Grand-Am undergoes major class changes for 2012

[RACECAR]

2011 marks the final time people will see the current Grand-Am classes because for 2012, Grand-Am will feature new rules that will see a major change in both performance and looks. For Daytona Prototypes, the new rules will allow for much sleeker designs that are more manufacterer influenced and Turbo-charged engines along with the allowance of more tech, including Sequential gearboxes and chassis. For GT, The old rules are completely gone and taking its place will be GT3 Specifications. So no more tubed-framed mistakes reffered to as GT cars.

Language warning which might be inappropreate around kids and is probably not safe for work


In my opinion, I think the ALMS may now have to really look over their shoulders with this. These announcements along with the recent announcement of Ferrari building a Grand-Am bound F458, might be a major shocker. It doesn't help also that they came up with the daft idea of running two spec classes in a sports car racing series(especially one thats an all Porsche class). What are your thoughts?

 

[SuperShouden]

Sounds interesting.

 

[Damirgt]

Off topic but do you guys know where there is going to be a live stream of the 24 hour race on the internert? I don't have speed for now unfortunely.

 

[wbrinkman]

Off topic but do you guys know where there is going to be a live stream of the 24 hour race on the internert? I don't have speed for now unfortunely.

Speed has 7 hours of broadcasting planned I think, Eurosport 2 (UK) has a little under 4 hours, if you are in Europe you can sign up and watch that online for a small fee.

I hope there will be some other sources though.

 

[SuperShouden]

Speed has more than that. They're supposed to broadcast the first 14 hours today and I believe the last 7 hours tomorrow.

 

[RACECAR]

According to SpeedTV, the New Grand-Am Spec Ferrari 458 will be on track sometime this year. Also, the new specificatinos for the new DPs bodywork will be released in the next few months with teams expected to start testing the cars themselves around June/July.

 

[NapoleonMikey]

This is the mock up they had on display at Daytona.

Still looks very much like the Riley chassis to me.

 

[RACECAR]

This is the mock up they had on display at Daytona.

Still looks very much like the Riley chassis to me.

Thats not really a mockup, thats just the Eddie Cheever redesigned Fabcar chassis from years ago. Its not really a representative of what the cars will look like.

For now, the only possible idea anyone will have is the design study here

 

[Cale]

I want the late 80's early 90's back. Now those cars were cool.

 

[wfooshee]

Personally I've never been a fan of the DP cars. At all. They're ugly, and they're slower than what they replaced, but I guess to stand out from ALMS Grand-Am had to do something completely different. Well, they did, and I've been an ALMS fan ever since.

I've flagged a DP race, and it only confirmed everything I'd gleaned from TV coverage.

I used to go to the Rolex 24 every year. I was there in '88 when Jaguar won in the Group C car with the huge V12. I was there when Max Papis got the nickname Mad Max from Bob Varsha. Max was running the Momo Ferrari and gaining on the leader by leaps and bounds, but pretty much ran out of tire. Nevertheless, an outstanding drive. I was there when Paul Newman drove the last time in this race, at 70 years of age.

I've never been since the DP came into being, and I have no plans to go.

The only manufacturer "involvement" is engines. Calling a car a Porsche or Lexus or BMW because it carries a production-based engine from that company is just stupid.

That said, Grand-Am's GT class has had some of the best racing in North America, including the ALMS GT classes. Oh, but that's cars built by the people who put their name on them and race them. Wow, market relationship!!!! Cool!

On-topic, I was pleased to see the phrase "manufacturer involvement" in the first post, but nothing else referenced makes it look like what it ought to be, with teams building cars, not buying one of the five models available and dumping a motor into it. Any high school kid can buy a car and stick a motor in it! OK, maybe not a half-million-dollar car, but there's nothing different in principle.

 

[LSX]

Do you think the manufactures would actually develop a prototype for both GA and LMS?

I don't. I also don't think it would be a great idea to run the same car in both series. However I don't care much for the DP's as is, so I don't know what I want really, other than something that pushes the envelope much further than what we currently see, because they are lacking in the individuality department.

Most of this is what leads me to believe that the Continental Tire series is the best thing going right now.

Maybe we don't need any prototypes, maybe merging SCCA world challenge, the new GT cars and the Continental cars would be cool. One side is purpose built carbon fiber share next to nothing with the actual street car and go like hell, the other is basically a showroom stock racer. Promote the actual manufactures that way, and keep a wide divide between class performance. Kinda Super GT style, but with an extra class. Everything from sheet metal sharing things you can buy, to tube framed crazyness.

Sell more cars?

 

[arvin charles]

Why is there two threads with this same GA news?

 

[Flying Lizard]

It sounds like a step in the right direction. True, the Grand am cars arent very exotic. But the racing is aggressive and top notch.

 

[RACECAR]

Personally I've never been a fan of the DP cars. At all. They're ugly, and they're slower than what they replaced, but I guess to stand out from ALMS Grand-Am had to do something completely different. Well, they did, and I've been an ALMS fan ever since.

Well funny enough, the fans I talked to prior to the DPs hated Grand-Am because it was an "ALMS copycat" so its funny to hear people want those cars back. Also, the one thing that really hampers the physical appeal of the DPs is the fact that its dominated by one Constructor (ironically, the same company that when you think about it, has never built beautiful cars even for LMP): Riley Technoligies. Honestly, the one car that usually has me disagreeing about DPs being ugly is the Lola. That alone is proof even before the new redesigns that the DPs can look better.

The only manufacturer "involvement" is engines. Calling a car a Porsche or Lexus or BMW because it carries a production-based engine from that company is just stupid.

Isn't this usually the story with LMP2s? To my memory, thats usually what I saw with LMP2 cars prior to Acura and Porsche's arrival and still see.

That said, Grand-Am's GT class has had some of the best racing in North America, including the ALMS GT classes. Oh, but that's cars built by the people who put their name on them and race them. Wow, market relationship!!!! Cool!

I have major hate for the GT class. I hated it when they got rid of the old rules that still allowed GT2 cars to compete and they were replaced with these pieces of crap. They look someone just stuck a rear wing on them and called it a day. These changes now have me actually giving a damn about GT again.

On-topic, I was pleased to see the phrase "manufacturer involvement" in the first post, but nothing else referenced makes it look like what it ought to be, with teams building cars, not buying one of the five models available and dumping a motor into it. Any high school kid can buy a car and stick a motor in it! OK, maybe not a half-million-dollar car, but there's nothing different in principle.

It was done that way as a cost-effective measurement. By not having extrodinary amounts of money constintly spent on developing cars, this keeps down costs and maintains a level playing field. So what if they look like a sore on someone's face, Its much better seeing a prototype field of around 12 cars all with a chance to win as opposed to a field of five cars with only two going for the win.

Why is there two threads with this same GA news?

Because the last I checked, the other thread was about "who follows Grand-Am" while this is actually about the changes coming next year.

 

[NapoleonMikey]

Why is there two threads with this same GA news?

Because the other thread is more directed about talking about the actual races, while this is a more focused thread on the rule changes coming to the Grand-Am series. Dont worry though im sure a mod will come along soon enough and merge them together saying this forum doesn't need dedicated topics on the series.

Back on topic though.

Didn't know that RACECAR. I just assumed that's what it was since I didn't see a sign board saying what the chassis was.

 

[RACECAR]

Back on topic though.

Didn't know that RACECAR. I just assumed that's what it was since I didn't see a sign board saying what the chassis was.

Some sponsors involved with certain American series tend to use a older car as a showcar or promo car so that was the case here promoting the 24 Hour race. Another example can be found with ALMS Sponsor Rockford Fosgate using the old Pilbeam MP96 Chassis at one of its booths with their Stereo system installed.

 

[arvin charles]

Because the last I checked, the other thread was about "who follows Grand-Am" while this is actually about the changes coming next year.

I was referring to your other thread "GT3 comes to US...Confirmed." Which is also about changes in GA rules, just like this one.

Come on, we can't even have separate ILMC, ALMS or LMS topics and you start 2 threads about this rules change!

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=129783

 

[RACECAR]

I was referring to your other thread "GT3 comes to US...Confirmed." Which is also about changes in GA rules, just like this one.

Because if you actually read that one, that specifically mentioned GT3 cars coming to the US at all (hence the title). Read the first post and you'll actually see the difference:

So here's the story from what I understand:


It appears that both the ALMS and Grand-Am are trying to bring the popular GT3 class over to the US. However, they want to this in various ways:

-IMSA (the santioning body behind the ALMS) wants to open up the GTC class to none Porsches, meaning that other makes can compete. However, there's a catch: "Massive changes" have to be made. I'm guessing the GT3 cars easily overpower the GTC cars, hence this.

-Grand-Am on the other hand wants to adapt the GT3 rules to their GT class and the best part: no expensive changes necessary.

This one reffers to the changes to both classes in Grand-Am series specifically.

 

[Ardius]

The only manufacturer "involvement" is engines. Calling a car a Porsche or Lexus or BMW because it carries a production-based engine from that company is just stupid.

I don't know who refers to the cars literally as the engine supplier, but manufacturer involvment being limited to engine supply is not something limited to Grand-Am.
There are far more motorsport series in the world where car manufacturers only supply engines than there are where they supply everything.

In fact, if we are talking literally, you could probably count the number of "pure" manufacturer teams with your two hands. Ferrari, McLaren, Audi, and Peugeot are the only ones I can think of off the top of my head. I don't know the ins and outs of DTM and SuperGT, but wouldn't be surprised if the "manufacturer" teams are still independent race teams, just like say, M-Sport for Ford or RML for Chevrolet.

The problem with DP, LMP and the various open-wheel formula series is that they are all about aerodynamics in their chassis design. Not many car manufacturers have the resources or expertise to design such cars, and its quite costly for them to produce their own. So its far cheaper and just as marketable to simply supply engines for independent chassis suppliers such as Riley, Lola, Dallara, Swift, etc. That or pay for Lola or whoever to help design and produce "their" car.

Personally I think Daytona is fine as it is with Grand-Am and DPs. At least it serves as a nice start to the motorsport season with some guest drives. If it was an ALMS race, it would be more expensive for teams to run competitively and hence guest drives wouldn't be so easy to come by.
In other words, don't take away my only source of Montoya-in-something-other-than-NASCAR!

It is a shame though that its no longer part of the Le Mans circle.

 

[RACECAR]

Personally I think Daytona is fine as it is with Grand-Am and DPs. At least it serves as a nice start to the motorsport season with some guest drives. If it was an ALMS race, it would be more expensive for teams to run competitively and hence guest drives wouldn't be so easy to come by

And the great thing is Unlike Le man as of late, you get a huge variaty of drivers from various diciplines. At most, its Sportscar aces at Le Mans whereas you always see someone from Motocross, Indycar, Nascar, F1, or even the lesser known racing series at Daytona.

It is a shame though that its no longer part of the Le Mans circle.

For now it isn't. However, there is a good chance that the new production based engine spec rules from the ACO might work well with the new DPs. If it pans out just right, we could for instance see the exact same Ford engine from Jack Roush in both LMP2 overseas as well as in DP. Sure they won't be the same cars, but that would be an excellent start I'd think.

 

[Ardius]

Well, at Le Mans itself you see quite a lot of ex-F1 drivers and current junior open-wheel drivers. Plus a few touring car drivers. Actually, it must be close to a quarter of the 2010 Le Mans 24 hours field were ex-F1.

 

[RACECAR]

And here it is:

GRAND-AM Road Racing has issued a new Constructor’s Manual outlining significant changes to the Rolex Sports Car Series’ Daytona Prototype class that will take effect in 2012.

The DP class debuted in 2003; the new version will debut in the 2012 season-opening event, the 50th anniversary running of the Rolex 24 at Daytona, Jan. 28-29 at Daytona International Speedway.

“There will be new cars to cheer for at the 2012 Rolex 24 – new dramatic shapes with more variety to feast the eyes on,” said GRAND-AM Vice President of Competition Dave Spitzer.

“We will have a strong field; this debut will mark a new growth curve for Daytona Prototypes where manufacturers and privateers alike know that GRAND-AM is the place to compete.”

The key aspects of the new DPs:

• The greenhouse (cockpit) area will be nearly identical for all newly constructed cars. The roll cage will be narrower on each side of the car, although the driver’s position will not be moved. There will be a one-inch zone throughout the greenhouse surface to allow for individual styling cues, including windshield implementation and window outlines.

• New minimum body cross-section provisions will make the new DPs have a more upright front fascia and nose, rather than the more sloped layout of the current cars. This will allow the different manufacturers to add more design character to their cars, making them closer to their street production offerings while still offering the dramatic message embodied by a prototype.

• Flexibility has also been introduced into the rules for the side bodywork, including production-derived sidepods and open vents behind the front wheels – enabling styling elements from the street cars to be functional on the race cars.

These considerable changes notwithstanding, the basic chassis structure below the DPs’ greenhouse remains the same, including suspension details, engine installation, bellhousing, gearbox, electronics, fueling and safety systems.

Wind tunnel and simulation testing has been ongoing for the new DPs and will continue in the fall, in preparation for the 2012 season.

Link

Thoughts?