I have a question about classic race cars and manual shifting.

[DesertPenguin09]

Did they all have a clutch that it used like in a road car? I'm playing sim racers Project Cars and Assetto Corsa and I like to immerse myself as much as possible. When I look down at the driver's feet they aren't going to a clutch pedal. Is this normal in some race cars or should I always be using the clutch?

 

[TheCracker]

Did they all have a clutch that it used like in a road car? I'm playing sim racers Project Cars and Assetto Corsa and I like to immerse myself as much as possible. When I look down at the driver's feet they aren't going to a clutch pedal. Is this normal in some race cars or should I always be using the clutch?

A lot of older race cars that have a manual pattern gearbox, rather than a sequential box like most modern race cars do, will have dog gears rather than synchromesh gears like a manual pattern road car will have. Dog gears are designed so you don't have to use the clutch to change gears - you just need to momentarily lift or tap the clutch break the engine load so the gear cog can slot in. The clutch will need to be used to get off the line though.

 

[DesertPenguin09]

Okay, but what is a dog gear and what's a synchromech gear? Otherwise I get that some cars you could clutch-lessly shift?

 

[TheCracker]

Okay, but what is a dog gear and what's a synchromech gear? Otherwise I get that some cars you could clutch-lessly shift?

Without getting too technical each synchromesh gear has a ring next to it that allows the smooth transition between selecting gears that you experience in a road car. A dog gear doesn't have this ring so allows the actual gear ring to be wider and therefore stronger. The plus of this is that the gearbox can take more power. The negative is that gear changes have to be precise and accurate if you don't want to miss changes.

 

[DesertPenguin09]

Gotcha, now to research every car before I drive it to see what kind of gears it had. Sometimes it's just insane the amount of mental work that goes into downshifting and braking and keeping the car steady with only one hand on the wheel... it's nuts.

 

[mwoodski]

Nearly every single racecar will have a dogbox, and every modern-ish road car will have syncros.

 

[Tired Tyres]

Also if you are able to check old results you'll find "Gearbox" or "Engine" listed as the reason for a LOT of retirements. Old school manuals caused big problems.

 

[DesertPenguin09]

I'm going to turn on damage but only Performance Impacting and see what happens when I mess up a lot

 

[TenEightyOne]

Many old manual gearboxes also require double de-clutching, not sure if that's in the simulations... it's a stinker in real life...

 

[twitcher]

And doesn't a dog box only allow for clutchless upshifts...I thought you still needed to clutch them to downshift.

Many old manual gearboxes also require double de-clutching, not sure if that's in the simulations... it's a stinker in real life...

I learned to drive in my dad's 1968 Landrover. It was like driving a tractor double clutching into and out of every gear. Its hard enough bouncing down the road at 70km/h, I can't imagine having to do it at racing speed

 

[DesertPenguin09]

I watched a video recently about how double clutching is smoother on your gearbox when you actually have to care about it in real life. I didn't think much of it since games don't matter, but still. I'm curious if PCars and Assetto Corsa properly modeled double clutching

 

[twitcher]

I watched a video recently about how double clutching is smoother on your gearbox when you actually have to care about it in real life. I didn't think much of it since games don't matter, but still. I'm curious if PCars and Assetto Corsa properly modeled double clutching

I'm pretty sure double clutching is only easier on wear in a conventional transmission, it's not necessary with a syncromesh transmission - eliminating the need to double clutch was one of the main reasons the syncromesh was developed. Double clutching a syncromesh just has the effect of putting twice the use on the moving parts.

 

[TenEightyOne]

I watched a video recently about how double clutching is smoother on your gearbox when you actually have to care about it in real life.

Perhaps that's technically true, I don't know... but I can tell you that our venerable Ulysse has 140,000 miles on the clock and it's never had a new clutch*. Many of those miles were with Mrs. Ten driving... she's fast and precise but she changes gears like a gorilla on acid.

*Touch wood