Sigh... Another atari/sega/neo geo situation.

[waffle911]

This isn't completely relaited to GTHD, but it is connected.
The PS3's cell processor costs ten times as much as the materials needed to make one. That's because only 1 in 10 processors actually has all of the cells in working condition. While the chip has 8, sony utilizes no more than 7, to increase production yield.
Blu-Ray is insanely expensive to produce disk drive parts for (for the time being). That raises the price into an unreasonable $600. Its the new Atari Jaguar, or even that obscure Apple game system from '96 that also had a price tag of $600.
A typical PS3 game will cost between $75-$100, due to the intensity of the graphical and physical complexity of the next generation.
Sony is in the red. Broke. Debt. BANG!
Poor customer support + poor quality control = bad.
When Sony either A) dies or B) takes up another partnership with Nintendo like in the early 90's, Polyphony Digital will be a free agent. Hellooo Xbox360 GT5. Xbox360 is the only other system powerful enough to meet the demands of a nex-generation GT, not to mention an ONLINE GT. Nintendo won the war already, but Xbox will not fade from hardcore gaming supremacy.
Also, new dowloadable cars should be free, paid for by more game sales, not charged so that a complete collection costs $450.

I'm sorry if anyone disagrees with anything I've done here, but I just felt this needed to be said.

 

[Wolfe]

I can appreciate your desire to voice your opinion on these matters, but it probably could have been done in one of the existing threads.

Anyway, I'd like to see some links to sources, please. Your claim about the Cell processor is new to me, and from what I've heard, PS3 game prices were reported to be closer to $60, if not $60 all across the board.

GT5 is already in production for the PS3 and will be produced for the console no matter what. If anything, GT6 would be the first Gran Turismo on a non-Sony console, but that is of course assuming that Sony sinks into bankruptcy and is forced to pull a SEGA, turning into a software company. In my opinion, that is highly unlikely.

I agree about the cost of downloadable cars, but the whole GTHD downloadable car situation seems to be a little more complicated and ambiguous than we all thought at first. You should read more of the posts in the already-existing threads to find out more about that.

 

[a6m5]

While I would love to see GT Series move to X360(it's cheaper!), some of the information in the original post is clearly false. You don't even have to google for any fact checking.

Sony is not doing too great financially, true. But it will take them a while before they go down, even in their current financial struggle, if you can call it that(that, I have to actually look up). If the PS3 flops completely, then it would definitely put Sony in trouble, but that's next to impossible for it to happen.

I'm just going to take waffle's post as his opinion, but I think it looks very shaky.

 

[road kill]

if sega goes down then all thats left is microsoft and Nintendo...and who knows maybe microsoft will buy nintendo then everyone has 1 universal game system! omg....that is so LAME sony better not go down... im definitley buying the 600.00 ps3 and the g25 steering wheel


or what if videogames go down the drain all together because of sales

 

[daan]

Any company makes a loss on any new console they produce. They make a profit on the games. They don't make any profit on the console itself until they revise what parts they use and how they manufacture it. The cell processor and Blu-ray will become cheaper and easier to produce in time, and that's when Sony will make their money.

EDIT: Moved to the PS3 forum

 

[Wolfe]

who knows maybe microsoft will buy nintendo then everyone has 1 universal game system!

Nintendo is far too healthy (and will only do better after the Wii's launch) to be forced to sell itself to or merge with Microsoft.

omg....that is so LAME sony better not go down... im definitley buying the 600.00 ps3 and the g25 steering wheel

Your fearful response to the mere suggestion of Sony "going down" is amusing... Perhaps Sony should use that in their advertising. Sony: "Buy the PS3 or we'll go out of business!" Customer: "Oh no! I better run to EB and shell out $600 right now!"

or what if videogames go down the drain all together because of sales

Indeed, because we all know that videogame sales are currently piddling along at a rate even slower than in 1984, and will only drop lower and lower, especially with the release of the Wii, which is so absorbed in satisfying hardcore gamers that casual gamers and non-gamers will feel completely alienated.

</ubersarcasm>

 

[Jeremy Ricci]

This isn't completely relaited to GTHD, but it is connected.
The PS3's cell processor costs ten times as much as the materials needed to make one. That's because only 1 in 10 processors actually has all of the cells in working condition. While the chip has 8, sony utilizes no more than 7, to increase production yield.
Blu-Ray is insanely expensive to produce disk drive parts for (for the time being). That raises the price into an unreasonable $600. Its the new Atari Jaguar, or even that obscure Apple game system from '96 that also had a price tag of $600.
A typical PS3 game will cost between $75-$100, due to the intensity of the graphical and physical complexity of the next generation.
Sony is in the red. Broke. Debt. BANG!
Poor customer support + poor quality control = bad.
When Sony either A) dies or B) takes up another partnership with Nintendo like in the early 90's, Polyphony Digital will be a free agent. Hellooo Xbox360 GT5. Xbox360 is the only other system powerful enough to meet the demands of a nex-generation GT, not to mention an ONLINE GT. Nintendo won the war already, but Xbox will not fade from hardcore gaming supremacy.
Also, new dowloadable cars should be free, paid for by more game sales, not charged so that a complete collection costs $450.

I'm sorry if anyone disagrees with anything I've done here, but I just felt this needed to be said.

1) Actually it's about 1 in 5 Cell processors that has all 8 SPE's functional, and about 1 in 3 that has 7. So you're wrong there.

2) PS3 games will be $59.99. This has been known for sometime. You're wrong again, keep going!

3) "Free" is not a word you use in gaming, it's a wishful thought. Everyone complains about how they "never drive all the cars in GT"...and now Polyphony gives you the opportunity to own all the supercars you wanted to drive and own the game for around $40 if you're conservative.

Game sales recoup the costs of development, additional downloadable content requires further development, the costs for this have to be paid. It's very simple. I'm sure Sony has cut down Polyphony's budget since they're spending so much on the PS3 already, hence the downloadable cars.

 

[Poverty]

PS3 is gonna win the japanese and and arguably the european market. The european countries that can afford consoles will most likely get the PS3. I personally only know 1 kid with a 360, but then again most people my age these days dont really play consoles anymore.

 

[Dave A]

I think theres more lete teens to young 20's with consoles than there are school kids these days.

 

[waffle911]

game prices: here
processor info: here
sony trouble: here
My beliefs are not unfounded.
EDIT:

GT5 is already in production for the PS3 and will be produced for the console no matter what.

There is some dispute over that apparantly. From what I've read, GT HD is NOT GT5, but rather more of a demo. GT5 is due sometime in '08 or '09 from what I can tell, so it still is open game.

Actually it's about 1 in 5 Cell processors that has all 8 SPE's functional

Read the research, man. 95% of all cores are good, devide by 8 for each cell, and you get 11.85%; the optimistic estimate is 10-20%.

PS3 games will be $59.99

$70-80, read the research, then do the math of production cost compared to XB360. 7 CPUs vs 3.

"Free" is not a word you use in gaming

What about all the free DEVELOPER-created content for the SIMS series? Not to mention developer-created maps for Unreal Tournament 2004.

 

[Jeremy Ricci]

No, they're completely unfounded.

I'm not trying to be a jerk, btw, but facts are facts. Sony and Activision have both confirmed that their retail price for games will be $59.99. You can go to www.sonystyle.com and check their listing for PS3 games, there are 7, and all of them are $59.99.

The article you are referencing has taken a few quotes seriously out of context. They are speaking specifically about Cell processors with 8 fully functioning SPU's. Fact of the matter is, however, that the PS3 only requires 7 SPU's to be functional. The number of Cell processors with 7 working SPU's compared to the number with 8 is significantly greater. So that point in your thoughts is, as I said, also unfounded.

 

[waffle911]

Do you know how to read? READ THE RESEARCH!

 

[KENJIusa]

I don't know how to read (text), but I can read the number:
SonyStyle

 

[Jeremy Ricci]

Do you know how to read? READ THE RESEARCH!

Understand the research.

ref: my edited post above yours.

 

[waffle911]

The number of Cell processors with 7 working SPU's compared to the number with 8 is significantly greater.

That's still no more than 14%.
As for game prices,$60 seems to only make sense for multi console games being shared with the XB360, like all of Activision's games will be. They wouldn't go through the time and money to really make the games that much better, so they still cost $60. Individual games that actually make the PS3 worth buying will likely be over $70. And don't give me examples of any launch or close to launch titles, they never use any of the console's power; no-one would make THAT much of an investment in unproven marketing.

P.S. I'm sorry if you are starting to hate me, but I don't like losing, if you can't tell. It'll be a while before I admit defeat to anyone, IF I lose. So maybe I should just ignore Jeremy from now on since everything he says is always right. It only makes me angrier and more stupid. Trust me, you don't want to see that.

 

[fasj6418]

Do you know how to read? READ THE RESEARCH!

joystic is a f&¨%ing blog and that is speculation. we all know about game prices, speacially after TGS, get serious.

 

[Dave A]

Do you know how to read? READ THE RESEARCH!

Do YOU know how to read point blank, many shops have already set the prices for PS3 games in countries outside Europe (because were getting it late, again) and they're the same as new XB360 games.

The same goes for the Cell processors, there's a lot more than what you think that pass, do you honestly think Sony could or would even try to make the cell work if it was that hard tomake right?

The only point I agree with you on is that additional downloads unless significant, shouldn't be charged for.

 

[Jeremy Ricci]

That's still no more than 14%.
As for game prices,$60 seems to only make sense for multi console games being shared with the XB360, like all of Activision's games will be. They wouldn't go through the time and money to really make the games that much better, so they still cost $60. Individual games that actually make the PS3 worth buying will likely be over $70. And don't give me examples of any launch or close to launch titles, they never use any of the console's power; no-one would make THAT much of an investment in unproven marketing.

P.S. I don't like losing, if you can't tell. It'll be a while before I admit defeat to anyone, IF I lose. So maybe I should just ignore Jeremy from now on since everything he says is always right. It only makes me angrier and more stupid. Trust me, you don't want to see that.

Sony's first party titles are also $60.

And "still no more than 14%" is also in correct. For their FULLY FUNCTIONAL 8SPU Cell processors, they are hitting around 20%. By throwing in redundancy, they can use those processors, as well as the processors with only 7 SPU's functioning. This *adds to* the 20% yeild, increasing yeilds by as much as 40% (as sourced from the article you posted). This comes out to around SIXTY PERCENT(to place it in numerical form, that's 60%).

So, still care to tell me to do my research?

 

[waffle911]

Yup. You forgot that I didn't like to lose.
That's not a 40% INCREASE, thats a 40% TOTAL. That's 60% that they have to TOSS, at LEAST. Only 40%, IF THEY'RE LUCKY, work on 7. The 95%/8 cells is based on IBM's own history of production, and won't be that much better, even with new fabrication processes. And in regards to Sony not buying into something so hard to make, remember: They committed to it a long time ago, before actual yield was realized. Now they're despirate. They did start planning PS3 literally right after the PS2 launch.

 

[Tornado]

Individual games that actually make the PS3 worth buying will likely be over $70. And don't give me examples of any launch or close to launch titles, they never use any of the console's power; no-one would make THAT much of an investment in unproven marketing.

Okay, explain every 360 game up to now then.

So maybe I should just ignore Jeremy from now on since everything he says is always right. It only makes me angrier and more stupid. Trust me, you don't want to see that.

Actually, you do not know how much joy it would bring me to see what is essentially 2 Jeremy Ricci's. A joke at Jeremy's expense.

Sony is in the red. Broke. Debt. BANG!
Poor customer support + poor quality control = bad.
When Sony either A) dies or B) takes up another partnership with Nintendo like in the early 90's, Polyphony Digital will be a free agent. Hellooo Xbox360 GT5. Xbox360 is the only other system powerful enough to meet the demands of a nex-generation GT, not to mention an ONLINE GT. Nintendo won the war already, but Xbox will not fade from hardcore gaming supremacy.

I've heard this crap before. So I'll just post what I posted before in response to articles such as that:

Propaganda, Go!
That article is crap. It completely neglects the fact that Microsoft lost (and loses) money on every single XBox and 360 sold, not to mention the silly amount of money selling games for $60 gets them in return. And MS selling 10 million 360's by December is a pipe dream cranked out by Moore. Companies losing money on hardware has been a prevalent problem since the Saturn days.
And what the hell is this:

Without an exclusive there, Microsoft and Nintendo would gain the edge in game sales, since their games cost less than Sony's.

Sony at least has a reason to charge $60 for the games. Microsoft doesn't.

And this is rediculous:

When things are all said and done, the most valuable piece of the pie at Sony is its video game division. They could very well put it up for sale. And who could be the potential buyer?

Microsoft.

That's right. I said it. Just think about it.

Who could benefit the most by purchasing Sony's video game division?

Microsoft.

Oh please. Microsoft has had the ability to buy out (completely) Sega twice now. Twice, and once when they had a console with a few million already sold. If SCEI was bought by Microsoft, all hell would break loose. It would be broken up as an anti-trust.

And this takes the cake:

You might say there's no way the U.S. government would allow such a thing. Anti-trust, you say.

Just remember who's running the government. A Microsoft takeover would be treated with the same kid gloves that created DaimlerChrysler.

Right. Because Mercedes performing a hostile takeover of an American company falls under American laws despite not being in America. Not to mention that the forming of DCX is still only the 5th largest automobile company. Moron.

No no no. This takes the cake:

But there's more! Want an HDMI cable? That'll be another $100 to $125. Now we're at $850 or so. You've got a Blu-ray player, so you'll want a few Blu-ray movies -- Sony titles only, of course. Buy six of them while you're at it! At an average list price of $25 each, we're talking another $150. That pushes our total price to an even $1,000.

Who the hell wrote this? Peter Moore himself? $100-125 for an HDMI cable? try subtracting 100 from the latter and you pretty much their. And, FYI, DVD's cost about the same when they were new. And Sony isn't the only company making Blu-ray discs.



I love it when some idiot gets a blog.

Also, what exactly does any of this have to do with SEGA, Atari or SNK (Neo-Geo was a console)?
SEGA's screw-ups of 1995 directly parellel Microsoft, not Sony.
Atari essentially killed off the entire industry in two full swoops (arguably 3) by doing things that no one is stupid enough to try anymore.
SNK went out of business because they scuttled the NGPC when it was doing quite well on the marketplace, and because the NGP was a spectacular failure.

 

[Dave A]

Yup. You forgot that I didn't like to lose.
That's not a 40% INCREASE, thats a 40% TOTAL. That's 60% that they have to TOSS, at LEAST.

Sony arn't tossing the ones with less than 7 working SPE's, they're using them or selling them to be used in appliances that will use less, if they have a Cell processor with only 4 working SPE's they'll use it or sell it to be used in something that will requier no more than 4 SPE's, the PS3 isn't the only thing in development that uses a Cell processor. This has been part of Sony's plan for a long time and it is something that they announced a while ago.

 

[G25RJ]

I have only one think to say about this, X-box Fan boys are so frightened by the PS3 that they do and say anything to try to change other peoples minds.

Why do you want Sony to die if your spectacular M$ X-Box360 is so ubber great and have so many great games.

Do you think that the PS3 is expensive try for example to buy a PC to play Oblivion, Battlefield 2142 or the new FPS Crysis that will use DX10.

 

[KENJIusa]

I have only one think to say about this, X-box Fan boys are so frightened by the PS3 that they do and say anything to try to change other peoples minds.

.

Peter Moore?💡

 

[road kill]

Nintendo is far too healthy (and will only do better after the Wii's launch) to be forced to sell itself to or merge with Microsoft.



Your fearful response to the mere suggestion of Sony "going down" is amusing... Perhaps Sony should use that in their advertising. Sony: "Buy the PS3 or we'll go out of business!" Customer: "Oh no! I better run to EB and shell out $600 right now!"



Indeed, because we all know that videogame sales are currently piddling along at a rate even slower than in 1984, and will only drop lower and lower, especially with the release of the Wii, which is so absorbed in satisfying hardcore gamers that casual gamers and non-gamers will feel completely alienated.

</ubersarcasm>

Lol hey i know video games aernt going down but hey they are getting more and more expensive to make and of course more expensive to buy...

but seriously if sony was to go down (like no one buys it at all) then wow...

but isnt sony like number 1 in Japan?...