GT5 related: Does multiplayer ruin the SP experience?

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hamster1984

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I was reading this cracked.com article and it got me thinking.

http://www.cracked.com/blog/5-ways-to-tell-youre-getting-too-old-video-games/

I agree with this totally; I have not seen a very great SP shooter experience in about 4-5 years. I think this is because of tailoring to the MP gameplay.

Now related to Gran Turismo, could this mean even less attempts at making a good SP experience when it comes to good AI, your thoughts!?
 
Multiplayer > Singleplayer. At least in 95% of games. It's the future, face it. With online gaming so readily available and popular, it's not gonna change.
 
^Games like Uncharted and Final Fantasy will always have strong sp though, it's only fps and tps games that had their sp campaign quality has gone to crap as of late.
 
Online is better then sp.
Reason: You are playing real people the AI is not good enough at the moment to provide the same level of challenge. It just "feels" better.

Thats my opinion.
 
Firstly far too much bad language in this article. Secondly in sim racing game you run a lot into old farts. People round my age and older usually take racing serious maybe a tad too serious at times.

So no, multiplayer can be great if you invest some time in filling your friends list.
 
Online is the better mode. If GT did away with single player completely, it would be a better game for me. It's basically an online only game the way I play it now, and I consider it wasted resources if PD tried to make SP better. It just can't be made as good as online. Technology isn't good enough yet to simulate live opponents.

As for SP in the first place, I think it's been fairly constant. GT1-GT5 has about the same level of enjoyment in terms of SP (though GT5 lacks content). I'd actually argue that the low point was GT4 and that GT5 is actually a little better in SP. I'm not a big FPS player, but I don't think that there has been a drastic drop in quality in recent time.
 
Well, both Resistance 3 and Deus Ex have great single player campaigns. But with something like a racing game multiplayer can only be a good thing. Especially if you get in a good group of racers.
 
hamster1984
Now related to Gran Turismo, could this mean even less attempts at making a good SP experience when it comes to good AI, your thoughts!?
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I think that's the case entirely. I see how it benefits the game though as more effort can be put into areas that people use the most, but it does give those who play primarily offline the short end of the stick.
 
I've tried finding decent races online and evidently have rotten luck with it. Haven't had a good experience yet. Never found a GT Planet-named server. So almost all of my racing is offline. I have a full field of cars, no knotheads or punters, and A.I. which is better than most of the yahoo know-it-alls around here will admit to.
 
sumbrownkid
^Games like Uncharted and Final Fantasy will always have strong sp though, it's only fps and tps games that had their sp campaign quality has gone to crap as of late.
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Some do and some don't however. I like to go back and play Halo's story over again because it is a story, not something that was added to fill some space on the back of the box. Same with Dead Space series, they're just fun singleplayer games.

That being said I think a lot of previous games *cough*Call of Duty*cough* have just been about the Multiplayer. I think a lot of games also go for the graphics too, like GT5, and it just doesn't seem fair to us gamers who want a fun and immersive game, where we can come home from a bad day and turn it round to a great day.

I remembered I made a thread on this a while back explaining another reason why I think MP ruined games as a whole.

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=220703
 
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I've been playing F1 2010 for quite a while now, both career mode and multiplayer. Decided to put GT5 back in after a long break since I just got a new Logitech G27 wheel. Have to say that GT5's "AI" is so bad it shouldn't even be called that. There is absolutely no reason to play GT5 single player other than trying to earn money for new cars. There really isn't even any "racing" to any of the events. Start from the back and move forward? That's not racing. The selection of cars in the game is great, but the rest of the game is greatly overrated, imo.
 
Just did a few of the Super GT seasonals. The AI just drive in a single file line, like moving cones on an obstacle course. Pretty funny too how they will just run straight into you if you are next to them. 👎
 
My complaint isn't really with multiplayer. It's with the fact that I can't stand teenage 🤬.
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:lol:

The article points it's finger at me several times, and I laughed each time, all very good points too.
But my god do I wanna play GTA4 now.:dopey:
 
Honestly MP is where the money is, that whole SP play by yourself bit is old and still kind of anti-social. Who plays by themselves anyway? GT is focusing on community oriented gaming, driving games are no fun playing the AI trust me I have played enough of them to know. AI can be too perfect to the point where it's just cheap any EA game can show you that crap, play FM3 on hardest setting with stock vehicles and you'll see what I mean. The AI can counter steer out of any spin and recover much quicker than a human and they can actually drive a mechanically disabled car better than you as well...I will prefer humans who I know have the same limitation on interface as I.

While I don't say remove the single player all together, it should be tailored much better than the borefest that is A Spec in GT5. It's so methodical and boring, the too fearful AI makes matters worse and the fact that Kaz didn't think it made sense to have the AI match your vehicles performance in the harder levels of A Spec. No pacing whatsoever in GT5, which is why I stopped play A Spec altogether. Only online seasonals and mp for this guy, mades loads of money had loads of incredible races, why would I go back to single player?
 
Photomode, enduros, and doing it for hilarity are the only reasons why I do A-spec. If you decide to challenge yourself, i.e. purposely use a slower car, it's not as boring, but what is the point of that? I mean the special mission in GT4 that requires you to pass NSXes, RX-7s, and Skylines with a Honda Fit racer with only 100 hp and racing tires, is proof that no matter what you do, PD puts in some way you can win in any car against any opponent.


I don't bash PD for making the A.I. super crappy, let alone give out less than stellar events. But the MP servers aren't currently up to speed either. But it is better than the SP experience that GT5 features.


Long story short, MP experience can only ruin the SP experience if you see fit. I don't see any relation between the two. If the MP was intertwined with SP, and the SP was BS compared to the MP, then the whole game is flawed.
 
Off Topic: when you think about it shooting games main point of interest is it's online. AI are simply not smart enough so making a long and engaging fps game is kind of pointless.

Now about GT5, I pretty much never touch it's SP mode I have completed every race except the endurance races. The only thing I do in GT5 that's not online is run some hot laps and that's it. If it wasn't for it's online I wouldn't be playing it as much.
 
SavageEvil
Honestly MP is where the money is, that whole SP play by yourself bit is old and still kind of anti-social. Who plays by themselves anyway? GT is focusing on community oriented gaming, driving games are no fun playing the AI trust me I have played enough of them to know. AI can be too perfect to the point where it's just cheap any EA game can show you that crap, play FM3 on hardest setting with stock vehicles and you'll see what I mean. The AI can counter steer out of any spin and recover much quicker than a human and they can actually drive a mechanically disabled car better than you as well...I will prefer humans who I know have the same limitation on interface as I.

While I don't say remove the single player all together, it should be tailored much better than the borefest that is A Spec in GT5. It's so methodical and boring, the too fearful AI makes matters worse and the fact that Kaz didn't think it made sense to have the AI match your vehicles performance in the harder levels of A Spec. No pacing whatsoever in GT5, which is why I stopped play A Spec altogether. Only online seasonals and mp for this guy, mades loads of money had loads of incredible races, why would I go back to single player?
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Playing by yourself is not anti-social. If I want to be social, I'll turn off my PS3 and go hang out with friends. I do occasionally go online, but with my schedule as of late, it's something I rarely do nowadays. So whenever I go online, I immediately get turned off by all the punters and disconnects.
 
SavageEvil
Honestly MP is where the money is, that whole SP play by yourself bit is old and still kind of anti-social. Who plays by themselves anyway?
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*raises hand* ;)

sumbrownkid is once again the GT Planet sage on the matter. Online play is fine for millions of racers, but it's not something everyone likes for obvious reasons. Both the A-Spec offline and online server system needs to be beefed up so that the online system gives us the quick and easy - and comprehensive - way to find serious servers with clean racers, especially GT Planet hosts.
 
Yeah, I agree that GT5 online is really enjoyable, but only with the right people. I can't stand racing against terrible drivers that overtake in any situation, and at any cost (almost always at the detriment of the other drivers).

But racing events with regulations, etc. are very enjoyable when the drivers are all on the same page and more concerned with clean driving than simply winning.


Dare I say, winning isn't everything? :eek:
 
Matters not what you guys say, it's the way things are going to go from now on. The playing by yourself mentality is slowly eroding into pointlessness. Find how many SP only games there are and you will see that many games that were SP originally are now having MP built it and for obvious reasons MP is built up to be stronger than the SP affair. There isn't much money in SP, you must have the MP added to bolster sales. Fact the vast majority of people like playing against other people.

You say you can't find decent races, but what I noticed is that a lot of people complain about that yet they go into a room and complain about the rules. One guy pops into a room that I was in and it had some driving aids on, he tells the room host to turn off the aids the host doesn't comply and adds light penalties to the room. The guy then grumbles about about the penalties being on then leaves....confused, no idea what he was on about.

Too many elitist hopping online looking for the perfect room, set up your own and stop complaining to hosts to do such and such, it's their room. I have had many good races in random rooms, no room is perfect and many times some idiot will pop in and want to drive backwards when he can't keep up. Big deal, he can be booted by the usually good host and usually has higher than 5 laps per race on a give track.

Sumbrownkid, I didn't know socializing only meant to go outside with people in fact only the verb use of socialize without and object means mingling with people. Many meanings one word don't try to downplay the word as if it doesn't mean online community gaming. What is it with some folks, is there really any need to be like that?
 
Savage E, we're going to have to differ on this. There are plenty of shooters as well as racers which have an extensive offline single player game. For two, Battlefield 3 and Forza 4. Most developers understand SP offline is still important aspect of game design, but some of them cheap out on that part, as GT5 has. You also have to consider how popular adventure, platforming and RPG games are which sometimes have nothing of an online system at all. There's still a huge market for offline gaming. It's not true at all to insist that most games are going that direction, even racers. Every PC sim is going to have an extensive offline single player game. And as I said before, designing and coding racing game offline structures is the easy part of their making. You can create events until you get tired of it, or assume even the most hardcore gamers would.

I fully expect that GT6 is going to have a single player offline structure even bigger than GT4 has, while having an online system more like we're used to. The Playstation Network should be beefed up enough to handle all this traffic by the time GT6 hits, so both sides should be happy.
 
Single player isn't anti social. It's like reading a book. You may (but don't have to) do the activity yourself, but you can also discuss and compare with other people. GTP is a good example. Huge forum built around an "anti-social" single player game that just recently went online.

I also disagree with the idea that there is no money in SP. MGS, Uncharted, Killzone (Except for MGS I've never played them so correct me if I'm off) are based on SP. It's there core. Cross Consoles, Forza is still advertising its SP content pretty heavily. It's not just an online racing game with some AI bots attached.

I personally like MP to take priority, but ideally SP should be high in quality as well. SP does have something to offer, even if it can't be as good as MP.
 
Considering how incredibly unbalanced the game is when it comes to multiplayer credit payouts, I find it funny that people are acting as if single player is holding multiplayer back.
 
I´m with you, OP. I hate multiplayer. Although there are exceptions... But only when I´m playing with my friends in co-op or something similar... Games like RE5 for example, I do enjoy a lot when I play them split-screen co-op. GT5 is boring and frustrating. I quit back in the Prologue days. Too much people that think wining is matter of life and death, and they will do anything to win, even ruinnning your game experience by running you off the track or something. I wouldn´t mind, but only if people had the adequate etiquette, and people who drive in the game just for the joy of it.

Last time I played GT5 online was two years ago when I had GT5 Prologue... GT5, I´m still doubting on playing it online. I enjoy it more as a SP game, even in the experience is short, and reppetitive. (Plus, currently I don´t have a good connection)
 

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