Soft/Hard tire compounds and mileage: do they differ at all??

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Bluez_Freak

Bluez_Freak

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I have completed already 6 out of 9 endurance races (A-Spec) and I am yet still not experiencing any differences in longelivity/mileage of harder vs softer compounds. Have checked this with both sports and racing tires.

It seems the best solution is to go softer as they will last the same laps with the harder ones anyway...

Anyone else noticed the same thing? This is a MAJOR flaw of the game, wondering if it has/will be addressed to KAZ/PD somehow...
 
I'm only guessing --- but could that be caused by a heavier-handed driving on those hards due to less grip on the tyres? I don't know much about this & wonder the answer as well.
 
I was in an online NASCAR league that regularly did 100 lap races. I, and many others, tried Racing Hards and Racing Softs, and there was no difference in how long they lasted. The only difference was performance... Racing Softs performing better, of course. Now this was online, but I can only assume it's the same for offline endurance races too.

I miss the tire strategies from past Gt games.
 
Can't believe they haven't modelled longelivity differences between Hards/Softs and they bothered only for grip levels...

This is insane - and after so many patches should have been one of the top priorities to correct.

This is a flaw which needs immediate attention - not an improvement of the game (like ballast, hp limiter etc) which can be done later on.

GT5 has got so many things right and some others sooooo wrong, it's really unbelievable for a "simulator".
 
I only use the harder compounds for balancing vs AI. No difference in tire wear, maybe 1-2 laps one way or the other.
Very disappointing compared to the differences in tires in F1 2010.

Bluez_Freak
GT5 has got so many things right and some others sooooo wrong, it's really unbelievable for a "simulator".
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That pretty much sums up GT5 experience. You can almost pick any two features at random and one is likely incredible while the other is just sad. I try to just ignore the bad ones as best I can.
 
TK42OnE
I was in an online NASCAR league that regularly did 100 lap races. I, and many others, tried Racing Hards and Racing Softs, and there was no difference in how long they lasted. The only difference was performance... Racing Softs performing better, of course. Now this was online, but I can only assume it's the same for offline endurance races too.

I miss the tire strategies from past Gt games.
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It is the same off line, i did the indy endurance and it took alot of the fun out of the race :grumpy:
 
Yup, realised this yesterday after racing the Indy 500 enduro, queue replies from the GT5 lovers moaning about "whingers" and "complainers".
 
They cared more about the relationship between tire compound and grip levels than they did between tire compound and tire wear. Hard tires spin more, so they wear out faster, which is idiotic.
 
Yep, quite simply tyre wear isn't modelled differently between the tyres. They're all the same. Very dissapointing, also that they haven't fixed it yet.

Bluez_Freak
This is major and I hadn't realised until I did the endurances in A-spec.

If you care, I just found this in the feedback...
http://feedback.gtplanet.net/forums...es-have-less-durability-than-hards-?ref=title

Just dropped my 3 votes in there, hoping for some change in the future... shame most of my endurance races are already done.
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That poll is the wrong way around though, it's the hards that need to last longer, not the softs shorter.
 
SimonK
Yep, quite simply tyre wear isn't modelled differently between the tyres. They're all the same. Very dissapointing, also that they haven't fixed it yet.



That poll is the wrong way around though, it's the hards that need to last longer, not the softs shorter.
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Yes, but it addresses the issue anyway and some votes are already there. If I start a new one there will be even less chance now.
 
They'll fix it by locking Traction Control at 5 and Active Steering to ON when using Hard Tires. And TC and AS OFF when using Softs. Thus the Hards will last twice as long.
 
The tire choice is about difficulty level and not about simulation. They would need a lot more accurate track condition modelling to make the tire choice to really mean anything other.
 
yeah, this game (and i mean game) needs to start paying more attention to tyre dynamics

Tyre wear, tyre width, and tyre grip all need to be modelled properly. I want to be able to choose my tyres, before a race, based on these parameters.

And besides that, im sick of seeing my awesome premium cars with mean wheels and SKINNY tyres.
 
this is what i said in another thread about tyres... same discussion basically as this thread:

"tyres in GT5 are a big ol mess of poop. You are not the first person to say that RH last less than Race-Softs. It happened to me during the INdy 500:

RS 25laps fastest laps
RM 26laps 3seconds slower per lap
RH 23laps 7seconds slower than RS per lap.

People have told me to drive less aggresive on Hards to make them last longer. Well using each set of tyres i drove just as hard on all the tyres. Full throttle all the way around, no braking for the turns; my set-up allowed about 16laps full throttle on the RS and barely 5-7laps on the RH. At which point i was already 7seconds slower a lap, then im suppost to drive gentler and go even slower to make them last longer!!? on a lap that was about 40-45 seconds, 7 seconds slower is about 16.5% slower! That math doesnt add up to me. that strategy and pace doesnt make sense.
That would be like going from an 8minute lap at the Ring on RS to a 9m32s lap at the ring on RH. LOOSING STRATEGY in my books."


Vinura
im sick of seeing my awesome premium cars with mean wheels and SKINNY tyres.
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by skinny you mean tyres that arent wide? or do you mean the tyre's profile?
 
The other night I was testing a GT500 NSX, the Takata Dome NSX '03 (standard). I had come to the conclusion that with the setup I had at the time that Race Hard (FR) and Race Medium (RR) was the best setup for Dry/Light Rain (no accumulation) on the car. Race Medium/Soft on the rear lasted longer because the softer compound gripped longer into the tread life, saving wear from needless tire spin; the Race Hard would wear out faster due to the wheel spin. Under heavy braking, the tires at the front need the Race Hard compound, this didn't appear to affect handling too much except for immediately after a tire change, you needed to warm the tires up to neutralize the understeer of the grippier rear tire.

When it came to Light Rain with some accumulation, I opted to switch the front to Race Intermediate for better steering, the Race Medium tire on the rear still provided more grip on acceleration than either Race Intermediate or Race Rain.

When it came to Heavy Rain with heavy accumulation, I opted to switch the front to Race Rain for best steering, the rear was swapped to Race Soft as it still provided the best grip under acceleration. Water accumulation slows the wear of the tires and I was getting near to equalizing tire life to fuel tank depletion time. Performance wise, this combination was netting lap times only about 15 seconds off dry pace on Suzuka circuit.

The car was equipped with max downforce 30/65 and camber 5.0 F / 4.0 R for reference purposes.

Dry laps with Race Hard (FR) / Race Medium (RR): 3 laps at Nurburgring Type V; 13 laps at Suzuka Circuit.
 
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Now correct me if im wrong, but a fair few of you are saying that the racing tyres wear the same, if not faster, on a 100%-throttle-100%-of-the-time track (Indy) as racing softs. Now the way I see it is that the car isnt constantly braking, accelerating, turning apart from 4 corners. Now, do the math.
RH: 45+7 second lap= 52sec x 23 laps= 1196sec.
RM: 45+3 second lap=48sec x 26 laps= 1248sec
RS 45sec x 25laps = 1125sec.
So all in all, the softer tyres last over a minute less than the hards around indy.
Also, Being a drifter, Tyre compound comes into play alot with online drifting and around Tsukuba, comforts softs would only last about 6-7 laps where as comfort hards would last 21 and still go on. OK, now that Ive done the math, there is a slight problem with the fact that the mediums last longer but thats only around Indy. In order to get a more accurate result the test should take place at Indy road where there is a mix of corners or even on Daytona road.
End Rant.
 
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Definitely something awry with tyre wear, Sports and Racing Hard have a consistently shorter life than their soft counterparts in my testing across many different tracks. I don't buy the explanation that its because there is more wheelspin with hard tyres... a hard tyre should always last longer than a soft.

I like the way tyres feel when running with wear enabled, and live in hope that these longevity issues will be cleared up with a patch soon.
 
Maffski
Definitely something awry with tyre wear, Sports and Racing Hard have a consistently shorter life than their soft counterparts in my testing across many different tracks. I don't buy the explanation that its because there is more wheelspin with hard tyres... a hard tyre should always last longer than a soft.

I like the way tyres feel when running with wear enabled, and live in hope that these longevity issues will be cleared up with a patch soon.
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Any chance of you posting lap times and how many laps the tyre lasted aswell as aids and track? I would, but I wont have access to the ps3 for quite a while.
 
Nismo34
Any chance of you posting lap times and how many laps the tyre lasted aswell as aids and track? I would, but I wont have access to the ps3 for quite a while.
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Only aids I use are ABS - 1, as for exact data I'll have to run some laps later and will let you know the outcome. I'll use Trial mountain as I run consistently there and it seems to be a track where tyre wear is very noticeable in lap times.
 
Although they last about the same, Soft tires are very prone to die faster due to overheat. A few wheel spins here and there and you'll notice wear right away.
 
BTW started since yesterday the 9-hour tsukuba endurance with Racing hards - the AI are on Racing mediums.

I pit every 10 laps or so and they pit every 30 or so - Does this make sense at all? As per my experience so far, aggresive vs smooth driving will only probably make 1-2 laps difference (already done about 200 laps).

I run a tuned 430 Scuderia (about 660 hp) I believe the AI are on 500-600 hp range but that wouldn't explain such a huge difference in pitting intervals.
 
Pitting every ten laps on Tsukuba? That would be like pitting in every lap on Nurburgring. You must be doing something very wrong. Tires last like 4 laps on the ring using the Scuderia.
 
I have noticed that too!some times I have used the Hard-racing tires on the Nurb' when we make 4-5 laps or more but it does'nt give me any advantage because they have the same longelivity of the soft-racing tires!the sad thing is that you can make 3-4 laps with the soft-racing tires on the Nurb' and all of us know that this is unrealistic!So use hard-racing tires is profitless any way!
 
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Nismo34
Now correct me if im wrong, but a fair few of you are saying that the racing tyres wear the same, if not faster, on a 100%-throttle-100%-of-the-time track (Indy) as racing softs. Now the way I see it is that the car isnt constantly braking, accelerating, turning apart from 4 corners. Now, do the math.
RH: 45+7 second lap= 52sec x 23 laps= 1196sec.
RM: 45+3 second lap=48sec x 26 laps= 1248sec
RS 45sec x 25laps = 1125sec.
So all in all, the softer tyres last over a minute less than the hards around indy.
Also, Being a drifter, Tyre compound comes into play alot with online drifting and around Tsukuba, comforts softs would only last about 6-7 laps where as comfort hards would last 21 and still go on. OK, now that Ive done the math, there is a slight problem with the fact that the mediums last longer but thats only around Indy. In order to get a more accurate result the test should take place at Indy road where there is a mix of corners or even on Daytona road.
End Rant.
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That makes no sense. Tyre wear should be calculated on the distance they cover, not how quickly they cover it. If a car covers 100 miles on a track and takes an hour and another car takes half an hour, the tyres have both still turned for 100 miles.
 
SimonK
That makes no sense. Tyre wear should be calculated on the distance they cover, not how quickly they cover it. If a car covers 100 miles on a track and takes an hour and another car takes half an hour, the tyres have both still turned for 100 miles.
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The tires that did it in half an hour have been subjected to much larger forces than the one hour tires.
 
Well that was an extreme example just to make my point, but in racing situations you drive the tyres just as hard whichever they are. To give a real example, I tested out the hard and soft tyres on a Pug 908 at Laguna Seca. They both lasted the same amount of laps, give or take one or two. The margin between a soft and hard tyre should be huge.
 
SimonK
That makes no sense. Tyre wear should be calculated on the distance they cover, not how quickly they cover it. If a car covers 100 miles on a track and takes an hour and another car takes half an hour, the tyres have both still turned for 100 miles.
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OK, just for your sake, Ima fix my math. But it shall be over equal laps so the baseline will be 20 laps.
20 x 4023m= 80460m
RS: 20 = 80% of 25 therefore the tyres were at 80% wear at 20 laps
RM: 20 = 76.923076923076923076923076923077% of 26 therefore, tyres were at 76.923076923076923076923076923077% wear at 20 laps
RH: 20 = 86.956521739130434782608695652174% of 23 therefore tyres were at 86.956521739130434782608695652174% wear at 20 laps.

Now this means that the hards wore out faster than the softs? which doesnt make sense......

Better? Do I need to bring more math into it?

Actually, Yes, I will.
The rate of wear per tyre per lap:
RS: 80/20 = 4% tyre wear per 4023m
RM: 76.923076923076923076923076923077/20 = 3.8461538461538461538461538461535% wear per 4023m
RH: 86.956521739130434782608695652174/20 = 4.3478260869565217391304347826085% wear per 4023m
 
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