Hand-brake drifting (side-drift)

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mugen_s2002

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I'm using feint and braking drift, but I can't get the dramatic angle I want, so I want to try out hand brake drift. But the car either understeers or sping out when I pull the hand brake. When's a good time to pull the hand brake, what can I do to recover the car when it's going to spin out. thx. 👍
 
From the little information I'm dealing with, I'm betting you could fix this little problem a few ways, the first and easiest is putting a lower grade tire on the rear of the car, N2s or N1s -- although this won't help you control, the car much better while in the drift. With an S2K, you might want to bump the rear toe down to -2 (maybe -3) and have at least 4.0 rear camber, these settings reflect my own personal style, so I can't say for sure that it'll work. The last thing I have to suggest is, Psuedo-Oversteer--put a wing on it, then put the back end at 15, the front at 5-10. Use this along side a double feint, whereas you have a slow gradual feint to the inside of the turn, then feint back to the ouside, adn finally, bouncing the car back into the drift--this method is tricky, and often contributes to powerslides (not drifts), but with proper courntersteer and throttle input, it works like a charm.

I'm assuming your using an S2000 (because of you name),

</Vin>:sly:

PS- Stay away from the E-Brake, it's better not to iniate drifts with them, only extend and modify drifts.
 
Thx for the reply. I'm just trying to learn a new technique of drifting. I know the RMR GTO has a modify hand brake to help drifing, so I want to try it out. Can you elaborate on the double feint technique? For a right turn, if turn the wheel to the left, and quicky to the right, when the car starts to slide, I countersteer. That's how I do feint drifts. What's the different on a double feint?
 
here is a nice fient for you.

I dont think the handbrakes is neccary unless your in a FF. a good fient/braking will always be sufficient
 
mugen_s2002
Thx for the reply. I'm just trying to learn a new technique of drifting. I know the RMR GTO has a modify hand brake to help drifing, so I want to try it out. Can you elaborate on the double feint technique? For a right turn, if turn the wheel to the left, and quicky to the right, when the car starts to slide, I countersteer. That's how I do feint drifts. What's the different on a double feint?
Click to expand...

If it's a right turn, you go in mid-speed and slowly move the car to the right side, then move the car back to the outside, than back to the inside again, but this time the suspension will easily be overloaded making the car "bounce" into the drift.

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|Path of Car|
|Track........|
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I'm using periods to fill the space because the forum automatically removes blank spaces (more than 2 in a row).

.......__________
...../...________>
.../..../....______
./.../..../
|....\....|
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I reccomend weight-transfer. Get the weight of the car transfered to the outside-rear tire and tap your handbrake button. The 'butt' should slide out; even if you've got the super softs. The rest is up to practice.
 
mugen_s2002
Should I wait till I feel the understeer then pull the hand brake, or should I pull the hand brake in corner entry?
Click to expand...

Don't pull it.

But if you feel you must, generally speaking it's at corner entry. Unless we're talking AWD where it can be a very useful tool mid-drift.
 
vinsion
If it's a right turn, you go in mid-speed and slowly move the car to the rught side, then move the car back to the outside, than back to the inside again, but this time the suspension will easily be overloaded making the car "bounce" into the drift.

___________
|Path of Car|
|Track........|
------------

I'm using periods to fill the space because the forum automatically removes blank spaces (more than 2 in a row).

.......__________
...../...________>
.../..../....______
./.../..../
|....\....|
|......\..|
|.......|.|
|....../..|
|.....|...|
|.....^..|
Click to expand...

I will try this technique when I get home. thx.
 
Mugen, it sounds like you're looking for a short cut that quite literally isn't there. The ebrake is not an effective way to shift the weight. Feinting, braking, Lift off oversteer are all much better ways then using the ebrake. In an S2000, you shouldn't have any major problems swinging the end out if you get it tuned well(check the drift settings depot). The challenge should be keeping that grip machine sideways. :sly:
 
I know most people consider hand brake cheating, but I watched a video of the Blitz ER34 (forgot the poster's name), he admitted using hand brake, but the drift angle is really good. So I'm looking to doing something similar. ER34 drifter (or anyone that use hand brake), if you read this thread, please share some of your techniques.
 
mugen_s2002
Is there other S2000 that are easier to drift with? I have N3/N2 tires (f/r).
Click to expand...

First, mixing tires is bad. I know drifters IRL do it. But in the GAME there is no need. Just put N2 or N1 all the way around.

All of the S2000's are driftable. Thought the non-tuner versions are a bit easier. It's about how they are setup. In there original setup they are set to stick to the road like glue. So you need to tweak out the spring rates, camber, toe and stabilizers to allow for more grip up front and easier weight shifting. This is probably what's giving you so much trouble right now.

TankSpanker, can you give some suggestions on settings. I'd appreciate it! :)
 
Swift
First, mixing tires is bad. I know drifters IRL do it. But in the GAME there is no need. Just put N2 or N1 all the way around.

All of the S2000's are driftable. Thought the non-tuner versions are a bit easier. It's about how they are setup. In there original setup they are set to stick to the road like glue. So you need to tweak out the spring rates, camber, toe and stabilizers to allow for more grip up front and easier weight shifting. This is probably what's giving you so much trouble right now.

TankSpanker, can you give some suggestions on settings. I'd appreciate it! :)
Click to expand...

what, me? :sly: I think breaker is the guy you want - he's done some good drifting in some S2000's

lemme just fire up my game - i had an S2000 i was working on a week or so ago

[reserved for settings suggestions]

ok, fired up the game
i had a stock '01 Honda S2000 Type V on N2's and was drifting it on autumn ring mini reverse with relative ease.....didnt want to fishtail too much or anything. quite stable. It did require a decent amount of weight shifting though.
259hp
no weight reductions
nothing but N2's and an oil change
(i bought it with 10km on the clock, so a chassis refresh may be needed for others)
oh, and its red

anyways, i bought racing suspension to see if I could make it more slide-happy

ok, did 12 quick laps or so and found the drifting to be improved slightly by the following changes to the suspension:
springs: 6.4 | 5.8 (no change from when racing suspension is equipped)
ride height: 95mm | 95mm
shock bound: 4 | 4
shock rebound: 8 | 4
camber: 2.5 | 0.8
toe angle: 0 | -1
stabilizers: 4 | 2

the front shock bound can be raised slightly without penalty, i have it set as low as i do because you can attack the curbs harder with it. The car jumped around on me a little bit more on the small course when it was higher.

in this state the car is quite happy to drift by lift off and feinting techniques (and yes, the ebrake still works too). Braking drift is less effective, but i attribute that to the lack of racing brakes and a balance controller. Power over is possible through some of the tighter corners on the course, but more power would likely be required for a larger course with wider turns.
 
mugen_s2002
Thx for the replies. Mixing tires would make the rear slide easier tho, what negative effect can it have?
Click to expand...

Balance, it's all balance. I thought mixing tires would work. It does at first, but it is harder to control. You could try my settings. Look for it on the last page of the settings post.
 
mugen_s2002
Thx for the replies. Mixing tires would make the rear slide easier tho, what negative effect can it have?
Click to expand...

Delphic Reason has given a much better explaination then I ever could HERE

Basically, you're messing up the traction coeficients between the tires and that jacks up the balance of the car.

Hammershot: Well said 👍
 
HammerShot
Balance, it's all balance. I thought mixing tires would work. It does at first, but it is harder to control. You could try my settings. Look for it on the last page of the settings post.
Click to expand...

correct

and personally i find it hard to tune a car where the maximum attainable grip level varies from one end to the other.
 
mugen_s2002
I know most people consider hand brake cheating, but I watched a video of the Blitz ER34 (forgot the poster's name), he admitted using hand brake, but the drift angle is really good. So I'm looking to doing something similar. ER34 drifter (or anyone that use hand brake), if you read this thread, please share some of your techniques.
Click to expand...
I use the feinting technique, not because its easy, but because it works. I think thats the best way, after that just try to keep sliding.
 
Usually I only use the e-brake when I'm going around a corner too fast, with too much understeer. I usually just tap the O button lightly and then floor it to create more oversteer, then use throttle control and countersteer to adjust the angle and speed.
 
mugen_s2002
Should I wait till I feel the understeer then pull the hand brake, or should I pull the hand brake in corner entry?
Click to expand...

If your understeering, it may already be too late. Remember the front tires are only for hinting at what direction you want the car to go. Accellerate before the corner in the power band, stearing early to compenstate for your new enterance angle; wait for the screen to stop tilting (indicating maximum weight transfer; try doing it on a car with stock suspension first, it's more apparent); get off the gas quckly for a moment; tap the handbrake; get back on the gas. Down-shift to keep in the power band, and counter-steer as neccissary. If you start to under-steer again, just pull the handbrake.

When to pull the handbreak is highly dependent on the type of corner. For a decreasing radius corner you're going to start eariler, that others.

But that's just how I do it.
 
I prefer to use the feint motion technique but I'll use wat ever suits the drift in order to keep me goin. I'll be releasing a drift video all about using the E-Brake in about a day or so, im still collecting demonsstration footage. Hopefully this will help you out on E-brake timing
 
The only place I see the e-brake being useful is on short straights to link the corners, but stay fully sideways. Like the small straight on El Capitan before the uphill left into the tunnel. But everyone does things differently, so if it helps you, use it till you don't need it anymore, or rarely.
 
i first learned this using the RE-RX7. if you are using a steering wheel, this will be really easy. since jgtc cars have plenty of grip at default settings, it is good to start out with it. to drift using the oh-ch1t button, you need to find your optimal speed. in trial mountain for example, there's sort of an s-curve after the long long left corner (going normal, not reverse). you really need to control your speed there for the oh-ch1t button. now for using it. attain the right speed(this will adapt after a couple of laps), let go of the gas and hold the O (hence, oh-ch1t) button and slightly turn your wheel to the direction for which you want to go. do not attempt to step on the gas when you are pressing O. that will just create oversteer. once you feel it sliding, counter-steer. on 900 degree steering wheels, you need to turn about 45-90 degrees, depending on your speed entry(you'll later go beyond 90 for high angles). as soon as the car starts to grip back in motion, floor the gas so you get wheel spin so you can still slide. determining when the car will slightly begin to grip back takes awhile to get used to. sometimes you end up gripping and flying towards the other way due to counter-steer, or if you do it too early you'll spin out like how anyone would.

if you strictly play tsukuba, the very long right corner (in normal direction) is complex. i've played both 4wd and FR using all of the r32s as an example, and both are very difficult in this corner. it requires using the O button several times during the sequence of sliding. i normally slide into the corner to get some angle to start out, and then, before the car starts to get back into a straight position, i have to time the use of my e-brake and how long i'm suppose to use it. this corner feels like the real deal. i go drifting at Willow Springs in California with my real car, so i'm a little used to the "new" physics in gt4. i wont get into that though since it's sort of silly to bring it up anyways. it takes time for me to sink in what to do and where, but it's getting there.

one thing i have to note though is not to turn your 900 degree wheel to full lock. that will just whiplash you as mentioned earlier. once you have A LOT of speed and control, which is rare in tsukuba and trial mountain, full lock will be necessary for the high angle drifts. the only places where i think full lock is actually usable is on that long corner in tsukuba and in trial mountain left turn before the left turn entering the bridge. since you can blast your way in, you'll have so much speed. i will post a video sometime. my pvr lags though...

to the above poster, u look guudd. s2k's rock. i want to buy one soon (a real one) but drifto take all of my $ away ='(
 
Ooooh Burned!

As for using the E-brake, Yeah I'll admit I use it. But not very often, only when really necessary. Like when I am about to hit the wall(which is pretty often :dopey: ). When it comes down to it, it is part of the car if its there and you need it use it. I won't rip on anyone who does.
 

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