real life manual cars questions.

[ddldave]

please don't laugh at me for asking this okay, i know it's stupid but i really don't know. i've never driven a manual transmission car before but i drive one in gran turismo 4. and all i know how to do is release the gas and press the clutch to shift gears. this is all i know, and there's quite a few questions left in me that i need to ask, it may be hard to understand because i'm not really good at explaining so please take it easy on me okay thanks.

this is about real life cars, not in gran turismo.

okay here i go.

1. help, how do i shift down to a lower gear if i were to slow down? okay well you know how when you press on the brakes to slow down your car? how do you know when to shift to a lower gear? what if i shift too early and the RPM is too high? and it redlines, will it damage my car? because i heard redlining is bad, but what about this? i'm not pressing on the gas or anything. is there anything else i need to know about this?

2. and here's another one, do i have to press on the clutch everytime i'm not pressing on the gas while in gear? like if i'm in gear 1-6 and i'm not pressing on the clutch, and i'm not pressing on the gas, it will damage my car right? so i have to either press on clutch if i'm not pressing on gas if i'm in gear 1-6 right?

3. everytime i press on the brakes, i have to press on the clutch first right? is there anything else i need to know?

4. also when you turn off your car, do you set it in neutral then put your emergency brake on, or do you put it in 1 and put emergency brake on? i don't understand this. is there anything else i need to know? thanks.

thanks for taking your time reading and helping me, thanks.

 

[Sage]

1. help, how do i shift down to a lower gear if i were to slow down?

It’s the same as GT4 – you learn when it’s the appropriate time to downshift.

2. and here's another one, do i have to press on the clutch everytime i'm not pressing on the gas while in gear?

No. If you have all feet off all pedals, you will be engine braking, which means that you’ll slow down faster than if you were in neutral, but slower than if you were on the brakes.

3. everytime i press on the brakes, i have to press on the clutch first right?

No. You only need to put the clutch in when your engine drops below idling speed.

4. also when you turn off your car, do you set it in neutral then put your emergency brake on, or do you put it in 1 and put emergency brake on?

The latter. The gears have a decent change of slowing or stopping your car if the parking brake fails.

 

[Philly]

I've never driven a manual, but here is what I understand:

1. Use the gear lever to shift down, opposite direction of shifting up. Basically, you downshift when the RPMs get too low. I think that is just something you have to play with and find your preference. Some people might do it at 1500, others might at 2500. And if you overrev the car, I imagine the limiter will kick in, but you want to depress the clutch as fast as possible and then upshift.

2. I think you only really have to press the clutch when you are shifting (so you don't grind the gears) and when you are stopped so you don't stall the car. It's like putting a car in neutral (automatics automatically disengage the clutch while stopped). But when the clutch is engaged and you aren't on the gas the wheels will drive the engine.

3. You don't have to use the clutch and brakes at the same time. If you are heel-toeing, you only need the clutch for the shifts. but a lot of people just depress the clutch for the whole stop and just put it in first once they stop.

4. I think you put the car in neutral and then put the brake on when parking, unless your emergency brake is broken like in my roommate's car and then you need to keep it in gear to hold the car.

 

[ddldave]

It’s the same as GT4 – you learn when it’s the appropriate time to downshift.


No. If you have all feet off all pedals, you will be engine braking, which means that you’ll slow down faster than if you were in neutral, but slower than if you were on the brakes.


No. You only need to put the clutch in when your engine drops below idling speed.


The latter. The gears have a decent change of slowing or stopping your car if the parking brake fails.

yeah but in GT4, you won't damage your engine, so i never really focus on when to downshift, i just downshift wheenver i'ma bout to turn, but in real life it's different right? if i downshift too early and rpm's go redline, will it damage my car?

so will it harm my car if i do "engine braking" or will it be fine?

what's below idling speed?

what does the latter mean?

 

[Sureboss]

(Christ, so many question marks!)
From my limited experience:

1. Let's say you're in 5th and you're on the Motorway/Highway and there's a big jam ahead, most manual drivers will brake, then clutch in and put it into 1st, I don't know of anyone who goes down through all the gears. Redlining, you'd have to shift really early, and you'd also have to be fairly high on the revs anyway, again, it's possible, but I've not heard of it happen.

2. No, you can be 'free', ie not pedals pressed at all, of course as soon as the car gets 'jumpy' Mr Clutch has to be called upon. A better understanding of what a clutch does.

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/clutch.htm - Clutch
http://auto.howstuffworks.com/transmission.htm - Manual Transmission
A good website for explaining car stuff

3. No, in an emergency stop I was told to not press the clutch in, as for normal driving, obviously you will need the clutch, because you can't accelerate out of a roundabout, junction in 4th. But you don't need to press the clutch first.

4. Stopping; I assume that you are already in line with where you want to stop btw.

Brake, you will need the clutch in, when you stop, the clutch needs to be fully in, put the car in neutral, as soon as it's in neutral you can release the clutch, and put your handbrake on at your own pace.

I've never understand the term emergency brake, using your normal brakes is much quicker than yanking up the handbrake.

...

I hope my answers don't get lambasted. [/crossesfingers]

 

[ddldave]

I've never driven a manual, but here is what I understand:

1. Use the gear lever to shift down, opposite direction of shifting up. Basically, you downshift when the RPMs get too low. I think that is just something you have to play with and find your preference. Some people might do it at 1500, others might at 2500. And if you overrev the car, I imagine the limiter will kick in, but you want to depress the clutch as fast as possible and then upshift.

2. I think you only really have to press the clutch when you are shifting (so you don't grind the gears) and when you are stopped so you don't stall the car. It's like putting a car in neutral (automatics automatically disengage the clutch while stopped). But when the clutch is engaged and you aren't on the gas the wheels will drive the engine.

3. You don't have to use the clutch and brakes at the same time. If you are heel-toeing, you only need the clutch for the shifts. but a lot of people just depress the clutch for the whole stop and just put it in first once they stop.

4. I think you put the car in neutral and then put the brake on when parking, unless your emergency brake is broken like in my roommate's car and then you need to keep it in gear to hold the car.

that's scarey, how does your parking brake get brokeN? how much does it cost to repair? and why do you have to keep it in gear to hold the car? wouldn't putting in gear 1 move the car forward? i don't understand.

 

[ddldave]

also what if it's my first time driving a car? how would i know what rpm to shift down at?

if i slow down too much, and i'm at like gear 5 or something, i'll have to shift down right? or can i leave it at gear 5 until i hit 0, then transfer it all the way down to gear 1? because if i have to know when to shift down everytime i slow down, it's going to be very hard on my head because i'm not very smart and i can't think a lot.

 

[FoolKiller]

I drive a manual and have my whole driving life.

1. help, how do i shift down to a lower gear if i were to slow down? okay well you know how when you press on the brakes to slow down your car? how do you know when to shift to a lower gear? what if i shift too early and the RPM is too high? and it redlines, will it damage my car? because i heard redlining is bad, but what about this? i'm not pressing on the gas or anything. is there anything else i need to know about this?

If I am just slowing down I typically wait for my RPMs to get down fairly low, like around 1500 and then down shift. Well, that's a guess. I rarely watch my RPMs once I get to know the car, it just comes naturally. But I slow down before I downshift.

2. and here's another one, do i have to press on the clutch everytime i'm not pressing on the gas while in gear? like if i'm in gear 1-6 and i'm not pressing on the clutch, and i'm not pressing on the gas, it will damage my car right? so i have to either press on clutch if i'm not pressing on gas if i'm in gear 1-6 right?

No, you can be off all pedals. As said before this just causes engine braking, which can only be damaging if you downshift too soon and it causes the RPMs to shoot up too high. Fortunately, many cars have rev limiters now and it helps to protect the engine. Doing it too soon and causes the RPMs to shoot up can also wear out your clutch.

But in general just letting off all the pedals will cause you to coast just like if you let off the gas in an automatic in drive while at speed.

Of course, if you are not moving, or moving slower than idle then yes you need to press in the clutch or the gas or you will stall.

3. everytime i press on the brakes, i have to press on the clutch first right? is there anything else i need to know?

Are we just slowing down some, like 5mph? No. Are we slowing down enough to need to downshift? Not necessarily, but I do go ahead and press my clutch in and then just shift into the gear I need to be in after I have slowed the car down with my brake.

4. also when you turn off your car, do you set it in neutral then put your emergency brake on, or do you put it in 1 and put emergency brake on? i don't understand this. is there anything else i need to know? thanks.

I leave it in first gear and put on the parking/emergency/hand brake. If the brake fails then the gear will hold it. It also make it a pain to tow when all my tires are locked.

Some people put it in neutral and some people just put it in first without the brake.

 

[Philly]

that's scarey, how does your parking brake get brokeN? how much does it cost to repair? and why do you have to keep it in gear to hold the car? wouldn't putting in gear 1 move the car forward? i don't understand.

I guess it just gets too worn, probably from driving with it on. And if he parked with the car in neutral, the wheels would only be connected to the drive shaft because no gear is engaged. And when the engine is off, I guess it won't want to move at all so putting the car in first "locks" the wheels from the engine.

also what if it's my first time driving a car? how would i know what rpm to shift down at?

if i slow down too much, and i'm at like gear 5 or something, i'll have to shift down right? or can i leave it at gear 5 until i hit 0, then transfer it all the way down to gear 1? because if i have to know when to shift down everytime i slow down, it's going to be very hard on my head because i'm not very smart and i can't think a lot.

Have you never driven a car before? I might recommend trying an automatic first because you will have enough to concentrate without having to figure out how to shift the gears. You will want to shift when you are too far out of the powerband for you to get the acceleration you want. That is just something you will have to figure out yourself because it depends on how fast you want to go, your speed and your car. The ballpark I gave above will probably work for most situations.

You will have to downshift if you slow down too much for fifth. For a beginner, when stopping I would recommend putting in the clutch and leaving the car in gear then downshifting once you get to a stop.

 

[Sureboss]

also what if it's my first time driving a car? how would i know what rpm to shift down at?

if i slow down too much, and i'm at like gear 5 or something, i'll have to shift down right? or can i leave it at gear 5 until i hit 0, then transfer it all the way down to gear 1? because if i have to know when to shift down everytime i slow down, it's going to be very hard on my head because i'm not very smart and i can't think a lot.

I think you have got yourself worried, it's far simpler than you think it is (judging from your post).

If you're in 5th and you have to stop to a halt, you don't need to change gear until you need to accelerate again, so you could leave it in 5th whilst braking from say 70 to a halt, you'll need the clutch in, but you won't need to change from 5th to 1st until you need to accelerate again. Going down through all the gears, although there's no reason why you can't do it, is hard work, if you know you're going to need 1st, why put it through all the gears?

You will have to downshift if you slow down too much for fifth. For a beginner, when stopping I would recommend putting in the clutch and leaving the car in gear then downshifting once you get to a stop.

WHS.

 

[FoolKiller]

that's scarey, how does your parking brake get brokeN? how much does it cost to repair? and why do you have to keep it in gear to hold the car? wouldn't putting in gear 1 move the car forward? i don't understand.

Your parking brake is like any other brake. It will wear out over time. Or something in the machinery can wear out, etc. If a manual is in first gear and turned off then the gears are locked in place, but the engine is not moving, so it will hold the car in place.

also what if it's my first time driving a car? how would i know what rpm to shift down at?

If you go too low it will begin to stutter. You just have to kind of watch, listen, and feel. You can almost hear teh engine straining when you get too low in the RPMs.

This is part of the reason why people have trouble learning to drive a manual, because it takes some time to learn how a car behaves in what conditions. You also learn what speeds match what gears.

if i slow down too much, and i'm at like gear 5 or something, i'll have to shift down right?

Yes and no. I can slow down to almost 15-20 mph in 5th gear, but then it begins to really strain and if I need to accelerate I have to downshift.

or can i leave it at gear 5 until i hit 0, then transfer it all the way down to gear 1?

It will stall after you get too slow. If I am going to a stop from fifth I just push in my clutch and left off the gas and use the brake to slow me down. After I come to the stop I downshift.

because if i have to know when to shift down everytime i slow down, it's going to be very hard on my head because i'm not very smart and i can't think a lot.

It becomes almost natural and reflexive. I have been in near accidents where I had to react quickly and my left foot and right hand just did it without me conciously thiking about it. When driving my wife's car I go to shift on my own even though it i an automatic.


Have you ever ridden a 10 speed or any multi-speed bicycle? It works the same. Too high of a gear and it takes a ton of effort to make it go. Too low of a gear and you can get it going easily, but after a certain point your legs are pedaling fast and burning up but you aren't going any faster.

 

[ddldave]

lol yeah i've driven automatic before, just not manual. thanks a lot you guys, you've helped me a lot. but i still have many many questions in my head, i'm scared driving manual will be too hard or it will have too much things to do and i can't think that much at the time.

 

[Muzaffar]

First of all, I have to respect ddldave for opening this thread. I did have a thought of asking the same question, but just thought it would be too stupid to ask.... Well thanks mate!!!

Well can I ask a question as well?

1.I know that you have to press the clutch to downshift, so like if I'm braking from high speed, can I press both the brake pedal and the clutch pedal? Or do I have to press one pedal at a time?

2. I also see how race drivers would downshift (with a H-gate) to each gear very quickly while braking and pressing the clutch, do you think a normal driver can do the same as well?

3. How do you stall your engine? Is it when your rev drops too low and you don't engaged the clutch, or is it when you don't shift properly (or shift too low/high)

I'm keen to get a drivers license and drive a manual car. 👍

 

[Kylehnat]

I think you have got yourself worried, it's far simpler than you think it is (judging from your post).

Actually, I think his post points out how complex the operation can be. We forget about how many decisions we make without actively thinking about them. Telling someone step-by-step how to drive a manual would freak them out. Of course it's easy, but that doesn't mean it sounds easy.

ddldave, I think reading about what a clutch actually does and how it works will make the actual driving a bit more intuitive. All of these "when do I clutch?" questions are answered when you know why you clutch.

Good luck!

 

[ND4SPD]

This video seems like it could help you out.

 

[Sage]

Actually, I think his post points out how complex the operation can be.

The first time I drove a stick-shift (actually, the first time I drove, period) was when I was 12 (and this is not illegal BTW, because it was on our private property) – my dad just had me hop into the Ranger, and didn’t explain anything at all to me. So I started the truck, then immediately took my foot off the clutch, and the truck jumped forward five feet and died. Scared the crap out of me.

 

[FoolKiller]

1.I know that you have to press the clutch to downshift, so like if I'm braking from high speed, can I press both the brake pedal and the clutch pedal? Or do I have to press one pedal at a time?

You can press them both at the same time. I do this a lot, especially when coming to a stop. If I am just slowing down, but not enough to downshiftthen I just press the brake.

2. I also see how race drivers would downshift (with a H-gate) to each gear very quickly while braking and pressing the clutch, do you think a normal driver can do the same as well?

Yes, this is actually how I learned. My mother was big on shifting through every gear so you didn't accidentally miss one or shift too far down too soon. Once I got used to the feel of the car and when I should be in what gear I just slow down to speed and then shift to the proper gear. For racing it is good to shift every gear so that you are sure you aren't too low when you accelerate again and don't lose any power.

3. How do you stall your engine? Is it when your rev drops too low and you don't engaged the clutch, or is it when you don't shift properly (or shift too low/high)

When your RPMs drop too low (too high of a gear, no clutch at below idle speed in first) the strain on the engine will make it stop, stalling and killing it. When RPMs go too high (you shift too far down) will make you redline/hit the rev limiter.

I'm keen to get a drivers license and drive a manual car. 👍

Some people prefer to start in an automatic because it is easier and others think that if you learn on a manual then you won't notice how much more you are doing or try something that works in an auto but not a manual, such as not pressing the clutch when you stop.

 

[YSSMAN]

also what if it's my first time driving a car? how would i know what rpm to shift down at?

I don't know if anyone answered this question, but it is somewhat hard to explain easily. Generally speaking, if you do have the ability to hear and feel, you will be able to "sense" it; Both for upshifts and downshifts.

Rarely, if ever, do you rev it all the way to the redline under regular circumstances, and at the same time, rarely if ever to you let RPMs fall nearly to the point of stalling before changing down a gear.

In my VW, I usually shift between 2500-3000 RPM on the upside, and I usually change down gears about 1200-1500 RPM depending on where/how I'm driving. Then then you obviously crank that up a bit if you're in any kind of "racing" situation.

 

[Muzaffar]

Well I did learn a lot from that video that ND4SPD link to. It does kinda help me understand more about manual and how easy it is to drive it. But I just wonder,

1. How long can a clutch usually last on a car before it need replacing?

2. Also, how do you know when you need to replace the clutch?

3. Well I know that in GT, you can buy different type of clutches, flywheels and transmissions and LSD. So like is there any difference between the flywheels, clutches, transmissions and LSD. Would a twin clutch be better than a single clutch in terms of durability and performance?

I more interested in manuals because autos are for wussies (or the way I see it) and like you don't actually get the feel of your car like when your driving manual. Besides, manual can save more gas than auto, and its cheaper as well

 

[FoolKiller]

1. How long can a clutch usually last on a car before it need replacing?

Depends on how you use it. If you don't race and aren't holding the clutch in part way it can last the life if a car. I had a Buick handed down from my mom that was 15 years old and over 300,000 miles before the clutch went out.

2. Also, how do you know when you need to replace the clutch?

Oh, once it goes there is no doubt. In the case of mine I hit a point where no matter how much gas I gave it would not go above 35mph, but the engine was racing. Talking to my mechanic afterward he said that over time it wears down thin and then will just crumble. I was concerned that maybe I missed the signs and he told me that if it just happened all of a sudden there was no reason why I shoudl have noticed before.

So, basically short of having it inspected, which is incredibly expensive, it just happens and then you know.

I'll let someone else answer your third question.

 

[YSSMAN]

1. How long can a clutch usually last on a car before it need replacing?

Depends usually. I think the one that was in my VW that I replaced last month was the original one, and that went 170K. Depends on the car, usually. American cars with big V8s that require a lot of pressure will likely last a lot less time than some tinny Japanese car with only a bit of power being applied, but then you must also factor in how someone was using it, what quality the parts were, etc.

2. Also, how do you know when you need to replace the clutch?

Like I said before, you can "sense" it. Normally something won't sound right or feel right, or may in fact be a combination of both.

When my clutch went out in my VW the travel was a lot longer to engage the clutch, the RPMs were higher than usual at certain speeds, when pressing the gas the clutch didn't seem to be grabbing (hence even higher RPMs), and you could definitely smell burning clutch.

3. Well I know that in GT, you can buy different type of clutches, flywheels and transmissions and LSD. So like is there any difference between the flywheels, clutches, transmissions and LSD. Would a twin clutch be better than a single clutch in terms of durability and performance?

That isn't something that I know a lot about offhand. I'm sure folks here who are more into racing could better explain it.

 

[ddldave]

okay thanks you guys.

so when i drive normally, i shift up when my rpm hits 3000 rpm, and i shift down when it hits around 12000 rpm. right? and to shift, i have to let go of gas, hold clutch down then shift.

i have another question. so do you have to worry about slowing down earlier since you have to watch rpm? or do you slow down as if you drive a automatic, since you drive manual and have to be more aware, you slow down earlier right?

also what does it sound like when the RPM is too high and you need to shift? and what does it sound like when RPM is too low? i want to learn about the sounds so then i don't have to look at the RPM's. thanks.

EDIT:

help i was looking at the honda s2000 dashboard since i've always wanted one of these babies. well i see there's no RPM meter, how do i know how much RPM i have to shift if there's no RPM meter?

EDIT: nvm, i see it, it's the orange line thing above the mph.

 

[ND4SPD]

also what does it sound like when the RPM is too high and you need to shift? and what does it sound like when RPM is too low? i want to learn about the sounds so then i don't have to look at the RPM's. thanks.

Well technically it's a different sound for different cars, I mean once you get used to a certain car you will eventually be able to know what rpm your at all by ear. Funny enough, my RX-7 has an alarm that goes on once you're at redline.

 

[ddldave]

Well technically it's a different sound for different cars, I mean once you get used to a certain car you will eventually be able to know what rpm your at all by ear. Funny enough, my RX-7 has an alarm that goes on once you're at redline.

how do you get the alarm? how much did it cost? is it loud so that you can hear it clearly?

 

[ND4SPD]

how do you get the alarm? how much did it cost? is it loud so that you can hear it clearly?

Actually, my RX-7 came with it stock. All 1st and 2nd gen RX-7's have them.

Here's a video of the beep.

 

[YSSMAN]

The more you get to know your car the less you have to think about it, but even then, when you generally know what you're doing, you should be able to drive a stick in just about anything.

It all comes with practice and learning, and then you'd be fine at it. I generally don't have to look at my tachometer simply because I know what my car is supposed to sound like at a certain speed before I shift. Its much the same if I'm in a Corvette, 911, Rabbit, 328ci, etc.

I know its really hard to give in a great amount of detail, but its just a combination of things all at once that let you "know" that you have to shift at whatever point.

 

[Sureboss]

Do you mean a twin clutch transmission?

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/dual-clutch-transmission.htm

Or do you mean twin clutch plates? Because twin clutch plates is a durability thing, iirc.

---

That Honda has a rev meter, it's that big thing going from 0-9 accross the dash.

 

[ddldave]

ND4SPD, the video you sent me, he wasn't letting go of his gas when he shift gears, he just steps on clutch and shift without letting go of gas, how is this? can you do this? is it bad for the car?

 

[ND4SPD]

ND4SPD, the video you sent me, he wasn't letting go of his gas when he shift gears, he just steps on clutch and shift without letting go of gas, how is this? can you do this? is it bad for the car?

Oh he was, that one shift you heard was him missing a shift. Some cars can take shifting without letting go of the gas it's called flat shifting, some cars can take flat shifting while the majority of cars don't take well to flat shifting.

 

[ddldave]

Do you mean a twin clutch transmission?

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/dual-clutch-transmission.htm

Or do you mean twin clutch plates? Because twin clutch plates is a durability thing, iirc.

---

That Honda has a rev meter, it's that big thing going from 0-9 accross the dash.

since redlining is bad the for the car, the AP2 goes up to 85000 RPM, so i want to shift at 80000 before it hits 85000? also it has orange at the 10000 RPM, i want to shift at 15000 before it hits 10000 or i'll stall right?

ND4SPD, does the AP2 take flat shifting?