Is the triangle button tap fair play?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Touring Mars
  • 25 comments
  • 3,223 views
Touring Mars

Touring Mars

ツーリング マルス
Staff Emeritus
Messages
31,379
Scotland
Edinburgh
Messages
GTP_Mars
The discovery of the 'clutch' gearchange in the GT series raises an interesting issue. The phenomenon, tapping the triangle button to illicit a gear change instead of using the regular manual transmission controls, has already recently been discussed by the likes of Arwin and Sphinx (see these threads -

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=49642
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=48174),

But it's the implications for lap-time comparisons and racing that I'm interested in here. Using a method that significantly affects lap-times would render any competition (in what ever form that may be) inherently unfair, unless everyone used the same technique... I tried it out for the first time last night, and was pretty astonished by how much of an advantage you gain from it. For example, it took me forever to Gold a licence test (actually a Prologue test, no. 6), but last night, using the triangle button tap gear change, I golded the test on my first attempt, and set a new personal best record by over 0.400 seconds. On some other tests, I smashed my previous bests as well.

I tend to agree with Squeek when he says that it shouldn't be used in races, and is implying that the practice is akin the wall-riding (i.e. cheating) (sorry if I misread you there!), but unless it's in the instructions and is a bona fide method, as opposed to a bug or a quirk, then a distinction needs to be made between people who use the technique and those who don't (presumably because most players wouldn't know about it)...

I wondered what other people thought about it... my feeling is that, although it may be a more 'realistic' clutch simulation, it doesn't feel right, and I feel more 'in control' using the regular gear shifters... also, there doesn't seem to be any way of down-shifting using the same trick (is this right?)... but it seems that the speed advantage is real and reproducible...
 
Should unusual settings be allowed, if they result in faster lap times?

Should the "hold gear" AT trick be allowed?

Should the "tranny glitch" tuning trick be allowed?

Should "wheel" drivers be penalized over DS2 drivers or visa-versa?

IMHO, if an exploit is discovered that doesn't violate the generally accepted "two wheels on track, no contact" rules of OLR and Course Records, then it should be ok. This issue has been sufficiently discussed in public, that everyone who hopes to be competitive in OLR events or Course Records should be aware of it and try to learn the technique.
 
NoQuarter
Should unusual settings be allowed, if they result in faster lap times?
Click to expand...

There is a major difference between the triangle tap and something like adjusting the settings in that finding the right settings for a given car/track requires skill and practice... in comparison, the triangle button tap is a no-brainer...

It's a fair point about the other techniques, but I'd like to limit the discussion here to the triangle button tap specifically.... I think it's of particular importance because the time advantage gained is so significant, and it's also so easy to use...
 
Nonetheless, the use of the "Triangle Tap" is akin to Manual gears vs Auto gears, or for that matter Auto gears vs Semi-auto gears. You are utilising buttons to gain an advantage.

If the "Triangle Tap" technique is decried as cheating - essentially it enables better gear changes through the pressing of one button (although I've not found it to be of significant advantage on any car, and only mild advantage on some) - then the Semi-Automatic Gear trick must also be classed as such - which essentially enables better gear changes through the pressing of one button.
 
If you are racing in an Online Competition, it is down to the organiser to decide whether the technique is allowed or not.

In db.de, there was much discussion as to whether this trick should be allowed when submitting times in the db. It has been decided that times submitted using this method are not legal. Here is the discussion
Reverse Gear Trick
Thankfully it is in english :)
 
Why speculate so early, the Prologue "bug" might be corrected in the final version of GT4 anyway.
 
Biased turkey
Why speculate so early, the Prologue "bug" might be corrected in the final version of GT4 anyway.
Click to expand...

It works in GT3 as well ;)
 
Biased turkey
Oh I see, i's not a bug, it's a "feature" :)
Click to expand...

Well it might be fixed for GT4, now that it has been discovered.
Its amazing that it was in the game all those years and no one noticed. I only found out last week, from reading the db.de thread. Some guys like Sphinx had known for a while. I didn't get a chance to try it out before they decided it wasn't legal for their db. I might still have a go, just to see what all the fuss is about. :)
 
I find this trick only to work correctly on FF cars or lower Hp FR, MR, and AWD cars.
 
I'm definitely going to try this new shifting technique this weekend.

While messing around with GT1 this week, I found that even the entry level cars engage gears MUCH quicker than in GT3/GTP. All I know is it felt artificial and very arcadish.
 
What exactly does the Triangle button do? I've remapped most of the buttons on mine, to make the ones I need easier to get to... so to me, the triangle button just changes views, not much of a "cheat". :)

I assume you're referring to the "gearchange bug". Doesn't make any difference to me, we didn't get Prologue in the US. And since it's simply a glitch, that showed up in an early build of the game, I think it's safe to say that it won't be in the final game. Which makes the whole discussion moot.
 
read further up, it is not "simply a glitch, that showed up in an early build of the game". It was in GT3 also.

Mike
 
Really? I've never been able to do it in GT3, and I've tried since reading up on it here. All it does is momentarily throw the car into reverse, exactly like it's supposed to.
 
What exactly does the Triangle button do? I've remapped most of the buttons on mine, to make the ones I need easier to get to... so to me, the triangle button just changes views, not much of a "cheat".
Click to expand...

in the default mapping of the buttons it puts the car into reverse (including accelerator at the same time to make the car go backwards) :) and secondly.........

I assume you're referring to the "gearchange bug". Doesn't make any difference to me, we didn't get Prologue in the US. And since it's simply a glitch, that showed up in an early build of the game, I think it's safe to say that it won't be in the final game. Which makes the whole discussion moot
Click to expand...

1.yes it is the gearchange bug
2. it does apply to most people
3. it appeared in GT3 aswell as concept and prologue, so not really safe to say, is it? :) and THEREFORE the discussion is not moot.

The trick should decrease the speed of the car dramatically as shifting the car into reverse would blow it up in life! attempts to do the trick should be hampered by the game somehow IMO. plus, is there anybody that would dare say they use the trick while racing? bet £1,000,000 they'd get flamed :)
 
Well, like I said, I've never been able to do it in GT3... all it does is pop the car into reverse, then back into whatever gear you were in before hitting it.. which does nothing but slow the car down.

Besides, without remapping the buttons, it means either an odd positioning of the hand on the controller, or letting go of the gas for a moment while you hit Reverse. Unless you're using a wheel, of course. Does the glitch only happen with a wheel, or can it be done with a DualShock2?
 
Jedi2016
or letting go of the gas for a moment while you hit Reverse.
Click to expand...

From reading Arwins post at db.de thats how you get it to work. You release the gas for a milisecond and tap the button. That is why they were calling it a "clutch" simulator. Try releasing the gas before you tap reverse...see if that works :)
 
also you gota make sure your on the edge of your rev limiter or else it wont change up but keep in the same gear
 
Biased turkey
Oh I see, i's not a bug, it's a "feature" :)
Click to expand...
I would say it's a bug,but I don't really care.....I can drive without using it and with using the triangle button to score faster times! :)
 
You're right, it does work in GT3, I just wasn't doing it properly before.

It does seem a bit of a hassle, though, unless I were to remap the Reverse button to one of the shoulder buttons (which would mean moving something else). Otherwise, it's too cumbersome to hold the controller all funky so I can hit it just right.
 
Here's what I do when I use the Transmission "glitch"/feature: I set the accelerator and brake onto the right analog stick. My left hand holds the controller as usual, but I put the thumb on my right hand on the analog stick for gas and brake while I tap the Triangle button with my index finger. Do it WHILE you're acelerating and it should work all the time.
 
why though? whats the point? spoils the game and its concept completely :(
 
The advantage in using the Triangle button is it makes up changes slightly quicker than using the shoulder buttons.
Every time you hit the reverse button the clutch is automatically engaged. When you release the reverse button the clucth engages and the closest gear is selected.
The up change and down change buttons uses a preset time to disengage and then reingage the clutch.
You know the clutch is engaged when the gear indicator goes blank.
I believe the handbrake button works in a similar way. (disengages clutch when pressed and reingages clutch when released.)
 
I know this is a pretty old thread. I haven't got around to try it but does anyone know if it works with GT4?!?!?!?
 
No, it doesn't work on GT4... not on the PAL version of the game anyway...
 
Tacet_Blue
It works in GT3 as well ;)
Click to expand...

It doesn't work in GT4--in fact, reverse never works unless the car is stopped, so pressing triangle does nothin (at least my NA version of GT4). PD must have found out about it.
 
Back