EVO vs IMPREZA

BolgOfThe North

BolgOfThe North

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Bolgofthenorth
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How very dare you!
Having watched & read a lot of car reviews about Evo's & Impreza's I've found that the general consensus about these cars are that the Evo tends to be considered quite a lot faster round corners and in terms of straight line performance there is not really anything in it, so on a track the Evo tends to be a bit faster, in some cases a lot faster.

I have an Evo 8 so I am obviously biased towards Evo's but if you look at the online time trial rankings on GTP between the Evo 9 & the '05 Impreza, the Impreza is considerably faster on every track, this is mainly due to the fact that (unlike in reality) the cornering ability is about the same but the straight line speed is much better in the Impreza.

So my point is this...on Gran Turismo 5 we will supposedly get to race on the Top Gear test track where the Evo has always wiped the floor with the Impreza (with the exception of the Evo 10) so will the developers take this into account? I realise no one can actually answer this for sure but I suppose I'm just highlighting one of the very few flaws in GT5P which I hope will not be carried onto GT5.
 
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I always felt the Evo 9 was a little too gutless in GT5P, which is a suprise as it is the opposite to the Evo 8 in GT4.
 
I remember an old Best Motoring video where the Imprezas were quicker than the evos... they did a race with the Evo X, new Impreza, Evo IX and the '06 Impreza STi.... First was the new Impreza, then the '06 impreza, then Evo IX then X...

I think older impreza like the bug eye werent as good as the Evo VI and VII were very good. But in the later models I think the Impreza is better..
 
Yeah Best Motoring is great, of the ones I've seen the Impreza Spec C ('03 I think) beat the Evo 8 RS round the old Fuji Speedway but on about 3 other races on Tsukuba with various versions of Evo 8's & 9's the Evo's quite easily win. Perhaps that shows that the Evo does have better handling and the Impreza has a better engine however the Evo does not have that handling advantage in GT5P.

I think your right though it definitely seems the later Impreza's improved a lot. I just hope the trend of the Impreza being unbeatable doesn't continue through every version on GT5.
 
BolgOfThe North
Yeah Best Motoring is great, of the ones I've seen the Impreza Spec C ('03 I think) beat the Evo 8 RS round the old Fuji Speedway but on about 3 other races on Tsukuba with various versions of Evo 8's & 9's the Evo's quite easily win. Perhaps that shows that the Evo does have better handling and the Impreza has a better engine however the Evo does not have that handling advantage in GT5P.

I think your right though it definitely seems the later Impreza's improved a lot. I just hope the trend of the Impreza being unbeatable doesn't continue through every version on GT5.
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The engines are totally different. Why is the STi engine better?
Anyway, back on topic, I also feel the evo lacks a bit of punch. Prior to spec II I remember the evo being pretty good (in fact better than the type RA STi) then after spec II the evo felt a bit different.
 
It's all about the power. In GT5P, the Impreza is more powerful, having the 2.5 liter engine compared to the Evo's 2.0. In the corners, the Evo is still sharper, and turns in more keenly, but that really doesn't help when the Impreza has such a big advantage in corner exit torque.

*shrugs* at least it's not as bad as in GT4, where the lack of snap-oversteer car dynamics doomed the nose-heavier EVO to even slower laptimes vis-a-vis the Impreza.
 
I think the EVO's harder to drive, IRL, so maybe while testing the guys at PD didn't quite wring out what's possible from it?
Everything I've read says the EVo should spank the Impreza round corners, while the Sub only has a small advantage down straights. Just my opinion/findings.
The cars won't be perfect in GT5 either, all I ask is that they're close with them, it's the really screwed up cars that bug me.
 
The problem really, is the torque and oversteer.

More torque for the Subarus means better acceleration out of corners, since there's little you can do in terms of clutch-slipping and modulation (again, from previous discussion) to get the dinky little 2 liters (if you can call those turbocharged monsters "dinky" ) out of the hole in the torque band.

More oversteer on the part of the Evo makes them a bit more difficult to drive if you can't feel the edge of adhesion through your fingertips... the Subaru's padding of tip-in understeer simply suits the less precise style of most console drivers more than the Evo's.

Simply put... it's easier to drive an AWD car than a RWD car in GT5P, right? Well... the Evo acts more like a RWD car than the Subaru does. :lol:
 
niky
The problem really, is the torque and oversteer.

More torque for the Subarus means better acceleration out of corners, since there's little you can do in terms of clutch-slipping and modulation (again, from previous discussion) to get the dinky little 2 liters (if you can call those turbocharged monsters "dinky" ) out of the hole in the torque band.

More oversteer on the part of the Evo makes them a bit more difficult to drive if you can't feel the edge of adhesion through your fingertips... the Subaru's padding of tip-in understeer simply suits the less precise style of most console drivers more than the Evo's.

Simply put... it's easier to drive an AWD car than a RWD car in GT5P, right? Well... the Evo acts more like a RWD car than the Subaru does. :lol:
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I'm going to drag race them down Fuji right now and see what happens.
 
DerekTX
i tested the two (newer versions) on a bunch of the tracks and i always came out with the evo being faster.
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Wow, really? Maybe you should rely on the leaderboards then?
Are you shifting the Impreza at 7200rpm? or 8000? If you shift the Sub at 8000rpm, it'll go slow as dog....
 
TrievelA7X
Wow, really? Maybe you should rely on the leaderboards then?
Are you shifting the Impreza at 7200rpm? or 8000? If you shift the Sub at 8000rpm, it'll go slow as dog....
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I dont know PD did this, in real the power curve doesnt drop that much, thats why people shift at the red line in real life...
 
Depends on your driving style... if you drive the Subaru the way it likes to be driven... muscled about, you'll go slower.

But if you adopt the classic racer's style, the Subaru is slightly quicker than the Evo on most tracks. It's just that it's easier to drive the Evo in the curb-apex-curb fashion that determines a really fast lap.
 
IMHO, the Subarus need more active driving style than the automagical Evos. lift off oversteer is available in both Imprezas, whereas Evo's feel like understeering 24/7.true, Evo X is slightly faster around the track, but I'm willing to say that if Subaru would have DCT as well, it would be just as fast.
 
I completely agree with that "automagical Evo" comment with the Evo X, not so much the Evo IX.

Leonidae
Evo X is slightly faster around the track, but I'm willing to say that if Subaru would have DCT as well, it would be just as fast.
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I have done some tests on Eiger before the leaderboards were wiped last year (At the time top of the leader board before it was wiped) and my results was for the current Subaru and Evo X the Subaru just had the edge.

Checking the leaderboards now (I don't bother with setting times anymore), it seems they still completely agree with me.
 
thats wierd yesterday i was doing a comparison of the 4 cars, the 05's and 08's impreza and evo, the 05 impreza is faster then 05 evo, but the evo 08 is faster then the impreza 08, i did a 2 player test, but i havent tested the 08 evo vs 05 impreza or vise versa BTW idid this under automatic tranny so it kan ease the tests, idk if reving it higher on both would make too much difference tho... someone try it out
 
zeromobius
idid this under automatic tranny so it kan ease the tests, idk if reving it higher on both would make too much difference tho... someone try it out
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It's not always about revving higher though, sometimes you will change earlier due to torqueband and gearing, sometimes you hold a gear rather than gear hunting (like auto does sometimes) or due to wheelspin, sometimes you shortshift rather than let off throttle to kill/reduce understeer (kill two birds with one stone), sometimes you will shortshift during a jump to save shifting while the wheels are in contact (two birds, one stone again) and as you mention sometimes you will hold revs longer for powerband and gearing reasons as well as short straight sections where shifting is just a waste of time. Many many reasons.


Eiger for example I often shortshift on the jump before corner one and pin the throttle (mid air), gives a extra little boost on landing, I also tend to short shift (not on all cars) on the long right hander before the tunnel (Car dependant), this helps kill oversteer and understeer with cars than on-throttle understeer (STi for example), it also saves a shift further up the road and by then end of the tunnel I usually have more speed .

In the end you have to drive the STi differently to the Evo, just like niky has explained in a couple posts.
 
yeah i was just doing a straight on drag race. i didnt course test, i just wanted to see which one got ahead thats all.. too bad i dont know much bought cars or racing, but i love gt tho and cars as well. just no informed on it. just a lil
 
zeromobius
yeah i was just doing a straight on drag race. i didnt course test, i just wanted to see which one got ahead thats all.. too bad i dont know much bought cars or racing, but i love gt tho and cars as well. just no informed on it. just a lil
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Trial and error :)

Actually often with each car before I go for hot laps I like do straight line drags against my ghost to figure out the optimum shifting points for each gear. I also check the power graph in quick tune to give me an idea of the torque profile (which I hope is more detailed in GT5). In the end it is trial and error.
 
Strange... drag-race the 08 STi and EVO and it isn't even close... of course... the only time I've ever drag-raced the two is on the uphill back straight on Eiger... where the Subaru's huge torque advantage recoups the time it loses in the twisty midfield... giving it the win by a few tenths.

Driving slow corners properly, like Jay says, is often a matter of knowing when to hold them, knowing when to fold them... in a straight drag race, unless you're racing a diesel with ultra-short gears, redline is always the answer. On the race track, where having too much power coming out of a corner can be just as bad as having too little power, it pays to experiment with weird shift points.
 
niky
Strange... drag-race the 08 STi and EVO and it isn't even close... of course...
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If you are referring to my above post about myself drag racing my ghost I mean within the same car, not a Evo vs STI comparison. Just to see where the best shift point is for each gear for maximum total acceleration, which after my vast amount of testing in GT4 (not too much in GT5 without a test track) is often not redline. :)
 
Jay
If you are referring to my above post about myself drag racing my ghost I mean within the same car, not a Evo vs STI comparison. Just to see where the best shift point is for each gear for maximum total acceleration, which after my vast amount of testing in GT4 (not too much in GT5 without a test track) is often not redline. :)
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Nah... meant zeromobius... when he said the 08 Evo was faster than the 08 Impreza.
 
7Sins
The engines are totally different. Why is the STi engine better?
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Yes the engines are totally different, therefore one is going to be better than the other, the old Fuji Speedway was a speed circuit (very long straights & fast corners), Tsukuba is a handling circuit (slow corners & not much of a straight). So if the Impreza dominates at Fuji & the Evo dominates at Tsukuba I think its fairly obvious the Impreza has a better engine & the Evo has better handling, like niky said its probably due to the greater torque produced by the higher capacity engine.
 
BolgOfThe North
Yes the engines are totally different, therefore one is going to be better than the other, the old Fuji Speedway was a speed circuit (very long straights & fast corners), Tsukuba is a handling circuit (slow corners & not much of a straight). So if the Impreza dominates at Fuji & the Evo dominates at Tsukuba I think its fairly obvious the Impreza has a better engine & the Evo has better handling, like niky said its probably due to the greater torque produced by the higher capacity engine.
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The Impreza is beats the Evo at Tsukuba, watch Best Motoring 2008-1. The new subaru and 2006 ones seem to be better than the Evo X and IX. But i dont know about the older models.
 
balang_479
The Impreza is beats the Evo at Tsukuba, watch Best Motoring 2008-1. The new subaru and 2006 ones seem to be better than the Evo X and IX. But i dont know about the older models.
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Is that normal Best Motoring (all Japanese) or Best Motoring International? (American voice over).
 
balang_479
I dont know PD did this, in real the power curve doesnt drop that much, thats why people shift at the red line in real life...
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IRL Subaru WRX STI's don't redline at 8000rpm, not in America anyway, I believe they have a rev-limiter at 7000 or so rpm.

In drag races, I found the EVO X is actually quicker, but it's because of quicker gears, and that weird auto-shift transmission, however, from any rolling 2nd gear start or higher, like out of most every turn on racetracks, the 'Sub pounds it, hard.
 

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