throttle + brake?

[Proud_God]

If noticed in replays that people are applying throttle while braking? I found this surprising (and a bit dodgy) as the clutch is not working. Can anyone explain this? I also wonder how much this 'trick' improves your laptimes.

 

[Reneetje]

When you drive with a pad you can use R2 en L2 for gas and brake and apply them at the same time. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I don't know if this would improve your laptimes. Personally I use the analog sticks.

 

[Stotty]

This is all about balancing the way the weight of the car moves around as different forces are applied to the tyres... in simple terms, a car has a fixed total weight and when static has a natural percentage of it's weight on each tyre (though the actual amount of weight and the way it's spread across the tyres will vary by car due to drive train layouts etc).

When a car is driven, the weight balance across the 4 tyres changes according to what forces are being applied... eg; braking causes a forward weight shift, accelerating a rearwards shift and turning a side shift, and then of course there's the added complication of multiple inputs... braking and turning or accelerating and turning.

As said, braking creates a forward weight shift which in effect, makes the rear of the car lighter and can reduce the amount of grip at the rear... in some cars this weight transfer can can be severe enough to cause the rear of the car to slide out when steering lock is applied at the same time as braking.

Using a bit of throttle whilst braking and turning helps control the forward weight shift by transfering some of the weight back on to the rear tyres (accelerating creates a rerwards shift).

 

[DrTrouserPlank]

It's pretty much explained above. Part of what you may be noticing is the accelerator being applied whilst the braking is tapered off. This is to create a more gradual progression of the weight shifting from the front to the rear, and to not unsettle the car by suddenly releasing all the braking force resulting in rapid weight shift to the rear, oscillation due to the sudden shift in weight, and the resulting understeer

 

[alexpez]

You also effect engine braking, and alter brake bias on the fly by using gas+brake at the same time.

 

[snoopybg]

Or in other words if the rear wheels get blocked by the brakes you can unblock them with some throttle.
Anyway I don't understand how it is better to reduce the amount of weight transfered to the front by pressing the gas than to release the brake a bit. You don't actually want to accelerate while braking because this then is not braking at all.

 

[MartyParty]

If you just release the brake you have to depend on the suspension to transfer the weight, but with a little help from the throttle you can use the engine to do the some of it and the transfer might be smoother.

Then you have the issue with brake bias. When you brake you transfer weight to the front, this increases the grip at the front and reduces the grip at the back. This means that you can have more brake pressure at the front than at the back before the tires lock up. The brake pressure is not even, in other words you have a bias. In this case a front bias. Designing ordinary road cars your first concern is safety, which means that you want an understeery, predictable behaviour; That means locking up the front wheels first. Locking up the rear wheels before the front is like pulling the parking brake.

However having a front heavy brake bias means you are not taking full advantage of the grip at the rear. (Rust on the discs at the rear is quite common on ordinary road cars if you don't do some heavy braking once in a while...) When racing you want to use as much grip as possible, which means you want some more brake pressure at the rear. However you need different brake bias depending on how heavy you have to brake. In many racing cars you can change the brake bias with a handle during a race. You can often see F1 drivers doing it on long straights before a hard corner.

In sims where you can't change the brake bias during a race you can use a setup with an unhealthy amount of rear brake bias and compensate with throttle to achieve the same thing. This works very well as long as the sim doesn't simulate brake wear...

 

[emohare7]

Also, The pressing of the gas while braking (as well as balancing the weight distribution) also helps the automatic transmission from slipping to a far too low gear, hence maintaining speed. its similar to the principle of double-clutching in real cars

 

[MartyParty]

... its similar to the principle of double-clutching in real cars

Could you please explain what you mean by principle of double-clutching. As far as I know double-clutching is what you have to do when driving a car with an unsynchronized gear box.

Back on topic: As well as keeping the automatic from slipping down a gear, you can keep up the turbo pressure and if you are driving a car with an LSD and you adjust your speed or weight shift in a corner by braking, maintaining some throttle can keep the LSD in a locked position.

 

[raceur]

Also, The pressing of the gas while braking (as well as balancing the weight distribution) also helps the automatic transmission from slipping to a far too low gear, hence maintaining speed. its similar to the principle of double-clutching in real cars

It's nothing like double-declutching which is a technique used with some manuals to change gear, but yes it can keep a car from changing up a gear. However you're better off manually operating the shifter even if it's not a manumatic version.