STIMME! Das Beste Deutsche Auto! (ENDS AT 10:56 EST)

[YSSMAN]

First things first, the Hyundai Tiburon/Coupe won the title "Best Korean Car" beating out the Proto Motors Spirra by eleven votes. Thus the Hyundai Tiburon joins up with these lengends:

- BMC Mini (UK)
- Lamborghini Muria (Italy)
- Bugatti Veyron (France)
- Mazda Miata MX-5 (Japan)

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So, the Germans:

-Audi Quattro
-Audi RS6
-Benz Patent Motorwagen
-BMW 3-Series (inc. 2002 and M-series)
-BMW 700
-BMW 1500
-BMW M1
-BMW M5
-Maybach 62
-Mercedes-Benz 300 SL
-Mercedes-Benz 600
-Mercedes-Benz AMG CLK-GTR
-Mercedes-Benz AMG Hammer
-Mercedes-Benz E320 CDI Bluetec
-Mercedes-Benz Geländewagen
-Mercedes-Benz S-Class (all generations)
-Mercedes-Benz Sprinter
-NSU RO80
-Opel GT (not the German Saturn Sky)
-Opel Manta
-Opel Speedster
-Porsche 911
-Porsche 959
-Porsche Carrera GT
-smart ForTwo
-Volkswagen Beetle
-Volkswagen Golf/GTI
-Volkswagen Microbus
-Volkswagen Type 81 (aka "Thing" or "Kurierwagen")
-Wiesmann Roadster

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Three days of voting and debate before we narrow it down to five, and then move on to a special round that will cover both the Sweeds and Aussies in one thread...

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And obviously...

Herbie FTW!!!

 

[exigeracer]

Someone wnat to clarify to me how the Opel Speedster made it there as a German?

 

[GT4_Rule]

Voted M3.

 

[TheCracker]

911 for winner, and probably should be overall international winner.

 

[amp88]

Porsche 911 again.

 

[Scaff]

911

Sorry but for me its the only choice

Ta

Scaff

 

[Poverty]

911 for winner, and probably should be overall international winner.

Yeah its obviously gonna win, only other car that could challenge it could be an american one.

 

[daan]

3 numbers. 2 ones and a nine.

 

[Dave A]

Someone wnat to clarify to me how the Opel Speedster made it there as a German?

The same reason the Ford GT and GT40 are going to be in the American thread, it's an American brand. Opel is a German brand.

 

[TheCracker]

The same reason the Ford GT and GT40 are going to be in the American thread, it's an American brand. Opel is a German brand.

It's not even built in Germany, at least the the Ford GT is actually built in America.

It matters not - it ain't going to win or even probably get a vote.

 

[Poverty]

I have a hunch that its gonna be 911 VS Z06 in the end.

 

[Dave A]

But the GT40 wasn't built in America . However that's besides the point. The bottom line is YSSMAN laid down the rules for what brand get's in where in the first thread.

I really can't see the Z06 winning the American thread, it'll get votes but other than it's great performance for your money what is so revolutionary about it to make it the best? The Corvette as an all in one vote however might becasue the first Corvette played a big part in American car culture and so on, but lets not get ahead of ourselves like just did .

 

[IMADreamer]

I voted for the 300SL. I don't have any arguement for that other then it's awe inspiringly beautiful.

 

[Duke]

I voted Audi RS6. It's not the best at any single category, but it's absolutely one of the most competent all-around cars ever made: quick, fast, excellent handling, all-weather, luxurious, handsome, comfortable for 4 adults, and available as a wagon and a sedan. I'd love one.

 

[TheCracker]

But the GT40 wasn't built in America . However that's besides the point. The bottom line is YSSMAN laid down the rules for what brand get's in where in the first thread.

The Ford GT and GT40 should be classed as completely different cars, since they are, totally.

In fact the GT40 shouldn't be in at all being a race car. (most were actually built in the US anyway )

 

[///M-Spec]

My nod goes to the Mercedes-Benz S-Class. The entire line, not just a specific model year. There is no other German car in history that embodies all the superlative qualities which characterize what every German car strives to be.

Technical proficiancy, innovation, quality of engineering, the overriding deep sense of wellness you feel when you sit in and/or drive one... the list goes on. No other car has done it so consistantly and for so long.

911 and Beetle are certainly close runners up. Audi Quattro and BMW "Neue Klasse" 2500 series and of course the 2002Tii are distant thirds.


M

 

[KSaiyu]

I'm voting for the 959, for the reasons I'll shamelessly copy and paste from my nomination thread:

It
-Put 4WD into a supercar
-Had a sophisticated computer controlled 4WD system a DECADE before the Skyline
-Was designed to tackle the Group B series
-Paved the way for 4WD in "super" Porsche 911s
-Came 1-2 at the infamous Dakar rally
-Led to the monster 961, a Le Mans class winner
-Scared Ferrari so much with its performance they had to make the F40 as good as it was.

 

[Jim Prower]

Beetle FTW.

The most tunable engine in history. From 50hp about-towner to 300+hp screamer.

oh, and what gave the early 911 it's basic design, eh?

let's see, torsion bean suspension, Rear-Rear, air-cooled Boxxer engine, huh, it sounds like a big BUG.

 

[Scaff]

In fact the GT40 shouldn't be in at all being a race car. (most were actually built in the US anyway )

?

What about the homologated road cars which were built?

I'd also class the GT40 (in terms of build) as half British and half American, after all it started life as a Lola chassis with American power and British suspension, best of both countries.

That aside its a car from an American manufacturer so we will see how well it does in the US poll.

My nod goes to the Mercedes-Benz S-Class. The entire line, not just a specific model year. There is no other German car in history that embodies all the superlative qualities which characterize what every German car strives to be.

Technical proficiancy, innovation, quality of engineering, the overriding deep sense of wellness you feel when you sit in and/or drive one... the list goes on. No other car has done it so consistantly and for so long.

911 and Beetle are certainly close runners up. Audi Quattro and BMW "Neue Klasse" 2500 series and of course the 2002Tii are distant thirds.


M

It was a close call for me between the 911 and the S-class (I nominated both), for me the only car that has done what you mention above for longer than the S-class is the 911.



Regards

Scaff

 

[TheCracker]

?

What about the homologated road cars which were built?

I'd also class the GT40 (in terms of build) as half British and half American, after all it started life as a Lola chassis with American power and British suspension, best of both countries.

That aside its a car from an American manufacturer so we will see how well it does in the US poll.

There were so few genuine road cars built, and the race car came first. There's been no other 'race cars' listed in any other poles so i don't think they should start putting them in now.

I don't deny the british imput to the GT40, it was like you said, based on an earlier Lola Mk6 design. But it was built for Ford of America and i believe apart from the very first few and the latter Mirage derivertives, mostly built in the US of A.

 

[///M-Spec]

It was a close call for me between the 911 and the S-class (I nominated both), for me the only car that has done what you mention above for longer than the S-class is the 911.

The sportscar nut in me saw the 911 as the only logical choice. But the realist in me keep nagging about what a niche car it is. After all, a sports car is only a small portion of the automotive landscape, even though people like you and me see it as the pinnicle of all things that move on four wheels.

The qualities that make a 911 the best at what it does appeals to a far narrower audience than an S-Class Benz. Refinement, luxury, build quality, technical innovation, (and so on) have a broader, more far sweeping impact on the rest of the automotive landscape.

When a new 911 appears, people in the sports car sector, --be it enthusiasts, press, or industry types-- sit up and pays close attention. When a new S-Class appears, everyone sits up and pays attention.


M

 

[TheCracker]

The sportscar nut in me saw the 911 as the only logical choice. But the realist in me keep nagging about what a niche car it is. After all, a sports car is only a small portion of the automotive landscape, even people like you and me see it as the pinnicle of all things that move on four wheels.

The qualities that make a 911 the best at what it does appeals to a far narrower audience than an S-Class Benz. Refinement, luxury, build quality, technical innovation, (and so on) have a broader, more far sweeping impact on the rest of the automotive landscape.

When a new 911 appears, people in the sports car sector, --be it enthusiasts, press, or industry types-- sit up and pays close attention. When a new S-Class appears, everyone sits up and pays attention.


M

The 911 is such an inspirational car. People aspire to own 911's - especially those who could never afford one. Kids have posters of them on their walls. No one really aspires to own an S-Class, good as they are, they just don't mean as much to the general public as 911s do - positive or negative.

Say 911 to the average guy or gal on the street and they'll picture one automatically - hell, say Porsche and they'll probably picture a 911!
Say 'S-Class' and joe bloggs probably doesn't know what you are talking about, say 'S-Class Mercedes' and they'll just picture a generic large Benz, possibly not even a S-Class.

I just can't believe that the Merc means the same to the general population as the 911 does.

 

[Dave A]

There were so few genuine road cars built, and the race car came first. There's been no other 'race cars' listed in any other poles so i don't think they should start putting them in now.

31 MKIII's were road cars, a lot of people used MKI's converted for road use, I use the term a lot relatvely, it was more than the 31 MKIII road cars. But they were British built road cars at that, but they'll be in American poll.

I'm not trying to prove anyone wrong, just stating that the fact is YSSMAN has already laid down the rules for which poll a car get's placed, and it is not where the car was built and using the GT40 as an example of another car built in another country that will be allowed in the American poll.

 

[TheCracker]

31 MKIII's were road cars, a lot of people used MKI's converted for road use, I use the term a lot relatvely, it was more than the 31 MKIII road cars. But they were British built road cars at that, but they'll be in American poll.

I'm not trying to prove anyone wrong, just stating that the fact is YSSMAN has already laid down the rules for which poll a car get's placed, and it is not where the car was built and using the GT40 as an example of another car built in another country that will be allowed in the American poll.

The rules are rules and that's fair enough, rightly or wrongly - I'm more than happy for the GT40 to be classed as an American car - i just don't see it as a road car. The GT40 is famous for being a multiple LeMans winning racing car - not for being an accomplished road car (which it wasn't)

I guess i'm just in a argumentative mood today

 

[Alex.]

i voted CLK GTR-coz i nominated it, i have a 1:18 model of it, and i love it!

 

[Roo]

On the assumption that the Beetle only covers the original one and not the silly remake, I vote VW. 20 million + of motoring to the masses.

 

[///M-Spec]

The 911 is such an inspirational car. People aspire to own 911's - especially those who could never afford one. Kids have posters of them on their walls. No one really aspires to own an S-Class, good as they are, they just don't mean as much to the general public as 911s do - positive or negative.

Say 911 to the average guy or gal on the street and they'll picture one automatically - hell, say Porsche and they'll probably picture a 911!
Say 'S-Class' and joe bloggs probably doesn't know what you are talking about, say 'S-Class Mercedes' and they'll just picture a generic large Benz, possibly not even a S-Class.

I just can't believe that the Merc means the same to the general population as the 911 does.

Very good points, no argument there.

Well, except one. The contest is for "Best" German car. Not necessarily the "Most Desirable". Yes, desirability plays a factor. But the "Best" car is not necessarily the same as the one you want in your garage the most.

I have zero desire to own an S-Class at this moment, and probably forever. Conversely, I often wonder how I could possiblity get away with buying a 911. But I cannot deny that the S-Class car, above all other German cars that sets the most standards for every other car.


M

 

[Jim Prower]

On the assumption that the Beetle only covers the original one and not the silly remake, I vote VW. 20 million + of motoring to the masses.

they should make that clearer.

 

[Dave A]

Well if it covers the new one as well (which I think it does since the cars have been combined in the other polls) it STILL covers the old one, so it's not taking anything away from the Beetle vote.

 

[Jim Prower]

good point.