GT5p physics comparison

[unv412]

Hi, managed to get a good 6 hrs of racing in last night behind a DFP wheel on GT5p.....and I have to say the physics, whilst infinitly better than GT4 and FM2, were just a little bit short of my favourite console games physics........Enthusia.Now I tend to split physics up into Low(0 to 60kph),Mid(60-130kph) and High(130kph +) speed.In the low speed physics GT5p failed to execute proper donut/figure 8 charactaristics but all else seemed ok.But in the Mid speed stuff was where its fell down failing to induce enough lift off oversteer and generally showing very little weight transfer at all.The cars during Mid speed cornered too flat and the tyre dynamics were too abrupt in there transition from grip to slip.The High speed physics continue to excel and are still the benchmark.Given more time to master/get used to GT5p physics i'm sure that I will grow to like them, its just I was expecting more, and at the end of the day found EPR's better understanding of weight transfer/balance, tire dynamics that are more progressive, and realistic suspension control/sway/rol centres much more immersive and rewarding than GT5p.

 

[Perfect Balance]

The cars during Mid speed cornered too flat and the tyre dynamics were too abrupt in there transition from grip to slip.

How abrupt are they if they are "too abrupt"? That transition is already pretty abrupt in real life, and in general becomes more so the higher the tire grip.

I haven't played it, but the videos of drifting seem to look pretty ok.

 

[CoolColJ]

maybe you need a different diff LSD to do donuts...

 

[RedBaron]

unv412, are you talking about Professional physics? This is very good, even compared to GT4, which sometimes uses inertia even more than real world physics does. And now oversteer is possible with all tyre types, not only N types. I'm very satisfied with it, there is room for improvement in colission physics between cars and between car and wall and I hate TCS automatically activating on grass, but on the road, it's just perfect for me.

 

[unv412]

How abrupt are they if they are "too abrupt"? That transition is already pretty abrupt in real life, and in general becomes more so the higher the tire grip.

I haven't played it, but the videos of drifting seem to look pretty ok.

in ZO6 transition is pretty snappy (ok its pretty much a supacar with masses of lateral grip) even at slowish 2nd gear corners but my thing is even with everything off (no accelarator/no brakes) and countasteered she still loops.Maybe its on race tyres during B class?The drifting videos are truely awsum and will spur me on to just try harder I guess.

I'm using Pro Physics and DFP and the LSD is working its just the inertia during donuts just aint right.

Anyone played EPR to compare GT5p with?

 

[Greycap]

But in the Mid speed stuff was where its fell down failing to induce enough lift off oversteer and generally showing very little weight transfer at all.The cars during Mid speed cornered too flat and the tyre dynamics were too abrupt in there transition from grip to slip.

Get a Ford GT, equip it with S3 tyres and take it for a ride. If you fail to find lift off oversteer or to get weight transfer - or get flat cornering - I can only wonder how you're driving.

The main problem may be that you're comparing to Enthusia which has a very high oversteer bias on the cars. You're not getting oversteer at will with just about every car in GT5P so you automatically think it's wrong... but is it actually that?

 

[CoolColJ]

Yeah you should be comparing to real life not other games

 

[unv412]

Get a Ford GT, equip it with S3 tyres and take it for a ride. If you fail to find lift off oversteer or to get weight transfer - or get flat cornering - I can only wonder how you're driving.

The main problem may be that you're comparing to Enthusia which has a very high oversteer bias on the cars. You're not getting oversteer at will with just about every car in GT5P so you automatically think it's wrong... but is it actually that?

true that EPR has heaps of oversteer, but I never said GT5p didnt.Its just the way it doesnt fully transfer the weight on lift off (RX8 was dissapointing).I'll have to the try Ford GT (mid engined usually does oversteer).I understand that standard FR cars will understeer mostly when on the limit (manufacturers build this in for safety reasons) but even the most terminally prone understeering cars can be made to oversteer with the right boysterous driving techneques (eg my company car 07 Ford Falcon)👍.

As for comparisons to real life with GT5p........that pretty much EPR job

 

[Greycap]

"Fully transferring" the weight is certainly something that doesn't happen when lifting off, the weight transfer is actually quite mild unless heavy engine braking is involved. You only get serious weight transfer under full braking and in heavier cars (anything over 1300 kg) that can easily lead to overloading the front tyres which leads to, who would have guessed, understeer. High levels of braking oversteer is very rare in modern road cars just for safety reasons.

 

[an1mal_69]

try the down hill hairpin on 'eiger' and say theres no weight shift there, when transitioning from one corner to an opposite is a true weight shift senario..lifting off mid corner isnt really, as most of the weight is acting in that direction already, by lifting off your probably only shifting around 10%, depending on the layout and model of vehicle

 

[amar212]

Do not forget to turn-off the ABS o "zero" too, it could help in getting the perception of true mass/weight-transfer in phisycs-model a bit..

 

[unv412]

thanks guys, i will try all the thing you'se have mentioned when my next date with PS3 comes around, as currently I have to go to my cousins place (he own the PS3) to make a night of it (probably another 6 hours + alcahol should make his and my wife supa happy lol).Whats the breakdown with the tyre types (eg n3 etc) and which ones are closest to real life?

 

[amar212]

1 is hardest, 2 is mid, while 3 is soft compound of each tire group.

N type tires are "everyday" tires - let's call them "comfort" class - like the tires that you'd be supplied with when you'd buy a normal car in RL. Those tires are not designed for track, however you can see what could happen if you'd drive on track your Mini Cooper on limit. Worth noticing is that N tires should be choosen not by factor "I'll put N1 tires on Lexus because that's like it is in RL", because Lexus would hardly come with N1 tires, more with N2 or even N3. In short, N-class should be considered as closest to "real-life" but only when speaking about simulating what would happen if you'd go hard-core racing on the limit with "stock" tires.

S tires are "sports" tires, not exactly like the tires you would get when buying high-performance car like F430 or Porsche 911 (you'd probably get something equal to N3 tires), but more like those expensive performance tires you'd buy afterwards for showing off at local pub. However, new M3 or 911 GT2 are shipping in real-life dealerships with counterpart of S class tires (both supplied with Michelin Pilot Sport or Michelin Pilot Sport Cup tires). Michelin Pilot Sport would be something like S1/S2 tire, while Sport Cup certanly like S3 tire.

Pilot Sport PS2

Pilot Sport Cup

Those are more track-designed tires, they are not slick, and they provide more grip than N tires. However, it would be unfair to call them "not close to real-life" because you'd get increased grip and speed with same tire class in real life.

R tires are slik-racing tyres.