simulator, semi sim, whats the difference?

[chimukun]

just wondering. what is it about certain pc games, like iracing, that are more "sim" than things like gt,forza,Kaido,etc series?

I would not say physics, for sure. I used to play LFS/Rfactor. Also tried GTR demo but did not like it. LFS was good for it's time, but kind of outdated now, and never even had 900 degree steering support(just 720). Rfactor is ok with the right mod, but I have yet to find a drift mod that feels realistic. There's no mod where you can both drift and grip realistically at all, that I am aware of.

 

[Willfred_1]

just wondering. what is it about certain pc games, like iracing, that are more "sim" than things like gt,forza,Kaido,etc series?

I would not say physics, for sure. I used to play LFS/Rfactor. Also tried GTR demo but did not like it. LFS was good for it's time, but kind of outdated now, and never even had 900 degree steering support(just 720). Rfactor is ok with the right mod, but I have yet to find a drift mod that feels realistic. There's no mod where you can both drift and grip realistically at all, that I am aware of.

The easiest way to work it out is how close is to real life.
Games such as need for speed are designed as a pick up and play. Cars have some what unrealistic handling.

Semi sim/sim-cade this is where the gt and forzas are. They provide a more sim like experience however again are commonly found on consoles. The physics and tyre models provide more realistic handling however these models are less complex than those found on sim racers. Often hardware is a limiting point.

Racing simulators.
Built to be as realistic as possible. The target audience is a lot different to the previous two categories.
Users will generally have a good quality force back wheel and a good computer.
Old school (I racing &rfactor 1&2)
Main focus is on the models of cars, physics and tracks to provide the best feedback possible. Often Graphics were ok but weren't anything to write to home about due the sims focus. In the case of iracing pros regularly race with genera
Users.

New style of sims
( assetto and pcars)
Very similar to the older sims however they have also put a larger focus on the visual feedback from the game. Graphics worked on to help with immersion. These games also have seen an increased focus on making the game suitable for Vr headsets such as the oculasrift.


Ultimately the difference comes down to what the target audience is.
The average gt or forza player would not be able to drive a cleanlap of a popular car such as the Capri or m1 pro car with the realistic settings.

This is why Project cars has so many options for it to succeed on consoles controller users need to feel in control and able to win on a controller. Where as a the sim racer will still want to win bit will also want to have a realistic experience when driving it.

 

[AlexDB9]

I want GT to become very realistic in terms of AI and damage. Imagine if you had AI that was more aggresive and realistic damage where a serious collision would mean game over. That would give the game alot of drama which is currenlty missing.

 

[guybo]

It depends on who you talk to. If you go by the dictionary definition of simulation, the most sim-like of racing games is the EA F1 games. They have fuel/tire use, safety car, tire allotment, full weekend sessions, full length GP with similar to real rules, rain and time simulation. That said, not one sim racer will call it a sim because the physics of the car are not simulated closely enough. EA and Codemasters tend to make semi-sims with good graphics but weak very forgiving physics and simplified tire and chassis physics.

IMHO, games like GTL, GPL, AC, rFactor 1, iRacing and GSC are also semi-sims because they lack a lot of features (esp. rain) that real race car drivers have to contend with. Also, gmotor2 games like rFactor1 and GSC don't force the use of the clutch or h-shifter in cars that require it IRL. It is a very big deal- if you don't think so, try to heel n toe shift and use a shifter in a full length race.

IMHO the only real sims are the ones with weather simulation. RBR, Race 07, GTR2, rFactor 2. The only big series in the world that really doesn't have to race in the rain is NASCAR. Driving in adverse weather conditions is real and significant part of any non-oval racing series (ask Felipe Massa about that).

That said, no one would agree with me on that. So the sims that don't have rain are considered sims just like the semi-sims that do have rain are still considered semi-sims. It really comes down to the way the car and tires interact with the road. The EA games (all of them), the Codemasters games (all of them) and the Test Drive series are considered semi-sims. All gmotor2 engined games and rFactor2 (gmotor 2.5), AC, RBR, GPL, GTR2 & all simbin games, RRRE, iRacing and SRW are all considered sims. That's not to say they are all considered equal, that is a matter for discussion. there are plenty of smaller sims and older dead sims but these are the big ones right now.

 

[LeGeNd-1]

In my opinion, the hard distinctions are kinda meaningless. Racing games exist on a spectrum from "fully arcade" Mario Kart to "as close as you can get" sims used by real F1 teams. Some games just happen to cluster together on this spectrum so that's why we call them simcade or hardcore sims. And physics should be the sole criteria to define these games. Things like weather, damage and rule simulations are often hardware limited or a developer's choice to include/exclude, it doesn't really influence the "simness" of a game. For example, Driveclub has amazing weather compared to rFactor (none at all), but clearly DC is arcade and rF is simulation.

In my mind, here's how I categorize my games:
Hardcore Arcade: Mario Kart, Modnation Racers, WipeOut, Ridge Racer, Burnout
Arcade: NFS (non-Shift), TDU, Driveclub
Simcade: GRID, DIRT, Codemasters F1 series, V8 Superstars series, NFS Shift
Simulation: GT, Forza, Ferrari/Supercar Challenge, EA F1 series
Hardcore Sim: GPL, rFactor, Simbin games, GSCE, RBR, AC, pCARS