in Arkansas, there were fields of wild growth that I was told are harvested for ethanol. The only thing the farmer has to do is own the land and, of course, do the harvesting. Why waste corn?
 
Pretty much sums it up. I'd be more then willing to drive around a diesel car or truck. I would like to get one as my next vehicle, but my options are the Rabbit, the Jetta, or a huge ass pick-up. American simply does not sell diesel cars and it irritates me. I like the Jetta and I love the Rabbit so I wouldn't have an issue driving either one of them, its just I would like a larger selection to choose from. I think Dodge is going to have a diesel Nitro, but those things are ugly and no one buys them. Why can't GM make a diesel Astra? I'm sure it would sell just fine.

Lets put it this way, 'they're working on it.'

Chrysler, as long as they are tied to DaimlerBenz, will more than likely have a few diesel variants as options starting in 2008 or 2009, but it is unknown what models would benefit most from the addition engine choice. The obvious choices would probably be the Caliber and the Avenger/Sebring, as I would doubt they would pack diesels into the Charger/300, but that is still up in the air.

Ford has said that they don't want to commit to diesels in the US because they see a greater market for Hybrids on most of their models. Although I would like to see a Focus/Escort/whatever diesel, its just not going to happen... And it sucks...

Over at GM, the news is a bit better. The General is diving head-first into diesels in the US, and the first big 'bombshell' will be the CTS diesel arriving for 2009. The 250 BHP 2.9L V6 is supposed to show up first in the CTS, and then it will probably proliferate to the different models as well, but likely would be made available on 'rational' models like the Aura/Malibu/Vectra, as well as the VUE, and maybe even the Equinox replacement.

GM is supposed to be working on a new I4 for the American market, probably just a 'cleaned-up' version of what they already sell in Europe, and presumably it would be used in the Astra, as well as the Cobalt, and we may see it in the other Epsilon models as well.

...The big news was the development of a new V8, reportedly putting down 340 BHP, displacing somewhere in the neighborhood of 4-4.5 L, as this would be the new engine that we would find in the larger sedans, more specifically the RWD Zeta/VE cars on-sale in the US, Australia, and Europe. There was even talk of a 'diesel Camaro,' which would probably never happen, but the idea is a sound-one, going 0-60 in under five seconds and getting 40 MPG. Sweet.

Honda is supposed to be thinking about diesels as well, particularly with the Civic and the Accord, and I believe Nissan was doing the same with the Sentra and the Altima. Toyota wants to stick to Hybrids, and Mitsubishi has said nothing.

...Oh, and the Germans? Well, they'll be happy to sell you a diesel model later this year. The TDI Jetta and Rabbit should be returning for the 2008 model year, and with 140 BHP on-tap, it should set the standard in the market for performance and reliability. BMW wants to sell us the 330d, and it wouldn't surprise me to see a diesel 5-series as well. Mercedes is sticking to BluTec, and we will have a sloo of those models available in the next few years.

The reign of diesel is upon us, and it is so sad that it has taken this long to get here. I know that I'm in the same boat, looking into a diesel-powered Golf to replace the current petrol-powered Jetta. We'll see what happens...
 
Ding ding.

Ever since I've seen that show on the Discovery channel where they interviewed these two dutch engineers who are creating full-spectrum panels, I've always wondered why it isn't hugely followed and etc.

Anyway, as far as ethanol goes, can't farmers harvest the crap that grows in their fields? When I was in Arkansas, there were fields of wild growth that I was told are harvested for ethanol. The only thing the farmer has to do is own the land and, of course, do the harvesting. Why waste corn?
Err how do you power a 30 storey building that has a small roof on top?

With current solar energy efficiency you can't.

I also heard an estimate before that with current solar energy efficiency a city would require an area or equal size to be completely covered in solar panels. Now while there will be improvements, they won't be that big.
 
I've been inquiring myself. Seems you spend an awful lot of money on solar cells that will produce just... a bit of power.

I was interested in augmenting our school's power usage with solar panelling, but spending millions just to buy enough solar panels to power a couple of rooms is mostly pointless. I could just bang out the walls for ventilation and use mirrors to reflect sunlight into them for light with less trouble.

Solar panel technology badly needs a breakthrough in order to bring panel prices down enough to make it practical. When I learned I'd be spending tens of thousands of dollars just to put a 5 kilowatt system in the house, I was majorly disappointed.

I think the biggest challenge here is to use less more than use different. At our current energy-usage level, there's not much that can sustain our society (at the same size and usage) for very long after our mineral resources run out.
 
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