Perfect Shifting?

[chameleon2]

When upshifting, I've noticed there's a "perfect shift" moment. It probably been there ever since GT1, but just now I noticed it. Can anyone confirm this? It's different of course for every car, but shifting on a certain point in the red line area, it seems to be shifting faster if you're at the perfect shifting point. I mean it''s also in Need for Speed underground, now that's an arcadady game, but is this in real life as well? I presume so, but am not sure. Not that a perfect shift will make much of a difference in a Nurburgring lap, but I guess it might be in your favor on the dragstrip.

 

[RX-7_FC_DrIfteR]

depends on the cars power band, but i still want to check these things out when i get the game.

 

[Darts]

depends on the cars power band, but i still want to check these things out when i get the game.

I always use Automatic, that way i can concentarte better on driving and overtaking and driving perfect, plus i can't downshift, i just don't ahve any feeling how many gears to go down, so when i have to do driving clases i have to learn that and it will take some time. But what are your reasons to use Manual? most of the time racing cars and good road cars have Automatic option so you can't react with the realism part.

 

[G.T]

I remember in GT4P the Ford GT would shift really slow if you shift early exiting a corner. ...or if you over rev it exiting a corner. I can't remember...

 

[Darts]

I remember in GT4P the Ford GT would shift really slow if you shift early exiting a corner. ...or if you over rev it exiting a corner. I can't remember...

Another reason to take automatic transmission.

 

[Stune]

just shift up as soon as the line hits the red. I think there might be a little light which starts flashing aswell.

 

[leenis24]

It all has to do with the cars power band and gearing. matching the right RPM's with the right gear and you have yourself a good shift. Shift to early and you miss the engines top power, shift to late and you over rev, also missing the engines most power output.

Can anyone agree with me on this? or not, whatever.

 

[Stune]

It all has to do with the cars power band and gearing. matching the right RPM's with the right gear and you have yourself a good shift. Shift to early and you miss the engines top power, shift to late and you over rev, also missing the engines most power output.

Can anyone agree with me on this? or not, whatever.

yes thats totally right

 

[Darts]

yes thats totally right

But my question still isnt answered, why is manual better than Automatic? on automatic you have no mistkaes and can fully concentarte on driving.

 

[G.T]

It all has to do with the cars power band and gearing. matching the right RPM's with the right gear and you have yourself a good shift. Shift to early and you miss the engines top power, shift to late and you over rev, also missing the engines most power output.

Can anyone agree with me on this? or not, whatever.

That explains the Ford GT's long shift.

Manual shifting is more of a challenge, that's it why I use it. That's why it's better.

 

[cobragt]

You can exit turns quicker with a manual transmission. A car is quicker with a manual transmission, correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[LoudMusic]

In the real world I could never see myself driving an automatic as my daily car. I think it destroys the driving experience.

But in a video game where all the control of the car is at your fingertips, it makes it rather difficult to handle throttle, break, stearing, shifting, and "looking over your shoulder" all with your fingers. It gets crazy sometimes so I just use automagic in the game. That is of course with the Dual Shock controller. When I drive with the wheel I use the paddle shifters.

Yes, there is most definitely a "perfect moment" to shift. It's what makes good drivers good.

 

[T5-R]

I used to use automatic in all racing games, but I trained myself to use manual in GT : P once I'd gotten used to it I easily started beating my best times in the McLaren.

I also drive a manual in real life & as LoudMusic says I can't imagine driving an auto, it'd seem crap. Which is why buying a Mercedes would be difficult as their autos are supposed to be better!

I still use auto in 2 player though.

 

[fasternfaster]

with an automatic the car will always shift RIGHT at redline.. and with a manual it is sometimes better to hold the car in gear and go past redline and get closer to the rev limiter which is usually 500-1500rpm higher depending on the car. on a some tracks shifting later could mean 1 or 2 less shifts and that means you spend more time accelerating and less time shifting. the difference each split second shift makes could be 1/3 to 1/2 a car length. try it with a ghost car and you will see that if you shift right before the revlimit where the tach needle bounces back you will get optimum acceleration.

 

[Symtex]

You can exit turns quicker with a manual transmission. A car is quicker with a manual transmission, correct me if I'm wrong.

You are wrong. Manual transmission is use to control the RPM of your car. You can also engine brake by downshifting. You just have more control over the speed / rpm of your car. Therefore you have better times.

 

[LoudMusic]

Generally speaking, the higher you rev the car without hitting the rev limiter the faster you can accellerate. Most cars produce more power at higher revs so if you keep the car at a higher rev longer rather than shifting and taking a lower rev you will be moving faster.

However, there are some rare instances where the power drops off at the higher rev and you actually may get more power at a lower rev.

 

[cobragt]

Thanks for the correction. But I wasnt all the way off about the car being quicker

 

[G.T]

I always thought overrevving achieved better acceleration in VTEC engines.

 

[Ceyvme]

Generally speaking, the higher you rev the car without hitting the rev limiter the faster you can accellerate. Most cars produce more power at higher revs so if you keep the car at a higher rev longer rather than shifting and taking a lower rev you will be moving faster.

However, there are some rare instances where the power drops off at the higher rev and you actually may get more power at a lower rev.

Completely Untrue, this is what alof of people think. People assume the higher it revs, the more power its going to make, but this is often false. That Rev limit is set not only to not damge your motor, but also to keep you in the powerband. On turbo and tons of NA cars, often times the stock turbo will die out near redline, and in NA cars the cams are not able to produce power above the stock redline. The same thing applies to the Gran Turismo series, shifting a turbo car with stock turbo earlier to keep it in 5k to 7k range, makes a huge difference.

 

[G.T]

Completely Untrue, this is what alof of people think. People assume the higher it revs, the more power its going to make, but this is often false. That Rev limit is set not only to not damge your motor, but also to keep you in the powerband. On turbo and tons of NA cars, often times the stock turbo will die out near redline, and in NA cars the cams are not able to produce power above the stock redline. The same thing applies to the Gran Turismo series, shifting a turbo car with stock turbo earlier to keep it in 5k to 7k range, makes a huge difference.

Just what I was going to say. When you redline turbo cars the turbos loose power.

 

[Swift]

I always thought overrevving achieved better acceleration in VTEC engines.

Well, the trick is to try to keep it in VTEC mode, so that's why a lot of drivers over rev the engine. For instance, in a 2002 model RSX-s, you need to shift at approximately 8000rpm to keep it in VTEC. Even though horsepower gain peaks at 7400rpm. So they keep it going and then shift in an attempt to keep the powerband in VTEC. Make sense?

 

[kensei]

Depends on so much to say there is a perfect shift point. Depends on the circuit, the tires you have on, your driving style, etc. All cars have a sweet spot, that is for sure. I've been testing out a Skyline R34 with this, as I did in GT3. Running it around tsukuba (the BEST test circuit EVER) shifting at 7000rpm, 7500rpm, over redline, etc....it does make a difference in time...AND now in GT4 fuel levels on those longer endurance races.

Downshifting into high speed corners is another plus....esepcially with cars that get squirrely under heavy braking

 

[Swift]

You are wrong. Manual transmission is use to control the RPM of your car. You can also engine brake by downshifting. You just have more control over the speed / rpm of your car. Therefore you have better times.

Exactly!

Darts, this is why you should use manual. It's not difficult to downshift. It just takes practice like anything else.

 

[GT Freak!]

Darts, i did not want to convert to Manual after i had spent so long with automatic. Now that i have got the hang of it, i would never go back! My lap times are faster and it makes it so much more fun. One thing i found fab, is when your in a corner andits the corner where you near the red line in the lower gear and low revs in the next up gear, the AT messes around swopping from one gear to the next. With MT, you have much more control and if need be you can let the car run in the red line while going around a corner so you have higher revs for when you do finaly floor it down to the next corner! So much more fun with MT, their is a learning corve of say 1 - 2 hours and you may find your lap times slower at first, but when you get the hang of it, its great!

In terms of downshifting, that is the hardest part of MT! Say when your on the straight at tokyo (im talking sabout gt3 here) and you have to slam on the brake fore the hairpin, if you change down to quickly the rear wheels lock up breifly and you overshoot the corner, practice changing down on the complex string and find out when in the rev range itis best to drop the gears! Have fun! You wont regret changing to MT!

 

[Darts]

I used to use automatic in all racing games, but I trained myself to use manual in GT : P once I'd gotten used to it I easily started beating my best times in the McLaren.

I also drive a manual in real life & as LoudMusic says I can't imagine driving an auto, it'd seem crap. Which is why buying a Mercedes would be difficult as their autos are supposed to be better!

I still use auto in 2 player though.

It is saver, cause you don;t ahve to spend time watching the clutch and gear, but can just look over the traffic.

 

[Darts]

Thanks, but i prefer Automatic above Manal through the better concentration.

 

[G.T]

Depends on so much to say there is a perfect shift point. Depends on the circuit, the tires you have on, your driving style, etc. All cars have a sweet spot, that is for sure. I've been testing out a Skyline R34 with this, as I did in GT3. Running it around tsukuba (the BEST test circuit EVER) shifting at 7000rpm, 7500rpm, over redline, etc....it does make a difference in time...AND now in GT4 fuel levels on those longer endurance races.

Downshifting into high speed corners is another plus....esepcially with cars that get squirrely under heavy braking

I've seen videos that race drivers shift earlier than usual on corners so I don't think it is best to shift just before redline. Race drivers know best!

 

[Stune]

But my question still isnt answered, why is manual better than Automatic? on automatic you have no mistkaes and can fully concentarte on driving.

Oh sorry. Right advantages of using manual are:

Over large bumps where the car redlines in the computer would shift up slowing you down.

You can often come out i corner one gear faster than what you would in automatic getting possible better acceleration.

since you know exactly when you are shifting up or down its easier to control or counter weelspin

 

[Daddybird]

With some cars, you dont have to run to red-line.
Most american muscles have their peak from 3000-5000rpm, but are redlining at 6, so gear at 5.

 

[Stune]

not nessessarliy but i wont go into why not becouse it can get confusing with no diagrams