Nürburgring skill in Power to Weight numbers

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The Teacher

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There are so many ways to prove your stupid-fast at "the ring" You can fix the formula gran turismo and try below 5min times, whitch is maybe the most boring thing to do at all... rather eat salt :yuck: . A boring evening last week I wanted to prove to my self that i have some real skill on that track... in the game that is, so I thought "an FF-car should make it pretty awkward" I went and bought the used '01 Acura Integra in black. I decided to attempt below 8min with as few mods as possible. After a couple of failed attempts I succeded in a 7'58 time... this in a car with 4,5PW (4,5kilos per Hp) I've barely modded it at all, it runs on R1-tires no "nos" and nothing else past semi-racing, i only used port polish and "those" no NA and no Turbo upgrades. I've atempted this in other cars lately also, in a used '99 s2000... with only oil-change and R1-tires (about 4,6PW) I easily got below 8min. My pressent
record is in a '01 Civic Type-R With 4,66PW this car barely have any mods at all...

OK, so I think i'm very good and so and so... Think you'r any good then do your best to get below 8min in a "high-PW" car, mod it only the least and don't play dumb with nos. I think i'm good :sly: ... prove me stupid!!! ( 💡 by beating my record that is)
 
A newbie called the teacher? Well well well...

Be warned, there's always someone who can beat you. Just ask Michael Schumacher...
 
Just jump in any moderately-powerful racing car (we're thinking the ASL Garaiya or the Ameniya Asparadrink RX-7 here but any SuperGT 350-class racer will do), and take a spin on the 'Ring in Family Cup mode. Ramp up the difficulty to +10, chuck an extra 200 weight in, and run with the minimum downforce just for good measure.

You have two laps. Good luck - you'll need it.
 
I have to say that while it will not effect your power or weight (and therefore not your PTW ratio) using R spec tyres, even R1's are a very major modification to the car.

Tyres of this spec are going to make a huge difference to your times, straping on rubber of this nature is always going to drop lap times by a huge degree. Over in the Tuning and Settings area a number of members looked at what modification had the biggest difference on lap times, and how much time you gained per credit spent. Tyres came out top here, as they will improve almost every aspect of a car, particularly in regard to braking and cornering ability.

As an example, over in the GT Series comparison thread, Wolfe and I have been running a stock BMW M3 around Grand Valley on N2 tyres and getting times in the region of 2.20. Last night I wanted to see how my DC2 Integra compared to this, the DC2 is running approx 270bhp (well below a stock M3) and has been lightened, but more importantly is on R3 tyres. Its lap time (without trying that hard) was 2.07. That would give average lap times of

BMW M3 - 78.94mph
DC2 ITR - 87.02mph

That gives the DC2 an average speed advantage of 8.08mph per lap over an M3!

I would personally be more interested in the sort of lap times that could be achieved running an mildly modificed car on N2's.

Regards

Scaff
 
Be wary of quoting kilo per HP figures - that is weight-to-power ratio, not power-to-weight, which is HP per kg.
 
RenesisEvo
Be wary of quoting kilo per HP figures - that is weight-to-power ratio, not power-to-weight, which is HP per kg.
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In some countries they use weight-to-power ratio, and vice versa is mostly unknown.
That's the case with us in Finland, and it's handy in that you can usually see roughly how fast the car will accelerate from rest, just by looking at the weight-to-power ratio: 5 kg/hp is roughly 5 seconds 0-60, 7 kg/hp is seven seconds and so on.
 
But that's not the only weird thing about us...
 
I was going to accept his challenge until i saw that he used R tires, i don't even leave past standard tires, as you get a serious feel for reaching the limit.

Putting up some pretty good numbers too with smooth driving.
I'll post some times later on as my bro is playing Forza at the moment.

Always give youself a challenge, buy standard tires for everycar you own, they'll have them selectable in arcade mode if you do this, helpful if you want fully stock vehicles without having to buy them all over again.
 
R tyres kill it for me. Esp in low powered cars. They mean you can probably go flat out all over the place, esp. at a track full of fast bends like the green hell. Grippy tyres make the car so much easier to drive, everywhere, as well as making it faster. Much more challenging to have more power but less grip.

Having said that, I haven't tried to beat your times, Teach, so for all I know you may be as good as you think :) But if you really want to pit yourself against the rest of the best, there's an online racing series on this very forum. Check out the sticky threads at the top. Then go and put your money where your mouth is 👍
 
Now personally, I love using racing tires and only use sports tires when doing races that require them. I love it when the cars handle well.

You can still push handling to the edge with racing tires, it is just that your overall times should be better on them. Some cars also get trickier on the stickier tires, but that's usually fun, at least for me.

I mean, I downhill ski, and I suppose I *could* use cheaper skis that didn't hold a carve well, but I sure wouldn't want to! I want skis that "feel like I'm on rails" no matter how tight I carve and no matter how fast I'm going.

(As a side note, I have spent many years skiing "at the edge" but haven't done any real-life driving "at the edge" since my early 20s. This really threw me off at first when playing GT4. When skiing, the faster you go, the more carving ability/control you get, as the g-forces push your edges deeper into the snow when carving. The first few hours I played GT4 I was continually trying to go faster to get more gripping power. It was really quite funny :-)
 
I agree with Scaff... if you want to talk about skill or whatnot, N3 is the limit.
 
Does it have to be an FF car?

If not, I reckon the S2000 should be pretty decent for this. I might give it a try later on
 
I relayed this challenge to a friend (PS2 and PC right next to each other in my room :D ).

7'44"591 on the first lap, in a bone-stock Nissan BNR34 Skyline GT-R V-Spec II Nür, with R1's. Weight-to-power ratio of 4.564.
 
panjandrum
The first few hours I played GT4 I was continually trying to go faster to get more gripping power. It was really quite funny :-)
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Opps, I bet that didn't work too well :)

Regards

Scaff
 
Mr teacher, if you were to organise a proper race in the spot race and times thread, i will give it a go :D, Im not the fastest but im not too slow either :D. Proper list of car and mods allowed etc.

I think a good one is a stock arcade NSX R 2002, with N3's 0% power and weight.

But its up to you.
 
Looking at my timesheets, I'm under 8:30 in a stock ITR on N3-tires (8:20+ in a Focus RS), and if memory serves me correct, I can do it in near 8-flat in a Focus RS on S-Tires. Which would mean that I could probably do it in under 8 in more than a few stock FF cars on R-tires. I've done way under 7 minutes (can't remember exactly, long time ago) in a fully modified SRT4 on race tires, but I'll have to dig up my files to see if I actually saved the time.

I'm not picky about tires (N2's? I've always swapped out my tires for the stickiest available in real-life, so N3's are just right for me. :lol: :lol: :lol: ), but the moment you say "time record", "street car" and "R-Tires" in the same post in this forum, eyes are going to roll...

@Teacher: If you think you're good, find a time on the leaderboards (highest time with a certain car), match the car and tires, and try to beat that time. If you can match it, you're probably good. If you can pass it with a lot of time to spare, you're probably very good...

Anyone who can do the ring in under 5minutes (no cheating/offs) is a God to me. Boring? Hell no. Hard as Nails? Definitely.

I don't like to compare my times to other guys, as I'm merely average or good as compared to some guys here in some cars, and very good in others. Like FastEddie says, there's always someone better than you.
 
For the very first time a post from me has attracted attention on this forum :drool:

Well, well, well... a bit sour are we, calling me a newb...
ok i'm a past 90% completed, should mute some people.
I've tried "the ring" in most the cars in the game so I know whats more challenging. Doing it in a fourwheel-drive car is allways far easier, so allso in cars like the MR-ones, for example the nsx-r does the ring below 8min in the real world, as known from BMI. Dont try to find shortcuts, it's fun when it's hard :dopey:
And yes it is harder with N-tires :dunce: so hard in fact that i have yet to get below 8min in any FF-car whether how much it has been moded.
Of course it's more grip in R-tires but to get below 8min in a relatively weak car thats what it takes, plus you really have to stay in the apex and try to find faster lines to carry more speed out of corners and so on. Try it then come back and complain.

As usual everyone has an opinion and nobody dares to challenge :grumpy:
 
Anyone with enough time can have 90% complete!

It's not that no one dares to challenge, it's just your idea doesn't attract people to even give it a try! GT is suppose to be a simulator, though it's not as sophisticated as we want it to be, however we play the way that is most realistic.

Your way is the worst, low power with high grip... Who can't handle that? If you change at least the tires, I'm sure people will start to do some ground work rather than just talking.
 
The Teacher
For the very first time a post from me has attracted attention on this forum :drool:

Well, well, well... a bit sour are we, calling me a newb...
ok i'm a past 90% completed, should mute some people.
I've tried "the ring" in most the cars in the game so I know whats more challenging. Doing it in a fourwheel-drive car is allways far easier, so allso in cars like the MR-ones, for example the nsx-r does the ring below 8min in the real world, as known from BMI. Dont try to find shortcuts, it's fun when it's hard :dopey:
And yes it is harder with N-tires :dunce: so hard in fact that i have yet to get below 8min in any FF-car whether how much it has been moded.
Of course it's more grip in R-tires but to get below 8min in a relatively weak car thats what it takes, plus you really have to stay in the apex and try to find faster lines to carry more speed out of corners and so on. Try it then come back and complain.

As usual everyone has an opinion and nobody dares to challenge :grumpy:
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Challenge? I had a lap in the s2000 you mentioned and got under 8 mins first go (7.55), so it not that difficult really is it?

Nothing interesting about standard suspension running slick racing tyres, in the real world it wouldnt happen as the chassis is set up for the tyres to get the most out of them.
 
The Teacher
As usual everyone has an opinion and nobody dares to challenge :grumpy:
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I never called you a newb or disbelived you ;).

If you want a challenge create a thread in this Section with a specific list of mods and your car, and the rules of the competition and i will race it.
 
The Teacher
Well, well, well... a bit sour are we, calling me a newb...
ok i'm a past 90% completed, should mute some people.
I've tried "the ring" in most the cars in the game so I know whats more challenging. Doing it in a fourwheel-drive car is allways far easier, so allso in cars like the MR-ones, for example the nsx-r does the ring below 8min in the real world, as known from BMI. Dont try to find shortcuts, it's fun when it's hard
And yes it is harder with N-tires so hard in fact that i have yet to get below 8min in any FF-car whether how much it has been moded.
Of course it's more grip in R-tires but to get below 8min in a relatively weak car thats what it takes, plus you really have to stay in the apex and try to find faster lines to carry more speed out of corners and so on. Try it then come back and complain.
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I wouldn't call you a newb myself (I avoid using the term in a degrading manner), but looking from the perspective of other people here, it adds up: New GTPlanet member + Challenge that isn't very challenging at all = Newb.

4WD cars are more stable but understeer more, and some MR cars can have the dangerous combination of being prone to both under- and oversteer.

As others have already said here, weak car + high-grip tires = boring/easy. As far as having to find faster lines...any person who knows the line well enough in a faster, harder to control car will have a picnic in a slow, high-grip car.

The Teacher
As usual everyone has an opinion and nobody dares to challenge :grumpy:
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*Ahem*

Wolfe2x7
I relayed this challenge to a friend (PS2 and PC right next to each other in my room :D ).

7'44"591 on the first lap, in a bone-stock Nissan BNR34 Skyline GT-R V-Spec II Nür, with R1's. Weight-to-power ratio of 4.564.
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Well alot of what your saying makes sence... so I won't speak so loud next time :grumpy: but I got a challenge :) the person driving the (r34) vspec-II Nür got it down to 7'44 in arcade I presume, so I did it my self with S2-tires and got 7'49.776. thats the fastest I could go in that car on that track and I don't get where u got those seconds from? Saying that I hate the R34 skylines and haven't driven them more than 10times at all... I love the r32's though.
Whell I'm going to post a challenge in the right forum, it's going to be "get the '01 civic around the ring under 8min with as little credits spent as posible, cars and all"
Anybody up to the challenge post your replys here:

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=70516
 
The Teacher
Well alot of what your saying makes sence... so I won't speak so loud next time :grumpy: but I got a challenge :) the person driving the (r34) vspec-II Nür got it down to 7'44 in arcade I presume, so I did it my self with S2-tires and got 7'49.776. thats the fastest I could go in that car on that track and I don't get where u got those seconds from?(...)
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Wolfe2x7
(....)with R1's.(...)
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!
 
The Teacher
Well alot of what your saying makes sence... so I won't speak so loud next time :grumpy: but I got a challenge :) the person driving the (r34) vspec-II Nür got it down to 7'44 in arcade I presume, so I did it my self with S2-tires and got 7'49.776. thats the fastest I could go in that car on that track and I don't get where u got those seconds from? ]

You sound like you cant believe someone else could go faster than you?

Join the weekly racing series and get a proper challenge every week that is equal in cars /tyres and you will get an idea of how quick you really are, every week there are people 2 -3 seconds a lap faster than me, and you picked the Ring to challenge which has so many areas that time can be made up!
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Just to add what Dave_George is saying above: I thought I was a pretty fast driver....then I joined the WRS and had my eyes opened... there are some really fast guys out there and some really talented gamers... the great thing about the WRS though is that no one has a chip on his shoulder, and some of the fastest guys are happy to share some of their tips (racing line, spec on tuning, etc) with the rest of the competition, so you can learn and improve your skills.
So its highly competitive, but friendly atmosphere there. I suggest you give it a try and join us...?
 
I'm gonna try the next weekly racing series, then lets see maybe i'll have to swallow my words :drool:
See you there 👍
 
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