Just a positive experience to share. Might contain tips

  • Thread starter fernandito
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fernandito

fernandito

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Was going to post it in the general discussion topic, but meh wanted to highlight which is another postive experience with PC2 in the physics/fun department.

I've just discovered the importance of preload. Increasing it by a good margin in most cars, road or not, allows you to run wayy higher coast ramp angles (lless block on deceleration), which combined with a more open bias accel diff and pretty lower pressure on the rears compared to the front, allows you to drive things like the all might 720 hypercar without TC and SC on a downpour (electric storm) combined Nords, and on Pirelli Trophy Softs, I swear. Have just scored a 10:51 under those conditions and on that car, sideways all the time, but still controllable.

Glorious. I find it so underwhelming that many of you guys will never be able to find out how good this tyre model is until you try things like the above, with a wheel too if possible of course. Give it a try to powerful road cars guys, and see how far you can push this awesome tyre model we've been given in pc2.

This game has no competition other than rfactor2. It's that clear to me.
 
Through this I've found out that a locked deceleration diff (25º-30-35º) caused more understeer than I would have ever imagined, and that you can now save the car (once tyres are optimum temp) from dangerous situations way better too with an open decel diff. I mean a locked decel diff really caused me to spin easily when losing traction. It does not happen now if I increase preload by a good margin instead, and combined it with high decel diff angles of 50-55º and even more depending on the car (720), allows me to push to the extreme with more ease because there's a ton less of understeer combined with a very stable car on either braking or of throttle.

The problem was, that before finding out how important preload was, I wasn't able to open the decel diff a lot more because it makes most cars so unstable on deceleration or heavy braking before turning in. Preload helps with this immensely, and spares you the terrible understeer caused by a tight deceleration diff angle.

I've also tried on GT cars, F40 GTO with literally no downforce, and man you can literally fly through corners. It only requieres to be highly gently on the throttle and severe lower tyre pressures on the rear,, but the results are awesome.

That's what I wanted to share, and find out who here feels similar when trying this.
 
Just a quick raid until I screw it, I'm no youtuber no clickbait .

You can see the car being way more stable and manageable on both braking before turning and powersliding-exiting corners, with a more willing to rotate car due to very open decel diff but still managable due to increase Preload.., I swear. And on fried tyres

I can push the rear tryes even more up to 150ºc and the car still holds his ground despite the twichiness derived of tyres too hot, although you usually get a rear puncture at around lap 10.

This game is amazing. Some people are missing too much playing GT all day. I can only dream with a Driveclub game with this physics, and I firmly believe it is the direction the game should be taking next, with all road stages kind Bannochbrae and full road car. This street tyre model just screams for it.

I'm gonna upload a more hardcore example of the effectiviness of open decl diff+high preload on an F40 with a very low downforce set and increased rear pressure too, all under heavy rain or storm.
 
Just another example until I make the F40 video I said, but now on a downpour real weather Bannoch, and on Hards, very cold hard tyres on heavy rain



As you see, you can keep the non-assisted 720 perfectly stable and managable even under these circumstances and on a dry setup (it is the same as used in the video above), all thanks to high preload+ high decel. diff setting, in spite of some mistakes I might make here and there.

This is also the point i was talking about in the first post. I fear the ubber good street car physics/tyres we have in project cars 2 eventually go overlooked because of most folks playing GT cars all day. Can only dream with a Driveclub game on this physics and with more stages like this and California, Azure Coast etc.
 
Yeah, the good thing about preload is that it's always there which makes the car's behaviour very predictable, while the locking effect of the coast and power ramp is linearly dependent of the applied torque.
 
Until PCARS2 I admit I had no clue about these finer details in differential tuning. I understood preload already, but I'm still lost on the ramp angles.

fernandito
I fear the ubber good street car physics/tyres we have in project cars 2 eventually go overlooked because of most folks playing GT cars all day. Can only dream with a Driveclub game on this physics and with more stages like this and California, Azure Coast etc.
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Oh, how sweet it would be if SMS decides to go forward with the touge discipline idea in PCARS3, with a handful of suitable cars to go along with it. :)

I haven't found it necessary to play with the setups of the cars I like to drive, but I'll keep your tip in mind when it comes to the few troublesome ones. :cheers:
 
I just tried messing with the preload and i concur. I drove a couple road cars on Bannochbrae road circuit before and after tweeking the preload and I can control my yaw angle and drive sideways much more intuitively and natural to how I do in real life. Amazing what some tuning can do.
I agree it is a shame that PC2 might get overlooked because of GTS and tips like yours definately help the community!
 
I'm not sure what y'all mean about driving sideways with Preload adjustment. Does the wheels alignment become unbalanced causing the steering wheel to have an unnatural pull off to one side causing the car to drive sideways or pull sideways? That seems odd re car stability on track if so or am I missing something in the description? Could you please clarify?
 
davidt33
I'm not sure what y'all mean about driving sideways with Preload adjustment. Does the wheels alignment become unbalanced causing the steering wheel to have an unnatural pull off to one side causing the car to drive sideways or pull sideways? That seems odd re car stability on track if so or am I missing something in the description? Could you please clarify?
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When I say Sideways, I mean the ability to control and hold a slip angle once a slide is initiated. The car does not align and track sideways like you are wondering lol you have to initiate it with driving techniques. The car drives straight.

This is me driving after making changes to preload and trying to test and explore the changes. The driving in PC2 is so enjoyable, theres life to the cars that you can feel that you are threading a needling when driving it and could make a mistake ... sadly in GTS the cars feel bland no feeling of on the edge driving like it used to be and capable of.

 
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Nice driving there. Oh hell I feel as If had discovered America, again.

The preload+open decel diff is definitely the way to go on street cars, and when I find time to upload the one big suicidal lap on the Nords on an F40LM with a very high preload setup+open decel diff I will prove that It is also the way to go on some GT cars too, at least the old ones
 
Here we go as promised:



Notice the stability granted when on the throttle thanks to a combination of a high preload setting + an open deceleration diferential, all in an old GT car without assists, under heavy rain and zero downforce setting on both front and rear. Also see how the car wants to rotate and even stays stable when on the throttle as you navigate through corners.

This makes for another pretty hardcore example about the impact of those diff settings on even GT cars, at least an old one, but very powerful nonetheless.
 
∆ looks more lively but also more supportive, less frustrating understeer on turn-in. You already know this but for sake of some audience you can reduce Accel locking (INCREASE ramp angle) to eliminate some the top-end wild power-on oversteer (or play with TC strength, also inverted so lower setting means MORE TC effect). May lose couple tenths here and there but gain more control.
 
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The_American
∆ looks more lively but also more supportive, less frustrating understeer on turn-in. You already know this but for sake of some audience you can reduce Accel locking (INCREASE ramp angle) to eliminate some the top-end wild power-on oversteer (or play with TC strength, also inverted so lower setting means MORE TC effect). May lose couple tenths here and there but gain more control.
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Hey thanks for the input.

Yeah the less understeer on turn-in thing is all thanks to the open decel diff (in this car the 65º you see seems to be enough, but it can be increased even further without risk thanks to the preload and allow the car turn even more without spinning under those conditions lol), but when you say I could try reducing the accel locking, you mean increasing the angle even more up to 90º?, the value you've seen at the beginning of the video of it, 75º, already eliminates powersteer on exit and also grants even less understeer too of course, even without downforce, on the wet and on that car. Either that or I'm not understanding what you're trying to explain me. You mean reducing the angle thus increasing the lock?, wouldn't that cause powersteer and not be the ideal thing on the wet and without downforce regardless the high preload that makes me stay safe on the throttle and on the very turning move?

And about the audience heheh. Don't worry I'm no youtuber nor I earn money with this, as you can see when you enter the channel I have just a handful of other videos I made for just some particular occasions some time ago, so you can click without worrying about that. The purpose of these videos are neither about hotlapping or master drifting classes, just about showing the "power" (lol) of combining preload and decel diff, and taking it to the extreme to prove its validity and that it works (Hypercars without assists and drifting with them lol; Powerful old GT cars without downforce and on a downpour, etc).

On the acceleration differential..., I always go very open on racing cars too (I don't understand why people go locked on accel diffs on GT cars, which may explain why many have so much trouble on Project Cars when they say they spin a lot), and since I like Hypercars most, I have no choice but to go max open accel diff on those ones too, so I use very locked acceleration diffs on rallycross and rally only. Maybe on snow too depending on the car, but it is dangerous as well.
 
You got it, if you are anyway already at 75 on Accel locking well then there's not much more to hit 90

Maybe try 90 see if you gain more "safety" and how much acceleration performance it costs. Then ultimately lap times, 20 laps any technical circuit like Imola (good sweepers, hard braking zones, twisty bits, chicanes and elevation changes) you are comfortable with would be good test

edit: perhaps lower the preload slightly too for more freedom/safety
 
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Big thank you to fernandito for raising this differential topic. This is one thing I love about sims there's so much depth and learning involved.. after months you still discover new things.
 
Forget about anything I posted in this thread. Patch 5 ruined everything diff related, as tyres is all about skidding around right now.

I'm starting to get tired of handling changes and experiments with every patch.
 
Do you use a wheel, fernandito? Couple of spots in the Bannochbrae video where I was watching you make lock to lock corrections when driving in the rain I can't seem to do that fast. Do you adjust the steering rack and run your wheel lower than 900º?
 
I use t300gte wheel to its stock 1080º rotation, and t3pa pedals set.

In the setups menu I don't touch the default steering rack. I go factory, always. The McLaren 720 seems to have around 720º rotation, where I find the soft lock activated when having the wheel at 1080º, and the F40LM around 420º I'd say, finding the soft lock there too. Always no assists too, specially on hypercars.

Thank god they don't seem to have touched street car tires physics in patch 5.0, but sadly you can already forget about what you saw in the Ferrari F40LM video. They have just screwed slick tyres behaviour (hards and softs, not wets), and the differential settings specially accel diff no longer has an effect on GT cars. You just slide the moment you press the throttle even if you do it sightly.

You guys might now try racing street cars for this reason, and rallycross and mercedes ice tracks too. It's in racing those that you will actually find out how good the tire model in project cars 2 is, until they fix the GT slicks in 6.0 in three months...
 
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