motorbike discussion...

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Surfing the internet, i look for GT4 info and what do i come across?? information that motorbikes may be added to the series. now, come on, if this is true, what are PD thinking!? especially Kaz himself being a lover of cars?.....

.....after reading about this, i was real peeved off with the idea of bikes in the gt series. after all, its about cars, aint it? well, tonight, i watched a DVD called Head to Head by Jeremy Clarkson, pretty old, but contains the likes of the Ferrari 360, Porsche 911, BMW M5 and Jaguar XK 180. the featured automobiles go against each other to find the best. guess what was put against the 911? a Yamaha R1 motorbike. my face shrunk as i thought of the defeat the car may suffer.....but the defeat never arrived...........

.........instead, when the Porsche won by 3/4 second, my face lit up with glee :):) "TAKE THAT YOU SCUMBAG!" i could imagine saying over GT4 online. then it clicked into my head.....how would you feel, racing against a bike online, winning for the cars and making the bikers shut the hell up??? i'd feel damn good myself :)

as such, i wouldn't mind bikes being added for a spin off, just for the odd fun drag occasion, but online, i'd love to race against them.

what do you honestly think about bikes? such as how they should/shouldn't be integrated? and how many/which ones should be added? etc etc. :)

you may now discuss.........
 
Theres a 99.9% chance thats false info, bikes were tested by PD, but the chances are they are working on a secret Bikes game since Gran Turismo has nothing in common with bikes in both real and game formats.

As for the discussion part of your thread, if you do a seach you'll find one we made earlier that has loads of good points (and bad).
 
i remember that pd DID test motorbikes at motegi, yet hey may or may not be in the game.
 
I saw a newer test similar to the Jeremy Clarkson test and tested a 2003 Suzuki GSX-R1000 against a Porsche Turbo, Murcielago and some other cars and the bike beat all the cars.
 
I don't think there is any car that could take a bike round a twisty track in all honesty, Think of the braking and handling advantage that bikes have compared to cars. Some of the super GT's and Le-Mans proto's perhaps but other I couldn't see it happening.

As for bikes in GT what would be the point? GT is about cars, I'm with l4s and think it's for a new biking game or something but certainly not within GT.
 
_aj
I don't think there is any car that could take a bike round a twisty track in all honesty, Think of the braking and handling advantage that bikes have compared to cars. Some of the super GT's and Le-Mans proto's perhaps but other I couldn't see it happening.
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Well if you have seen the jeremy clarkson video ( i own it ) , they say this .....
that the yamaha R1 is the cream of road bikes ..... and the porsche wasnt.
and the porsche still beat the best bike ( riden by nial mckenzie aswell might i add )

Your argument of bikes beating cars is a bit strange .. Maybe in a straight line the bike would have the power to weight to beat a car . a twisty track ...... not a chance in hell ....

Bikes ( like the R1 ) might have good handeling , but two tyres with a postage stamp worth of tread on the tarmac compared to a cars four fat tyres on the road isnt even close .... it is a well known fact that a bike cannot corner aswell as a car . on the video the porsche goes around the outside of the bike in a corner , and porsche's arent the best handeling car in the world , if that bike came up against a mclaren F1 ( which is the cream of road cars ) it would get licked... no question ........

as for bikes in GT - no way man - GT is a cars only game . Riding spirits / motogp are the games for bikers !!!!

** closed thread **
 
I say bring on the bikes. MotoGP 2 by Climax is one of my favorite racing games and I can only imagine PD doing a similar job with bikes making it a worthwhile addition to the game. Im not looking for them to be a main part of the game but more like an add-on similar to the F1 cars in GT3 or Hi-res mode in GT1(or GT2???) The Dodge Tamahawk has already been hinted at being included in the game and it would be awfully sad if they only included one. Maybe 2 or 3 with their own bonus race event just to test the waters for a possible stand alone PD project. 👍
 
Fact: fast toys are fun…as a regular bike/car trackday participant, I can tell you that it doesn’t matter if they have two/four wheels, they both offer a different thrill. The ability to use them both in GT4 would be incredible.

I think it is quite possible that some bikes will be included as the big surprise if you consider the recent work PD have been doing on modelling the human form…
Fingers crossed then

Ducati 998 vs Pagani Zonda...yes please
 
i hope they leave secret bikes out, GT4 shouldnt be turned into an arcade game where when you finish it you get all these goofy secrets like no walls, or unlimited speed or bikes....
 
Nemo
i hope they leave secret bikes out, GT4 shouldnt be turned into an arcade game where when you finish it you get all these goofy secrets like no walls, or unlimited speed or bikes....
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How is the simulation of a two wheeled vehicle going to turn GT into an arcade game? Equating the inclusion of motorcycles with speed and wall cheats is laughable. :dunce:
 
ERB
Well if you have seen the jeremy clarkson video ( i own it ) , they say this .....
that the yamaha R1 is the cream of road bikes ..... and the porsche wasnt.
and the porsche still beat the best bike ( riden by nial mckenzie aswell might i add )

Your argument of bikes beating cars is a bit strange .. Maybe in a straight line the bike would have the power to weight to beat a car . a twisty track ...... not a chance in hell ....

Bikes ( like the R1 ) might have good handeling , but two tyres with a postage stamp worth of tread on the tarmac compared to a cars four fat tyres on the road isnt even close .... it is a well known fact that a bike cannot corner aswell as a car . on the video the porsche goes around the outside of the bike in a corner , and porsche's arent the best handeling car in the world , if that bike came up against a mclaren F1 ( which is the cream of road cars ) it would get licked... no question ........

as for bikes in GT - no way man - GT is a cars only game . Riding spirits / motogp are the games for bikers !!!!

** closed thread **
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What are you talking about? Bikes will kick the **** out of any car. Most bikes have verry wide treds. that combined with the low weight allows them to out handle just about any car. You are totally in control of the weight distribution on a bike.

I don't think bikes should be included though. Any one else seen the vid of a snowmobile out dragging a viper? just because they are fast doesn't mean they should be included.
 
boooooooooooo. bikes IN GT4?
what a simulation game.. GT4 might turn into.. into...into.. A MIDNIGHT CLUB! eeeek!
 
xcsti
What are you talking about? Bikes will kick the **** out of any car. Most bikes have verry wide treds. that combined with the low weight allows them to out handle just about any car. You are totally in control of the weight distribution on a bike.
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Edit : But under heavy breaking a bike only has one narrow tyre on the road and a car has 4 fat tyres on the road. And the bike can't even maximise the grip from that one tyre, because the rear end wants to come round or over the front wheel. Oh and don't forget that bikes don't get any downforce to gain grip.

The only things that bikes do better than cars is accelaration, and falling over.

The bike will always start infront of a car, but the car will haul in the bike in eventually.

This may be different however, if a car and bike of equal value are compared.



I hope PD don't waste too much time on bikes in GT4, I couldn't care less about them.
 
I'd like to see bikes in GT4, like we had F1's in GT3. At the end of the day, a bike has more in common with a road car, than a road car does with a F1.

Quick bikes don't corner as quickly as even a relatively quick car, and they certainly don't brake as quickly as a car can - its all to do with tyre contact patches.

F1 cars lap Suzuka under 1minute 38seconds, Moto GP bikes lap at no more than 1minute 55seconds, which is only about as quick as the JGTC's lap.


If PD do include bikes in GT4, i hope its only 'sports' bikes and not crappy 'Tomahawks' or Harley's which would probably lap in similar times to the Model T.
 
But the Tomahawk has a Viper engine and 4 wheels...

I reckon it would be awesome!!

C.
 
How exactly do you lean a bike with 4 wheels? It was built for show and nothing more.
However a 500bhp holeshot powered Suzuki Hayabusa would be interesting 👍 👍
 
How can anybody who has a penchant for quality engineering and speed not desire this scenario…
This pic is from the Nring by the way, so including both 2/4 wheels would be realistic 👍

Edit:shame about the ugly replacement panels and dodgy rider on the bike…
 
ERB
a mclaren F1 ( which is the cream of road cars )
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I really dislike you for that comment....

I think bikes shouldn't be added to the game because cars and bikes simply can't be compared to eachother. The only similarity they have is that they run on tyres and have a combustion engine. If kaz would like to make a bike game, let him, but don't bring them into GT.
However, there was this rumour some time ago that the Dodge Tomahawk would be in the game. I don't really think it's true, but funny nonetheless.
 
I don't understand all that "bike should be in GT" hype.

Have you ever drove a bike simulation on any console? If yes - you should notice that all have one thing incommon - they all suck big time.

There is no way - not even the gloriuos Namco's Moto GP on PS2 or same named series on Xbox - that yoou can go beyond the arcade point of thing on console. I wonder how the engine should be coded - for controller - to represent the delicate movement of the bike. Moto GP3 on PS2 is my favourite bike game ever, but it doesn't come close to an simulation. It is a simulation in terms of competition, but as a game, it is still an arcade.

You should have an full-bike controller - as one in the arcades - to properly simulate the bike. On controller - no way. Not to mention the ridiciluos task to drive the bike inside the GT game with DFP. Maybe Tomahawk, but it is questionable too.

And as for "bike vs. car" issue - no bike can catch a race car on track. Bikes can accelerate faster, but their braking and slow speed in corners makes them slower then cars, as stated before. Also, on straights, cars are faster from some point just because of the aerodynamics - of course, Hayabusa is faster in total then Fiat Stilo, but that should not be compared.
 
Hasen't ny one who's all up for cars v bikes in GT4 (Sambero ;)) realised that GT4 is a simulation of real car racing, what real car racing pitches a car against a bike? Sure it happens in tests by magazines but they never are raced against each other in competition. Also putting bikes in GT4 would detract from the whole experience, it would take away potetial improvements and additions to the cars and car racing bits and instead of GT4 being a complete game it would be two incomplete games, a half hearted bike sim (theres no way KY will have an engine that can fuly simlate cars and bikes together) so compromises on each will be made.

Personally even if bikes could be put in without any compromises I'd rather them stay out, have a dedicated bikes sim for that, dont spoil Gran Turismo, which is called GranTurismo because of it's focus on the cars, Gran urismo has nothing to do with bikes, so the name of the game should also change if bikes were included.
 
Ah the old bike v car argument well yes a superbike could cane any car this side of Ferrari Enzo from 0 - 120mph ish under braking AND cornering most cars can beat any bike.

I have that video as well and that test is totally fixed the bike blatently throttles back before the finish line ;) to allow Plato and the 911 thru.
 
I don't know that the GT series has ever said anything about CARs only. They say "Driving Simulator", and last I checked, that can include bikes. I'm not a bike rider, and never have been. It might be kind of fun to have some bikes included, but I certainly wouldn't lose any sleep over it if they wern't. On the other hand, I wouldn't be upset about having them either. I've said this many times: I see the GT series as a celebration of speed. The thrill of driving a bike through a road course would fit within that definition just fine, in my opinion.

As for bikes beating cars in a straight line or a road course, it will depend on the bike. Don't make the mistake of thinking if it has 2 wheels it will automatically win. My daily driven car will take down bikes in a straight line too, so long as they are 600cc or less (unmodified of course).

I'm more concerned about what GT4 may leave OUT, rather than what they might ADD. :D
 
As much as blasting around Tsubuka or Motegi on a Honda MotoGP bike is somewhat appealing I don't want to see bikes in the GT series. You'd have to comprimise I think, or bloat it all out with a different physics engine.

It would be much more interesting for PD to develop a bike specific sim, much better.

Plus I don't want to see PD spread their resources even thinner to make a bike sim game. We all see how long it takes them to make GT4, when they ARE focused on it.
 
londor
Porsche GT3 vs Yamaha R1. 1 full lap at Nurburgring.

http://homepage.mac.com/rafaelma/FileSharing4.html

The bike does not stand a chance till the car hits traffic near the end of the lap.

I will have the video in my website for a few hours. Enjoy it.
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Great video!

But, it proves nothing. The two drivers just look like average shmoes.

I think you'd need to take one of the top Porsche supercup drivers, or lemans GT drivers and then a top world superbike or MotoGP rider. Give them each a few laps on a CLOSED course in equal conditions and compare laptimes. I still think on tighter twistier circuits that a top rider on a top bike would beat a GT class car.

Now an F1 or prototype car would wipe the curcuit with a bike, but a GT or even GT-S class car I imagine would be pretty even.

I'd rather be in the Porsche GT3 anyway...I would like a black one please and unlimited laps at the ring...haha.
 
Lethalchem
I don't know that the GT series has ever said anything about CARs only. They say "Driving Simulator", and last I checked, that can include bikes. I'm not a bike rider, and never have been. It might be kind of fun to have some bikes included, but I certainly wouldn't lose any sleep over it if they wern't. On the other hand, I wouldn't be upset about having them either. I've said this many times: I see the GT series as a celebration of speed. The thrill of driving a bike through a road course would fit within that definition just fine, in my opinion.

As for bikes beating cars in a straight line or a road course, it will depend on the bike. Don't make the mistake of thinking if it has 2 wheels it will automatically win. My daily driven car will take down bikes in a straight line too, so long as they are 600cc or less (unmodified of course).

I'm more concerned about what GT4 may leave OUT, rather than what they might ADD. :D
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1st off, you don't drive a bike, you ride it so GT would have have the slogan real driving/riding simulator. It's changed anyway but now it's the drive of your life, I don't know how boffins at Peugeot will react to that. Anyway even the name Gran Turismo indicates cars only, Gran Turismo is not only an Italian expression but it's a form of motorsport, it has many refferences in the world of cars, not so in bikes because it has no meaning there. GTO in cars is Gran Turismo Omolagato, which again is a class of motorsport as well as an extenson to some cars name. If Gran Turismo were to feature bikes, it could no longer call itself Gran Turismo. Bikes in GT4 would not in any way be an addition, because as I said before, in order for it to work and for the bikes to handle well too sacrifices n both fronts would have to be made, you'd have a less complete car engine and an incomplete bikes engine as well as a lower number of cars since the bikes have been created instead. Bikes will only detract from the spirit of GT and the experience.
 
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