Thrustmaster T3PA PRO hydraulic brake Add on
- Thread starter clos2727
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This is just adding hydraulic feel. Pedals would work like they normally would without modification. They still work of the pots. No modification to the wheels electronics.
On a side note. I am in the process of converting pedals to be stand alone. Via usb. ( instead of plugged to thrustmaster wheels) Already have program written up. So you can use them with any wheel. ( Fanatec, Logitech, ect.) However, this would only work on pc, And console games that have keyboard compatibility, such as Pcars. It will essentially act, and behave like an add on
( like the th8rs shifter )
Also doing the conversion would
allow me to get rid of the pots on the brake and clutch and add pressure sensor instead. Meaning we can get a precise read of the hydraulic pressure. Still work to be done on the later. But the hydraulic add on is nearly complete just need some parts in the mail. Some stress testing, Then a demonstration on my Youtube channel
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- 182
- con-sistant
spring mod could never emulate the feel of a hydraulic brake, knowing how far to push with a spring mod is nearly impossible, and at best inconsistent. and consistancy is key in racing. with a spring you can only make the pedal harder to push by changing springs to harder ones. but then you will limit the pedal travel due to compression limit. and no mater how hard you make your spring it will never feel like a real brake. also with springs, finding the lock point for cars with no abs is a nightmare, and at best all guess work. not enough resistance in either direction to make muscle memory any useful. lets not even go into trail braking.
with hydraulic brakes you get both push and release feel, allowing better modulating of the pedal. unlike a springs, you do not loose pedal travel. and the feeling isnt linear. ( same pressure throughout out the pedal travel) where as in a hydraulic system the more pressure you apply the more pressure is required to go full travel. giving you a much better feel of where you are on your pedal travel . which in turn will provide you with better muscle memory of how far to push the pedals before they lock up. (in long stints this will keep you from going through your tires because you keep looking them up, and keep you out of the pits) easily reduces lap times due to more consistency with brake. not slowing down more than you have to and fast enough to reduce engine lag, and downshifting. with practice. you can tell whether your at 60% brake or 80%. ( with spring at best is 20% or 80% ) and trail braking can be achieve 100% of the time. the difference between staying on the track, or going into a spin because you locked your brake mid turn. brakes usage is just as important as throttle usage. and with proper feel. you lap times with decrease by 2 to 3 seconds guaranteed.
IE professional sim racer dont use springs in their pedals they use hydraulic systems. imaging if we use spring system in real cars. its like a button either completely on/off. because its very difficult to modulate. not very practical to stop a car consistently.
hope this clarified some major advantages of hydraulic system over springs.
with hydraulic brakes you get both push and release feel, allowing better modulating of the pedal. unlike a springs, you do not loose pedal travel. and the feeling isnt linear. ( same pressure throughout out the pedal travel) where as in a hydraulic system the more pressure you apply the more pressure is required to go full travel. giving you a much better feel of where you are on your pedal travel . which in turn will provide you with better muscle memory of how far to push the pedals before they lock up. (in long stints this will keep you from going through your tires because you keep looking them up, and keep you out of the pits) easily reduces lap times due to more consistency with brake. not slowing down more than you have to and fast enough to reduce engine lag, and downshifting. with practice. you can tell whether your at 60% brake or 80%. ( with spring at best is 20% or 80% ) and trail braking can be achieve 100% of the time. the difference between staying on the track, or going into a spin because you locked your brake mid turn. brakes usage is just as important as throttle usage. and with proper feel. you lap times with decrease by 2 to 3 seconds guaranteed.
IE professional sim racer dont use springs in their pedals they use hydraulic systems. imaging if we use spring system in real cars. its like a button either completely on/off. because its very difficult to modulate. not very practical to stop a car consistently.
hope this clarified some major advantages of hydraulic system over springs.
- 145
- Thessaloniki
Some clarifications here as I already noted on your channel the other day.
Having a pressure based system is about the sensor that translates pressure to braking force (1:1) input. Having a hydraulic brake without a psi sensor, and using a pot (linear) sensor is like replacing the spring with the best progressive feeling. What basher mod tries for cheap with his urethane springs, or the logitech nixim/gteye progressive springs.
It's better than stock but not the real deal.
Replacing the pot with a load cell makes braking pressure based making it easier to be consistent, and with proper progressive springs/resistance tries to replicate as good as it gets a hydlaulic brake.
And finally the real thing (which you are soooo soooo close to achieve) is the hydraulic feeling which is translated (this is the most important part) via a psi sensor to braking force. But if you don't put the sensor you are just putting a nicer resistance to your foot, not your car...in an expensive way :-)
Haven't messed with psi sensors, but if they operate on the same voltage as the t500 pots then you can even replace the sensor and keep them compatible 100% to stock. TM ecosystem etc.
Your plate is a very useful product for a hydraulic build,and seems well designed. Sourcing parts to offer a complete kit would be something to consider, since you would be having a wider customer audience, people that have no diy skills or technical understanding.
All in all I really enjoy following your builds through YouTube and find very nice that you make good use of your 3d printer as well.
Keep up the great work!
Having a pressure based system is about the sensor that translates pressure to braking force (1:1) input. Having a hydraulic brake without a psi sensor, and using a pot (linear) sensor is like replacing the spring with the best progressive feeling. What basher mod tries for cheap with his urethane springs, or the logitech nixim/gteye progressive springs.
It's better than stock but not the real deal.
Replacing the pot with a load cell makes braking pressure based making it easier to be consistent, and with proper progressive springs/resistance tries to replicate as good as it gets a hydlaulic brake.
And finally the real thing (which you are soooo soooo close to achieve) is the hydraulic feeling which is translated (this is the most important part) via a psi sensor to braking force. But if you don't put the sensor you are just putting a nicer resistance to your foot, not your car...in an expensive way :-)
Haven't messed with psi sensors, but if they operate on the same voltage as the t500 pots then you can even replace the sensor and keep them compatible 100% to stock. TM ecosystem etc.
Your plate is a very useful product for a hydraulic build,and seems well designed. Sourcing parts to offer a complete kit would be something to consider, since you would be having a wider customer audience, people that have no diy skills or technical understanding.
All in all I really enjoy following your builds through YouTube and find very nice that you make good use of your 3d printer as well.
Keep up the great work!
- 182
- con-sistant
Thanks Asteruolis, When i came up with the design, admittedly it was to make it as simple as possible. So that anyone could build it. But you are correct. adding a sensor to this only posses difficulty to those non diy selfers. it doesnt require much outside of some extra adapters and fittings. and removing the wires from the pot and adding them to the sensor. Although not tested, the theory behind this is, that it should work.
I just finished the how to install parts video. Which i shortly go into about the sensors. I will continue to keep everyone updated as i continue to build upon it.
Thanks for being a subscriber. As you know i try very hard to cover all basis of my builds, covering functionality, testing and ease of builds. Sometimes i wish i had a bigger budget to do exactly what i want. and sometimes people like you. provide useful insight about how to improve, or even add a feature i may not have thought of or mentioned. And i thank you
Anyways here is the ho to install part to frame video
I just finished the how to install parts video. Which i shortly go into about the sensors. I will continue to keep everyone updated as i continue to build upon it.
Thanks for being a subscriber. As you know i try very hard to cover all basis of my builds, covering functionality, testing and ease of builds. Sometimes i wish i had a bigger budget to do exactly what i want. and sometimes people like you. provide useful insight about how to improve, or even add a feature i may not have thought of or mentioned. And i thank you
Anyways here is the ho to install part to frame video
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