Mercedes continues to ignore that MT's are awesome.

[Tornado]

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]CLK63 AMG Black[/FONT]
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AMG's newly established Black Series targets the most demanding drivers in the same way as Porsche 911 GT3. The first Black Series product was last year's SLK55 Black. Now it is joined with CLK63 AMG Black. From the outlook, you might confuse it with Mercedes' F1 safety car. Yes, it shares most of the exterior modifications with that one, such as a deep and wide front bumper with massive intakes, flared wheel arches, extended side skirts and rear diffusers. Still, it is not as aggressive as the CLK DTM because it lacks a rear spoiler and intakes at the rear fenders. In fact, the CLK63 AMG Black bridges the gap between the "regular", 481hp CLK63 and the 582hp supercharged CLK DTM. Its 6.2-liter DOHC V8 is tuned to 507 horsepower at 6800 rpm and its torque remains unchanged at 465 lbft at 5250 rpm. 0-60 mph takes 4.1 seconds, 0.3 quicker than the regular car. The electronic speed regulator is no longer set at the usual 155mph (250kph), but at a generous 186mph (300kph).

The gearbox of the Black continues to be the 7G-Tronic with AMG's Speedshift program and paddle shift control. However, it offers only two modes - Sport and Manual, with Comfort mode deleted because there is virtually no comfort to say for the very track-biased car. The final drive ratio is shortened to sharpen acceleration.

Predictably, the flared wheel arches bring wider tracks - that's an additional 75mm and 66mm front and rear respectively. This necessitates revised suspension geometry and AMG introduced adjustable dampers by the way. The compression rate, rebound rate, ride height, tracks and camber are all adjustable, obviously designed for track use. The wheels are upgraded to 19-inch forged aluminum ones. The front brakes become ceramic discs measuring 360mm in diameter. The rears are 330mm steel. Tires are upgraded to Pirelli P-Zero Corsa 265/30ZR19 front and 285/30ZR19 rear. There are plenty of carbon fiber used in the bodywork, such as the diffusers and front fenders.

Inside, the Black series is trimmed in black, of course. Carbon-fiber trim is used throughout the center console and instrument binnacle. A pair of lightweight racing buckets is standard, but customers may also opt for the more comfortable electric leather seats. Pricing is yet to be announced, but expect it will cost around 30% more than the regular CLK63 AMG, or more than a 911 GT3. Perhaps too expensive for a car based on the last generation Mercedes C-class.

Linky.

Oh well. It still looks sweet, and it sounds silly fast.
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[exigeracer]

Monster Trucks? Motor Trends? Empty?

edidit - Oooooooooooooh manual transmissions.

 

[Tornado]

Haven't you ever been to an arcade? MT = Manual Transmission.
Edit: Never mind.

 

[exigeracer]

I even thought in my mind while reading the article, "haven't they figured out that people want a normal transmission?!?" But I guess I didn't put the two together.

 

[Philly]

I think it may be a little late to introduce something on this platform, but hey, it really makes that car look good. I would still stick with the CLK63 or the DTM. I can't wait for the new C versions to arrive, even though that may be awhile.

And for a track car, I am a little suprised that there is no old-school manual option. Oh well, the car appears to make up for that fault.

 

[harrytuttle]

Linky.

Oh well. It still looks sweet, and it sounds silly fast.
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For a minute, I thought this was the successor to the SLK55 Black Ed., but then I remembered MB saying that they'd get around to doing a bunch of AMG "Black Editions". The little SLK with the 6.3L V8...well, I probably don't need to say much more than that.

But it's a definite swing-and-a-miss for MB. If this is supposed to "truly compete against BMW's M series", more so than the way the regular AMG's were supposed to, they're still so far from barking up the wrong tree, they may not be in the right forest. It's not speed or grip that makes a great car, it's interaction and the sense of involvment. The moment you introduce a torque converter -- regardless of how good it may be -- a major level of connection is gone. That's the major difference between MB and BMW, and no amount of carbon-fiber paddles can change that.

 

[niky]

It's just Merc's way, I guess.

Not very big news... isn't this nearly the same package as the CF-roofed SLK from a while back?

 

[land sea air]

It is a similar package, and until MB develops a worthy non-track manual then we probably won't be seeing many manual Mercs AMG or otherwise. MB does automatics well and you should always stick to what you do best.

 

[MistaX]

They are listening to Douglas DeMuro.


So the only person that wants it, is Douglas DeMuro.

 

[land sea air]

Just because it has an auto doesn't mean that it isn't awesome, I'm not a big fan of autos (despite owning one) but I've driven both 5 and 6 speed MB manuals and trust me, it's better this way.

 

[Nickbag]

I always like the Mercedes with wide body kits. It sounds crazy fast too.

 

[YSSMAN]

Lack of a 'true' manual or not, I'd have it. I can't think of too many cars that look this cool and go this fast, and yet, nobody really knows what it is. Generally speaking, this is Germany's 'Daytona,' if you know what I mean... Build a couple of race-spec cars like Dodge used to do for the street, and you've got one bad-ass car that not only looks cool, but goes like stink as well. I just have to ask, where is the rear spoiler? Can't we get a small-ish one?

 

[1X83Z]

They are listening to Douglas DeMuro.


So the only person that wants it, is Douglas DeMuro.

Does the fact that all the major manufacturers are leaving clutches behind tell you something? Perhaps something like 'maybe Doug is right'?

 

[Dave A]

Only thats not true, they arn't leaving clutches behind. Auto's are only more common than Manuals in America. The vast majority of cars sold in Europe are manuals and I'd hazard a gues that thats true of Asia as well. And theres no shift in trend happening over here either.

 

[niky]

Does the fact that all the major manufacturers are leaving clutches behind tell you something? Perhaps something like 'maybe Doug is right'?

ATs are indispensible, true, but at the top and at the bottom of the market... at the top, where "sportscar" owners prefer it, and at the bottom, where budget specials save weight, fuel and purchase price by using it, there's lots left in the manual tranny.

 

[Kent]

Looks like an awesome car, I would love to have one. 👍

That said, I'm going to keep an eye on this thread to make sure it doesn't turn into a auto vs manual flame fest.

 

[RouWa]

I just have to ask, where is the rear spoiler?

With a DTM spoiler the car would not be street legal anymore in Germany. In Germany a spoiler may not have any sharp edges and it may not be higher than the roof of the car. Basically every big spoiler is forbidden here. The German safety guidelines (not only for spoilers) are so strict, that MTV cancelled a German version of "Pimp My Ride".

 

[land sea air]

I remember reading something to that effect, plus there are plenty of good looking aftermarket carbon spoilers that you would be able to fit. I think this is the perfect bridge between the DTM and the AMG cars.

 

[Scaff]

Does the fact that all the major manufacturers are leaving clutches behind tell you something? Perhaps something like 'maybe Doug is right'?

Would you be so kind as to provide so source material to back this up? As I certainly remain to be convinced that all the major manufacturers are leaving clutches behind, and certainly not for all markets.

As has been said, certainly in Europe manufacturers would face a massive back-lash if auto was the only way forward. The UK alone is 80-85% manual cars and very unlikely to change in the near future, and would certainly not be forced by manufacturers to do so. Any volume manufacturer attempting to force such a change would run into major problems if it was not something the buying public wanted.

Certianly in the US autos are far more common and some manufacturers may see an opportunity to allow one transmission to dominate (and some would argue it already does), however to try and apply that logic on a global basis simply will not work.

Mercedes Benz are also not the best example to use either, as a company their autoboxes have always been the better choice, as for a long period of time they could not build a manual worth using. A manufacturer that has for decades always favoured autos over manuals is certainly not a good example of a change in auto vs manual positioning for all manufacturers.

Regards

Scaff

 

[RouWa]

The UK alone is 80-85% manual cars and very unlikely to change in the near future,

Here in Germany it's 95%+. I don't know a single person that owns a car with automatic transmission.

 

[1X83Z]

ATs are indispensible, true, but at the top and at the bottom of the market... at the top, where "sportscar" owners prefer it,

Who prefers it?

Check and see what transmission all the 'top' sports cars use. If I recall correctly, Ferrari's top sports car has no clutch; 90% of Lamborghini's top sports cars don't have a clutch; Audi's new supercar has no clutch; Mercedes' supercar is clutchless; even the fastest, most powerful, most expensive, quickest Bugatti Veyron is devoid of a clutch.

Only Porsche chose to fit its supercar with a clutch, and of course that was welcomed with poor sales and transactions far under the MSRP - and ultimately a cancellation before it had been planned.

Would you be so kind as to provide so source material to back this up? As I certainly remain to be convinced that all the major manufacturers are leaving clutches behind, and certainly not for all markets.

Lord.

 

[Dave A]

Not all the major manufacturers are leaving clutches behind, there's got to be at least an 85%+ of new cars in Europe still being sold with a clutch. Your point about clutches dissapearing on more techinical supercars is certainly valid, cars like the F430 where it's main goal is to lap a track faster than the Porsche 911 Turbo, who in turn replaces the 911 Turbo with a new 911 Turbo to lap a track faster than the F430 are more concerend with beating the performance of their rivals while at the same time offering a day to day usability. The main reason I see clutches not being seen as a big plus in these cars is because the clutches tend to be extremely heavy to handle the power and stress these cars take, that doesn't equate to good day to day usability. However, less techincal supercars that are concerned with the thrill of driving above 2/10ths on a track are still for the most part, building cars with clutches. Also, as valid as your point is, thoes technical, upper market sports and supercars most certainly do not account for every major manufacturer not a vast percentage of car sales in general, even if you break it down into sports and supercars, clutchless cars are still very far behind in terms of volume in the market today. The only market I see clutchless cars thriving in Europe is the upper market sports and supercars.

 

[Scaff]

Lord.

While I of course have to turn down the deification you seem to want to gift me (but the offer is nice), I do notice that you have avoided the point.

Putting forward a list of high end sports and supercars (some of which are still very much offered with a manual), it does not support a claim of "Does the fact that all the major manufacturers are leaving clutches behind tell you something?". Sales figures and market share of manuals is still very much dominant is a number of rather large markets around the globe.

You may well be of the opinion that the industry is shifting in this direction, but that most certainly does not make it a fact. If this is the fact that you so clearly claim it to be, then providing us with information to back it up with should prove relatively easy for you to do. If not then its your opinion, and one that I have to say I certainly don't find supported by the European market for one.


Regards

Scaff

 

[1X83Z]

While I of course have to turn down the deification you seem to want to gift me (but the offer is nice), I do notice that you have avoided the point.

Putting forward a list of high end sports and supercars (some of which are still very much offered with a manual), it does not support a claim of "Does the fact that all the major manufacturers are leaving clutches behind tell you something?". Sales figures and market share of manuals is still very much dominant is a number of rather large markets around the globe.

You may well be of the opinion that the industry is shifting in this direction, but that most certainly does not make it a fact. If this is the fact that you so clearly claim it to be, then providing us with information to back it up with should prove relatively easy for you to do. If not then its your opinion, and one that I have to say I certainly don't find supported by the European market for one.


Regards

Scaff

Prior to this, I had never seen someone write two full pages in response to a single, one-sentence, obviously intentionally exaggerated, off-the-cuff remark which itself was a reply to a humorous comment.

Now I have.

You see something new every day.

Also, as valid as your point is, thoes technical, upper market sports and supercars most certainly do not account for every major manufacturer not a vast percentage of car sales in general

Look at the point I made. Then look at the point I was replying to. Then look back at the point I made.

 

[YSSMAN]

Putting forward a list of high end sports and supercars (some of which are still very much offered with a manual), it does not support a claim of "Does the fact that all the major manufacturers are leaving clutches behind tell you something?". Sales figures and market share of manuals is still very much dominant is a number of rather large markets around the globe.

I'm in agreement with you here. Rambling off a bunch of supercars and other sports cars really doesn't mean anything, as most people wouldn't drive them on a day-to-day basis. Those of us who are left driving Calibers , Mazda 6s, and Commodores thankfully have a choice in what we want to utilize...

...The fact of the matter is, the manual transmission is far from leaving us. Well, that is, the rational world that knows how to drive stick and would choose to. But even then, referring to the Ferrari F1 system or that of the VAG DSG setup as "clutchless" is indeed technically false, as it does indeed have a clutch, the only difference being that it is not activated by the driver. Certainly, it isn't the true experience, but I would suppose that if you wanted the performance of a manual but didn't want to deal with it in traffic (or whatever), they are the best option made available to you. Plus, it does shift faster than that of an 'average' human...

But that doesn't mean it is a suitable replacement either. Quite frankly, I refuse to buy a car without a manual transmission as it stands right now. The thought of going with an automatic seems like a good way of boring myself to death behind the wheel, taking away yet another layer of control I have over my car...

...And I'm not alone. We've had these conversations dozens of times here on these forums, and beyond that, I think the more important thing to recognize is that many more Americans (in particular) are warming up to manual transmissions. Simply put, if manual transmissions were a bad idea, why are they beginning to offer them on so many models, hell, even ones that most people would say 'shouldn't' have them? I've even managed to convince my Mother (of nearly 48 years of age) to buy a manual with her next car, and my newly-driving cousin (who is about to turn 16, and no-less female) is eager to learn how to drive stick... As her best friend has a stick in her Rabbit, quite a ride for a first-car.

So while some companies may be stalwart in their position against manuals, others certainly have been proponents of the system for some time, and many more are warming up to the idea.

...Quite frankly, as long as I can get a manual transmission in 'average' cars, I'm going to be happy. Beyond that, cars like the Miata and the Corvette will always have them as options as well, and heck, even their larger models gives the option as well. Certainly, not everyone will take it, and they bet on that, but the fact that they are an option is indeed an important one no less...

 

[Scaff]

Prior to this, I had never seen someone write two full pages in response to a single, one-sentence, obviously intentionally exaggerated, off-the-cuff remark which itself was a reply to a humorous comment.

Now I have.

You see something new every day.

In total I wrote a shade under 400 words in replying to you, now I don't know what you use as a writing implement (crayola maybe), but that's quite a bit short of two pages. You may also note that I was not the only person who picked you up on this.

As for intentionally exaggerated and off-the-cuff, it seems to me that its little more than a restating of your opinions from here, then again what would I know. I am after all dealing with a man whose idea of a witty comeback is to compare a post of mine to an '02 Altima, and via a negative rep comments at that (bravery abound).

Ta

Scaff

 

[Pupik]

In Germany a spoiler may not have any sharp edges and it may not be higher than the roof of the car. Basically every big spoiler is forbidden here.

Hmmm...that's one law I wouldn't mind seeing in America. We'll trade you our open-highway speed limit laws in exchange, so as not actually add any legislation to our books.

Nice car, though. Perhaps McLaren could be sub-contracted to manufacture some manual gearboxes, though? Maybe?

Two pie-in-the-sky requests in one post...I feel 20 years younger already!

 

[RouWa]

Hmmm...that's one law I wouldn't mind seeing in America.

1/2 Off Topic.

Germany is totally different in this matter. In Germany there is an organization called TÜV. They decide wether every individual car is street legal or not:

From Wikipedia:

TÜVs (short for Technischer Überwachungs-Verein, Technical Monitoring Association in English) are German organizations that aim to protect humans and the environment against hazards coming from factories and mechanisms of all kinds. As an independent consultant, it examines monitoring-needy plants, motor vehicles, energy installations and devices. The many subsidiaries of the TÜVs can also appear as project developers for energy and traffic concepts, problem solutions in the area of environmental protection and certification bodies.

No German-registered road vehicle may be operated on public roads without a certificate from the TÜV. The certificate has to be renewed after two years, and is indicated by a decal on the license plate. Most modifications also need to be approved, from installing tires of a different size to materials used in nuts and bolts. TÜV's safety guidelines are among the strictest in the world, and getting a road permit for thoroughly customized vehicles borders on the impossible.

Whenever you change something on your car, the car must be shown to the TÜV directly afterwards. The changes are then added to the car's vehicle registration certificate. You can not simply buy 20 inch tires and mount them. The TÜV does not allow changes that endanger the driver or other road users. This includes spoilers or neon lights under the car.

Every two years the TÜV checks the operability of the car's brakes, lights, safety belts, speedo, tires, everything. If something is not working properly, you have two weeks to fix it. Otherwise the car may not be used anymore. The biggest problem: run up tires. It may sound fussy, but because of the TÜV there is not a single "dangerous" car on German roads. I think the TÜV is a good idea. I don't want to get killed by a car, just because the driver of that car did not have the money to fix a broken part.

 

[YSSMAN]

Well, on the subject of the spoiler that I brought up some time ago, could they not have gone with a small spoiler, not nearly as large as what was found on the DTM, but say, a lip-style one similar to what I've seen on Brabus models?

 

[1X83Z]

In total I wrote a shade under 400 words in replying to you, now I don't know what you use as a writing implement (crayola maybe), but that's quite a bit short of two pages.

Oh moderators. Always missing the big points and going for the minor ones. And you wonder why you guys get no respect.

I am after all dealing with a man whose idea of a witty comeback is to compare a post of mine to an '02 Altima, and via a negative rep comments at that (bravery abound).

I've never given negative reputation, and I have no idea what post you're referring to in your remark about the Altima, though if it helps I had no idea who you were until we began discussing this just now.