The General RTS/MOBA Threat

[Luminis]

Figured I'd be making a threat to gather all the Action Real Time Strategy games (or Multiplayer Online Battle Arena games, whichever you prefer) in one place - namely, League of Legends, Defeat of the Ancients and DOTA 2 and Heroes of Newearth. Unless I'm missing another one

Anyways, I've been playing LoL a bit lately, but grew tired of it and got myself into the DOTA 2 beta. Gotta say, great game, but it's considerably more difficult than good ol' LoL.

So, anyone else into these games? And if so, which ones?

Oh, and please, keep it civil. I know that to some folks, the whole LoL vs. DOTA thing is even more severe than GT vs. FM

 

[ghskilla]

I have brought this thread back to life.

LoL scrub here who will head to DOTA once I get to 30. Decent with Kat and with LeBlanc, and don't like playing as the tank.

Scrub to RTS games in general...

 

[Luminis]

Yay, thanks for the first aid, ghskilla! A Guardian Angel, so to speak. Okay, I'll getm y coat

Dota 2's got a new update today, by the way. "Least played" sounds like a strange game mode to me, though. I don't like some heroes, that's why I don't play them - why would I play a mode that makes me do exactly that?

Haven't launched LoL in weeks, to be honest...

Maybe I should just rename this threat to something like general RTS/MOBA threat? I kinda want to talk StarCraft in here, too

 

[Luminis]

Necromancing the crap out of this threat

Recently got into the Heroes of the Storm closed beta and I gotta say, it's one fun game. Got me back into the genre a bit, after dropping Dota 2 a while ago. Never felt I got anywhere there and I started to grow tired of the snowballing effect (that's present in LoL as well, of course). Quite impressed how open the games stay until the very end in HotS. Also liking the different maps with different objectives a lot. Anyone else playing?

 

[Imari]

Necromancing the crap out of this threat

Recently got into the Heroes of the Storm closed beta and I gotta say, it's one fun game. Got me back into the genre a bit, after dropping Dota 2 a while ago. Never felt I got anywhere there and I started to grow tired of the snowballing effect (that's present in LoL as well, of course). Quite impressed how open the games stay until the very end in HotS. Also liking the different maps with different objectives a lot. Anyone else playing?

I never really got into Dota, LoL and friends, but I've been watching a lot of HotS videos recently and it's far more exciting to me. I'm still waiting on my beta key (if it ever comes, I'm too cheap to pay for the founders pack), but it seems like a good game that does away with a lot of the weird BS that comes with "standard" MOBAs, and focuses on team fighting and being in the right place at the right time.

Also, games seem to be perpetually winnable unless you're getting absolutely rolled. You can almost always work your way back into a victory one objective at a time. It's pretty cool the way they've balanced it that you can get your team an advantage (early heroics or whatever), but it's nearly impossible to engineer a completely dominant position.

 

[Luminis]

Couldn't have said it better, @Imari. Those are the precise reasons why I'm into HotS.

Ditching the gameplay related conventions that come from Dota being a WarCraft 3 mod is a huge step forward, in my opinion. Sure, a lot of people might think that that's basically dumbing the game down, same as removing items. Personally, I feel that it just shifts the focus away from the laning phase. Which, to me, is a great thing. But that's what Blizzard does, I suppose. Take an established formula and polish it.

 

[Snorevette]

Started playing LoL about a week ago. I've played like 2 games, all against bots. I dunno, it's fun, but I feel kinda alienated trying to figure out the meta. I know that Warwick is pretty good, and I know he's best in the top lane, but other than that I have no idea. I still haven't worked out exactly how the items system works and how to make a good build (admittedly it probably doesn't matter too much against easy bots, but still)

 

[Imari]

Started playing LoL about a week ago. I've played like 2 games, all against bots. I dunno, it's fun, but I feel kinda alienated trying to figure out the meta.

This is the other part of the problem that Heroes of the Storm is trying to solve. The barrier to entry for a new player of Lol or Dota is extremely high. The game itself doesn't teach you much at all, so you have to spend significant amounts of time reading up on the internet or figure it out for yourself. Some people like that, but those people tend to be the ones that are already good at it.

But that's what Blizzard does, I suppose. Take an established formula and polish it.

They are quite good at it. WoW and Starcraft are still pretty unquestionably top of their genres, and Hearthstone is an extremely well designed simple M:tG type card game. They know how to iterate and fix what doesn't work.

I do like the little things they did to limit game length as well. Ammo count on towers and forts is a brilliant idea. Along with most maps having some objective that just smashes some buildings every few minutes, it makes it impossible for a game to stagnate.


Edit: OMG, opened Battle.net and it's offering me to install HotS. I guess I'm finally into the beta. I'm looking forward to this.

 

[Luminis]

Started playing LoL about a week ago. I've played like 2 games, all against bots. I dunno, it's fun, but I feel kinda alienated trying to figure out the meta. I know that Warwick is pretty good, and I know he's best in the top lane, but other than that I have no idea. I still haven't worked out exactly how the items system works and how to make a good build (admittedly it probably doesn't matter too much against easy bots, but still)

I can't offer any advice with LoL, to be honest... There's bound to be a Leaguer or two around here who might, though. All I can do is point you to SoloMid and MOBA Fire, I'm afraid.

They are quite good at it. WoW and Starcraft are still pretty unquestionably top of their genres, and Hearthstone is an extremely well designed simple M:tG type card game. They know how to iterate and fix what doesn't work.

Yeah, Diablo is another example. They took the Rogue-like formula, softened it, streamlined it, made it accessible and fun for the more casual audience.

I do like the little things they did to limit game length as well. Ammo count on towers and forts is a brilliant idea. Along with most maps having some objective that just smashes some buildings every few minutes, it makes it impossible for a game to stagnate.

Agreed on all point. The most annoying thing about Dota, in my opinion, is sitting on your lane for thirty minutes and farming your butt off only for the game to still be stalled to the 60 minute mark thereafter. Others might enjoy the more drawn-out nature of Dota and LoL, though.

Edit: OMG, opened Battle.net and it's offering me to install HotS. I guess I'm finally into the beta. I'm looking forward to this.

Nice one! Now, that's good news! All thanks to the MOBA threat, of course 👍

 

[Imari]

Yeah, Diablo is another example. They took the Rogue-like formula, softened it, streamlined it, made it accessible and fun for the more casual audience.

Diablo 3 is a funny one. It's good, but there's enough wrong with it that it's not what I'd hold up as a paragon of the type, unlike WoW and SC2.

Nice one! Now, that's good news! All thanks to the MOBA threat, of course 👍

One day the MOBA threat will destroy us all.

I've been playing through the tutorials and practise and it's pretty good. I want to go online, but I'm getting such terrible framerates in practise that I'd just be useless. Team fighting with ~5fps is hard.

It's not my comp I don't think, apparently there are issues with net connection seriously affecting framerate. Which sucks, in what's essentially single player (and the bots are incredibly bad). Hooray for beta, I guess.

 

[Luminis]

Yeah, Diablo III is the odd one out, in my opinion. It was the first one that laid the foundations and the second that perfected the formula, I'd say.

I've also been randomly experiencing some extreme frame rate drops, apparently for no reason at all. Also led to a few disconnects... That needs fixing. And they desperately need a better reconnect feature

 

[Imari]

After a week and a half playing, I have to say HotS is pretty good. There are balance issues, some characters are quite strong, others are really not, although most are playable. But it's a beta, and adjustments continue to be made (although maybe not as fast as some hope).

It's a good game that seems to achieve it's goals of being reasonably easy to get into (pick Raynor, right click, win), and yet still maintain a lot of the strategic depth and tactical play that makes MOBAs so interesting. If you're a good player, you will find success on the whole. Although sometimes you simply have to accept that the other team is better than the rest of your team and you're going to lose.

P.S. I'm having mad fun with Tyrael this week, something about his style of play (mobile, somewhat suicidal) really clicks with me. I like it.