Give this S-13 Silvia a try

Discussion in 'GT5 Drifting' started by bread82, Apr 29, 2013.

  1. bread82

    bread82

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    Hi All,

    I've been using this car since I first got GT5, and I didn't really use it for drifting until about 6 months or a year ago. I got fed up with racing, and drifting after work seemed much more therapeutic. Now I spend 90% of my GT5 time on drifting.

    I've posted this since I've grown quite attached to this car.... but I'm not sure if it might be set up a bit strangely compared to some drift cars. It works well for me and I've deliberately kept the power low. It's quite capable of showing understeer in certain situations, but I like this as I can compensate with slipping the rear wheels with throttle.

    Anyway, here are the settings: The reason some things aren't maxxed out is because when I first bought this car I intended to keep it vaguely "street-tuned" rather than a 100% lightened, lowered, super-tuned racer.

    Bread's Silvia
    254 BHP/6800 rpm
    30 kgfm/4600 rpm
    1026 kg

    Chassis:
    Weight reduction 2
    Chassis reinforcement*
    No Ballast

    Engine:
    ECU
    NA+1

    Intake:
    Racing Air Filter
    Sports Intake Mani

    Exhaust:
    Sports cat
    Sports Exh Mani
    Semi Racing Exhaust

    Stock Turbo (rarely, for high speed tracks, I'll put in the low RPM turbo. Might need to change the gearbox to stock depending on track)

    Transmission:
    5-Speed Close Ratio**

    Drivetrain
    Single plate clutch
    Sports Flywheel
    LSD 5/8/5 ***

    Suspension F/R
    RH 20/25 ****
    SR 5.0/4.0
    Damp Ext 4/4
    Damp Comp 4/1
    Anti Roll 3/1

    Camber 2.5/1.5
    Toe -0.15/+0.15

    Brake Balance 7/5

    CH tyres

    NO AIDS, and NO ABS

    notes
    * I stuck chassis reinforcement on ages ago. I honestly don't know if it helps of hinders. Sadly it's irreversible and I didn't want to sell the car and build another.

    ** I've not used a custom box as I've found this works for me. Might be something I change in the future.

    *** A diff this open could be considered sacrilege around here!... I've tried more locked ones, and have always come back to this - I genuinely prefer it.

    **** Yes this isn't lowered much, but I didn't want something that bottomed out constantly (not that I think GT handling models the violence of hitting a bump stop very well).

    I find that this car is reasonably responsive enough in transitions and entries, but has some "cushion" when applying the gas so it won't instantly lose the back end (probably helped by the low power). But then again, I'm biased as I've been driving it for hours (days!?). I'm not sure if anyone else finds this but after driving something for ages you start to wonder if you're tuning it or it's tuning you.

    I usually drive on Deep Forest, Trial Mountain or Grand Valley Speedway. Deep Forest video below *mods if this should be in the video section as a separate thread I'm happy to move it*



    Dodgy line after long tunnel, turned in too late. Grass needed a trim though! And I got a bit carried away on the last corner.

    Comments and criticisms welcome.

    Cheers,

    Bread
     
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2013
  2. Streeto

    Streeto

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    Seems to straighten out and catch traction a lot.

    Oh, just noticed the diff, not surprised the car acts like that! :D
     
  3. JrDarknes

    JrDarknes

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    Lmao @ OP. I knew I wasn't the only one who used a LSD like that except mine is usually 5/5/5

    Its a really good tune! Just I removed the camber and made them both to zero (I just hate camber while drifting). Perfect Tandem Car, I only had a S13 for my drifting events but not one for everyday tandeming. Its also under 300HP which makes it suitable for me =D!!!. Thanks so much.
     
  4. dice1998

    dice1998 Premium

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    What's so funny about his post?
     
  5. UrieHusky

    UrieHusky Premium

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    Read the rest of the sentence.
     
  6. dice1998

    dice1998 Premium

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    It's so funny that I fall off of my donkey because the tune's good?

    I don't get it.
     
  7. UrieHusky

    UrieHusky Premium

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    He is laughing because he never thought anyone else would use an open diff like that and he finds it amusing that he's not the only one.

    He is expressing his amusement with the acronym "L.m.a.o"
     
  8. GhostZ

    GhostZ

    Messages:
    271
    5/5/5 isn't open. Either way, the diff setting is fine. For this car I would run about 7/10/5. The difference is almost negligible. Springs are softer and rear camber is a bit low for the weight, but that's for more purpose-built tunes. For a general tune, this is both very good and close to what my calculated results come to.
     
  9. dice1998

    dice1998 Premium

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    I still don't see how a working tune is funny, let alone so funny that I fall off my donkey.
     
  10. UrieHusky

    UrieHusky Premium

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    By open I should say "More open".

    Are you kidding me right now? I broke it down to you in the most simplistic way possible and you still miss it?

    I give up.

    Also where on earth do you keep getting this donkey line from.
     
  11. GhostZ

    GhostZ

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    271
    "Laughing my ass off". Technically this wouldn't mean falling off a donkey, but a donkey falling off of you.

    To some drifters, a 5/5/5 differential is laughably silly and is completely stupid to use, so those that do use it like the solidarity.





    Those drifters that find 5/5/5 unusable? Those drifters are ignorant.
     
  12. UrieHusky

    UrieHusky Premium

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    Considering "ass" in this sense is referring to the buttocks of a human being and is widely known to mean this - I am assuming I'm being taken for a ride.

    Having used a 5/5/5 diff, I would never say it is laughably silly. It's perfectly effective at what it does.
    Though I still prefer a locked diff when driving with others I have found a great deal of use from other diff types.
     
  13. dice1998

    dice1998 Premium

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    It's explained to you in the post below.

    That wouldn't make sense, would it? So I went with the next best thing.


    Then again, I wouldn't know enough about tuning to understand "LMAO @ OP" i guess.
     
  14. UrieHusky

    UrieHusky Premium

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    He is laughing is ass off, it is a common term used on the internet to express something being highly amusing.

    I explained why he found the situation highly amusing previously.

    If you still cannot understand it the only remaining possibility is that you're intentionally ignoring what is being presented to you for the sake of making a joke about how the word "Ass" is also a name used for the Donkey.

    If the above is true I will end with; Grow up.
     
  15. dice1998

    dice1998 Premium

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    I'm still not understanding how it's highly amusing that the tune works.


    Really? Because I don't understand that sense of humor? Well.. hell.
     
  16. UrieHusky

    UrieHusky Premium

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    It has nothing to do with whether the tune works or not.

    He's amused by the fact someone else uses an LSD set up that is rather uncommon that he himself uses.
     
  17. D-Max

    D-Max

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    Why are you even entertaining this person? Just ignore the stupidity!

    I tried the tune and its not so bad! But reading that someone removed the camber, I can't say that would help in any way whatsoever?
     
  18. Stavingo

    Stavingo

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    I swear dice is here just to gain a higher post count :lol:
     
  19. D-Max

    D-Max

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    It would seem like it.
     
  20. Lock2Lock

    Lock2Lock Premium

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    I wouldn't say that at all bro. I have used that diff setting many times in the past. However now I mostly use 5/60/60 (manly for competitions or serious tandems)


    5/5/5 to me feels like a locked diff, but doesn't have the snappy feeling that comes with 5/60/60

    I wouldn't call myself ignorant/not a good drifter for using it either. I am actually a good drifter (not pro or anything just good). The cars I had used with the 5/5/5 diff setting were actually not bad at all. I have never had problems with it. I guess the only way I can describe the 5/5/5 diff setting, is a lazy lock diff.

    I hardly use the 5/5/5 anymore because I have picked a different type of drifting style. With the 5/5/5 I was slower than a lot of cars (not by much though), but I was amazingly smooth and holding 80-90 degrees everywhere. Now I am after smoothness with faster pace while holding the same angle. So i tend to use a proper locked diff.

    So to me what diff you use depends on your style. Which once again drifting is a art, everyone's style is different.
     
  21. GhostZ

    GhostZ

    Messages:
    271
    There is a difference for saying that 5/5/5 is a worthless setting, and choosing not to use it. You are not the type who would condemn someone for using a 5/5/5 setting, so you are the latter type, so the comment was not directed at you.

    As for me, the settings I use vary depending on vehicle weight, cornering grip levels, body roll, rear wheel torque and car width. The range is between 5/5/5 and about 40/50/20, with the average setting probably close to 18/20/7. Again, it all depends on the vehicle. I have drifted both 0/0/0 and 60/60/60 settings quite a bit. I find neither of these are optimal, however, the difference between the two can be so minor that most drivers can't perceive it, particularly if their technique has not adopted to where it would hold them back.




    Drifting is an art if you want it to be. Likewise, warfare is an art if you'd like it to be as well.

    But I wouldn't bet my life on the country that wears pink camouflage because they find it their style. In other words... even if you judge the armies on appearance, someone is going to get shot. Drift cars have a purpose and a goal, it's the driver and tuner's job to achieve that objective as best as possible. That's my belief.
     
  22. bread82

    bread82

    Messages:
    112
    Location:
    England
    Thanks for the feedback everyone!

    @ JrDarknes - glad you like lower powered cars mate, have you ever tried chucking some of the JP/Euro 1960's cars around? Some are really underpowered and do require a bit of an increase, but a short gearbox, low speed/tight track and aggressive steering/braking goes a long way. And they're so light! I have a Mazda Cosmo(110S) as my "#2" car, it's a bit of a handful at the moment but I do enjoy it.

    Nice to know there are some fellow low-LSD users out there!

    In my experience 60/60/60 and similarly high settings make the car very twitchy/responsive - but that's about all they do for me. I don't usually find that a car is in need of being made that twitchy, at least the way I drive.

    On some cars I find that a stock open diff (0/0/0) or a 5/5/5 custom give inside red wheel and thus no real forward drive, and since the outside wheel isn't under much power it doesn't let the back end out either. I don't want either of those situations when drifting, so I try to find something in the middle. A lot of people use the "make sure both rear tyres turn red at the same time" rule and it's one which I generally use as a first setting, usually set on a very shallow turn (grip racing), then I drift the car and see how it feels.

    I must confess I've never really experimented with decel settings. I'd appreciate any advice. I've survived without them so far but I imagine as well as during braking, they'll come into play if you're doing a lift-off-throttle transition.... is it as simple as a higher decel setting gives you a more effective/sudden lift-off "jolt"? I'm aware of how LSDs work in general and for grip, but I've not specifically thought about the decel in a drift scenario, other than the fact that it probably isn't the same logic as in grip. Kind of like when "increased accel LSD can promote understeer" - yes it can in a grip situation, but that doesn't mean jack when both back wheels are spun up and smoking!

    Back to Accel and LSD in general:
    What I like to have is where the throttle gives you a range of options. 60/60/60 feels ,broadly, like a on-off switch: hit the gas, lose the back end.

    For more moderate LSD it just feels more progressive:

    Moderate throttle: hold the car steady mid-drift

    A bit more throttle: to adjust (and this is also nice when finishing the drift, if you want the rear wheels to start to hook up and accelerate you). Since you're not sliding sideways as much, and have reduced any countersteer, the rears can take a bit more power to use for straight-line propulsion. (Aside: I know a lot of people link constantly and manji down straights, and that's cool, but the feeling where the whole car is moving laterally, and you see the exit line "appear", get the throttle control right as the sideways motion stops & blends into forwards motion.. then roar down the straight... lovely!)

    Wide open throttle: Spin up the rears more to significantly increase angle (which is what I find the 60/60/60 does all the time).

    Kind of like when people set spring rates or dampers I guess, you don't want it too blobby or too twitchy.

    @Ghost: I did have the rear camber hovering around 2.0 at one stage, kept flicking it back down and up again until I left it where it is. I'd be interested to know what suspension settings you'd recommend, given keeping the power and tranny the same. If you'd prefer me to submit this to your garage I'm happy to do so, but I'm happy if you want to post them here.

    Cheers,

    Bread
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2013