GT5 related: Does multiplayer ruin the SP experience?

[JediRage]

Modern Warfare 1 was the last great single player FPS. Other than that, there are quite a few good SP third person shooters like Uncharted, Red Dead Redemption, Valkyria Chronicles, vanquish etc.

Its amazing that PD didn't even perfect the online experience along with an already broken single player. What can I say? It's probably more down to incompetence.

 

[Bye Ya]

Too much people that think wining is matter of life and death, and they will do anything to win, even ruinnning your game experience by running you off the track or something. I wouldn´t mind, but only if people had the adequate etiquette, and people who drive in the game just for the joy of it.

I know what you mean. I hosted a string of several online races tonight and was just running in a slow NSX enjoying my own experience with the car, and in trying to drive as clean as I could, focusing on getting braking points for the optimal line, etc. But eventually I had to basically babysit and moderate those who were recklessly ruining it for everyone around 1st-5th place just like you mentioned. I eventually resorted to just "watching" the last few races and kicking the punters so that the other people in the room could enjoy themselves.

 

[SuperCobraJet]

Playing by yourself is not anti-social. If I want to be social, I'll turn off my PS3 and go hang out with friends. I do occasionally go online, but with my schedule as of late, it's something I rarely do nowadays. So whenever I go online, I immediately get turned off by all the punters and disconnects.

You can overcome the punters and disconnects by getting with the right people to race, but you can never overcome scheduling conflicts.
They go with the online territory. Neither can you overcome the hours of practice with car setups and driving, it takes to improve and be competitive.
As far as the social part, you paid your money for the console and the game, so play it the way you want to.

Matters not what you guys say, it's the way things are going to go from now on. The playing by yourself mentality is slowly eroding into pointlessness.
There isn't much money in SP, you must have the MP added to bolster sales. Fact the vast majority of people like playing against other people.

There's plenty of money in single player for a good quality well built game.
GT4 sold over 10.5 million copies on the strength of single player alone.

The problem is that MS, Sony, the developers, and publishers are blind with visions of dollar signs from subscriptions, DLC, and other goods and services from which money can be made.
Unfortunately, this comes at the expense of a good single player game, since corners can be cut here and still bring the suckers in clamoring for online.
GT5 is a prime example.

Online Racing is the way forward.

The demise of Single Player has just begun IMHO

Unfortunate also, but probably true.
I just hope someone else recognizes the opportunity for a good single player game and can capitilize on it.

While the online craze seems to be just overtaking the masses, I was racing online ten years ago.
Through numerous games I have played, and always the same scenario of progression.

1st: Seek out and join leaque or group of like minded clean racers.
2nd: Endure for a while but eventually drop out do to "scheduling conflicts" and "shortage of time to practice".

Single player will always have two distinct advantages:
You can play whenever, however and for as long as you wish on your schedule.
You are practicing while you play.

I'm very curious to see with the release of FM4 next month, how they will appoach the single player content, given the trend we are discussing.

Too much people that think wining is matter of life and death, and they will do anything to win, even ruinnning your game experience by running you off the track or something. I wouldn´t mind, but only if people had the adequate etiquette, and people who drive in the game just for the joy of it.

This comment reminds me of something Vince Lombardi said once:

"Winning is not everything, its the only thing."

 

[GTShadowKing]

Fallout guys, Fallout. Nuff said

The problem is that MP is considered the main part of many games, not SP anymore. If companies complement both (Borderlands) and put the efforts required then the conjuction would be better I guess. But no, they want what makes money, not the best experience.

 

[Exorcet]

You can play whenever, however and for as long as you wish on your schedule.
You are practicing while you play.

That's not really exclusive to SP. Maybe the first one is, depending on the situation. In GT5 I've never felt the need to join a group to get good racing. I find it in public lobbies, but not every public lobby is a success.

The second one is always true so long as you're playing the game. I actually think online practice is far more valuable because online tends to be more difficult/competitive/unpredictable than SP.

Fallout guys, Fallout. Nuff said

The problem is that MP is considered the main part of many games, not SP anymore. If companies complement both (Borderlands) and put the efforts required then the conjuction would be better I guess. But no, they want what makes money, not the best experience.

Well another way to think about "wanting money" is giving the consumer what they want. You can't really blame developers if no one cares about a good SP. I'm not saying that no one does, but if that were the case it would only make sense that companies ditched SP.

 

[occasionalracer]

I can't for the life of me understand why some people cling to the idea that SP should need improvement in a racing game. Nobody will ever program A.I. to the point where you have strategic overtaking and real human behaviour (granted we're talking about experienced guys).

PD needs to vastly improve the Online part of the game starting with a ranking system. I see no satisfaction in racing against a calculator these days, even if they have mastered the A.I, the satisfaction and joy is not the same as having an epic race with a bunch of guys from around the world.

 

[PAWEL17]

Multiplayer > Singleplayer. At least in 95% of games. It's the future, face it. With online gaming so readily available and popular, it's not gonna change.

But for those people that despise it?? Im only up for multiplayer if its co-op with your mates, otherwise count me out.
I hope this doesn't happen, lately i bought a copy of ferrari the race expierence and had way too much fun against the AI, and think, that if GT had the same strength in that area, i would still be playing.

 

[Tenacious D]

I can't for the life of me understand why some people cling to the idea that SP should need improvement in a racing game.

I'm not sure what you mean by this. If you mean that A.I. is good enough, this is sort of true. While PC sim bots are all over the map, they're pretty good, so are consoles'. Even GT5 can give you a good offline experience, outside of early braking bots.

But I'm waiting for a racer which has a proper season or career mode, which is what I hope to see in Gran Turismo, hopefully 6. Seasons are something which is in almost every sports game, and should be in many racers, but would take a very gifted game designer to make work online. I don't see how it can, because servers rarely have the same number of racers, or the same people, making the challenge entirely different each race.

This is something which requires a good single player offline game, and something I'm going to be praying that Kazunori pulls off in Gran Turismo, because GT games are the most satisfying. To me, almost forgot that, but many of us here agree, so there.

 

[Slash]

I think there needs to be an even balance between the two. Multiplayer is now the big thing, and we were the fools who didn't see it coming with the big rise of the internet and technology in the past 10 years.

And personally, I'm not sure why all the hate of no matchmaking. I love being to select a lobby I want to be in and not get stuck with idiots. If we had matchmaking, you can kiss cops, drag racing, and all that goodbye because they wouldn't be supported if you had to choose from a list of what gameplay you were looking for before match making started.

If your going to make a game, go all out. Make a strong single player and a stong mulitplayer to go with it. Unfortunantly, single player is going out the window. Poeple like myself like to be able to go online and race against real people, not A.I. Give it time, eventually single player will be phased out and what used to be single player would now be multiplayer. Imagine doing Nurb 24hrs in GT mode with a bunch of other people that planned on doing it.

 

[Tornado]

I can't for the life of me understand why some people cling to the idea that SP should need improvement in a racing game.

You'll note that the title of this game is not Gran Turismo. It is Gran Turismo 5. People want the single player improved because it is severely lacking compared to the other 4 games in the series, and "shut up and play online" is not a solution to that.

 

[Tenacious D]

Imagine doing Nurb 24hrs in GT mode with a bunch of other people that planned on doing it.

Yes, and imagine that you wind up in a clean server with three other people waiting for who knows how long before just starting the race with that, or seeing the other three drop because the field is way too small. And then poking at other clean servers which aren't full before settling on one with seven other people. And add to that the slightly different online physics in GT5 which make racing online annoying in and of itself for many of us, something which is hopefully rectified soon.

This is just one reason why offline is going to remain popular. For whatever reason, the PSN just doesn't seem fast enough, or the GT5 online code is structured to weed out all but a handful of servers, and I've had rotten luck finding a satisfying race in that cramped pool. Some say, "Well, you could beef up the field with co-op bots." Well, now you're right back to the essence of single player, bot A.I.

Fans in the tens of thousands complained long and loud that Battlefield 2 had a rotten puny single player game, which statistically means the vast majority of gamers hated it. DICE heard this clearly, the result being a Battlefield 3 with a single player game which seems to be the most epic in a war game yet. The trailers are stunning. Very few are saying, "Spew that, I just want to play online." Almost everyone is itching to experience these scenes for themselves.

How are racing seasons supposed to work online, when you have to commit to a strict schedule in a league? Who besides teens living at their parent's home can never miss a bunch of races?

With few exceptions, almost every game is going to have a single player aspect to it for the foreseeable future. Especially since, in answer to the original subject, many of us insist that multiplayer has ruined the online experience.

Even with the success of MMORPGs, most RPGs are based mainly on an epic single player game, and this is likely going to continue to be true for shooters, racers, and all other game types. And I have to second what the drunk pony said.

 

[amkobih]

I can't for the life of me understand why some people cling to the idea that SP should need improvement in a racing game

well,some people don't have internet conection on ps3,or have a slow connection,so...

 

[SuperCobraJet]

You'll note that the title of this game is not Gran Turismo. It is Gran Turismo 5. People want the single player improved because it is severely lacking compared to the other 4 games in the series, and "shut up and play online" is not a solution to that.

Well said.

While each format has its merits, online can never substitute for a good, in-depth single player mode.