Next M3 a hatchback?

  • Thread starter Thread starter SuperShouden
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Wouldn't bother me if it was. As long as it's still a good piece of engineering and still drives brilliantly, it doesn't matter what bodystyle it has. They've made M3 convertibles, coupes, sedans and even wagons, and they've made M5 sedans and wagons. That's quite a mix of bodystyles and if they want to make a hatch that's fine by me.

Incidentally, that rendering, which they even say is "just an unrealistic rendering by InsideLine" is not what it'd look like.

Also, this probably would have been better in the Auto News section.
 
I hope they don't go through with it, the M3 is the only BMW I like. In my opinion saloons look more dignified than hatchbacks.
 
Nice image, I particularly like the registration plate. Car looks terrible.
 
Judging from that image and the screen quality between the front and rear I'd say that image is just the current M3 with the rear sawn off and the rear from an M3 coupe pasted on. The shape of the boot is close to exactly the same as that of the M3 coupe.

Name one M3 that didn't look good. Although judging from the current 5-series and X-series I might need to be careful with what I've just said :p
 
Maybe they think times have changed since the M Coupe? Remember those? It was probably an awesome car that hardly anyone bought.

rr_m_coupe_1.jpg


Maybe BMW is looking at the North American sales of the Mazdaspeed 3 and thinking, when all those owners are ready to go a little upscale, they'll have just the thing.
 
Except the "Gran Turismo" series more resembles the Accord Crosstour....

but where is the 3-Series GT in the first place? How can we have a car based on something that doesn't exist?
 
I'll say again: The image on that site isn't real. It even says so below the image itself. The pic is clearly a mixture of current M3 sedan and 5-Series GT.

There's no 3-Series GT, and to the best of my knowledge there are no plans for one.
 
Someone tell BMW to get away from these "cross-over" type vehicles. The X5 was fine, it didn't need a X6. The 5 Series was fine, it didn't need a GT model. I'm going to cut the 6 Series some slack since the GranCoupe is sexy, but this is too much for me.
 
There's no 3-Series GT, and to the best of my knowledge there are no plans for one.

There are lots of plans for one!

BMW evaluating introduction of 3GT and 1GT, the GT being an additional body style to the accepted line-up of saloon, coupe, convertible, tourer etc...

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8187489#post8187489

Progressive Activity Sedan (Gran Turismo)
5er GT , 3er GT approved for production. 1er under evaluation.
3er GT will be based upon the extended 3er Li platform for China, but the look is lower and sleeker than the 5er Gran Turismo, more like a fastback. The twin hatch will not be carried over.

And..

McLaren
Someone tell BMW to get away from these "cross-over" type vehicles. The X5 was fine, it didn't need a X6. The 5 Series was fine, it didn't need a GT model. I'm going to cut the 6 Series some slack since the GranCoupe is sexy, but this is too much for me.

The X6 has sold over 100,000 units.. no they didn't need an X6, but obviously plenty of people wanted it.

I do get tired of people ragging on BMW for making these cars, yes I am a self professed BMW fanboy... but honestly, how is offering a wider choice not a good thing? With modern design and manufacturing techniques it is a lot less expensive to develop new models based on existing platforms/architecture, sure some of them may seem pointless to YOU, because YOU have no need of them, or YOU don't like the way they look... but that does not make them pointless... I have no kids, no dog, no garden to maintain, I don't have tools I need for work... so pretty much anything other than a motorbike would be pointless from my point of view, using your logic... ... but it's clearly not the case (infact I drive a 5 tourer!)

The fact is that car manufacturers are offering more choice.... they are evolving the car... it's called progress... some may sell, some may not... but that doesn't mean it's not worth trying.



As. for the F30 M3 being offered as a GT.. It doesn't offend me. RS4, RS6, M5 tourer, AMG C63 tourer, AMG E55 tourer... they all perform well.

Toronado
It may be offered as an additional model, but it certainly won't out and out replace the sedan.

E90 M3 sales have been poor, BMW announced some time ago that F30 M3 wouldnt be offered as a saloon. E30, and E46 variants weren't so I don't think its a big stretch of the imagination...
 
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The X6 has sold over 100,000 units.. no they didn't need an X6, but obviously plenty of people wanted it.
Because when people see new BMWs, they immediately want it just b/c. Classic ended up with a large chunk of X5s because people were trading in on X6s.

Same damn thing with Ferrari throwing out a Spider version of the Scuderia.
I do get tired of people ragging on BMW for making these cars, yes I am a self professed BMW fanboy...
I'm not ragging on BMW at all. FYI, I've been a BMW owner for several years from a M to a 3 to a 5 back to a 3 currently. The brand has been in my family for 2 decades now and has ranged from the 3 to 8.

but honestly, how is offering a wider choice not a good thing? With modern design and manufacturing techniques it is a lot less expensive to develop new models based on existing platforms/architecture, sure some of them may seem pointless to YOU, because YOU have no need of them, or YOU don't like the way they look... but that does not make them pointless... I have no kids, no dog, no garden to maintain, I don't have tools I need for work... so pretty much anything other than a motorbike would be pointless from my point of view, using your logic... ... but it's clearly not the case (infact I drive a 5 tourer!)
The whole, "Fill the line-up with 1 more car" mentality is excessive. The X6 was a bit much, but the 5GT is nothing more than a "Cross-over" Edition of a 5 Touring w/ a hefty price tag thrown on it. Originally, there was nothing wrong with a 5 Touring & it didn't cost too much more than the sedan. Now the 5GT is here, which has killed off the 5 Touring in the states & starts $7K+/- more than the same sedan model.

The original idea behind the 6 Series Gran Coupe was a CLS-Fighter that would be marketed as an 8-Series? Really now? Thankfully, they wised up & built as a 6-Series model.

Bringing up a M3 Hatchback seems like they want to do it just because.
The fact is that car manufacturers are offering more choice.... they are evolving the car... it's called progress... some may sell, some may not... but that doesn't mean it's not worth trying.
If they want to evolve the cars, evolve what you've got. BMW likes to do things just for the sake of doing it, ala, throwing out the idea of a 2 Series. They got away with the 1 Series amazingly.
 
E90 M3 sales have been poor, BMW announced some time ago that F30 M3 wouldnt be offered as a saloon. E30, and E46 variants weren't so I don't think its a big stretch of the imagination...
Not producing a sedan for the next redesign does not mean the same thing as replacing the sedan with something else.
 
Because when people see new BMWs, they immediately want it just b/c. Classic ended up with a large chunk of X5s because people were trading in on X6s.

Again, this is just about choice, those people obviously prefer the X6 to the X5.. BMW have offered them a product, and they have taken it... I don't see it as a bad thing. Afterall, the X6 is a good car!

The whole, "Fill the line-up with 1 more car" mentality is excessive. The X6 was a bit much, but the 5GT is nothing more than a "Cross-over" Edition of a 5 Touring w/ a hefty price tag thrown on it. Originally, there was nothing wrong with a 5 Touring & it didn't cost too much more than the sedan. Now the 5GT is here, which has killed off the 5 Touring in the states & starts $7K+/- more than the same sedan model.

I do agree its not a good thing that the GT replace the tourer in the US, but BMW have made that decision based on sales figures.. I'm not trying to offensive, but the impression I get is Americans are their own worst enemy when it comes to cars, they often miss out good stuff because to many of them are stuck in their ways... Diesels, Hatch-backs, Tourers (Station Wagons), the fact is 5 tourers in the US don't sell that well.

The original idea behind the 6 Series Gran Coupe was a CLS-Fighter that would be marketed as an 8-Series? Really now? Thankfully, they wised up & built as a 6-Series model.

Lol, well that is personal preference I guess.. as a life long lover of the E24 six series I would argue that the Gran Coupe is better suited as an 8 series.. since the 8er was less of a sports car and more of a GT, compared to the 6er it replaced! But, either way.. I'm just glad it will see production!

Bringing up a M3 Hatchback seems like they want to do it just because.

If they want to evolve the cars, evolve what you've got. BMW likes to do things just for the sake of doing it, ala, throwing out the idea of a 2 Series. They got away with the 1 Series amazingly.

The M3 Hatchback will get made if it makes good business sense.

And the 1 series is set to become the 2 series.. to free up the 1 series tag for a smaller (FWD) car. Sounds like evolution to me!

In my opinion, NOT offering a vehicle (such as a supercar), is a far worse thing than offering a car some people don't need (such as the X6).

A) 5GT: Don't like it? Don't buy it!
B) BMW M Super car: Want it? Can't buy it!

...Which is worse!

.. and also, why is it amazing the 1 series has been a success?
 
Again, this is just about choice, those people obviously prefer the X6 to the X5.. BMW have offered them a product, and they have taken it... I don't see it as a bad thing. Afterall, the X6 is a good car!
They preferred it because it was new. That's it. Same reason idiots trade in 1 year old Ferraris. They want it just to have it.
And the 1 series is set to become the 2 series.. to free up the 1 series tag for a smaller (FWD) car. Sounds like evolution to me!
Does it? Or is it going to put BMW in an even bigger issue with Mini? They don't need a smaller car. That's what the Mini is for. As I said, they'll do it just for 🤬 & giggles.
In my opinion, NOT offering a vehicle (such as a supercar), is a far worse thing than offering a car some people don't need (such as the X6).

A) 5GT: Don't like it? Don't buy it!
B) BMW M Super car: Want it? Can't buy it!

...Which is worse!
The one that costs BMW money when the car doesn't sale as expected. A BMW M Super Car will get sales, that's a guarantee. In fact, BMW will more than likely fill the first year orders in days.

The 5GT can't do that. When it was released, it didn't seem like people were interested just because of the design.
.. and also, why is it amazing the 1 series has been a success?
Because it's priced very close to the base 3 series. $4K more for a better car is a good deal.
 
They preferred it because it was new. That's it. Same reason idiots trade in 1 year old Ferraris. They want it just to have it.

If that were true, it would be impossible for BMW to have a sales failure.. which would make most of this of this discussion irrelevant, clearly it's not the case.

Does it? Or is it going to put BMW in an even bigger issue with Mini? They don't need a smaller car. That's what the Mini is for. As I said, they'll do it just for 🤬 & giggles.

Mini has been a massive success for BMW, personally I don't care for them.. but it has helped BMW hugely in terms of revenue and profitability..

.. the problem BMW have with Mini, is where to take it next, Mini sales compared to it's competitors are struggling a bit these days... when it was first introduced, it was new funky and fresh, yet it still resembled the original somewhat, it resurrected a much loved brand... I think that is a trick that can only be pulled once, ... The fact that the novelty has worn off the Mini, will probably generate much interest in it's competitors... so it makes sense for BMW to have an alternate car.

The one that costs BMW money when the car doesn't sale as expected. A BMW M Super Car will get sales, that's a guarantee. In fact, BMW will more than likely fill the first year orders in days.

The 5GT can't do that. When it was released, it didn't seem like people were interested just because of the design.

That may be true, but overall I suspect a slow-selling 5GT to ultimately generate more profit than a super car (mainly, because it's cheaper to develop - lots of 7 series in there)


And when I talk about evolution, I dont just mean each model, I mean as a company.

Look back at cars like the isetta, the 700, the neu klasse cars, the X5... BMW has adapted it's range to suit the times, it would be foolish for BMW to sit back and think that they will survive forever just selling a 3, 5 and 7 series... because they won't..
 
.. the problem BMW have with Mini, is where to take it next, Mini sales compared to it's competitors are struggling a bit these days... when it was first introduced, it was new funky and fresh, yet it still resembled the original somewhat, it resurrected a much loved brand... I think that is a trick that can only be pulled once, ... The fact that the novelty has worn off the Mini, will probably generate much interest in it's competitors... so it makes sense for BMW to have an alternate car.

I do see where you're coming from with that.

Apart from anything, there will be people out there for whom the BMW badge is a must, regardless of what it's attached to. Plenty of people have taken the option to downsize when BMW have produced 3-Series Compacts or the 1-Series - I'm almost certain the upcoming FWD small car will be a successful seller. The MINI, despite actually being a BMW product, still doesn't have the BMW badge so for some it won't be what they're after.
 
Again, this is just about choice, those people obviously prefer the X6 to the X5.. BMW have offered them a product, and they have taken it... I don't see it as a bad thing. Afterall, the X6 is a good car!



I do agree its not a good thing that the GT replace the tourer in the US, but BMW have made that decision based on sales figures.. I'm not trying to offensive, but the impression I get is Americans are their own worst enemy when it comes to cars, they often miss out good stuff because to many of them are stuck in their ways... Diesels, Hatch-backs, Tourers (Station Wagons), the fact is 5 tourers in the US don't sell that well.

Americans are not 'stuck in our ways' nor should anyone be offended by what you have said.

In the US, we have some draconian regulations regarding cars & engines. Diesels have to meet some strict standards, however, those may change in lieu of a revelation that the people who set the standard, basically California, screwed up...big time.

We don't get the good stuff b/c all US cars have to have airbags in the seat. All US cars have to have ABS, stability management, and other passive safety devices that would make the exportation of some European cars cost too much to make business sense.

What's the point of exporting, say, a 1000 or so Focus RS models if you have to change the seats, the emissions equip, and spend who knows how much to have that car crash tested, EPA tested, etc, etc, etc. Lots of bureaucracy, UAW (union) 2-fleet rules, and expenses in bringing in a new/different car to the US market.

Also, the roads in the US are much different than in Europe. Vast wide expressways pretty much connect the entire country and most are quite smooth. That's why automatics, big V8's, and boat-like handling is somewhat the norm as a true 'sport' suspension would leave most drivers quite tired.

Station wagons don't really sell in the US for 2 reasons;
1. Women like to 'feel' safe in a car - so they buy higher riding & heavier SUVs which hold the same amount of cargo.
2. Young families prefer car based mini-vans b/c of ease of access, lots of space, and perceived safety.

There may be a small niche for a wagon/estate in the US - but everyone who's tried has failed. If you need that much space; SUVs are perceived as being safer and mini-vans are more convenient.

The BMW M3 quasi-hatch mutant thing will not go over well. Sports cars are usually toys and not used daily, so why would you want a 4-door sedan when the 2-door version looks better? In the circumstance that you need a car with more passenger space, chances are you have another car or can use your spouse's.

Sell M3's and only offer a coupe. Seems like the accounting dept/committee thought this brilliant idea up to sort out their books.
 
Wouldn't bother me if it was. As long as it's still a good piece of engineering and still drives brilliantly, it doesn't matter what bodystyle it has. They've made M3 convertibles, coupes, sedans and even wagons, and they've made M5 sedans and wagons. That's quite a mix of bodystyles and if they want to make a hatch that's fine by me.

Incidentally, that rendering, which they even say is "just an unrealistic rendering by InsideLine" is not what it'd look like.

Also, this probably would have been better in the Auto News section.

By wagon do you mean estate? I don't recall an M3 estate ever being made.

I think one would be ok though to compete with Audi and Merc hot estates. I will be pretty gutted if they don't make a saloon version of the next M3. I love the M3 saloons, its actually one of the things that put me off buying an E46, the lack of a four door version.
 
Americans are not 'stuck in our ways' nor should anyone be offended by what you have said.

In the US, we have some draconian regulations regarding cars & engines. Diesels have to meet some strict standards, however, those may change in lieu of a revelation that the people who set the standard, basically California, screwed up...big time.

We don't get the good stuff b/c all US cars have to have airbags in the seat. All US cars have to have ABS, stability management, and other passive safety devices that would make the exportation of some European cars cost too much to make business sense.

What's the point of exporting, say, a 1000 or so Focus RS models if you have to change the seats, the emissions equip, and spend who knows how much to have that car crash tested, EPA tested, etc, etc, etc. Lots of bureaucracy, UAW (union) 2-fleet rules, and expenses in bringing in a new/different car to the US market.

Also, the roads in the US are much different than in Europe. Vast wide expressways pretty much connect the entire country and most are quite smooth. That's why automatics, big V8's, and boat-like handling is somewhat the norm as a true 'sport' suspension would leave most drivers quite tired.

Station wagons don't really sell in the US for 2 reasons;
1. Women like to 'feel' safe in a car - so they buy higher riding & heavier SUVs which hold the same amount of cargo.
2. Young families prefer car based mini-vans b/c of ease of access, lots of space, and perceived safety.

There may be a small niche for a wagon/estate in the US - but everyone who's tried has failed. If you need that much space; SUVs are perceived as being safer and mini-vans are more convenient.

The BMW M3 quasi-hatch mutant thing will not go over well. Sports cars are usually toys and not used daily, so why would you want a 4-door sedan when the 2-door version looks better? In the circumstance that you need a car with more passenger space, chances are you have another car or can use your spouse's.

Sell M3's and only offer a coupe. Seems like the accounting dept/committee thought this brilliant idea up to sort out their books.

Thanks for the explanation, I know california has some crazy rules & regs, but what you say makes a lot of sense.
 
If that were true, it would be impossible for BMW to have a sales failure.. which would make most of this of this discussion irrelevant, clearly it's not the case.
It's true for the people that came through Classic when the X6 came out & had X5s they wanted to trade in. The clue there is X5 owners. People weren't coming in to trade in X3s or anything else.

Mini has been a massive success for BMW, personally I don't care for them.. but it has helped BMW hugely in terms of revenue and profitability..

.. the problem BMW have with Mini, is where to take it next, Mini sales compared to it's competitors are struggling a bit these days... when it was first introduced, it was new funky and fresh, yet it still resembled the original somewhat, it resurrected a much loved brand... I think that is a trick that can only be pulled once, ... The fact that the novelty has worn off the Mini, will probably generate much interest in it's competitors... so it makes sense for BMW to have an alternate car.
Obviously, where to take it next is to keep expanding it ala the Clubman & whatever else they've been showing off. Building another car to compete with that is going to affect the sales of one or the other. The only people who get away with this is Audi & VW.

That may be true, but overall I suspect a slow-selling 5GT to ultimately generate more profit than a super car (mainly, because it's cheaper to develop - lots of 7 series in there)
That's if it sales as they hope it does. But of course, naturally over time the 5GT will sale more.
And when I talk about evolution, I dont just mean each model, I mean as a company.

Look back at cars like the isetta, the 700, the neu klasse cars, the X5... BMW has adapted it's range to suit the times, it would be foolish for BMW to sit back and think that they will survive forever just selling a 3, 5 and 7 series... because they won't..
There is a difference between doing that & doing stuff for "teh lulz". BMW does it just to do it, they don't watch to see if what they're doing will affect sales. That's why they got lucky with a 135i running as much as a 328i; different cars. Can't say the same for 128i though.
 
I love hatches but if it looked like the rendered picture count me out. That car looked horrid.
 

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