I dont understand what people want...

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Dynablaster

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Dynablaster
Just to introduce myself in regards to my skills in this GT TT. My current best time is 1:39:671. In that sense I am a GT noob but I am satisfied with it. I am HAVING FUN.

I don't understand people's frustrations with this demo. They want to have best times in the world yet they don't want it to be hard to get to that skill...What's the point then if anyone can drive that good?

I hear how Forza isn't as frustrating and unforgiving like GT has become and other racing sims...Again I will repeat-I am nothing special but I slowly learn and I drive at my limits. I don't go attacking every corner as the best drivers. I drive as my skills permit me. If you can't finish 5 clear laps in a row around 1:41:00 then you are really bad player...

That's the whole point of me getting GT5. I want to drive with people at my level and admire those that are way above mine. I want to have fun and I am having fun more than with any racer.

The point of GT5 is to let you drive your dream cars as real as PS3 can deliver it and if you can't accept your own limitations then I feel sorry for you. Instead of moaning and complaining you could be having fun just DRIVING. GT is the BEST package that has something for everyone. "The drive of your life" :)

Oh and another thing; There is no such thing as driving simulator in a sense that it matters. These are all GAMES. Here is what I mean: Until there is a game and the driving setup(with seat, wheel,...) from which I can transfer on to the REAL TRACK,REAL CAR;without any practice beside virtual; and repeat the same lap time in real life; then that's a REAL DRIVING SIMULATOR.
Until then lets just enjoy the game...
 
I haven't really heard people saying its too hard to get a good time. I've heard them say its disappointing because they must have had their hopes up, saying that the graphics are unimpressive and that it was an odd move for PD to release the TT demo instead of a proper demo. However I think most people realise that if you want to be in the top 20 of any racing game, you have to be very skilled and/or waste a lot of hours playing, just like anything else in life.
 
Well, perhaps I've heard wrong, but what I've heard is that people think it's too hard compared to real racing. Most notably, the normal car.
 
Dynablaster
If you can't finish 5 clear laps in a row around 1:41:00 then you are really bad player...
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How is it that if you cannot do 5 clear laps in a row around 1:41:00, they must be a bad player? 1:41:00 is very respectable for anybody with a modest interest in the GT series. 1:41:00 is a steady clean lap, with lots of room for improvement if they choose to put the effort in to learn how to race a car on its limits - it does not mean they are bad players. Herein lies the problem with the time trial demo...most people do not want to learn how to race a car properly - they want to FEEL like they are racing a car properly without needing to learn the intricacies, just like somebody doing a tandem parachute jump - they want the thrill of the jump, but don't necessarily want to bother training.

Following my initial hatred of the time trial, I stuck with it and am still only hovering around the 1:40:00 mark, and like you, I'm having fun. However, for a LOT of people, it is NOT fun getting to a level where you can break the 1:40:00 barrier. I'm not a good player by any stretch, so I would argue that your current 1:39:671 also makes you "not a good player", because you are still way off the pace.

I agree, until a driving simulator inflicts pain, makes you break limbs or die when you crash, there will never be a true driving simulator. All a "simulator" can ever do is help you learn the basics, learn the track, and become a competent racer within the realms of guaranteed safety and lack of physical exertion. Swap that safe cocoon for a real car on a real track, and no matter how accurate the simulator was, or how good you were with it, fear will always get in the way until you learn to overcome that too, and you can only do that on one place - a real race track. Then there is the small matter of physical fitness...

I admire your attempt at getting everyone on your side by playing the diplomatic card and telling people to just "enjoy the game", but for what? All you are doing is admitting you fully understand how people can get frustrated with it, but ignore that side of things because you want to make friends in a forum?!

Forza this and more forgiving that...yes, because if you actually look at the majority of gamers who enjoy racing games, they are not race drivers in real life and do not want a full-on simulation experience. I'm not saying a "game" should not provide that full simulation experience for those who want it, but the fact is, if you ignore the majority then you are asking for trouble. Good job that the final release will have all kinds of different physics modes and assists eh? Still doesn't hide the fact that this release did not do PD and SONY any favours in the marketing department, no matter how much fun you might be having.

This release also highlights just how important a balanced off-line single player mode is.
 
TokyoDrift
How is it that if you cannot do 5 clear laps in a row around 1:41:00, they must be a bad player? 1:41:00 is very respectable for anybody with a modest interest in the GT series. 1:41:00 is a steady clean lap, with lots of room for improvement if they choose to put the effort in to learn how to race a car on its limits - it does not mean they are bad players. Herein lies the problem with the time trial demo...most people do not want to learn how to race a car properly - they want to FEEL like they are racing a car properly without needing to learn the intricacies, just like somebody doing a tandem parachute jump - they want the thrill of the jump, but don't necessarily want to bother training.

Following my initial hatred of the time trial, I stuck with it and am still only hovering around the 1:40:00 mark, and like you, I'm having fun. However, for a LOT of people, it is NOT fun getting to a level where you can break the 1:40:00 barrier. I'm not a good player by any stretch, so I would argue that your current 1:39:671 also makes you "not a good player", because you are still way off the pace.

I agree, until a driving simulator inflicts pain, makes you break limbs or die when you crash, there will never be a true driving simulator. All a "simulator" can ever do is help you learn the basics, learn the track, and become a competent racer within the realms of guaranteed safety and lack of physical exertion. Swap that safe cocoon for a real car on a real track, and no matter how accurate the simulator was, or how good you were with it, fear will always get in the way until you learn to overcome that too, and you can only do that on one place - a real race track. Then there is the small matter of physical fitness...

I admire your attempt at getting everyone on your side by playing the diplomatic card and telling people to just "enjoy the game", but for what? All you are doing is admitting you fully understand how people can get frustrated with it, but ignore that side of things because you want to make friends in a forum?!

Forza this and more forgiving that...yes, because if you actually look at the majority of gamers who enjoy racing games, they are not race drivers in real life and do not want a full-on simulation experience. I'm not saying a "game" should not provide that full simulation experience for those who want it, but the fact is, if you ignore the majority then you are asking for trouble. Good job that the final release will have all kinds of different physics modes and assists eh? Still doesn't hide the fact that this release did not do PD and SONY any favours in the marketing department, no matter how much fun you might be having.

This release also highlights just how important a balanced off-line single player mode is.
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OK Maybe 1:41:00 is still little too much(around 1.42 would be more fair) but then again if I could pull it off in 5 days of playing(played an hour a day maybe) then its not that hard. And best of everything its SATISFYING.
And Gran Turismo 4 has been to me like this TT. It was hard for me and I never reached a point where I could say. "I am good." And yet I enjoyed it.

So I don't understand the frustration of people cus THIS IS GT like its always been...It always evolved into more "hard to play" game. As you say the full game will have tons of options and you will be able to make it hard for yourself as you like. It seems people forgot that you don't have to play with professional driving physics but I think its not even that, its the fact that they don't want some arcade stuff, they want the real thing :) but as you say they don't want to put the effort in...Hence the frustration...

I think this TT is a great move cus it does whats its supposed to do and I am sure the "real" demo will come before actual release.

BTW Where did I say I am a good player??? I said I was a noob :)
 
Indy road course is hideous, and takes 50% of the enjoyment from the demo straigtaway, I've never liked it since I first saw it in real-life.

The other 50% enjoyment is taken away because I believe that it attaining anything close to the top times requires a G25/G27 set up. Easing the throttle and brakes, and matching that to steering input, with a standard 6-axis... it's so much more hit and miss than I believe the proper wheel set-up to be.

I played it on xmas day, I went from (approx) 18,000th to 15,000th, to 7000th to 5000th, in the UK rankings for the normal car, and I gave up the same day... not because I've done my best, but because I got bored of it... and even with persaverence I don't think I'd be anywhere near the top. I'm fine with that because I know what this 'demo' is about, but I wonder how many newer fans might be put off the full game because this demo is difficult, and only 0.002% of people are anywhere near posting a top time...
 
The other 50% enjoyment is taken away because I believe that it attaining anything close to the top times requires a G25/G27 set up.
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I know a certain member here who will disagree with you. :lol:
 
MatskiMonk
The other 50% enjoyment is taken away because I believe that it attaining anything close to the top times requires a G25/G27 set up. Easing the throttle and brakes, and matching that to steering input, with a standard 6-axis... it's so much more hit and miss than I believe the proper wheel set-up to be.
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I agree with this to an extend.

I suspect that I'd personally be happy to continue using the joypad in GT - after all, although I'm not quick enough to get anywhere in the Academy rankings with the controller I'm quick enough in online races and I'm quick enough to defeat the AI. I also enjoy GT's graphics, physics and features.

All that said, after just a week or so of playing it using my brother's G25, it's so much more fun with a wheel. The physics are good enough that you can drive the cars like you would a real one and this brings fun and challenge in equal measure.

It's been a while since I've been bothered about being too quick - I know too many people now who are much better than I am! For me now the appeal of GT is to have fun with it, and I reckon that the best way for me to do that is purchase a wheel. I'll be leaving this until the full game comes out though...
 
Calcifer12
Well, perhaps I've heard wrong, but what I've heard is that people think it's too hard compared to real racing. Most notably, the normal car.
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Normal cars do not make good race cars. That's why race cars, even if based on a road chassis, are heavily modified.
homeforsummer
If real racing was easy, we'd all be racing drivers...
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👍 Just look at how many offs and spins there are in a Formula One practice session. The cars have tons of grip, but that doesn't make them easy to drive.
 
i agree on most except for this ... "If you can't finish 5 clear laps in a row around 1:41:00 then you are really bad player...".

There is always room for improvement, just because you can't make 1:41 does not make you a bad player, it just means that you need to keep at it. I'm now at 1:42 :)
 
I think everything under 1:40 is good. ;)
However there is something missing in this demo and GT5P, I'm not really sure what, but I guess it's FFB ... in previous GTs you'd always get a warning before something happens, this is completely gone IMO. Maybe this is more realistic, or maybe not, it's definitely less "fun".
Also in other GTs I could always improve my times, I just had to put some effort and voila, magically improved my time. This isn't working in the demo for me, so that's rather frustrating for others too i guess...
 
I think my '39 is just good. I have a lot of fun power sliding when exiting a turn with the turned Z. And with my set (a Driving Force [GT3 version, you know?] putted between my legs) it's just good.

Have FUN guys!!!
 
It should really have been a combination of the two... "If real racing was easy and wasn't so expensive..."
 
Dynablaster
I think this TT is a great move cus it does whats its supposed to do and I am sure the "real" demo will come before actual release.

BTW Where did I say I am a good player??? I said I was a noob :)
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I think a "real" demo has to come before the release date in order to prove to people that the graphics we have been seeing in promo videos are in fact real, damage is real, the driving experience (difficulty) can be tweaked to your liking, and using a pad is perfectly feasible. In other words, something that can appeal to the masses rather than just the few hardcore sim racers out there!

Granted, you did say you were a noob with the time you had, but then you proceeded to say that if you cannot make 1:41:00 5 times in a row, you are a really bad player. 1:41:00 is not a bad time at all, and anything sub-1:40:00 is, in my opinion, very good.

I still stand by the fact that SONY and PD could have done a lot more to educate people into what this download is really all about. If it blatantly said in advance that physics are fixed on pro, the driving experience is skewed towards sim racers with wheel setups, it used an old graphics build (if applicable), and that GT5 would be much more configurable, there would be a lot less whining going on.

There is also the added frustration of people realising just how much they don't know about thrashing a car around a race track. Beating AI and a few people online in a race is one thing, but it's a bit of a wake-up call when you struggle like mad after hours and hours in a time trial to reach your limit, knowing you need to find another 5 seconds or whatever to come anywhere near the top times.
 
I'm enjoying improving in the GT5 Demo.

I do not believe you should drive faster then a certain time to be good.
It depends on your age, set-up and experience. That is why GTP works with Divisions, so you can race peers and evolve.

Yes a better set-up like any wheel will allow you to put down better times.
Unfair for those that can not afford it.
Fair for the Nissan GT Academy, because the real car also uses pedals and wheels.

Yes I have a wheel and yes I suffer and I'm no good, losing against many 6-axis players with that are better.

Where in GT5p a little mistake made me lose time, but I could correct, continue behind my ghost and learn on the rest of the track; I do understand that the restarts I need in in the GT5 Academy demo are less amusing. I restart since I can not recuperate the slips (be it from slightly touching the grass or steering and accelerating wrongly) in a reasonable time, spinning round and off the tarmac and not getting to the track over the grass.

However when I do a series of good times, with subtle braking, progressive accelerating and pure lines, I feel like an artist on the track which I did not have in other simulations.
Yes more and hard work in this demo, yes more rewarding in the end.
 
homeforsummer
Hear hear 👍
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homeforsummer
If real racing was easy, we'd all be racing drivers...
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homeforsummer
It should really have been a combination of the two... "If real racing was easy and wasn't so expensive..."
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True, True, True, VEEEEEEEEEEERY TRUE! 👍👍👍👍👍. I agree with everything you guys said, and of course, the OP.

Dynablaster
...My current best time is 1:39:671. In that sense I am a GT noob but I am satisfied with it...If you can't finish 5 clear laps in a row around 1:41:00 then you are really bad player...
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Well, I can finish 3 clean laps in a row around 1'44-46 so thank you for calling me useless. But, differently from the noobs ranting about GT5D, I'm a good loser and I know that 2 weeks of not-so-constant playing wont make me a pro. That's all my driving experience right there. So yeah, I'm useless, sadly.
 
Think about it, guys. Do you have any idea of the amount of hours the top 250 players have put into GT over the years? I play GT a lot and I don't think I've put in 25% of the driving time of some of those guys. Those are the kind of sick people that actually prefer driving stock Minis over Corvette C6R's. Don't compare yourself to them. I, for one, am happy with my 1'38.3 and have given up hope of trying to break into the 37's. I just play to have fun. I'm not even thinking about purchasing a wheel either. The control pad has been good to me. Hopefully, Polyphony will have another couple of demo TT's for us after this one is finished.
 
CarBastard
True, True, True, VEEEEEEEEEEERY TRUE! 👍👍👍👍👍. I agree with everything you guys said, and of course, the OP.



Well, I can finish 3 clean laps in a row around 1'44-46 so thank you for calling me useless. But, differently from the noobs ranting about GT5D, I'm a good loser and I know that 2 weeks of not-so-constant playing wont make me a pro. That's all my driving experience right there. So yeah, I'm useless, sadly.
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Yeah we are useless:grumpy: I say me also cus my form dropped, I cant even get close to my personal best, granted I havent played it much last couple of days...As you say "2 weeks of not-so-constant playing" wont make us great drivers. But we will be good enough when GT5 comes out and when only game that I will play will be GT5:)
 
Vince_Fiero
However when I do a series of good times, with subtle braking, progressive accelerating and pure lines, I feel like an artist on the track which I did not have in other simulations.
Yes more and hard work in this demo, yes more rewarding in the end.
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👍
 
Some people on here call themselves GT fans but they complain about one thing or another that isnt up to their standards. I dont think thats the way a GT fan should act. In my opinion a GT fan shouls be happy with what KY gives us. I bet even if KY gave us his GT that he dreams about a lot of people will have something to complain about.
 
There is no such thing as a lap time that makes you a bad player, only a bad racer. What makes you a bad racer is not trying to improve your lap time, being satisfied with mistakes. As soon as youre satisfied with your time you are no longer "racing", youre playing. And, well, a bad player is someone who has stopped racing and is complaining about the game.
 
steve30x
Some people on here call themselves GT fans but they complain about one thing or another that isnt up to their standards. I dont think thats the way a GT fan should act. In my opinion a GT fan shouls be happy with what KY gives us. I bet even if KY gave us his GT that he dreams about a lot of people will have something to complain about.
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In my opinion, people should be free to express their views on how they perceive things without being ridiculed for it. The time trial is tough to get a decent time on, this has not met with many peoples expectations, and so they have every right to state their piece. If you as a "true GT fan" wish to accept anything that KY produces without question, then I feel sorry for you. Having said that, I'm sure you would be quick to express your dissatisfaction if GT5 ended up way off the promised mark.

If you have your favourite music artist, and one year they produce an album that you really don't like much, should you listen to it repeatedly anyway just because you feel you have to because it's your favourite artist? Maybe you would, but I know I wouldn't. I make my decisions based on the product itself, not the people or the brand behind it.
 

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